BoxRec

raylawpc wrote:

CNorkusJr wrote:

raylawpc wrote:Hey Charley:

I did a little research and I was able to find out what happened to the mural. Apparently, it wasn't painted onto the wall, but was on canvas.

From the F.Y.I. in the NyTimes in 2000:

. . . And Still Champion

Q.: In the 1940's, the boxer Jack Dempsey had a restaurant on Broadway between West 49th and West 50th Streets. Behind the bar was a large mural of Dempsey's third-round knockout of Jess Willard on July 4, 1919. What happened to the painting?

A.: When Jack Dempsey's Restaurant closed its doors in 1974, the former champion and his wife donated the mural to the Smithsonian National Portrait Gallery in Washington. According to Fred Voss, a senior historian at the Smithsonian, the 6-by-18-foot oil has dominated the first-floor gallery devoted to sports figures ever since.

''When it came to us it was very brown,'' Mr. Voss said. ''I suppose it was from the cigar and cigarette smoke.''

The painting, commissioned by Mr. Dempsey himself, was unveiled in 1944, 25 years after the famous knockout in Toledo, Ohio, gained him the heavyweight crown. It was painted by James Montgomery Flagg, who was known for the scowling, finger-pointing Uncle Sam in his Army recruiting posters during World War I. In addition to the fighters, Mr. Flagg -- who worked from photographs taken at the bout -- painted some famous public figures among the onlookers, including Rube Goldberg, Damon Runyon and Max Baer. Mr. Dempsey paid him $12,500.

Jack Dempsey's Restaurant, which closed after the owners lost a legal dispute over the terms of the lease, was among the last of the old celebrity haunts on Broadway. During its waning years, Mr. Dempsey was a fixture in the corner booth, where he usually sat with his back to the window, greeting customers. He died in 1983 at 87.

One correction. He didn't sit with his back to the window. His seat was perpendicular to the window, so you could see his profile from the street.

I also found a photo of it:

Beautiful Find, Tom, I was in midtown yesterday when the mayor honored the guys from my firehouse for being the first firetrucks there at the terrorists car bomb threat. On my way out I stopped by the record store and took a look around. The front and the wall that the painting was on was all glass windows now. Incidental now, but thanks for the history post and picture. If you didnt find it, I'm sure my boys in the FDNY could have done a little careful wall inspection to see if it was hidden. Bottom line- it looks great right where it is and cleaned up too.

Charley, is this the record store where Dempsey's Restaurant was located?

"The Artists & Writers Club, as its label indicates, was origin­ally organized to gather certain members of the literary and art sets for occasional dinners and chatter, though often outsiders were admitted to our esoteric clan. Usually, we congregated in the up­stairs dining room of "21."

Sports columnist Grantland Rice, one of the original organ­izers, was president. After his death, cartoonist Rube Goldberg succeeded him. Goldberg usually was the master of ceremonies at our gatherings.

An account of just one meeting may convey some idea of what took place at these sessions. This one took place on December 7, 1944, and, of course, since December 7 was a memorable date in our history, there were solemn toasts to our fighting lads.

Then we turned to lighter subjects. Artist James Montgomery Flagg revealed his minor problems when he began painting that famous and much-discussed mural of the Dempsey-Willard fight that was to be hung in Jack Dempsey's restaurant.

"I didn't even know how sensitive some folks could be," he lamented. "Why, this fight was held back in 1919, and I painted in some folks who never were at that fight simply because Jack thought they were important and should be included. Do you know something? Some of them, and I'm not kidding, actually squawked because they didn't like the seats I put them in! And my friend Damon Runyon told me he wasn't too sure he even liked the people I put next to him in that painting."

Runyon was sitting at the fight between Hype Igoe and Tad Dorgan

KI

Finding this painting has great interest for me. Thanks for the heads up. Two things I will
see when time allows. this and the painting by George Bellows of Dempsey being knocked
out of the ring by Firpo onto Hype and others. The second painting hangs at the Ny Met.

KI

Freddie Roach's Wild Card Gym . . .

Stopped by with a friend today. Just missed Frankie Duarte, who works with fighters in the morning.
Freddie is in Canada with Amir Khan. The gym slows down when Freddie is out of town. That is, the Hollywood crowd thins out.
Had a nice visit with Freddie's older brother Pepper, or Pep.

Mostly amateurs on the floor at the time.
Showed my friend around the gym, the photos, a lot of L.A. history on the walls, fighters from the past.
Wish I had something of interest to report. Nada. We left.

