BoxRec

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:

scurlaruntings wrote:

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:Its kind of odd that the boxrec forum reveres fighters like Richard Williams (decent enough fighter, got his chance, didnt happen but frankly never good enough for the top, or anywhere near) and when they finally retire its all "respect" "talented" "politics" "thanks" etc


But, say, Ricky Hatton its all "fraud" "ducking" "Witter" "Joke" etc

A psychologist would have a lot to say about that.....

You seem to casually forget the massive and glaring diffrence in OPPORTUNITY! Richard Williams STILL had a job and was doing meals on wheels to make the ends meet. Ricky was fed the silver spoon made millions off defences of the WBU under the auspices of WORLD TITLE action - bearing in mind the WBU was an organisation run from a cottage in Norwich that had as much credibility as George Bush`s tenure as president -

Ricky has NEVER had to fight for anything. It was handed to him on a plate. When he was supposed to fight Witter he made up a plethora of excuses and 10 years later the fight STILL hasnt happened and now has no meaning. Thus he denied the hardcore British fans the fight we truly wanted as well as making a nice buck of us at the gate.

You also conviniently forget that Martinez has had a VERY succesful career and apart from 1 loss to Margarito is treading the exact same path Ricky trod.

Boxing is a tough game. The WORKING man will ALWAYS get respect. Ricky beats the drum repeatedly that he`s "one of the lads" but how can he be considering his whole career has been wrapped in cotton woll and is entirely hinged on a win over a fighter who had one foot in retirement.

What on gods name are you rambling on about?

I think these 3 points

Ricky was fed the silver spoon

his whole career has been wrapped in cotton woll

Ricky has NEVER had to fight for anything

Are perhaps the most misguided things i have ever read here, and by god have i read some tripe on here

Are you talking about this Ricky Hatton? (pictured here in his trademark cotton wool)




or this one (pictured here before his fight with Floyd Mayweather)




yes i agree Counter-puncher

what an excellent post

A laughable retort. The same Jon Thaxton that cut him to ribbons! Oh please if you want a debate on semantics find someone else. If you want to deal with facts take the blue bill and come and see me outside the Matrix.

Arnie wrote:Hope he enjoys the rest of hes life outside the ropes. I thought he was the best of the bunch out of all the lightmiddles. Very classy.

He certainly was. It was a dam shame we never saw him against Adrian Stone or Steve Roberts. Williams career was marred by niggly injuries. Matters not as he ticks all the boxes in my book.

why are u even arguing about ricky hatton and richard williams concerning the treatment of the 2.

hatton proved himself to be one of the best fighters in the world.

williams wasn't even the best in europe at light middle or middle.

and with the likes of DG supporting him u can understand why he didn't sell many tickets.

hitman_hatton1 wrote:why are u even arguing about ricky hatton and richard williams concerning the treatment of the 2.

hatton proved himself to be one of the best fighters in the world.

williams wasn't even the best in europe at light middle or middle.

and with the likes of DG supporting him u can understand why he didn't sell many tickets.

We dont even know if he was the best fighter in Britain.. And yet he`s the best fighter at 140 on the basis of a victory over a semi retired Kostya 3 years ago?

Arnie wrote:Hope he enjoys the rest of hes life outside the ropes. I thought he was the best of the bunch out of all the lightmiddles. Very classy.

Is that you Farnell? I will pass that on to him - yo were Light Middle then also, right?

scurlaruntings wrote:We dont even know if he was the best fighter in Britain.. And yet he`s the best fighter at 140 on the basis of a victory over a semi retired Kostya 3 years ago?

tszyu could come out of retirement now and bounce right handers off witter's nugget.

williams didn't prove himself the best in britain either.

least hatton practically cleared out the other domestic 140 pounders at the time.

witter didn't even beat magee during his 15 ko's over taxi drivers.

hitman_hatton1 wrote:

scurlaruntings wrote:We dont even know if he was the best fighter in Britain.. And yet he`s the best fighter at 140 on the basis of a victory over a semi retired Kostya 3 years ago?

tszyu could come out of retirement now and bounce right handers off witter's nugget.

williams didn't prove himself the best in britain either.

least hatton practically cleared out the other domestic 140 pounders at the time.

witter didn't even beat magee during his 15 ko's over taxi drivers.

