Classic American West Coast Boxing

[bennie]

Question is-did he learn anything from this ?

This was in January last year and he was out until the December, when he lost on points in a six-rounder in Belfast. The Derby man has ability but clearly lost it in front of the cameras. I remember a lanky American fighter dancing like that prior to a fight with Jimmy Paul on the Heans-Duran bill in Vegas in June 1984 and then getting poleaxed.

Bennie I saw that fight live, Alvin ''too sweet'' Hayes came out break dancing with a mask on and his friends carried a boom box the size of a station wagon into the ring and then he proceeded to get drilled by Jimmy Paul.

Yeah, they showed it over here. Hayes had ability and obviously knew it but Paul, a future world champion of course, really drilled him with the right hand in the fifth round.
Sadly, Alvin never really got over it and I think he's brown bread now.

[bennie]

Tribute To Gary Mason R.I.P. (1962-2011)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrLno4LwLT4

Lots of good names on his record.

R.I.P. Gary Mason

Thanks, Randy. Gary was not as good as his stablemate Frank Bruno but he could punch, and I'm not just saying that to be kind, he could really punch.
The Lewis fight was a Mickey Duff gamble that backfired. Uusally, Mickey got it right.

[THEHAMMER321]

And who could forget another clown, Jorge Paez, he is one fighter I never cared for, not sure if the Mexicans cared for him,from my experience Mexicans don't go for that kind of nonsense, they are used to fighters who let the fist's do the talking.

[bennie]

Our own Jeff Thomas returns to the ring in Colne on March 4 for his first fight in five long years.
The 29-year-old Thomas, from scenic St Annes near Blackpool, was desperately close to a showdown with Amir Khan in early 2006 but a surprise points defeat to the rugged Baz Carey in Blackpool in December 2005, whom Khan had just outpointed, cost him the opportunity and an estimated payday of £5,000. Thomas admitted he was "not in a good place" and fought just twice more, including a surprise loss to Dublin's Oisin Fagan in Dublin, before walking away in the summer of 2006.
A pro since 2001, Jeff went unbeaten in his first seven fights before stepping up against the talented Lee McAllister in 2003 in McAllister's own hometown of Aberdeen. He fought his heart out but dropped an 'iffy' 10-round decision (97-95), despite finishing much the stronger. Incredibly, Jeff had scaled lightweight that night, for a light-welterweight bruiser, and he dropped down for another 10-rounder just three months later in Bradford against local hard man Martin Hardcastle, dropping another close verdict.
This was in December 2003, and Jeff has boxed only seven times since, duking it out with the gifted Ricky Burns and the huge-punching Steve Murray, among others, but the Khan blow and the priority of a young son, Joe Louis Thomas, kept him on the sidlelines.
Now the classy, durable Thomas is back, probably at light-welterweight. Good luck, Jeff, you will do well.

[kikibalt]

This was in January last year and he was out until the December, when he lost on points in a six-rounder in Belfast. The Derby man has ability but clearly lost it in front of the cameras. I remember a lanky American fighter dancing like that prior to a fight with Jimmy Paul on the Heans-Duran bill in Vegas in June 1984 and then getting poleaxed.

Bennie I saw that fight live, Alvin ''too sweet'' Hayes came out break dancing with a mask on and his friends carried a boom box the size of a station wagon into the ring and then he proceeded to get drilled by Jimmy Paul.

Yeah, they showed it over here. Hayes had ability and obviously knew it but Paul, a future world champion of course, really drilled him with the right hand in the fifth round.
Sadly, Alvin never really got over it and I think he's brown bread now.

Hayes, as I heard it is dead....

[kikibalt]

Jesse Valadez of lowriding fame.

http://www.latimes.com/news/obituaries/ ... 8686.story

[THEHAMMER321]

Jesse Valadez of lowriding fame.

http://www.latimes.com/news/obituaries/ ... 8686.story

Frank did you him ? , I lived in a diverse ethnic neighborhood back in the 1970s as a kid, North Las Vegas had many guys driving lowriders, mostly Chicano's but a lot of black dudes also, I could see them driving at night with a hood ornament that lit up and music playing, R.I.P Jesse.