A week from tomorrow night, Freddie will be in the corner of Amir Khan as he takes on Paulie Mali-whatever at Madison Square Garden.
A week after the fight I'll drop in then to say hello. Of course, I won't be alone.
All the Hollywood-types that wallpaper the gym when Roach is in the house will be back.

I'd love to see Mel Epstein walk into Wildcard when the Hollywood crowd is present. He might have an opinion?


-Rick Farris

Happy Birthday Randy . . .

Amir Khan’s American dream looms. The British boy makes his US debut in New York’s legendary Madison Square Garden next Saturday against brash and talented local man Paulie Malignaggi. While Las Vegas and its over-the-top hotels took over from New York as boxing’s major host from the late 1970s, The Garden is still shrouded in the history of big-time boxing, a place to rise to glorious victory or to sink to bitter defeat. It separates the men from the boys.
An Olympic silver medalist at 17, Khan won his medal as a one-man British boxing team in 2004. How lonely he must have felt squaring up to Cuban great Mario Kindelan in the lightweight final but the steely son of a scrap-metal merchant fought magnificently to concede a 30-22 verdict to a man whose victims included Miguel Cotto and Felix Trinidad. A year later, Amir lured "Super" Mario over here and took his revenge by 19-13 in his own hometown of Bolton. He was ready to hand in his vest.
Khan launched his pro campaign in Bolton in July 2005 with a quick dismissal of outgunned Londoner David Bailey. His hands were a blur as he reeled off 18 straight victories (14 early) before an unknown but unbeaten Colombian by the name of Breidis Prescott sparked him in 54 shocking seconds in Manchester in September 2007, dumping him twice. Khan now faced the second lonely climb of his career.
He made it look easy. In three inspired matches he toppled Irish brawler Oisin Fagin, Mexican great Marco Antonio Barrera and Ukrainian stylist Andreas Kotelnik, the latter for the the WBA light-welterweight title, a title he puts on the line against Brooklyn’s Malignaggi.
Khan makes his second defence. He disposed of another Brooklyn man, Dmitiry Salita, inside a round last December in Britain, dropping Salita three times and then rather ungraciously dropping his British backers to fight out of America, hence this showdown.
Malignaggi is better than Salita. He has good speed and a good chin but falls down on his power with just five career stoppages. Khan, who is even quicker but falls down (literally) on an ‘iffy’ chin, has nothing to fear this time. Watch him unload his lightning combinations, whip in his body blows, use the big ring and look a million dollars against a proud Italian with brittle hands and a history of soaking up punishment.
Khan, 23, dazzles Malignaggi on the way to a unanimous decision.

Rick Farris wrote:Happy Birthday Randy . . .

Happy Birthday Randy, and may you have as many or more than me.....

Rick Farris wrote:Freddie Roach's Wild Card Gym . . .

Stopped by with a friend today. Just missed Frankie Duarte, who works with fighters in the morning.
Freddie is in Canada with Amir Khan. The gym slows down when Freddie is out of town. That is, the Hollywood crowd thins out.
Had a nice visit with Freddie's older brother Pepper, or Pep.

Mostly amateurs on the floor at the time.
Showed my friend around the gym, the photos, a lot of L.A. history on the walls, fighters from the past.
Wish I had something of interest to report. Nada. We left.

A week from tomorrow night, Freddie will be in the corner of Amir Khan as he takes on Paulie Mali-whatever at Madison Square Garden.
A week after the fight I'll drop in then to say hello. Of course, I won't be alone.
All the Hollywood-types that wallpaper the gym when Roach is in the house will be back.

I'd love to see Mel Epstein walk into Wildcard when the Hollywood crowd is present. He might have an opinion?


-Rick Farris

Rick I used to see pepper in the golden gloves gym back in the 1980s when he was fighting, Freddie never trained there, I think he trained at Johnny Tocco's gym, maybe it was Joey Roach cause I used to get Joey and Pepper confused

Happy birthday Randy

Happy Birthday, Randy!

- Chuck Johnston

Copy both Bennie's and Rick's latest post to my blog, take a look.

http://westcoastboxersofyearsgoneby.blogspot.com/

THEHAMMER321 wrote:

Rick Farris wrote:Freddie Roach's Wild Card Gym . . .

