BoxRec

No chance Lee would last as long as Murray.

expe wrote: HBO are backing Golovkin big time.

Eddie Hearn says Golovkin v Froch isn't PPV in the States so that can't be true...! :)

Ridiculous from Collins and Woodhall 'Murray should have pushed him back' Yeah easier said than done guys. There's a reason noone has managed it.

A prime Collins probably could have lasted the distance against GGG though.

Riddick Blowe wrote:Ridiculous from Collins and Woodhall 'Murray should have pushed him back' Yeah easier said than done guys. There's a reason noone has managed it.

A prime Collins probably could have lasted the distance against GGG though.

I found Collins' assertion that GGG needs to move up in weight to be odd. Gennady looks small at the weight and there are some big fights there - Cotto, Quillin, Lee. I think he could even fight at lt middle or catch weight against Mayweather

reggaereggae wrote:

Riddick Blowe wrote:Ridiculous from Collins and Woodhall 'Murray should have pushed him back' Yeah easier said than done guys. There's a reason noone has managed it.

A prime Collins probably could have lasted the distance against GGG though.

I found Collins' assertion that GGG needs to move up in weight to be odd. Gennady looks small at the weight and there are some big fights there - Cotto, Quillin, Lee. I think he could even fight at lt middle or catch weight against Mayweather

Not much chance of getting Cotto or Quillin into a ring with him, Lee would be more likely, but he'd have to beat Quillin and Saunders first. He could stay at middleweight and carry on beating the fornicate out of everyone there, but to find someone that will challenge him and the career defining, big money fights, he will probably have to move, whether that's up or down remains to be seen.

reggaereggae wrote:

Riddick Blowe wrote:Ridiculous from Collins and Woodhall 'Murray should have pushed him back' Yeah easier said than done guys. There's a reason noone has managed it.

A prime Collins probably could have lasted the distance against GGG though.

I found Collins' assertion that GGG needs to move up in weight to be odd. Gennady looks small at the weight and there are some big fights there - Cotto, Quillin, Lee. I think he could even fight at lt middle or catch weight against Mayweather

Agree 100%, he really looks small for 160....when you think of the great middleweights, Hagler for instance, he just seems much bigger than Golovkin...though checking GG is actually taller.
But he should stay at 160 I think...

johnswan1 wrote:I think the only man who can stop GGG at Middle is Lee. He is not difficult to hit and Lee has the punch to take anybody out.

Biased quote of the century :)

Matchmaking for the British lads after tonights fights -

Murray vs. Martinez/Soliman/Rubio/Korobov
Smith vs. Periban/Davis/Douglin/Sjekloca
Price vs. Chagaev/Scott/Meehan
Fury vs. Lewison/Bakhtov/Sexton

ShadrachSimmo wrote:No chance Lee would last as long as Murray.

Lee may not last as long but I've give him more of a shot of winning than I'd give Murray as he offers a lot more offensively and GGG is not difficult to hit. Lee has been putting opponents to sleep, Murray has never done that.

Lee wouldn't last three rounds with Golovkin.

The statement isn't that Lee is more durable than Murray, it's that he is better offensively so has more of a shot of winning. Murray last eleven rounds but didn't trouble Golovkin in the slightest. If Lee lands right he can hurt anybody, that's why I think he's one of the only guys out there I'd give a punchers chance to.

johnswan1 wrote:The statement isn't that Lee is more durable than Murray, it's that he is better offensively so has more of a shot of winning. Murray last eleven rounds but didn't trouble Golovkin in the slightest. If Lee lands right he can hurt anybody, that's why I think he's one of the only guys out there I'd give a punchers chance to.

Lee won't hurt Golovkin even if he does land. Plus he is more limited than Murray and Golovkin would see him off easily.

Ian1973 wrote:

johnswan1 wrote:The statement isn't that Lee is more durable than Murray, it's that he is better offensively so has more of a shot of winning. Murray last eleven rounds but didn't trouble Golovkin in the slightest. If Lee lands right he can hurt anybody, that's why I think he's one of the only guys out there I'd give a punchers chance to.

Lee won't hurt Golovkin even if he does land.

So you know for a fact that one of the most concussive punchers at the weight couldn't put a dent in him despite not having fought anybody with similar power? Every fighter can be hurt. Stevens probably the hardest hitter he has faced, but Lee is better and hits harder IMO. Lee would be a huge underdog but the only people I'd give any sort of chance to would be a master boxer (none at the weight, but Ward above), or a puncher (Lee being one of the best at Middle).

johnswan1 wrote:

Ian1973 wrote:

johnswan1 wrote:The statement isn't that Lee is more durable than Murray, it's that he is better offensively so has more of a shot of winning. Murray last eleven rounds but didn't trouble Golovkin in the slightest. If Lee lands right he can hurt anybody, that's why I think he's one of the only guys out there I'd give a punchers chance to.

Lee won't hurt Golovkin even if he does land.

So you know for a fact that one of the most concussive punchers at the weight couldn't put a dent in him despite not having fought anybody with similar power? Every fighter can be hurt. Stevens probably the hardest hitter he has faced, but Lee is better and hits harder IMO. Lee would be a huge underdog but the only people I'd give any sort of chance to would be a master boxer (none at the weight, but Ward above), or a puncher (Lee being one of the best at Middle).