People

Richard Williams dd not PROVE he was the best because he did not get the fights - but we all know he would start favourite over Takaloo - Roberts etc - only Wayne Alexander had a chance and that's a punchers!

HitmanHatton1 - go and suck Hattons bottom on another thread.

hitman_hatton1 wrote:why are u even arguing about ricky hatton and richard williams concerning the treatment of the 2.

hatton proved himself to be one of the best fighters in the world.

williams wasn't even the best in europe at light middle or middle.

and with the likes of DG supporting him u can understand why he didn't sell many tickets.

Tunbrige Wells very own answer to Quentin Crisp.

I know Khaosai Galaxy can be deliberately "anti-establishment", but he often makes a good point, although rubs people up the wrong way in doing so.

He was perfectly correct to counter the argument of "Williams never got the chances he deserved" by pointing out that he lost to Martinez twice. Yes, Martinez is a highly-rated class act, which therefore proves he DID get his shot at the top. What's your beef with that??

oliverfennell wrote:I know Khaosai Galaxy can be deliberately "anti-establishment", but he often makes a good point, although rubs people up the wrong way in doing so.

He was perfectly correct to counter the argument of "Williams never got the chances he deserved" by pointing out that he lost to Martinez twice. Yes, Martinez is a highly-rated class act, which therefore proves he DID get his shot at the top. What's your beef with that??

Shot at the top?
Remind me - who was the Champion in the first fight? Williams was and Martinez was a voluntary.

KG just likes to act the idiot. I would class shot at the top as a shot at a TOP 4 World Title.

Williams never did get that shot.

Lockett lost to Tsarenko - yes he won the rematch but he got his shot against Pavlik.

Takalooo lost to Jawaid Khaliq and others yet got a shot at Santos.

Wayne Alexander got his shot at Harry Simon.

Who had....
Lockett beaten?
Takaloo?
Wayne Alexander?

I would say that RWs record more than matches up against those guys. He battered Shannon Taylor who had only lost to Shane Mosley and some other guy 6 months earlier. Shannon Taylor went on to take Abrahams 12 for the World Title years later.

Life is not fair, we all now that - but I think RW had 1 REAL opportunity and that was against HOWARD EASTMAN

AND I GUARANTEE YOU THAT WAYNE ALEXANDER TURNED DOWN £100K TO FIGHT HOWARD.

LOCKETT SAID HE WANTS NO PART OF HOWARD

and I am sure Takaloo would know better than to risk 1 round with Howard.

Richard fought him.

Case closed.

Yes, he did do more than those you mentioned, but the fact remains that he lost convincingly at world level, regardless of what belts were or were not at stake.

Should he have had another chance a la Takaloo, Lockett et al? Maybe, maybe not. But the point is, he DID get an opportunity at the next level, and he lost.

No shame in that, and I too was a big fan of his, but perpetrating the myth about him being an avoided/denied world-beater is inaccurate. If it was true, he would have delivered on at least one of his THREE trips to world class (and no, I don't consider Shannan Taylor world class).

oliverfennell wrote:Yes, he did do more than those you mentioned, but the fact remains that he lost convincingly at world level, regardless of what belts were or were not at stake.

Should he have had another chance a la Takaloo, Lockett et al? Maybe, maybe not. But the point is, he DID get an opportunity at the next level, and he lost.

No shame in that, and I too was a big fan of his, but perpetrating the myth about him being an avoided/denied world-beater is inaccurate. If it was true, he would have delivered on at least one of his THREE trips to world class (and no, I don't consider Shannan Taylor world class).

1) Glad you agree he did more that the others.
2) Martinez counts as 1 trip - its the opponent. Mosley lost twice to 1 man in Forrest.
3) Howard Eastman fight is no disgrace but a more active RW would have performed better even though he performed well.

All I will say is that there was too much inactivity that was not of RWs doing.

