BoxRec

BIGMARK wrote:come on people its obvious the khan calling kotelnick the worst world champ was tongue in cheek as he no doubt knew he was going to be fighting him.

No, he didn't.

J wrote:guys come on, we know Amir aint got the best chin what do you want frank to do stick him in with Valero?

Have alook at Hopkins first ten defences hardly frikken stellar oppo was it.

Some of you guys are seriously deluded.

All the general public is going to get now is how Khan is getting his deserved shot at THE world title when it's not even the proper WBA one.

You can come out with the argument that they are all playing the game, doing what's best for them, etc...but it doesn't mean anyone with the integrity of boxing at heart has to like it.

If ANYONE can explain to me who Amir Khan deserves any kind of shot at a light-welter 'world' title, I'm happy to listen. And don't do it by saying far shitter fighters than him have had cracks at it.

It's bollocks, again.

Finch wrote:I hope Buncey tells it straight with them.

Fwank and Khan must think we're stupid. The sad reality of it is i feel they will con the average joe in the street but people more into their boxing know it's an undeserving fraud and i feel it's insulting.

I'm disgusted this fight is allowed, it epitomises everything wrong with boxing.

Get over it.

There have been worse things and careers, i.e. Calzaghe's

BIGMARK wrote:

Ian 'Mr' McNeilly wrote:

J wrote:guys come on, we know Amir aint got the best chin what do you want frank to do stick him in with Valero?

Have alook at Hopkins first ten defences hardly frikken stellar oppo was it.

Some of you guys are seriously deluded.

All the general public is going to get now is how Khan is getting his deserved shot at THE world title when it's not even the proper WBA one.

You can come out with the argument that they are all playing the game, doing what's best for them, etc...but it doesn't mean anyone with the integrity of boxing at heart has to like it.

If ANYONE can explain to me who Amir Khan deserves any kind of shot at a light-welter 'world' title, I'm happy to listen. And don't do it by saying far shitter fighters than him have had cracks at it.

It's bollocks, again.

Ian but if you are going to have a go at Khan and Warren have a go at boxing in general because its a part of the sport i hate when i see a fighter get a shot at a title when he doesnt deserve it. For Amir Khan's WBA title shot there are 100's of other examples and a lot of them close to home which are just as bad and since when has boxing had Integrity? i am not trying to get into a slagging match but wake up and smell the coffee, why do you think Don King is so rich ?

Oh, I agree with everything you say here Mark mate. (Except perhaps asking when boxing had integrity...though I understand this too...I'd like to think it always has on one level and never has on another, if you get me.)

I think I particularly object to Khan because he's very close to home and in a couple of months we'll have 90% of Joe Public and even worse, the national sports media, telling us he's the next best thing since sliced bread - again.

I feel a bit guilty because the lad himself seems canny enough.

When I grew up a world title shot was a really big thing...god knows how real old timers feel.

BIGMARK wrote:

[quote="Ian 'Mr' McNeilly
Oh, I agree with everything you say here Mark mate. (Except perhaps asking when boxing had integrity...though I understand this too...I'd like to think it always has on one level and never has on another, if you get me.)

I think I particularly object to Khan because he's very close to home and in a couple of months we'll have 90% of Joe Public and even worse, the national sports media, telling us he's the next best thing since sliced bread - again.

I feel a bit guilty because the lad himself seems canny enough.

When I grew up a world title shot was a really big thing...god knows how real old timers feel.

i understand where you're coming from about Joe Public and a lot of media but as someone pointed out the other day in a Hatton thread in many ways fighters like Khan and Hatton are good for the sport. When i say good, i mean in a way that they getting boxing in the papers and putting it in the public eye, the reason we have such a good bunch of fighters coming through now is the affect of the Bruno, Benn, Lewis, Eubank, Naz etc years which got kids into the gyms because they wanted to be like their idols. As for the old timers nothing has really changed as boxing has always been a cruel sport and a lot of the time its not the guy who deserves shot but the guy who sells the tickets who gets the chance. This has been true since the days of Jack Johnson to the present and its why boxing a lot of the time drives the fans mad.[/quote]

Absolutely.

But when we stop saying it drives us mad, we're really in trouble!

If we didn't have politics and everyone fought who they should, what the fkk would be discuss.

There have been armfuls of threads about politics, the mismatches, the bodies, the ducking, the diving and probably 3 per great fight.

Its the mess that makes it interesting, if you have cream every day you get fat and bored, if you have cream now and then you crave it.

DavidPayne wrote:If we didn't have politics and everyone fought who they should, what the fkk would be discuss.

There have been armfuls of threads about politics, the mismatches, the bodies, the ducking, the diving and probably 3 per great fight.

Its the mess that makes it interesting, if you have cream every day you get fat and bored, if you have cream now and then you crave it.

Yeah, I mean I wouldn't want to win the lottery because I'd get so fed up with lighting cigars with £20 notes.

Actually I do know what you mean, David.

But given a choice between 'interesting' politics and having one champion in each division, I wouldn't have to think twice.

Ian,

I'm with you, but you get what I mean.

I mean, aren't you tired of watching Liverpool v Chelsea?

DavidPayne wrote:Ian,

I'm with you, but you get what I mean.

I mean, aren't you tired of watching Liverpool v Chelsea?

For sure. But I'm even more sick of watching Middlesbrough and Darlington. Then again, I wouldn't if they weren't shit.

Totally get your point.

