BoxRec

kikibalt wrote:

CNorkusJr wrote:Fights over-Khan wins-stops Malignaggi in 11th.
Looked like the fans got into it at the Garden theatre in the background.Typical nowadays.

I can't help but think that these same fans today which are causing trouble are the same blokes who are rooting for the MMA fighters on their telecasts.
Right now I am so glad that NY State and Athletic Commissioner Melvina Lathan is sticking to her guns in not recognizing MMA in NY right now.

Depending on how the draw on the local boxing cards here will depend on if they mix the two eventually for an event. Much discussion but the local cards in the Metropolitan area are doing well. Staving off the MMA right now.

Cheers to Freddie Roach on calling his shot for Amir Khan.

Charlie, the fans fighting? it was the norm at the Olympic back in its hay day, seen lots of that in my youth....

At the Olympic . . .

FRank said it right about the OLympic Auditorium. Fights in the audience were just part of the show each week at the Olympic.
Before one of my early pro fights, my opponent did not show up at the weigh-in.
My friends and family already had tickets to the event, so they came to see the main event which featured Jean Claude Bouttier and Henry Walker.
During one of the amateur bouts that proceded the pro card, featuring a young amateur bantam named Danny Lopez, my girlfriends sister, wife Olympic pole vault gold medalist Bob Seagren, was being bothered by a group of L.A. Times advertising salemen that had gotten drunk and decided to try to pick-up a blonde.
Within minutes, Seagren had the salesman on the deck and we were all into it.
A few of the L.A. Times boys were ejected, and the bouts continued on as usual.
I've seen guys stabbed,punched and rolled on thursday nights at the Olympic.
Just common behavior at 18th & Grand.

Rick Farris wrote:

kikibalt wrote:

CNorkusJr wrote:Fights over-Khan wins-stops Malignaggi in 11th.
Looked like the fans got into it at the Garden theatre in the background.Typical nowadays.

I can't help but think that these same fans today which are causing trouble are the same blokes who are rooting for the MMA fighters on their telecasts.
Right now I am so glad that NY State and Athletic Commissioner Melvina Lathan is sticking to her guns in not recognizing MMA in NY right now.

Depending on how the draw on the local boxing cards here will depend on if they mix the two eventually for an event. Much discussion but the local cards in the Metropolitan area are doing well. Staving off the MMA right now.

Cheers to Freddie Roach on calling his shot for Amir Khan.

Charlie, the fans fighting? it was the norm at the Olympic back in its hay day, seen lots of that in my youth....

At the Olympic . . .

FRank said it right about the OLympic Auditorium. Fights in the audience were just part of the show each week at the Olympic.
Before one of my early pro fights, my opponent did not show up at the weigh-in.
My friends and family already had tickets to the event, so they came to see the main event which featured Jean Claude Bouttier and Henry Walker.
During one of the amateur bouts that proceded the pro card, featuring a young amateur bantam named Danny Lopez, my girlfriends sister, wife Olympic pole vault gold medalist Bob Seagren, was being bothered by a group of L.A. Times advertising salemen that had gotten drunk and decided to try to pick-up a blonde.
Within minutes, Seagren had the salesman on the deck and we were all into it.
A few of the L.A. Times boys were ejected, and the bouts continued on as usual.
I've seen guys stabbed,punched and rolled on thursday nights at the Olympic.
Just common behavior at 18th & Grand.

About 50 years ago I seen a guy stabbed at the Olympic on fight nite, he was laying on the 18th St. side, on the inside walk of the auditorium, not sure, but I think he died before he was taken away, I say that because he looked dead to me....

No body asked me, but I think both Amir Khan and Victor Ortiz are two over hyped guys...Imo they will never be talked about as all-time greats, just think what some 135-140 pound guys of some 30-20 years ago would do to this guys, Khan with his chin up in the air and Ortiz with that goofy stance of his.

