BoxRec

T.M.K wrote:

BigEars wrote: Well then wouldn't it have looked less cynical for Eastman to have held the title before - anot just when his luck ran out at British level?

I personally say good luck to Jamie Moore as he did BOTH before moving on up - but had he failed at all levels, got stumped for the British again, and THEN done it, it looks more desperate does it not?

"T.M.K"

ps: Also, hasn't there been an All-Ireland title for years anyway? Why this sudden craze with Irish titles has come about... it's not exactly a "new" concept.

Well to be fair to Howard he started off boxing in the UK and was living in the UK at that stage.
Howard was above fighting for any domestic title for a couple of years as he looked to become a World champion, it is only in the last few years in which he has fallen back to domestic level and it is only in the last few years in which he has gone back to Guyana. Only Eastman really knows his reasons though, he may be using the title or he may just want it because he's a Guyanan.

The Irish title goes all the way back to 1888 as far as Marquis of Queensbury Rules goes, when future Heavyweight title claimant Peter Maher(another Tipperary man ) won the Irish Middleweight title over Harvey de Cross.

However Irish title fights have been sporadic in the last 100 years, generally fought for in front of small crowds in nothing venues. The problem was the sport wasn't really promoted here properly until recently.
Bernard Dunne came back from the United States in 2005 and together with his promoter and manager Brian Peters signed a deal with national broadcaster RTÉ. That pretty much changed everything as Irish people were reminded of their love for boxing and more cards and fighters were needed. It only made sense to include the Irish title when two fighters eligible for it were fighting over 10 rounds, it helps sell a fight and give it meaning.

Now we've loads of promoters, plenty of cards and with that a need for plenty of Irish title fights. Tommy Egan, the promoter who has started to work with RTÉ rival station TV3(the first card was the Jamie Moore one) has said he's going to base his cards around Irish title fights. Simply put the reason that there's more Irish title fights now is that there are more fights now.

Big ears you seem to have good knowlege of Irish boxing , can you tell me where I can find out about Irish boxing history? As you know we all get hyped easily with whats going on today. I was born in 86 and have vauge memories of carruth and everybody jumping around the sitting room when he won. For me I got excited about boxing when collins v eubank listening on the radio ( didnt have sky). When dunne came it re- ignited my passion. Do you think out of one of the prospects one can be world champ? My bet would be duddy ( seems he will get a shot first) or lee( who i prefer to watch).

BigEars wrote:
Now we've loads of promoters, plenty of cards and with that a need for plenty of Irish title fights. Tommy Egan, the promoter who has started to work with RTÉ rival station TV3(the first card was the Jamie Moore one) has said he's going to base his cards around Irish title fights. Simply put the reason that there's more Irish title fights now is that there are more fights now.

Is hylands card going to be covered on tv? With egan focusing on the irish title , its good news. Do you know whether his cards will get tv coverege?

liamlion wrote:If a cow is born in a stable, does it make it a horse?

Cleary Calzaghe is not english, he is a welshman and also a plastic Sardinian.

If it was brought up moooooing it would be.

I was born and raised in America by Irish-American and Italian-American parents. I'm very familiar with my heritage but I have no inclination to be anything but American. I'm American cultured. Although I have an olive complexion and dark hair (what's left of it), my children have light Irish complexions reflective of my Irish and their mother's Irish American mother. I can make it more complicated if you wish, but my question is - When the hell do I become an American?

OH! I make my living with an Irishman from NI and a few Puerto Ricans, some Afro-Americans and a Dominican. Does that make me anything else?

So who would u fight for then or would u just chase the money?


quote="Jabby"]

liamlion wrote:If a cow is born in a stable, does it make it a horse?

Cleary Calzaghe is not english, he is a welshman and also a plastic Sardinian.

If it was brought up moooooing it would be.

I was born and raised in America by Irish-American and Italian-American parents. I'm very familiar with my heritage but I have no inclination to be anything but American. I'm American cultured. Although I have an olive complexion and dark hair (what's left of it), my children have light Irish complexions reflective of my Irish and their mother's Irish American mother. I can make it more complicated if you wish, but my question is - When the hell do I become an American?

OH! I make my living with an Irishman from NI and a few Puerto Ricans, some Afro-Americans and a Dominican. Does that make me anything else?[/quote]

Jabby wrote:

liamlion wrote:If a cow is born in a stable, does it make it a horse?

Cleary Calzaghe is not english, he is a welshman and also a plastic Sardinian.

If it was brought up moooooing it would be.

I was born and raised in America by Irish-American and Italian-American parents. I'm very familiar with my heritage but I have no inclination to be anything but American. I'm American cultured. Although I have an olive complexion and dark hair (what's left of it), my children have light Irish complexions reflective of my Irish and their mother's Irish American mother. I can make it more complicated if you wish, but my question is - When the hell do I become an American?