Stopped by with a friend today. Just missed Frankie Duarte, who works with fighters in the morning.
Freddie is in Canada with Amir Khan. The gym slows down when Freddie is out of town. That is, the Hollywood crowd thins out.
Had a nice visit with Freddie's older brother Pepper, or Pep.

Mostly amateurs on the floor at the time.
Showed my friend around the gym, the photos, a lot of L.A. history on the walls, fighters from the past.
Wish I had something of interest to report. Nada. We left.

A week from tomorrow night, Freddie will be in the corner of Amir Khan as he takes on Paulie Mali-whatever at Madison Square Garden.
A week after the fight I'll drop in then to say hello. Of course, I won't be alone.
All the Hollywood-types that wallpaper the gym when Roach is in the house will be back.

I'd love to see Mel Epstein walk into Wildcard when the Hollywood crowd is present. He might have an opinion?


-Rick Farris

Rick I used to see pepper in the golden gloves gym back in the 1980s when he was fighting, Freddie never trained there, I think he trained at Johnny Tocco's gym, maybe it was Joey Roach cause I used to get Joey and Pepper confused

Paul . . . Freddie has a sign at Wild Card that hung in Tocco's Las Vegas gym. I forget the exact wording on the sign, but something like "It Takes Balls, etc.". Freddie has a crazy group of gym rats at Wild Card, Pep being one of them. These guys are right out of a "Dead End Kids" movie. Yesterday, I had an attractive young lady with me when I visited the gym. Pep and I are talking and he says to her, "You are really beautiful, do you have any sisters?" The girl answers, "No". Pep then asks, "Well do you have any brothers, I go both ways." Typical Pep Roach dialogue, he's quite a charactor. I remember one time I was talking with Pep and mentioned we were going to induct Lucia Rijker into the WBHOF. Pep just shook his head and commented, "I know Lucia. I sparred with her one time and the bitch kicked my ass!"

Thanks guys. 56 today. In my mind I still feel like I'm in my twenties.... until I pass by a mirror.

We're heading over to my daughter Meranda's home in a few minutes for a big breakfast.

Don't forget Paul Williams vs Kermit Cintron. It has the makings of a good fight.

Thanks again

Randy

Randyman wrote:Thanks guys. 56 today. In my mind I still feel like I'm in my twenties.... until I pass by a mirror.

We're heading over to my daughter Meranda's home in a few minutes for a big breakfast.

Don't forget Paul Williams vs Kermit Cintron. It has the makings of a good fight.

Thanks again

Randy

Mel's New Kid . . .

Have a great day, Randy. I was thinking back to the 22-year-old boxer Mel Epstein introduced Karl Nelson and I to in 1976.
You were young and looked ready to go ten rounds. You had the qualities I relate to a true boxer, a fighter. You were polite, looked us right in the eyes, had class and charactor. All of the intangibles that complement a strong body and fighting spirit. I remember you impressed Karl, and we were looking forward to watching you in the ring. I never got to see you fight, but I got to know you as you are today, and what a great man you evolved into.

Randyman wrote:Thanks guys. 56 today. In my mind I still feel like I'm in my twenties.... until I pass by a mirror.

We're heading over to my daughter Meranda's home in a few minutes for a big breakfast.

Don't forget Paul Williams vs Kermit Cintron. It has the makings of a good fight.

Thanks again

Randy

Randy, you share a birthday with my granddaughter, Keana, she is 13 today...feel sorry for James....

Rick if you ever run into Barbara Streasand again, say to her ''Barbara you look terrific pause you don't look a day over 90''

Happy birthday Randy!!

THEHAMMER321 wrote:Rick if you ever run into Barbara Streasand again, say to her ''Barbara you look terrific pause you don't look a day over 90''

Paul, you should write a book . . . "How To Bury A Career In Hollywood" (my career, that is).
I can hear the dirt hitting the lid of my casket as I write this.

Rick Farris Interview
Latino Boxing documentary film.


Rick --

First and foremost, thanks for the wonderful interview today. Your insight into boxing is fantastic, and so too is your passion.

As for Frank Baltazar, that's great news. I'm looking forward to getting him -- and, hopefully, Hap Navarro -- on camera soon.

Please let me know how I should proceed. And if you get other notions, don't hesitate to let me know.

Also, thanks to your wife for being a good sport.

Best,

Alan


Alan . . .

It was great talking with you today and I hope some of what I shared can be of use to your project. I spoke with Frank Baltazar and he would be open to have you interview him.