I agree with you on that Frank, I remember watching the Maidana-Ortiz fight and thinking: Entertaining brawl , but these guys will never be world class. Imagine my shock when i heard them being talked of as two of the best 140 pounders today

As for Khan ,I think he showcased a good jab last night ,He has improved from what i have seen of him earlier. He should probably fight Maidana next. to see if he can survive against a very limited puncher this time around . He should be able to outbox and stop Maidana by this point.

kikibalt wrote:No body asked me, but I think both Amir Khan and Victor Ortiz are two over hyped guys...Imo they will never be talked about as all-time greats, just think what some 135-140 pound guys of some 30-20 years ago would do to this guys, Khan with his chin up in the air and Ortiz with that goofy stance of his.

Amen!
While watching these guys last night, I began to think of a few 140 pounders I remember.
Of course, most I recall were blown up lightweights that were forced to fight welters.
Names like L.C. Morgan, Adolph Pruitt, Paulie Armstead, etc.
None of the guys I mentioned were world champions in their day.
For me to name the best of that era I'd have to look to guys like Jose Napoles, Carlos Ortiz, etc.

Hey Frank, big difference between Victor ORTIZ and Carlos ORTIZ, huh?
By the way, how do you like it when you see today's superstars running straight forward, chin in the air, and throwing straight left-right, left-left-right, left-right blows. I see this every week when I watch HBO boxing (no wonder I'm usually asleep by the fifth round). They just wanna land those tip-tap, tip-tap to score the points as they did in today's version of amateur boxing. I truly believe that they have come up with an answer for taking the fight out of boxing.

Rick, I watch Ortiz/Campball for 3 rounds, change the tv to cartoons, Paulie/Khan 6 rounds was all I could take, turned the tv off and went to sleep....

kikibalt wrote:

Rick Farris wrote:

kikibalt wrote: Charlie, the fans fighting? it was the norm at the Olympic back in its hay day, seen lots of that in my youth....

At the Olympic . . .

FRank said it right about the OLympic Auditorium. Fights in the audience were just part of the show each week at the Olympic.
Before one of my early pro fights, my opponent did not show up at the weigh-in.
My friends and family already had tickets to the event, so they came to see the main event which featured Jean Claude Bouttier and Henry Walker.
During one of the amateur bouts that proceded the pro card, featuring a young amateur bantam named Danny Lopez, my girlfriends sister, wife Olympic pole vault gold medalist Bob Seagren, was being bothered by a group of L.A. Times advertising salemen that had gotten drunk and decided to try to pick-up a blonde.
Within minutes, Seagren had the salesman on the deck and we were all into it.
A few of the L.A. Times boys were ejected, and the bouts continued on as usual.
I've seen guys stabbed,punched and rolled on thursday nights at the Olympic.
Just common behavior at 18th & Grand.

About 50 years ago I seen a guy stabbed at the Olympic on fight nite, he was laying on the 18th St. side, on the inside walk of the auditorium, not sure, but I think he died before he was taken away, I say that because he looked dead to me....

Frank, the night that Bruce Curry KOed Monroe Brooks at the Olympic, I saw a guy almost get his arm cut off by some guy with a knife. I won't go into details of how it happened, but this guys arm was hanging limp and gushing blood. This took place during a prelim, and aside from a little excitement, it was business as usual. I also saw Randy Shields' dad, Sonny, get in a fight with some businessman at ringside. Sonny was a crazy bastid and could fight, but this old guy in a suit was pretty tough himself and literally picked up Sonny and tossed him over a couple rows of seats. The cops broke things up before it went any farther.

Rick Farris wrote:

kikibalt wrote:No body asked me, but I think both Amir Khan and Victor Ortiz are two over hyped guys...Imo they will never be talked about as all-time greats, just think what some 135-140 pound guys of some 30-20 years ago would do to this guys, Khan with his chin up in the air and Ortiz with that goofy stance of his.

Amen!
While watching these guys last night, I began to think of a few 140 pounders I remember.
Of course, most I recall were blown up lightweights that were forced to fight welters.
Names like L.C. Morgan, Adolph Pruitt, Paulie Armstead, etc.
None of the guys I mentioned were world champions in their day.
For me to name the best of that era I'd have to look to guys like Jose Napoles, Carlos Ortiz, etc.