OH! I make my living with an Irishman from NI and a few Puerto Ricans, some Afro-Americans and a Dominican. Does that make me anything else?

Make it as complicated as you like pal.

I think you missed the point. Calzaghe's only connection with England is that he was born there - he was not raised in England.

My point is that, where you are born does not necessarily define your nationality particularly if you have no connection with the country, other than being born there.

metropol wrote:Big ears you seem to have good knowlege of Irish boxing , can you tell me where I can find out about Irish boxing history? As you know we all get hyped easily with whats going on today. I was born in 86 and have vauge memories of carruth and everybody jumping around the sitting room when he won. For me I got excited about boxing when collins v eubank listening on the radio ( didnt have sky). When dunne came it re- ignited my passion. Do you think out of one of the prospects one can be world champ? My bet would be duddy ( seems he will get a shot first) or lee( who i prefer to watch).

Well the book 'The Fighting Irish'- Inside The Ring With Boxing's Celtic Warriors by Roger Anderson is a pretty good read which goes back to the very roots of Irish boxing and starts with the famous Dan Donnelly(I'm sure you're familiar with the name and his arm) and comes forward till about 6/7 years ago with Eamon Magee.

In truth though all you need to know about Irish boxing can probably be found online, I can't point you in any particular direction though but there is plenty of stuff on Irish fighters out there.

metropol wrote:Is hylands card going to be covered on tv? With egan focusing on the irish title , its good news. Do you know whether his cards will get tv coverege?

Hyland's next fight will be promoted by his father and is unlikely to be on tv, but there is a good chance of youtube clips of the action like there was at Hyland's last bill.

Egan for the moment will probably(and I am making assumptions) retain TV3 coverage but he'll want to make sure the viewing figures are good(not sure what they were for the Moore card).

A better choice of Arena is needed aswell, the National Basketball Arena was a terrible result and was one of the main reason for the very poor crowd last time. That certainly won't have impressed TV3 much but I've no doubt that the crowds will improve.

I think we've gone a little off-topic here though.

Yeah we have strayed a little. Thanks for the info. Here in the middle of ireland no one around my age is into boxing ( maybe casual but not knowledgebale). Looking foward to seeing paulies career advance he has got talent , hopfully he can deliver. Agree about the choice of arena terrible , also needed better promotion. I think the " 3 hyland brothers " bill would have sold out the arena with promotion, after all do any of the public know about this bill?

Moore was just marking time while waiting for a bigger fight, so why not bag another belt while he does so? Sure it means less than a british title fight, but it also means more than a non-title fight. Would you say he was going backwards if he just fought a routine 8x3?

What I'm not sure I'm sure I'm okay with

Come on BigEars, that is hilarious!

Carlos-Wigan wrote:
I'm Welsh/Peruvian and born in England.

You can't understand how a person of dual nationality feels unless you are one - you aren't your sons - you are better asking your sons. (if they are old enough)

Because I'm English does not mean I have to support the England football team for example, lots of English people don't - especially around Liverpool and Manchester where their allegiance is to the Republic of Ireland - maybe thats to do with England never playing up north apart from the era wembley was being built.

I wasn't forced to think one way or nationality was better than the other though English and not Spanish was spoken in our home, but being Peruvian is a very important part of who I am and I'm not going to deny myself any alligiances towards that country because I was born English.

Its not all one or the other.

My mother is Cuban, my father Peruvian... I was born and raised in Peru but have lived in the U.S. my whole adult life (mainly among Cubans here in Miami) so identity is quite an issue with me too.

I have it easy compared to my newborn niece though. Get this: My sister is half Cuban/half Peruvian like me and born and raised in Peru, moved to France and married a Half French/Half Peruvian guy, born and raised in France. He works for a French bank and his company sent him to Panama for a few years... so last month they had their first daughter.

She is a Panamanian born, half Peruvian, one quarter French, one quarter Cuban beautiful baby.

T.M.K wrote:

ps: Now as someone who married a German, please do not speak to me like I don't understand the concept and/or the opportunities that being of 2 descents brings to a child - my boys are English-with-a-German-mother and at the end of the day they were born/bred/rasised/educated etc here. Germany is a very important part which will never be denied to them, but playing one off versus the other is not in my or my wife's nature. I know ODLH has been the best at switching in recent years: Mexican when it suits him and American when he needs to be..... but lets try to keep it in perspective and not go OTT.

Im really am asking out of interest, not anything else racial/social or anything else.

:-)

*yawn*.....

Thanks for the carefully worded caveat. Without it, being incredibly thick, I might have completely misinterpreted your post and descended into a volley of verbal abuse about how racist and socially divisive you are.

Without doubt it is just opportunism, sprinkled with a degree of romanticism. Eastman is the former, Moore the later.