Frank is a treasure trove of Los Angeles and Latinio boxing history.
He was running the Jr. Golden Gloves tourney in L.A. when Albert Davila, the Sandovals, etc. were competeing and can open doors to the true history of the great Latinos who came out of East L.A. You will get some true, unbiased history from Frank.

I will E-mail Hap Navarro tonight, and see if there is a possibility of your interviewing him. He promoted guys like the great Enrique Bolanos, Art Aragon, Manuel Ortiz, Keeny Teran, etc.

I'll be in touch. Good luck with your film, one I consider very important, and one that won't be possible in the near future (the history is dying with those who were involved).


Take care,
Rick Farris

Kermit Cintron literally hits the floor in loss to Paul Williams

Cintron is injured and loses bout when he accidentally slips through the ropes and falls out of the ring in fourth round of super-welterweight fight. His promoter disputes the judges' decision and demands a rematch.

By Lance Pugmire

May 8, 2010

Kermit Cintron took a dive and lost his Saturday night super-welterweight fight to Paul Williams.

Cintron's dive wasn't the kind usually associated with boxing.

During the fourth round of a fight that was slow to become active, Puerto Rico's Cintron was rushing toward Williams when the 6-foot-3 southpaw slipped, causing Cintron's momentum to carry him through the ropes, toward a tennis-court landing at Carson's Home Depot Center that caused a fight-stopping injury.

"He hit his head twice, on a [television] monitor and then on the floor," Cintron promoter Lou DiBella said.

Cintron (32-3-1) remained face-down for minutes as Williams rested in the ring. Ringside doctor Paul Wallace then assessed that Cintron was "groggy," according to DiBella.

Cintron "feels like he's OK, he wanted to continue," DiBella said. "But the doctor said, 'No, you can't continue' "

That decision threw the fight, disputedly, to the judges' scorecards because of a California rule that says a bout can be decided by scorecards after the fourth round has begun. That differs with the Assn. of Boxing Commissions, which stipulates that four full rounds must be completed before the judges can determine a winner.

At the stoppage, almost midway through the round, judge James Jen Kin had Williams leading 40-36, judge Fritz Werner had Williams ahead 39-37, and judge Jerry Cantu gave all four rounds to Cintron, 40-36. Yet, a fourth round was judged without being completed.

Williams (39-1) accepted the victory almost in embarrassment, and suggested a rematch will be made.

"He hit me with a little [right-handed] shot, I hit him with one, we got tangled, and then he fell out of the ring," Williams said. "I know he wanted to fight. I know I wanted to fight. It's a strange way to get a win. I'll try to get a better one next time."

However, Williams' promoter, Dan Goossen, said he was not receptive "to look for a rematch." Goossen wants Williams to explore a richer fight in the welterweight division, which counts Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Manny Pacquiao as residents.

"There's nothing compelling to me, other than the uniqueness of how the fight was stopped, to do it over again," said Goossen, who also expressed some doubts about the severity of Cintron's injury.

Cintron was sent to a hospital for assessment.

DiBella and Cintron's trainer, Ronnie Shields, argued the bout should have been fought under ABC rules and should have been called a no-contest. They both demanded a rematch.

"Who should get a loss because of that?" DiBella asked. "I don't know what I can do, but I shouldn't have lost that fight. It was 3½ rounds. That's why there should be some uniform rules in boxing. Twenty years in this business, you see some weird [stuff]."

Williams started tentatively, and Cintron landed jabs and counterpunches in the first round. A good Williams left in the final 10 seconds was followed by a clean Cintron right.

The early inactivity drew heavy boos from the crowd, and Williams didn't become the pursuer until late in the third round. He landed two big lefts early in the fourth, and the action shifted left across the ring, with Cintron answering a Williams punch with a straight right before the entanglement, slip and ring dive.

Williams was hoping the fight would catapult him to a shot at Floyd Mayweather Jr. or Manny Pacquiao, but the outcome defused all that talk.

[email protected]

kikibalt wrote:Kermit Cintron literally hits the floor in loss to Paul Williams

Cintron is injured and loses bout when he accidentally slips through the ropes and falls out of the ring in fourth round of super-welterweight fight. His promoter disputes the judges' decision and demands a rematch.

By Lance Pugmire

May 8, 2010

Kermit Cintron took a dive and lost his Saturday night super-welterweight fight to Paul Williams.

Cintron's dive wasn't the kind usually associated with boxing.