Hey Frank, big difference between Victor ORTIZ and Carlos ORTIZ, huh?
By the way, how do you like it when you see today's superstars running straight forward, chin in the air, and throwing straight left-right, left-left-right, left-right blows. I see this every week when I watch HBO boxing (no wonder I'm usually asleep by the fifth round). They just wanna land those tip-tap, tip-tap to score the points as they did in today's version of amateur boxing. I truly believe that they have come up with an answer for taking the fight out of boxing.

Victor Ortiz will NEVER be mistaken for Carlos Oritz, much less for Manuel Ortiz, Victor is begining shame to the Ortiz name....

Fight Fans at the Olympic . . .

The only thing that excited the Olympic crowd as much as a fight (in the ring or out) was when a hot lady in a short dress made her way to her seats. If the lady was at all self concious, she'd never return. However, as we all know, a lot of women like the attention.

Rick Farris wrote:Fight Fans at the Olympic . . .

The only thing that excited the Olympic crowd as much as a fight (in the ring or out) was when a hot lady in a short dress made her way to her seats. If the lady was at all self concious, she'd never return. However, as we all know, a lot of women like the attention.

What woman don't like attention.....

kikibalt wrote:

Rick Farris wrote:

kikibalt wrote:No body asked me, but I think both Amir Khan and Victor Ortiz are two over hyped guys...Imo they will never be talked about as all-time greats, just think what some 135-140 pound guys of some 30-20 years ago would do to this guys, Khan with his chin up in the air and Ortiz with that goofy stance of his.

Amen!
While watching these guys last night, I began to think of a few 140 pounders I remember.
Of course, most I recall were blown up lightweights that were forced to fight welters.
Names like L.C. Morgan, Adolph Pruitt, Paulie Armstead, etc.
None of the guys I mentioned were world champions in their day.
For me to name the best of that era I'd have to look to guys like Jose Napoles, Carlos Ortiz, etc.

Hey Frank, big difference between Victor ORTIZ and Carlos ORTIZ, huh?
By the way, how do you like it when you see today's superstars running straight forward, chin in the air, and throwing straight left-right, left-left-right, left-right blows. I see this every week when I watch HBO boxing (no wonder I'm usually asleep by the fifth round). They just wanna land those tip-tap, tip-tap to score the points as they did in today's version of amateur boxing. I truly believe that they have come up with an answer for taking the fight out of boxing.

Victor Ortiz will NEVER be mistaken for Carlos Oritz, much less for Manuel Ortiz, Victor is begining shame to the Ortiz name....

Victor Ortiz branded himself a coward in his quitting performance last year.
He is a castrated dog with a lot of fleas and no teeth.

The Victor Ortiz Shuffle . . .

Pop-pop-pop- then run like a bitch.
The moment the going gets tough, he gets going - In reverse!
His trunks should have back-up lights sewn in the rear.

Rick Farris wrote:The Victor Ortiz Shuffle . . .

Pop-pop-pop- then run like a bitch.
The moment the going gets tough, he gets going - In reverse!
His trunks should have back-up lights sewn in the rear.

Johnny Flores . . .


When discussing Classic American West Coast Boxing personalities, the name Johnny Flores is one that covers a lot of history.
I had the good luck and pleasure of getting to know Johnny as I was growing up, a young boxer in his well known stable.
Johnny was a master story teller. Maybe the best I ever heard. His words left an impression on me, and I remember most of them.

I met Johnny in early 1965. I was referred to him by his newly crowned Nat'l Golden Gloves heavyweight champ, Jerry Quarry.
Jerry was ready to turn pro, and when he did, Johnny Flores, would become a major player in the world of professional boxing.
We are talking professional heavyweight boxing during the era of Ali, Frazier, Norton, etc.

Johnny had been known for decades in Los Angeles, where he was tagged "Mr. Golden Gloves" for his amateur boxing participation, in every aspect of the sport. He also cornered and managed the careers of a number of top pros, but none with the clout afforded the manager of a "white heavyweight" during the late '60's.