Shannon Taylor was considered World Class when he fought a PRIME Mosley 6 months earlier when he was something like 30-0.

Shannon Taylor was good enough to last 12 with Abrahams years later.

Richard stopped him in 4.

If you are World Class in June then you are World Class in December, imo.

And then to last the distance on a World Title fight years later against Abrahams shows Shannon Taylor had/has class.

Abrahams beat Howard Eastman and destroyed Miranda the other day.

None of the other Light Middles has a Taylor type win on their record OR had courage to fight Eastman.

And when up at Middle Wayne and Lockett swerved Eastman for the British -Commomwealth and European belts..why?

SO he would vacate and they would have an easy ride to the belts.

RW said yes to HE for the British!

Yes, Big Fan of RW myself but all bias aside.. he was smoooth!

oliverfennell wrote:Yes, he did do more than those you mentioned, but the fact remains that he lost convincingly at world level, regardless of what belts were or were not at stake.

Should he have had another chance a la Takaloo, Lockett et al? Maybe, maybe not. But the point is, he DID get an opportunity at the next level, and he lost.

No shame in that, and I too was a big fan of his, but perpetrating the myth about him being an avoided/denied world-beater is inaccurate. If it was true, he would have delivered on at least one of his THREE trips to world class (and no, I don't consider Shannan Taylor world class).

just wasn't good enuff was he.

tell it straight.

right down the middle of stockwell high street.

hitman_hatton1 wrote:

oliverfennell wrote:Yes, he did do more than those you mentioned, but the fact remains that he lost convincingly at world level, regardless of what belts were or were not at stake.

Should he have had another chance a la Takaloo, Lockett et al? Maybe, maybe not. But the point is, he DID get an opportunity at the next level, and he lost.

No shame in that, and I too was a big fan of his, but perpetrating the myth about him being an avoided/denied world-beater is inaccurate. If it was true, he would have delivered on at least one of his THREE trips to world class (and no, I don't consider Shannan Taylor world class).

just wasn't good enuff was he.

tell it straight.

right down the middle of stockwell high street.

There is no Stockwell High Street and if there were you would be hanging from a street lamp with your diseased cutaway chaps on getting a good kicking!

Did RW get a shot at a TOP 4 World Title belt like Takaloo - Alexander and Lockett did even thought he fought better opposition and beat better oppositon? NO!

The only decent guys Wayne/Takaloo and Lockett fought were

Wayne...Harry Simon THE WORLD CHAMP

Lockett..Pavlik THE WORLD CHAMP

Takaloo...Santos THE WORLD CHAMP

Based on the achievements of especially Takaloo and Lockett - RW deserved his shot

Remember - Bernard Hopkins boxed on the back foot all night against Howard because he knew to mix it would be too dangerous for him.

Who knows, maybe RW woud have got the World Title shot if he was with Fwank Wankerus, we will never know.

DG. wrote:Remember - Bernard Hopkins boxed on the back foot all night against Howard because he knew to mix it would be too dangerous for him.

ha ha don't kid yaself.

hopkins has boxed that way consistently in the last 5 or 6 yrs.

he's put pressure on joppy and taylor late on.

oh yeah and oscar in that 9th rd.

aside from that it's virtually stick and move tactics all the way.

eastman was a good fighter though.

i remember i missed the eastman-williams KO cos the pizza man called round.

hitman_hatton1 wrote:

DG. wrote:Remember - Bernard Hopkins boxed on the back foot all night against Howard because he knew to mix it would be too dangerous for him.

ha ha don't kid yaself.

hopkins has boxed that way consistently in the last 5 or 6 yrs.

he's put pressure on joppy and taylor late on.

oh yeah and oscar in that 9th rd.

aside from that it's virtually stick and move tactics all the way.

eastman was a good fighter though.

i remember i missed the eastman-williams KO cos the pizza man called round.