During the fourth round of a fight that was slow to become active, Puerto Rico's Cintron was rushing toward Williams when the 6-foot-3 southpaw slipped, causing Cintron's momentum to carry him through the ropes, toward a tennis-court landing at Carson's Home Depot Center that caused a fight-stopping injury.

"He hit his head twice, on a [television] monitor and then on the floor," Cintron promoter Lou DiBella said.

Cintron (32-3-1) remained face-down for minutes as Williams rested in the ring. Ringside doctor Paul Wallace then assessed that Cintron was "groggy," according to DiBella.

Cintron "feels like he's OK, he wanted to continue," DiBella said. "But the doctor said, 'No, you can't continue' "

That decision threw the fight, disputedly, to the judges' scorecards because of a California rule that says a bout can be decided by scorecards after the fourth round has begun. That differs with the Assn. of Boxing Commissions, which stipulates that four full rounds must be completed before the judges can determine a winner.

At the stoppage, almost midway through the round, judge James Jen Kin had Williams leading 40-36, judge Fritz Werner had Williams ahead 39-37, and judge Jerry Cantu gave all four rounds to Cintron, 40-36. Yet, a fourth round was judged without being completed.

Williams (39-1) accepted the victory almost in embarrassment, and suggested a rematch will be made.

"He hit me with a little [right-handed] shot, I hit him with one, we got tangled, and then he fell out of the ring," Williams said. "I know he wanted to fight. I know I wanted to fight. It's a strange way to get a win. I'll try to get a better one next time."

However, Williams' promoter, Dan Goossen, said he was not receptive "to look for a rematch." Goossen wants Williams to explore a richer fight in the welterweight division, which counts Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Manny Pacquiao as residents.

"There's nothing compelling to me, other than the uniqueness of how the fight was stopped, to do it over again," said Goossen, who also expressed some doubts about the severity of Cintron's injury.

Cintron was sent to a hospital for assessment.

DiBella and Cintron's trainer, Ronnie Shields, argued the bout should have been fought under ABC rules and should have been called a no-contest. They both demanded a rematch.

"Who should get a loss because of that?" DiBella asked. "I don't know what I can do, but I shouldn't have lost that fight. It was 3½ rounds. That's why there should be some uniform rules in boxing. Twenty years in this business, you see some weird [stuff]."

Williams started tentatively, and Cintron landed jabs and counterpunches in the first round. A good Williams left in the final 10 seconds was followed by a clean Cintron right.

The early inactivity drew heavy boos from the crowd, and Williams didn't become the pursuer until late in the third round. He landed two big lefts early in the fourth, and the action shifted left across the ring, with Cintron answering a Williams punch with a straight right before the entanglement, slip and ring dive.

Williams was hoping the fight would catapult him to a shot at Floyd Mayweather Jr. or Manny Pacquiao, but the outcome defused all that talk.

[email protected]

Frank I didn't watch the fight last night but which judge got drunk before the fight, it says James Jen Kin scored all four rounds for Williams,and judge Jerry Cantu scored all four rounds for Cintron, like I said I didn't see the fight but someone needs a refresher course in judging fights.

THEHAMMER321 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:Kermit Cintron literally hits the floor in loss to Paul Williams

Cintron is injured and loses bout when he accidentally slips through the ropes and falls out of the ring in fourth round of super-welterweight fight. His promoter disputes the judges' decision and demands a rematch.

By Lance Pugmire

May 8, 2010

Kermit Cintron took a dive and lost his Saturday night super-welterweight fight to Paul Williams.

Cintron's dive wasn't the kind usually associated with boxing.

During the fourth round of a fight that was slow to become active, Puerto Rico's Cintron was rushing toward Williams when the 6-foot-3 southpaw slipped, causing Cintron's momentum to carry him through the ropes, toward a tennis-court landing at Carson's Home Depot Center that caused a fight-stopping injury.

"He hit his head twice, on a [television] monitor and then on the floor," Cintron promoter Lou DiBella said.

Cintron (32-3-1) remained face-down for minutes as Williams rested in the ring. Ringside doctor Paul Wallace then assessed that Cintron was "groggy," according to DiBella.

Cintron "feels like he's OK, he wanted to continue," DiBella said. "But the doctor said, 'No, you can't continue' "

That decision threw the fight, disputedly, to the judges' scorecards because of a California rule that says a bout can be decided by scorecards after the fourth round has begun. That differs with the Assn. of Boxing Commissions, which stipulates that four full rounds must be completed before the judges can determine a winner.