Flores was tough and smart, good looking, with sharp wit and personality. Thruout his life, he strayed into dangerous territory.
During WW2, he enlisted in the Army in his mid-20's, was assigned to a platoon of immigrants that would be sent out on info seeking missions, sent out with little expectation of returning.
Flores was operating behind enemy lines, by himself, just wandering with his rifle. "Go out and capture a German" was his order.
Flores stumbled upon a farm house. Coming from the barn were voices, speaking German.

Flores peaked into a window and saw two German officers sitting at a table, talking.
Flores had an arenalin rush, took a deep breath and kicked in the door, he was spewing obsenities, in Spanish and English.
The officers were caught by surprise and Flores knocked one out with the butt of his rifle. The other put his hands behind his head and surrendered.
Suddenly, thru a back door leading to another room, another soldier appeared, hands behind his head in surrender.
Then another came out, and another. Flores captured a dozen German soldiers and four were officers.
For that he would win a Silver Star, and later a Purple Heart.
Johnny would later be seriously injured and sent home a disabled American Veteran.

Johnny Flores had balls. That's how he would describe a fighter with courage. That's how I describe Johnny.
After WW2, Johnny worked with the Disabled American Vet's and became a part of L.A. boxing history when he and another coach, Louie Jaurique, established the Los Angeles Junior Golden Gloves program.

For more than three decades, the Junior Golden Gloves would serve as a breeding ground for top professional talent.

I'll continue this during the coming week.


-Rick Farris

More on Johnny Flores . . .
Wrapping a boxer's hands


We learn this quick, regadless of what you do in boxing.
Most of us start young, and this you are taught on day one.
We'd buy cotton hand wraps. I first got them at United Sporting Goods, on 9th & Hill St.
Johnny Flores showed me how to best wrap them for training. I'd pad the knuckles with foam when they were bruised.

My grandfather worked at Warner Brothers, and he had access to a lot of 1" white adhesive tape, so Flores Gym always had tape, etc.
My grandfather would do a lot of the maintenance at Johnny's Gym. Warner Bros. Studio supplied the tape, pads, and misc. maintenance items.
He'd patch the bladder for the speed bag, keep it full of air, bring in bungie cord from the studio to fix the double-end bag.
When you run a gym, you learn it has to be kept up if used regularly.

Johnny's gym had a ring, a couple heavy bags, speed bag, double-end bag, excercise table, scale, pictures on the wall, vintage 50's-60's amateur shows.
His 50-60's fighter, Louie "The Lion" Perez, a hard hitting middleweight from Canoga Park pictured.
Posters from Johnny's match making days for promoter Joe Louis, in Hollywood at the Moulin Rouge.
Gil Cadilli, one of many names of the era were featured on those cards.
Photos of a ten-year-old Jerry Quarry trading blows in the juniors.
A B&W photo of me with Flores, Quarry, Big Train Lincoln at the Main St. Gym was also on the wall.
Flores with 1952 Olympic Champ Ed Sanders, who was later killed in the ring.
My trainer, middleweight Manuel Diaz, slamming Eddie Land with a hook to the body in a 1959 amateur match at Valley Garden Arena.
Frank Baltazar might have fought that same night?

Johnny Flores showed me how to wrap my hands, and later, wrapped them many times for my fights.
As a pro, Johnny was able to wrap my hands with more tape, etc. It felt incredible, better than others, including Eddie Futch.
He was the best to ever wrap my hands.


-Rick Farris

"Ma and Pa Kettle"

Johnny Flores' reference to Jack & Arwanda Quarry.
Jerry's parents.

Attorney Paul Caruso . . .

Was George Parnassus' friend and attorney,
repped Art Aragon in a divorce,
and Jerry Quarry.
Caruso was connected to everything.

Trouble loomed for Flores.
Johnny survived WW2, and he survived an attempt on his life in 1971.
He turned the incident into a law suit, which resulted in the L.A. Youth Athletic Club.

