BoxRec

Max Molyneux wrote:Froch will be exposed soon.

Reid won 2 of those rounds and one of Froch's knock downs was not legit and was a back of the head shot followed with a shove. Froch's knock downs were coming due to the shoves.

effing joke how he can even target Calzaghe.

If that was a prime Reid no matter how mediocre he was at his best, he would of beaten Froch.

A prime Barney and a prime Reid would beat Froch according to you. Who else would beat Froch? A prime Dodson and Magee as well?

Emerson Poncey Name Ghent wrote:Did Murray win?

Yep and looked very impressive doing so. On top of Hickman all night and gave him a beat-down to head and body. Sparked him with body shots followed by clean hooks to the head in the 4th with Hickman on the ropes the whole round. Murray is a real threat to Khan but they say they are gunning for a December stay busy bout followed by Thaxton for the British crown in the New Year. Murray 22-0(12) now and won the English title with this win. Top prospect and very entertaining.

Now for a more tempered opinion, I was really angry about Reid (Reid was one of my favorite fighters back in the day) being used as a stepping stone but on reflection wasn't being entirely fair to Froch.

He did what all boxers are supposed to do which is beating the man in front of him and coming through unharmed. He made short work of a man, who some thought had a chance of exposing him. I won't pretend to be a fan but the only thing I see Froch being exposed as is a world-class fighter who will be real threat in the division untill such time as he chooses to stands down. I've been telling anyone who cared to listen that he has world-class potential since he took care of Ruben Groenwald.

But Kilburn - who people choose to support is their privilage and as much as Froch owes noone here anything, the reverse also applies.

Horse wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:Froch will be exposed soon.

Reid won 2 of those rounds and one of Froch's knock downs was not legit and was a back of the head shot followed with a shove. Froch's knock downs were coming due to the shoves.

effing joke how he can even target Calzaghe.

If that was a prime Reid no matter how mediocre he was at his best, he would of beaten Froch.

A prime Barney and a prime Reid would beat Froch according to you. Who else would beat Froch? A prime Dodson and Magee as well?

Did'nt a prime Reid(no matter how mediocre )almost(some say did)beat Calzaghe?

A little dissapointed with the match up, but Froch put it into context when he said it was a nice fight to get back in business after knee surgery and 7 months out.

Holding is hands low is never gonna change, which could mean some entertaining fights in the future.
He took a couple of massive shots from Reid and brushed them off.He has a very, very strong chin.

I don't see the problem with calling out Calzaghe(Maccarenalli has called out David Haye and the belt holders at cruiserweight for years now).It gets his name about and shows he would be wiling to fight the very best.
Of course, I cannot see this fight ever happening due to Joe only having one or two bouts left, but never say never!

Is'nt the WBC ranked number one guy supposed to call out the WBC champion!!!

tony3 wrote:But Kilburn - who people choose to support is their privilage and as much as Froch owes noone here anything, the reverse also applies.

True, there are just a few too many sensitive souls around for me. Froch hasn't got to this stage without some serious graft and if he wants to tell all how confident he feels then I'm not going to get upset about it.

At some point Froch is going to be right up against it, and I hope people get behind him then.

As usual on these Sky Sports shows, the prospects have been looking better than the main event fighters. Murray, as I predicted, beat up his opponent. Hickman was one of those foes who coming in throwing lots of shots. Murray was cool as a cumcumber, and, given plenty of punching opportunities, really broke his man down. His body shots were murderous and his punch variety impressive. He kept on his man, used subtle sidesteps, smothered Hickman's shots...Impressive stuff, has a real pro look about him and will be more than ready for Thaxton next year.

Murray-Thaxton is the main domestic fight out there IMO, not Khan-Earl or Mitchell-Johanesson.



Froch's legs didn't look right. I noticed he couldn't get any leverage into his body shots. Reid tried his best, went into a bit of a spoiler mode and Froch dropped him 3x or so. Whatever Froch's technical issues, he is hard to read & has a very heavy punch. With his personality and punch, Froch can be a star. I think he can easily win a vacant belt. I really hope he does. And he'll beat Bute.

