BoxRec

Yeah, old time fighters never fouled. Greb, Zivic, Dempsey, Sharkey, Marciano... foul? Ha, never.

One thing I have said in the past is that I don't believe that its fair to assume that Douglas, on the night he fought Mike in Tokyo, couldn't have beaten the Tyson who fought Spinks. I think for all we know he may well have, even if it had been a tougher fight. Or maybe Tyson would have won, but the point is we shouldn't just assume that he would have.

That said, Tyson was obviously in bad shape, and that made Douglas look real good. I don't think its safe to assume that Lewis never had a performance as good as the one Douglas had against Tyson. Lewis-Holyfield I and Lewis-Rahman II weren't all that bad, where they? And while Tyson wasn't a 240 pound Tua, Lewis wasn't a 38 year old Holmes or a 16-0 Tyrell Biggs. I think Lewis' reach and power and boxing ability might allow him to win a close one against Mike. If Mike won I doubt anyone would be surprised, but I would favor Lennox.

Show of hands, does anyone honestly believe that Holyfield's head butting was the only thing that allowed him to beat Tyson in those fights? Not his defense, counter punching, apparent strength advantage, or even his excessive holding?

BoxBuzz wrote:

granberry wrote:Billygoat Holyfield 'won' both his 'fights' with Tyson with the deciding "blow" being a butt EACH time.

TWO IN A ROW is no accident.

Billygoat Holyfield did not "attempt" to butt.

He DID butt.

Only halfwits who don't know the basic rules of boxing could give Holyfield any credit for butting his way to "victory."

The same halfwits who thinks it's just great for Holmes to thumb his way to "victory" against Scott Frank and Scot LeDoux,

for Duran to thumb Davey Moore

for Hagler to thumb Roldan

for Hagler to butt Antofermo ten seconds into their second fight

for Sugar Ray Leonard to punch after the bell in every fight he had

for Ali to grab behind the head and grab behind the head and grab behind the head and grab behind the head as his basic "boxing" technique.

What a great bunch of "boxers' you worship, halfwits.

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uh....it's a tough sport granberry, you can't get your panties in an bundle when things get tough. "protect yourself at all times" is one of the last bits of good info given before all hell breaks loose. Then it's up to the ref and judges and the fighters as to what takes place. granberry is just another face in the crowd, sort of like the rest of us.....

You don't stop the football game and award it to the offending team upon every infraction of the rules. Your going to have to let go of your feminine side and reimbrace your masculinity and accept some of the natural ways that "the cookie crumbles" in life. Including the management or mismanagement of infractions. It is after all "managed conflict" as is most every sport.

You can't spend your life lamenting that the "immaculate reception" may have had some suspicious circumstances and that perhaps the Steelers should never have won the game..

Most of us have moved on.

buzz--the ulimate "feminine" boxing fan

fills up the internet with his clueless and useless crap.

BoxBuzz ( the ultimate Tom Hauser clone) wrote:
And of course many of us Ali "shills" think that Ali's performance in the wake of that devastating left hook is almost equal in it's remarkable nature as the KD itself. That shot would have put almost any other heavyweight in history both DOWN and OUT.
IMHO.

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granberry, you NEVER address the point.

would you or I have gotten up from a shot like that after 15 rounds with Joe Frazier? That's all I'm saying....if Joe is the ultimate "beat you up, wear you down, take you out guy, why couldnt' he finish the job? He caught the guy flush with his Sunday punch after delivering a "Joe Frazier" style beating right? Who gets up after that?

And then you have to ask could it be because Ali could take it with the best of them? Am I being to Shill for you here?

You also seem to say that Ali should never have been caught with that left....Why? Was Joe really that bad when it came to delivering a left hook? Ali should be ashamed of getting caught by a Frazier hook? Is this what your saying here?

Are my questions just too unfair to be asking?

Gran is in agony when Ali gets up from (let's face it, those of us non-Ali fans who have the balls, that is) a hellacious shot, at that late stage in the game, that most fighters wouldn't have recovered from.

Gran is in agony when the footage of Ali contradicts his flights of fancy.