The LAYAC is located on the top floor of the abandoned former L.A. City Jail in Lincoln Heights.
In the early 70's, it was a hot L.A. gym with top pros and amateurs working out in the biggest, cleanest gym in L.A.
It's still a great facility, but nearly empty today due to poor management.

More on Flores and the LAYAC to come . . .

"He bit the dust . . ."

-Johnny Flores' reference to a boxer who has fallen in love.

"The dumb bastid . . ."

-Mel Epstein's reference to a boxer who has fallen in love.

I went to my first MMA card last night with my sons - "Strikeforce" which was also broadcast on ShowTime. Maybe it was because I was with my two adult sons, and the three of us don't get to do much together anymore, but I had a good time. Although I would have preferred boxing, I thought the matches were entertaining.

The crowd didn't strike me as being much different than the boxing crowds I used to see in Oklahoma City and the other venues I worked and visited in the 1970s. Oh sure, alot of the people dressed in the biker, grunge and punk attire trying to look tough. But folks for the most part kept their behavior in line. I only saw one scuffle in the crowd - which was about par for fight cards in the Midwest back in my day.

One thing I did notice was how young everybody was. I think I might have been the oldest person there - really - and I'm just 55. I remember old guys coming to the fights, but none of that at the MMA. That was a difference for sure.

One thing that doesn't change between 1970s boxing and 2000 MMA - women who want attention. Lots and lots of eye candy last night.

P.S.: Jimmy Lennon Jr. was the announcer. I thought he did a good job - very classy, like his Dad.

December, 1994 . . .


Johnny Flores, 78, dies in fall.
Body found in gym's elevator shaft.

Whenever a brawl broke out in the audience at the Olympic Auditorium, it seemed that the fans would be watching it intently, completely ignoring the bout which was taking place in the ring.

- Chuck Johnston

Chuck1052 wrote:Whenever a brawl broke out in the audience at the Olympic Auditorium, it seemed that the fans would be watching it intently, completely ignoring the bout which was taking place in the ring.

- Chuck Johnston

A few Olympic Auditorium ringsiders I remember . . .

Mickey Cohen with B-Movie actress Edie Williams, Connie Stevens, Chuck Connors, Burt Reylolds, Ryan O'Neal, Bill Cosby, Chris Connolly, Robert Goulet, director Otto Preminger, Redd Foxx, Marvin Gaye . . . to name a few.

As I'd stand in the ring before the introductions, Johnny Flores would tap me on the shoulder and point to the ringside celebs.
That was cool, but I really wasn't much impressed with entertainers, I was more concerned about the guy in the other corner.


-Rick Farris

RayLaw- Thanks for the description you had going to an Live MMA.
I never did yet,and they dont have it here in NY, yet, but my nephews are all into it and spring for the PPV MMa bouts. I just dont get into it. It seems so under-controlled, meaning , compared to boxing with its rules. It was nice to see refs the other night call the rabbit punch warnings and holdings.
Maybe I'm getting old and seen too much boxing to enjoy this new wave stuff.

I really cant blame this younger generation getting into MMa.Boxing popularity and frequency are down, and the occaisional " sensational bouts" are far amd few between- the youth enjoy the MMA today,it gives them a sport that they feel part of- like boxing was ages ago.

Quick story- 1980's Felt Forum, NYC My dad was tapped to ref a few preliminaries. I sat ringside as his "bodyguard" which was a term he used to get me in past security at employees entrance. The Main event was a Puerto Rican fighter vs Irish kid. Their names elude right now. My dad was sitting ringside with me as the seconds counter, so the ref can pick up the count if a man is knocked down. The fight was close going into rds 9 & 10.
IT looked like the Puerto Rican kid had an edge in the last two rounds but the irish kid knocked him down once. At the start of rd 10 my father told me to start working my way back to offixcials dressing room. Quickly. Sure enough, the irish kid got the decision and the mostly latino crowd went nuts. Chairs, bottles, you name it flew at the ring. Shots rang out in the back. 2 people dead was in the headlines the next day.I am not a rascist, just telling you like I saw it. My father told me that close Main events will do this in New York as it has for many years. Gun shots are not the norm though.