On this exposed subject. I'm sick of hearing that every puncher is going to be exposed. No doubt Calzaghe is the man to "expose" Froch. Calzaghe wasn't exacty put in fights where he could get "exposed" at around that age.

Kilburn wrote:It makes me laugh. All the arrogance we have to put up with from American fighters / fans, and we're still so quick to turn on one of our own.

I agree.

It's all too bloody typical of England sports fans unfortunately. If we have someone decent to get behind, who is cocky, exciting to watch and a potential world beater then it's time to start moaning about them, hoping they get beat, and "hoping they go away"....

Who cares if he is arrogant??? You only have to watch him box - not get married to the guy.

If Froch was some plucky loser, with 3 losses on his record I suppose everyone would love him.

I expect these are the same people who cheer on Tim Henman at Wimbledon each year....

Horse wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:Froch will be exposed soon.

Reid won 2 of those rounds and one of Froch's knock downs was not legit and was a back of the head shot followed with a shove. Froch's knock downs were coming due to the shoves.

effing joke how he can even target Calzaghe.

If that was a prime Reid no matter how mediocre he was at his best, he would of beaten Froch.

A prime Barney and a prime Reid would beat Froch according to you. Who else would beat Froch? A prime Dodson and Magee as well?

Dodson and Magee are not and were not fringe world level like Reid was.

I didn't say a prime Barney would beat Froch, don't lie. I said once that Barney looked capable of winning that fight but he came to spoil and take the pay.

Is'nt the WBC ranked number one guy supposed to call out the WBC champion!!!

Brahmer's No 1.

http://www.wbcboxing.com/WBCboxing/Port ... sortby=ASC

I think it's time Froch stepped it up some - This was never going to be competitive (and yes I did predict it before the fight)

It's all very well shouting from the roof tops about how great you are, but prove it first - I think that's probably what a lot of fight fans want to see in regards Froch.

But we all know he'll have to sit tight and wait for his ranking to force a mandatory, or maybe a vacant shot will happen if Calzaghe vacates.

Take out the knockdowns and It was competitive.

Aye, Froch mouths off but he ducks Bute to fight Tatevosyan who only just came off a beating from Bute less than 2 months earlier yet It was hyped as a world class win.

I think Froch feels he should be #1 after another good KO win. Brahmer, all he's done is beat Mario Veit, and he had to have 2 fights to get that result!

"Who cares if he is arrogant??? You only have to watch him box - not get married to the guy."

Quite brilliant.

Can't believe I got this so wrong. I didn't realise just how shot Reid was. I thought he would last the distance and might even spring a surprise - he did hurt Froch in the fourth, I thought.

But he had nothing left. A pay day, plain and simple. Thought he would have gone out on his shield too but he wasn't interested. All the fire had gone and he was prepared to quit.

Probably the wise thing but very sad.

Max Molyneux wrote:

Horse wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:Froch will be exposed soon.

Reid won 2 of those rounds and one of Froch's knock downs was not legit and was a back of the head shot followed with a shove. Froch's knock downs were coming due to the shoves.

effing joke how he can even target Calzaghe.

If that was a prime Reid no matter how mediocre he was at his best, he would of beaten Froch.

A prime Barney and a prime Reid would beat Froch according to you. Who else would beat Froch? A prime Dodson and Magee as well?

Dodson and Magee are not and were not fringe world level like Reid was.

I didn't say a prime Barney would beat Froch, don't lie. I said once that Barney looked capable of winning that fight but he came to spoil and take the pay.

You may not have said that a prime Barney would beat Froch, but you have repeatedly said that Barney would have beaten Froch if he had tried.

Also Magee was fringe World level; can you not remember that Calzaghe wanted to defend his WBO belt against him, whilst dismissing Froch.

That's true. Magee was a hand picked Calzaghe voluntary before it got called off. I felt Magee beat Oakey soundly, and some say Magee deserved the nod over Tsypko, who some felt deserved the nod over Lacy...

Either way, Froch KO'd a tricky customer in Magee.

