BoxRec

raylawpc wrote:

I Feel Fine wrote:Leonard is a tad high.

Which Leonard is too high?

Sugar Ray Leonard.

Edit: Let me clarify. I would have Ray in my top 20, maybe even top 15, but not my top 10, and probably not above Archie Moore, for example.

Big John,

Certain observation! Thanks!

Big Bad John wrote:

Martin Sosa Cameron wrote:Nicolino Locche is not in this list; neither Stanley Ketchel (???)

Ketchel died before Ring magazine was created.

So did Bob Fitzsimmons, Terry McGovern, Joe Gans, etc etc etc.

I got the Magazine of that issue and The Ring explained about the rankings. They selected them in terms of historical impact and accomplishments of fighters of the last 80 years between 1922 to 2002.

I agree with most of the boxers SELECTED in the list.

I do believe that Oscar De La Hoya, Felix "Tito" Trinidad nor Antonio Cervantes should be in that list at all. Neither of the 3 should be in the top 100 greats, pound per pound. I would rather put Jersey Joe Walcott, Jack "Kid" Berg, Lou Ambers, Nicolino Locche, Floyd Patterson and Nino Benvenutti in there INSTEAD of DLH, Tito and Pambele.

Aaron Pryor, Roy Jones, Jr., Bernard Hopkins, Miguel Canto, Joe Brown and Khosai Galaxy were too high. They should be ranked from 55 and up.

Jose Napoles and Jimmy McLarnin should be top 40 of the 80 greats.
Tony Canzoneri should be in the top 20

I haven't read the criteria that was used, but overall I think it's pretty sound, by any standards. Which surprised me, as usually these kinds of lists make some kind of colossal blunders that really piss me off.

I was particularly pleased to see how high Kid Gavilan and Dick Tiger are rated on this list (both rate in or near the top 30). They are two of my very favorites of all time, and usually they are underrated on these kinds of lists IMO.


But of course, there are still some rankings that raise eyebrows IMO. Rocky Marciano shouldn't be nearly as high as he is IMO (although that apparently has something to do with some special criteria the Ring used), and Harold Johnson is much too low.

granberry wrote:

Big Bad John wrote:

Martin Sosa Cameron wrote:Nicolino Locche is not in this list; neither Stanley Ketchel (???)

Ketchel died before Ring magazine was created.

So did Bob Fitzsimmons, Terry McGovern, Joe Gans, etc etc etc.

They're not on the list.

Harvey Levy wrote:

granberry wrote:[quote="Big Bad John
Ketchel died before Ring magazine was created.

So did Bob Fitzsimmons, Terry McGovern, Joe Gans, etc etc etc.

They're not on the list.[/quote]

As well they shouldn't be. The list is the 80 greatest of the past 80 years. The list came out in 2002. Hence, the cut-off was 1922.

Any idiot can make a "list."

It is FALSE to say this is a RING magazine list.

The RING magazine ended when Nat Fleischer died in the early 1970's.

Since then what purports to be the Ring magazine is a bastardization of the original, put out by a continuous series of clowns.

This "list" comes from the most current bastardization of Nat Fleischer's original RING magazine,

"edited" by politically correct burned out 1960's radical Nigel Collins.

Granberry isn't the sharpest knife in the drawer.

Aaron Pryor is way too high, Marciano and Dempsey are too high and Hearns, Canzoneri and Ross should be higher.

In the late 1990s/early 2000s, Aaron Pryor was pretty popular. There's been a backlash since then.

Big Bad John wrote:In the late 1990s/early 2000s, Aaron Pryor was pretty popular. There's been a backlash since then.

Personally, I'll never get over the fact that he chugged from a mysterious black bottle every time he was in trouble against Arguello.

Yeah, but what about Larry Holmes asking for his "blue bottle" in that one fight? Or Roy Jones testing positive for an anabolic steroid?

Big Bad John wrote:Yeah, but what about Larry Holmes asking for his "blue bottle" in that one fight? Or Roy Jones testing positive for an anabolic steroid?

here we go with this crap again. i've noticed big bad john has has to take a vacation from the boards. hopefully it's a permanent one.

bjermaine wrote:

Big Bad John wrote:Yeah, but what about Larry Holmes asking for his "blue bottle" in that one fight? Or Roy Jones testing positive for an anabolic steroid?

here we go with this crap again. i've noticed big bad john has has to take a vacation from the boards. hopefully it's a permanent one.

I'm not one to question the mods but it is interesting a certain poster who engages in hate speech and questions other poster's sexuality is allowed to continue posting...

loads of arguments about the list but its one of the better efforts i have seen. lamotta is way down to name one dodgy placing.

If Nat were still around then I can just about guarantee that a certain 'Manassa Mauler' would have been on top of this list,.

Grant wrote:If Nat were still around then I can just about guarantee that a certain 'Manassa Mauler' would have been on top of this list,.

How many of these gentlemen would you rank Dempsey over?


Sugar Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
Roberto Duran
Willie Pep
Harry Greb
Benny Leonard
Sugar Ray Leonard
Pernell Whitaker
Carlos Monzon
Rocky Marciano
Ezzard Charles
Archie Moore
Sandy Saddler
Jack Dempsey

TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:

Grant wrote:If Nat were still around then I can just about guarantee that a certain 'Manassa Mauler' would have been on top of this list,.

How many of these gentlemen would you rank Dempsey over?


Sugar Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
Roberto Duran
Willie Pep
Harry Greb
Benny Leonard
Sugar Ray Leonard
Pernell Whitaker
Carlos Monzon
Rocky Marciano
Ezzard Charles
Archie Moore
Sandy Saddler
Jack Dempsey

I probably ranked ALL OF THEM over Dempsey

I'm talking about Nat Fleisher here, not myself. From memory he idolized Dempsey.

TheOneIsHere2008 wrote:

Grant wrote:If Nat were still around then I can just about guarantee that a certain 'Manassa Mauler' would have been on top of this list,.

How many of these gentlemen would you rank Dempsey over?


Sugar Ray Robinson
Henry Armstrong
Muhammad Ali
Joe Louis
Roberto Duran
Willie Pep
Harry Greb
Benny Leonard
Sugar Ray Leonard
Pernell Whitaker
Carlos Monzon
Rocky Marciano
Ezzard Charles
Archie Moore
Sandy Saddler
Jack Dempsey

Another question:

Which editor of what was left of RING magazine after Nat Fleischer died

was the biggest shill for Ali?

Nat Loubet ?

Steve Farhood ?

Bert Sugar and Herbert Goldman ?

Nigel Collins ?

granberry wrote:Another question:

Which editor of what was left of RING magazine after Nat Fleischer died

was the biggest shill for Ali?

Nat Loubet ?

Steve Farhood ?

Bert Sugar and Herbert Goldman ?

Nigel Collins ?

Please stop spamming my threads with your aberrant nonsense.


Thank you in advance.

collins/TheOne spams boxrec 24 hours a day.

granberry wrote:collins/TheOne spams boxrec 24 hours a day.

Show some respect for the administrator's bandwidth...If you want to trade insults with other posters maybe the boxing forum at ESPN would provide you with the environment you are looking for...

Ring has been in a dowward spiral since 79. I rarely would buy that trash the following decade and knowing that Farhood is at the helm I never even glance at the mag.

Ray Leonard was popularized throughout the 80s and which is the reason his image has loomed so large in the minds of many. A pity his performances could never match up to the hype.

As for this list, it is not to be taken seriously. As a wise man once said, any idiot can make a list.