I know that Khan was entering into the spirit of the question - Ricky named Junior and Carl named Joe!! It was Khan humour my friends.
I can see a Bunce in the Argentine steak house in Mexico city with King's beefy paw on my shoulder moment...
Khan and Kotelnik is terrific...that's my spiel and it will stay that way.

Adios.

Terry D wrote:Khan has got a WBA title shot because he can get one, he has the clout, the connections and the profile to jump the queue ahead of everyone else. I think allegedly has done a great job with Khan since the Prescott loss. Khan's indecent haste to get to a title has seen him up in weight and stepping into the realm of big(ish) fights before his chin can get shattered again. It is a great move, plus he can swerve Prescott, Romanov and Murray. Hatton will retire down the line, say that Khan, by then the WBA champ, is his successor, and off they go.

Next thing you know you are sat there minding your own business, someone mentions Khan, you mention his chin (quietly, if the sound wave hits Bolton it may well knock the lad spark out) and the other guy says, "Well Khan has won a world title and would batter those old guys like Hagler and Hearns, they would be smaller than him, innit?"

lmao

brilliant - and bang on the money

I have been busy away from boxing the last few weeks and have some catching up to do.
I might be talking out of my arse here - but wasn't the Barrera fight the last on the contract with Wazza, and the last on the contract between Khan and Sky ?
If so I assume Khan has signed a new deal with Wazza ?
Is there a contract with Sky ?
What happened to all this going it alone crap - prior to Prescott ?

Can someone repeat the Don King steak house story please?

Don King goes into a steakhouse. Unfortunately for him, Mike Tyson is there and he gets 'tenderised'.

Ian at what point in its long history has boxing been full of integrity?

Dating back to Johson, Dempsey's colour line, mob involvement, right through its sordid history shit like this has happened mate.


your too nice for this world mate

J wrote:Ian at what point in its long history has boxing been full of integrity?

Dating back to Johson, Dempsey's colour line, mob involvement, right through its sordid history shit like this has happened mate.


your too nice for this world mate

Ha ha! You're right, of course. Strange that, at its more basic level (i.e. the actual boxing and respect afterwards) is full of integrity.

But if people like me don't whinge, where are we then?

(I know, in a much quieter world )

Terry D wrote:Boxing has some integrity (nobility of the warrior and all that) but was born out of vice and corruption. It is like a sleazy woman, you do not know where she has been (or where she is going next), but you find it hard to put her down.

Yes, I've thought this myself, perhaps more in relation to football...which is even worse.

I see football (and to a far lesser extent, boxing) like a girlfriend you were once deeply in love with. Not just any girl...the one you were going to walk up the aisle with, have kids, the lot.

But you weren't enough for her so she f*cked off and started shagging around with all and sundry, some real shitbags. And everyone knows it.

But she keeps coming back and stupid you end up shagging her again, often. You can't help yourself even though it rips your heart out.

What you and J are telling me is that she was always a c*nt, too and I just didn't know it.

(I need to get out more, FFS )

By eck it gets wild and wooly in Mansfied dunt it?

agree the fighters in the ring are in general behaving with inegrity and honesty certinaly much more so that footballers, the only sport I can think iof with a similar ethic is rugby as far as that is concerned.

However dealings out of the ring and all that goes with it...well we know bout that dont we...

interesting chat so far though chaps!

Who is the "proper" WBA champion?

The last WBA "Super" Champion was Hatton after he beat Maussa in 2005, combining WBA with IBF meaning he was the WBA Super Champion. After that fight Hatton moved up, got stripped, and the WBA "ordinary" title has been the only "world" title used by the WBA at the weight.

twenty six wrote:I have been busy away from boxing the last few weeks and have some catching up to do.
I might be talking out of my arse here - but wasn't the Barrera fight the last on the contract with Wazza, and the last on the contract between Khan and Sky ?
If so I assume Khan has signed a new deal with Wazza ?
Is there a contract with Sky ?
What happened to all this going it alone crap - prior to Prescott ?

I think Khan has one fight left. I thought he signed a four fight deal prior to Prescott.

Going it alone crap... I think it was just rumour and all, I don't think it was every concrete.

BIGMARK wrote:

stujones wrote:Who is the "proper" WBA champion?

The last WBA "Super" Champion was Hatton after he beat Maussa in 2005, combining WBA with IBF meaning he was the WBA Super Champion. After that fight Hatton moved up, got stripped, and the WBA "ordinary" title has been the only "world" title used by the WBA at the weight.

they dont have a super champ at 140 but KOTELNIK is the champ or super champ in waiting

So he is the "proper" WBA champion.... I'm not going into the debate on whether there should be one champion or not - but he is the proper WBA champion?

This is where I think Boxrec stance of calling the non Super WBA champion "ordinary" has confused the issue further- this, I do not think is a WBA stance, but a boxrec stance. Even in situations like this, where there is no WBA "Super Champion", the regular champion and the ONLY champion recognised by the WBA is now called "ordinary"... which I think does the boxer a disservice and also flatters a WBA "ordinary" titlist when there is a Super Champion. Looking at the records now, it looks like Muhammad Ali held the exact same belt as Bernard Dunne is now holding (there is a WBA Super champion at Super Bantam).. love to meet the Super Champion when Ali was around.

Kotelnik might not be "the" champion or he might not be "the man", but he is THE proper WBA recongised champion... the only fighter at Light Welter holding the WBA belt... which is something it seems some the critics of this world title legitmacy have argued otherwise.