I thought last nights performace did nothing to enhance Froch as a fighter or a person - At one point Reid had him well worried but was unable to follow it through - Reid in his prime may have - Froch looked very beatable, he was hurt and his confidence for a moment went - Calzaghe or Kessler at that point would have taken him out - Although Reid was well past his best and not up to the job he still showed how Froch can be floored by the right man - Froch may get a title but he will never be a great like Calzaghe - I just cant see him dominating at SM as he thinks he will, or as Calzaghe has - Next year will be very interesting if Froch does fight the top men and gets a chance for a title - As for his arrogance, there is no need for it - Boxing is a sport and he does it no favours shouldering his opponents before a fight and mouthing off about how good he is - He isnt a good role model for youngsters either - The Clay/Ali hype was a very different matter, which we all laughed at because it was just showmanship and a bit of fun - Froch means it and he will never get the country behind him because of it.

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:Can't believe I got this so wrong. I didn't realise just how shot Reid was. I thought he would last the distance and might even spring a surprise - he did hurt Froch in the fourth, I thought.

But he had nothing left. A pay day, plain and simple. Thought he would have gone out on his shield too but he wasn't interested. All the fire had gone and he was prepared to quit.

Probably the wise thing but very sad.

Think Lacy took away his "fighting guts" (as Mike Tyson calls it). Hs fire and ambition had gone more so than him being physically shot.

Yes, there were some distress signals from Froch in the 4th, albeit subtle ones, and I didn't like his foot movement from the offset. He didn't seem that confident moving his lead leg - was that the one with the injured knee?

Contary to what Froch has said, not ideal preperation for a world title fight. At the step up, he won't find many (if any) who elect to go down like Reid did.

I think Froch raises his performance to the opposition. We've seen similar holes in Kelly Pavlik's defense but he's gone on to do big things. Regardless of how KP's career goes, he's won the middleweight crown.

IMO Froch will definitely be a world title holder. Suspect defense, great offensive abilities. These were heavy shots that did away with Reid.

Whats the big deal. THis was the classic boxing match up, new contender sends old champ out to pasture. Nice name on Frochs record. He'll step up in 08, win or lose hes good to watch. Seems a bit to JC what JC was to Steve Collins a decade ago, if ya know what i mean? Ahh, how it all goes round in circles!

Anyways, 08 will be interesting for Froch, we should be happy.

stujones wrote:

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:Can't believe I got this so wrong. I didn't realise just how shot Reid was. I thought he would last the distance and might even spring a surprise - he did hurt Froch in the fourth, I thought.

But he had nothing left. A pay day, plain and simple. Thought he would have gone out on his shield too but he wasn't interested. All the fire had gone and he was prepared to quit.

Probably the wise thing but very sad.

Think Lacy took away his "fighting guts" (as Mike Tyson calls it). Hs fire and ambition had gone more so than him being physically shot.

Yes, there were some distress signals from Froch in the 4th, albeit subtle ones, and I didn't like his foot movement from the offset. He didn't seem that confident moving his lead leg - was that the one with the injured knee?

Contary to what Froch has said, not ideal preperation for a world title fight. At the step up, he won't find many (if any) who elect to go down like Reid did.

I think you're both on the money here in terms of Reid's true standing as an opponent at this stage of his career, and Froch's performance.
While I thought Murray put in an impressive performance I was extremely worried about his lack of head movement - he was unbelievably static in this respect and will be his undoing when he tries to move into world class.

I am still adamant Froch will be exposed at the top level. Reid did seem to hurt him a bit there and his timing which has been terrible for a good few years is now non existent. A top level guy like Kessler or Bute would take advantage of Froch's complete lack of defence. He gets away with it at this level.

I thought the performance was ok but he didn't look that good. Granted he's just back from injury but Reid showed absolutely nothing in there but still had a couple of moments.

As for him calling out Calzaghe I don't think he's earned it as yet and needs a genuine world class win first. I don't give him much of a chance against Calzaghe I think he'd get schooled.

Deserter wrote:

stujones wrote:

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:Can't believe I got this so wrong. I didn't realise just how shot Reid was. I thought he would last the distance and might even spring a surprise - he did hurt Froch in the fourth, I thought.