That's your own fault

Fancy ordering a pizza while the fights on you fanny

hitman_hatton1 wrote:

DG. wrote:Remember - Bernard Hopkins boxed on the back foot all night against Howard because he knew to mix it would be too dangerous for him.

ha ha don't kid yaself.

hopkins has boxed that way consistently in the last 5 or 6 yrs.

he's put pressure on joppy and taylor late on.

oh yeah and oscar in that 9th rd.

aside from that it's virtually stick and move tactics all the way.

eastman was a good fighter though.

i remember i missed the eastman-williams KO cos the pizza man called round.

Hopkins put no pressure on Eastman.

Two of South Londons best fighting and you order a Pizza? chav!

I understand both of the arguments in here: 1) Regarding Richard Williams getting his shot against Martinez TWICE and failing both times, and 2) That Ricky Hatton is an overhyped club fighter.

Both are correct. Richard Williams however, is a far slicker and better talent than Hatton. Martinez would've wiped the floor with Hatton if they met, which if we consider some of Ricky's touted opponents size-wise pre-Floyd, was not beyond the realms of possibility.

Hatton was definitely a spoon fed fighter becasue he was with Warren, who is a notoriously light matchmaker/promoter.

When it's all said and done however, no one will remember Richard Williams, and that is a crying shame. F**k Ricky Hatton. He couldn't even look good against a blown up, old lightweight. I hope Paulie boxes his square head off.

Gray-Fox wrote:


Both are correct. Richard Williams however, is a far slicker and better talent than Hatton. Martinez would've wiped the floor with Hatton if they met, which if we consider some of Ricky's touted opponents size-wise pre-Floyd, was not beyond the realms of possibility.

Well said.

Gray-Fox wrote:I understand both of the arguments in here: 1) Regarding Richard Williams getting his shot against Martinez TWICE and failing both times, and 2) That Ricky Hatton is an overhyped club fighter.

Both are correct. Richard Williams however, is a far slicker and better talent than Hatton. Martinez would've wiped the floor with Hatton if they met, which if we consider some of Ricky's touted opponents size-wise pre-Floyd, was not beyond the realms of possibility.

Hatton was definitely a spoon fed fighter becasue he was with Warren, who is a notoriously light matchmaker/promoter.

When it's all said and done however, no one will remember Richard Williams, and that is a crying shame. F**k Ricky Hatton. He couldn't even look good against a blown up, old lightweight. I hope Paulie boxes his square head off.

Martinez just turned out to be step ahead of RW.

I agree with all you points.

Hatton took the easy route to the big fights and if anyone is honest he is at best at the lower end of World Class.
Urango hugging all the time and the 'war' with Collazo trounched by Mosley have shown that along with Maussa .

He was NEVER in it against PBF.

Richard Williams will be remembered by some of us when they show previous commonwealth winners in years to come, Hatton will most likely be on a chat show somewhere just because he likes a pint and a pie.

Boxing, you gotta love it.

Talent gets you only so far when a fat pikey like Hatton can be worth £10M plus for telling bad jokes and beating old inactive shot fighters.

Met Richard Williams just before his victory over the tragic Andrew Murray. Smashing bloke and I'm sure he'd be the first to acknowledge Hatton's achievements also and would be a bit horrified to hear a 'fan' of his just trash talking another fighter.

don't call it a comeback wrote:Met Richard Williams just before his victory over the tragic Andrew Murray. Smashing bloke and I'm sure he'd be the first to acknowledge Hatton's achievements also and would be a bit horrified to hear a 'fan' of his just trash talking another fighter.

I really do not think he would wopuld give a flying......look, its about opinions.

Horrified? are you kidding me?



Hatton has achieved and WE ALL ACKNOWLEDGE THAT - hes stinkingrich and won 789 titles 200 weight divisions(as he tells us everyday) - don't get me wrong!

But his 'talent' is a lot less than even a Sharmba Mitchell or Paulie Maliginaggi imo. He has overachieved by great matchmaking and having this cheeky chav persona.

As a skilled boxer I do no rate him.

Are you 'horrified'?

:P

Me? No.

But I once saw a man lose control of his bowels on a train, so the bar is set high.

don't call it a comeback wrote:Me? No.

But I once saw a man lose control of his bowels on a train, so the bar is set high.

Tell the forum, where did you meet MARK THOMPSON? - what train was he on?