At the stoppage, almost midway through the round, judge James Jen Kin had Williams leading 40-36, judge Fritz Werner had Williams ahead 39-37, and judge Jerry Cantu gave all four rounds to Cintron, 40-36. Yet, a fourth round was judged without being completed.

Williams (39-1) accepted the victory almost in embarrassment, and suggested a rematch will be made.

"He hit me with a little [right-handed] shot, I hit him with one, we got tangled, and then he fell out of the ring," Williams said. "I know he wanted to fight. I know I wanted to fight. It's a strange way to get a win. I'll try to get a better one next time."

However, Williams' promoter, Dan Goossen, said he was not receptive "to look for a rematch." Goossen wants Williams to explore a richer fight in the welterweight division, which counts Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Manny Pacquiao as residents.

"There's nothing compelling to me, other than the uniqueness of how the fight was stopped, to do it over again," said Goossen, who also expressed some doubts about the severity of Cintron's injury.

Cintron was sent to a hospital for assessment.

DiBella and Cintron's trainer, Ronnie Shields, argued the bout should have been fought under ABC rules and should have been called a no-contest. They both demanded a rematch.

"Who should get a loss because of that?" DiBella asked. "I don't know what I can do, but I shouldn't have lost that fight. It was 3½ rounds. That's why there should be some uniform rules in boxing. Twenty years in this business, you see some weird [stuff]."

Williams started tentatively, and Cintron landed jabs and counterpunches in the first round. A good Williams left in the final 10 seconds was followed by a clean Cintron right.

The early inactivity drew heavy boos from the crowd, and Williams didn't become the pursuer until late in the third round. He landed two big lefts early in the fourth, and the action shifted left across the ring, with Cintron answering a Williams punch with a straight right before the entanglement, slip and ring dive.

Williams was hoping the fight would catapult him to a shot at Floyd Mayweather Jr. or Manny Pacquiao, but the outcome defused all that talk.

[email protected]

Frank I didn't watch the fight last night but which judge got drunk before the fight, it says James Jen Kin scored all four rounds for Williams,and judge Jerry Cantu scored all four rounds for Cintron, like I said I didn't see the fight but someone needs a refresher course in judging fights.

Paulino...Both Kin and Cantu most've being smoking some good sh*t...

kikibalt wrote:

THEHAMMER321 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:Kermit Cintron literally hits the floor in loss to Paul Williams

Cintron is injured and loses bout when he accidentally slips through the ropes and falls out of the ring in fourth round of super-welterweight fight. His promoter disputes the judges' decision and demands a rematch.

By Lance Pugmire

May 8, 2010

Kermit Cintron took a dive and lost his Saturday night super-welterweight fight to Paul Williams.

Cintron's dive wasn't the kind usually associated with boxing.

During the fourth round of a fight that was slow to become active, Puerto Rico's Cintron was rushing toward Williams when the 6-foot-3 southpaw slipped, causing Cintron's momentum to carry him through the ropes, toward a tennis-court landing at Carson's Home Depot Center that caused a fight-stopping injury.

"He hit his head twice, on a [television] monitor and then on the floor," Cintron promoter Lou DiBella said.

Cintron (32-3-1) remained face-down for minutes as Williams rested in the ring. Ringside doctor Paul Wallace then assessed that Cintron was "groggy," according to DiBella.

Cintron "feels like he's OK, he wanted to continue," DiBella said. "But the doctor said, 'No, you can't continue' "

That decision threw the fight, disputedly, to the judges' scorecards because of a California rule that says a bout can be decided by scorecards after the fourth round has begun. That differs with the Assn. of Boxing Commissions, which stipulates that four full rounds must be completed before the judges can determine a winner.

At the stoppage, almost midway through the round, judge James Jen Kin had Williams leading 40-36, judge Fritz Werner had Williams ahead 39-37, and judge Jerry Cantu gave all four rounds to Cintron, 40-36. Yet, a fourth round was judged without being completed.

Williams (39-1) accepted the victory almost in embarrassment, and suggested a rematch will be made.

"He hit me with a little [right-handed] shot, I hit him with one, we got tangled, and then he fell out of the ring," Williams said. "I know he wanted to fight. I know I wanted to fight. It's a strange way to get a win. I'll try to get a better one next time."