But he had nothing left. A pay day, plain and simple. Thought he would have gone out on his shield too but he wasn't interested. All the fire had gone and he was prepared to quit.

Probably the wise thing but very sad.

Think Lacy took away his "fighting guts" (as Mike Tyson calls it). Hs fire and ambition had gone more so than him being physically shot.

Yes, there were some distress signals from Froch in the 4th, albeit subtle ones, and I didn't like his foot movement from the offset. He didn't seem that confident moving his lead leg - was that the one with the injured knee?

Contary to what Froch has said, not ideal preperation for a world title fight. At the step up, he won't find many (if any) who elect to go down like Reid did.

I think you're both on the money here in terms of Reid's true standing as an opponent at this stage of his career, and Froch's performance.
While I thought Murray put in an impressive performance I was extremely worried about his lack of head movement - he was unbelievably static in this respect and will be his undoing when he tries to move into world class.

they've got plenty of time to fix it

Autobarn wrote:

Deserter wrote:

stujones wrote: Think Lacy took away his "fighting guts" (as Mike Tyson calls it). Hs fire and ambition had gone more so than him being physically shot.

Yes, there were some distress signals from Froch in the 4th, albeit subtle ones, and I didn't like his foot movement from the offset. He didn't seem that confident moving his lead leg - was that the one with the injured knee?

Contary to what Froch has said, not ideal preperation for a world title fight. At the step up, he won't find many (if any) who elect to go down like Reid did.

I think you're both on the money here in terms of Reid's true standing as an opponent at this stage of his career, and Froch's performance.
While I thought Murray put in an impressive performance I was extremely worried about his lack of head movement - he was unbelievably static in this respect and will be his undoing when he tries to move into world class.

they've got plenty of time to fix it

This is where I have to disagree fella. It's a classic British/European trait and Murray's style will have developed over the past 10 years in this manner, so trying to address and rectify it will be incredibly difficult. His whole style is built around a high guard and tucking up to avoid shots - will work fine up to a point, but will be exploited at world level. No shame in that necessarily, as being a good European-level boxer is a real achievement, but I'm willing to bet everything I have that Murray won't be able to 'fix' this issue.

Horse wrote:

Max Molyneux wrote:

Horse wrote: A prime Barney and a prime Reid would beat Froch according to you. Who else would beat Froch? A prime Dodson and Magee as well?

Dodson and Magee are not and were not fringe world level like Reid was.

I didn't say a prime Barney would beat Froch, don't lie. I said once that Barney looked capable of winning that fight but he came to spoil and take the pay.

You may not have said that a prime Barney would beat Froch, but you have repeatedly said that Barney would have beaten Froch if he had tried.

Also Magee was fringe World level; can you not remember that Calzaghe wanted to defend his WBO belt against him, whilst dismissing Froch.

If he came to win, Barney could of outboxed Froch In that fight yes. Whats It to do with anything you replied to?

Magee's a hype job and Calzaghe would destroyed him. He didn't even fight Barbosa and pulled out. Anyway I don't justify Calzaghe's bad opponents anyway like most of you wrongly make out. But Calzaghe's cleaned out the division now and Is the Pimp of all the current 12 stoners so Froch Is a joke calling Joe out when he gets outboxed at times by Reid.

Anyway you rated Hatton above Calzaghe even after the Urango win.

Deserter wrote:

Autobarn wrote:

Deserter wrote: I think you're both on the money here in terms of Reid's true standing as an opponent at this stage of his career, and Froch's performance.
While I thought Murray put in an impressive performance I was extremely worried about his lack of head movement - he was unbelievably static in this respect and will be his undoing when he tries to move into world class.

they've got plenty of time to fix it

This is where I have to disagree fella. It's a classic British/European trait and Murray's style will have developed over the past 10 years in this manner, so trying to address and rectify it will be incredibly difficult. His whole style is built around a high guard and tucking up to avoid shots - will work fine up to a point, but will be exploited at world level. No shame in that necessarily, as being a good European-level boxer is a real achievement, but I'm willing to bet everything I have that Murray won't be able to 'fix' this issue.

Its like the Froch low left, too late to change.