You wait and see ................... if they do fight. I guarantee you Lee won't get to the forth round.

wesshaw1985 wrote:Matchmaking for the British lads after tonights fights -

Murray vs. Martinez/Soliman/Rubio/Korobov
Smith vs. Periban/Davis/Douglin/Sjekloca
Price vs. Chagaev/Scott/Meehan
Fury vs. Lewison/Bakhtov/Sexton

I would go with
Murray vs Daniel Jacobs or the winner of the vacant IBF
Smith vs rebrasse or winner of mahoummidi vs hilario for ebu
Price vs chisora or chagaev for vacant ebu
Fury vs Michael sprott
Haskins vs ceja or hall

I agree if he didn't land the Knockout punch early enough he would get stopped. You keep forgetting that the point I'm making is not about durability. Murray is a lot more durable than Lee.

johnswan1 wrote:I agree if he didn't land the Knockout punch early enough he would get stopped. You keep forgetting that the point I'm making is not about durability. Murray is a lot more durable than Lee.

But Lee was getting beat in both of his last two fights before pulling the big shot out. He wouldn't last long enough to find the big shot if he boxed like that against Golovkin.

mickey1975 wrote:

johnswan1 wrote:I agree if he didn't land the Knockout punch early enough he would get stopped. You keep forgetting that the point I'm making is not about durability. Murray is a lot more durable than Lee.

But Lee was getting beat in both of his last two fights before pulling the big shot out. He wouldn't last long enough to find the big shot if he boxed like that against Golovkin.

To be fair that's not really relevant to John's argument, which is that if (by hook or by crook) Lee could land the right hook on Golovkin before getting KO'd himself it would be enough to get GGG out of there.

I'm not sure that Lee has that kind of power myself. Jackson was fairly untested, and Koborov was not sparked out cold. Don't get be wrong, nobody wants to get his with that shot but I'm not sure it's a fight ender every single time.

Golovkin has shown no durability issues Am or Pro that I know of.

mickey1975 wrote:

johnswan1 wrote:I agree if he didn't land the Knockout punch early enough he would get stopped. You keep forgetting that the point I'm making is not about durability. Murray is a lot more durable than Lee.

But Lee was getting beat in both of his last two fights before pulling the big shot out. He wouldn't last long enough to find the big shot if he boxed like that against Golovkin.

Landing a big shot depends more on opportunity than time spent in the ring, and nobody has had trouble landing on GGG. He comes forward with little regard for what his opponent has and leaves himself very open. If he has any weakness, that's it.

LEVELS


Says it all. Who does what. It's all about levels, no-one will beat Golovkin.

Ian1973 wrote:LEVELS


Says it all. Who does what. It's all about levels, no-one will beat Golovkin.

Someone will if he goes up in weight. Don't get me wrong, he looked brilliant last night but at the same time showed signs of being human. Murray took some heavy artillery and stood his ground well at times and threw some fire back.

GGG looked small as well compared to Murray in a similar way to how smith looked against AA obviously with the rresults being different. It would be interesting to know the fight night weights of AA and GGG for future reference

Ian1973 wrote:LEVELS

Says it all. Who does what. It's all about levels, no-one will beat Golovkin.

A lot of people think Ward would, but I just don't see it. Ward would be put in reverse like the rest of them because he just doesn't have enough power to keep GGG honest, and he can't just tie up GGG all fight long, at some point he would have to actually throw punches.

I actually think Froch would have more chance vs GGG than Ward because at least Froch has respectable power and is strong and tough enough to have a chance in the trenches. Although a younger and fresher Froch maybe...now I can imagine Carl being a bit past it.

Riddick Blowe wrote:

Ian1973 wrote:LEVELS

Says it all. Who does what. It's all about levels, no-one will beat Golovkin.

A lot of people think Ward would, but I just don't see it. Ward would be put in reverse like the rest of them because he just doesn't have enough power to keep GGG honest, and he can't just tie up GGG all fight long, at some point he would have to actually throw punches.

I actually think Froch would have more chance vs GGG than Ward because at least Froch has respectable power and is strong and tough enough to have a chance in the trenches. Although a younger and fresher Froch maybe...now I can imagine Carl being a bit past it.

Froch is too open defensively for me, he's got a great chin, but I don't think it would stand up to Golovkin's punches, would take something incredible to walk through punches like that for 12 rounds.

Riddick Blowe wrote:

Ian1973 wrote:LEVELS

Says it all. Who does what. It's all about levels, no-one will beat Golovkin.

A lot of people think Ward would, but I just don't see it. Ward would be put in reverse like the rest of them because he just doesn't have enough power to keep GGG honest, and he can't just tie up GGG all fight long, at some point he would have to actually throw punches.

I actually think Froch would have more chance vs GGG than Ward because at least Froch has respectable power and is strong and tough enough to have a chance in the trenches. Although a younger and fresher Froch maybe...now I can imagine Carl being a bit past it.

It's not all about power vs power though, it's about what you neutralise the threat from GGG. Otherwise Bruno would have faired better with Tyson than Holyfield (not an exact parallel, but you get what I mean)

Ward has a lot of skills in his armory and does a lot of stuff better than Golovkin. He fights on the inside as well as anyone, he's not just going to try and tie GGG up.

I thought Golovkin looked very comfortable throughout the fight. I dont think he ever needed to get out of first gear really. I thought that Murray could have used his jab more to try and make Golovkin think more and break up his attacks-but easy to say outside the ropes! Golovkin may have that rare ability to dominate opponents psychologically as well as physically.

He just looks so at home and ease in the ring. Murray is a good, experienced top level contender and Golovkin hardly looked out of breath at the end.

Take someone very special to beat him in the next two years imo.