However, Williams' promoter, Dan Goossen, said he was not receptive "to look for a rematch." Goossen wants Williams to explore a richer fight in the welterweight division, which counts Floyd Mayweather Jr. and Manny Pacquiao as residents.

"There's nothing compelling to me, other than the uniqueness of how the fight was stopped, to do it over again," said Goossen, who also expressed some doubts about the severity of Cintron's injury.

Cintron was sent to a hospital for assessment.

DiBella and Cintron's trainer, Ronnie Shields, argued the bout should have been fought under ABC rules and should have been called a no-contest. They both demanded a rematch.

"Who should get a loss because of that?" DiBella asked. "I don't know what I can do, but I shouldn't have lost that fight. It was 3½ rounds. That's why there should be some uniform rules in boxing. Twenty years in this business, you see some weird [stuff]."

Williams started tentatively, and Cintron landed jabs and counterpunches in the first round. A good Williams left in the final 10 seconds was followed by a clean Cintron right.

The early inactivity drew heavy boos from the crowd, and Williams didn't become the pursuer until late in the third round. He landed two big lefts early in the fourth, and the action shifted left across the ring, with Cintron answering a Williams punch with a straight right before the entanglement, slip and ring dive.

Williams was hoping the fight would catapult him to a shot at Floyd Mayweather Jr. or Manny Pacquiao, but the outcome defused all that talk.

[email protected]

Frank I didn't watch the fight last night but which judge got drunk before the fight, it says James Jen Kin scored all four rounds for Williams,and judge Jerry Cantu scored all four rounds for Cintron, like I said I didn't see the fight but someone needs a refresher course in judging fights.

Paulino...Both Kin and Cantu most've being smoking some good sh*t...

I think both guys got an envelope with some cash in it before the fight, but one of them was unhappy with how much he got, and he voted the wrong way.

kikibalt wrote:

Frank How many on this forum showed up.

iskigoe wrote:

raylawpc wrote:

CNorkusJr wrote:

Beautiful Find, Tom, I was in midtown yesterday when the mayor honored the guys from my firehouse for being the first firetrucks there at the terrorists car bomb threat. On my way out I stopped by the record store and took a look around. The front and the wall that the painting was on was all glass windows now. Incidental now, but thanks for the history post and picture. If you didnt find it, I'm sure my boys in the FDNY could have done a little careful wall inspection to see if it was hidden. Bottom line- it looks great right where it is and cleaned up too.

Charley, is this the record store where Dempsey's Restaurant was located?

"The Artists & Writers Club, as its label indicates, was origin­ally organized to gather certain members of the literary and art sets for occasional dinners and chatter, though often outsiders were admitted to our esoteric clan. Usually, we congregated in the up­stairs dining room of "21."

Sports columnist Grantland Rice, one of the original organ­izers, was president. After his death, cartoonist Rube Goldberg succeeded him. Goldberg usually was the master of ceremonies at our gatherings.

An account of just one meeting may convey some idea of what took place at these sessions. This one took place on December 7, 1944, and, of course, since December 7 was a memorable date in our history, there were solemn toasts to our fighting lads.

Then we turned to lighter subjects. Artist James Montgomery Flagg revealed his minor problems when he began painting that famous and much-discussed mural of the Dempsey-Willard fight that was to be hung in Jack Dempsey's restaurant.

"I didn't even know how sensitive some folks could be," he lamented. "Why, this fight was held back in 1919, and I painted in some folks who never were at that fight simply because Jack thought they were important and should be included. Do you know something? Some of them, and I'm not kidding, actually squawked because they didn't like the seats I put them in! And my friend Damon Runyon told me he wasn't too sure he even liked the people I put next to him in that painting."

Runyon was sitting at the fight between Hype Igoe and Tad Dorgan

KI

Sorry Wasnt on in a few days. Yes thats the one. Dempseys rest. was on the ground floor. The picture dosnt show it but the corner Street sign says " Dempseys Corner".
The Brill Bldg in which this bldg is known is famous for music writers. Neil Diamond, Paul Simon and other greats all have or had offices in here and is known as the spot which turned out more musical hits than anywhere else. Also, The Brill Bldg is named after the Brill Bros Clothing empire back in 1930's. The original builder Alan Lefcourt had a bust of his son,Abraham, placed above the main door ,you can see in the picture, after his son was killed in an auto accident. Google "Brill Bldg" for more.

THEHAMMER321 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:

Frank How many on this forum showed up.

Don't know cause I didn't go....