[THEHAMMER321]

Good morning guys, Coffee time, just woke up about 30 minutes ago,

[kikibalt]

Jesse Valadez of lowriding fame.

http://www.latimes.com/news/obituaries/ ... 8686.story

Frank did you him ? , I lived in a diverse ethnic neighborhood back in the 1970s as a kid, North Las Vegas had many guys driving lowriders, mostly Chicano's but a lot of black dudes also, I could see them driving at night with a hood ornament that lit up and music playing, R.I.P Jesse.

Did I know him?, no never met him. I did my lowriding (early '50's) way before he came around.

I had my coffee at 4 AM....Have Bobby and Tony here from Arizona for the weekend, Bobby's wife Kathy is here also.

[Rick Farris]

You guys think Naz is bad; check out this prick

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RJPesST- ... r_embedded

Bennie, since I pointed out that I thought Naz was weak of heart compared to L.A. based Latinos, I had to remind myself that not all Southern Cal Mexican-Americans exhibit courage in a prize fight. The most cowardly act I ever saw in a boxing ring happened not that long ago when Victor Ortiz literally quit after flooring Marcos Maidana twice and was unable to put him away. When the heavy underdog continued to battle, and started to score, the Southern Cal boxer (one of Oscar's favorites) said "No Mas!". He explained that he didn't come with the intention of risking injury, and it best he quit and hope to do better another day. I'll never consider Hamed anything more than a joke in the ring, but the worst joke of all was played out by an L.A. boxer. As for the guy in the video, I couldn't stop laughing as I played it for several members of the Spider Man crew on stage today. Thanks for some good entertainment, the guys loved it!

Victor Ortiz vs Marcos Maidana. A dark day for boxing and an even darker day for "West Coast Boxing".

A sign of the times, Randy. That's why we have this Forum, a place for those who remember something better.

[THEHAMMER321]

A gym workout..... , I often hear fighters or other people bragging about what so and so did to so and so in the gym, well I learned a great lesson about that in 1983, it was at the dunes hotel and Tim Witherspoon had a gym workout and sparring session open to the public for his fight with Larry Holmes just days away, at the time Witherspoon was undefeated but was not given much of a chance to beat Holmes, in the sparring session Mitch ''blood'' Green was Witherspoons sparmate, Green didn't have very many fights at that point, in the sparring session Mitch beat the stuffing out of Tim Witherspoon, all Tim did was cover up in his crablike defense as Mitch just kept unloading and Tim doing very little firing back, people that I was sitting around were making comments like Holmes is gonna kill this guy, and Don King should be arrested for letting Witherspoon fight Holmes, well as everyone now knows Tim Witherspoon ended up giving Holmes one of his toughest fights and nearly pulled off the upset, so much for gym fights.

[kikibalt]

Rudy Garcia, standing on the right, with other members of the 1948 Los Angeles National Golden Glove Teams on their way to Chicago for the national tournament.

[Rick Farris]

A gym workout..... , I often hear fighters or other people bragging about what so and so did to so and so in the gym, well I learned a great lesson about that in 1983, it was at the dunes hotel and Tim Witherspoon had a gym workout and sparring session open to the public for his fight with Larry Holmes just days away, at the time Witherspoon was undefeated but was not given much of a chance to beat Holmes, in the sparring session Mitch ''blood'' Green was Witherspoons sparmate, Green didn't have very many fights at that point, in the sparring session Mitch beat the stuffing out of Tim Witherspoon, all Tim did was cover up in his crablike defense as Mitch just kept unloading and Tim doing very little firing back, people that I was sitting around were making comments like Holmes is gonna kill this guy, and Don King should be arrested for letting Witherspoon fight Holmes, well as everyone now knows Tim Witherspoon ended up giving Holmes one of his toughest fights and nearly pulled off the upset, so much for gym fights.

Paul . . . For one thing, Mitch Green was a rough customer that never made it because he could not keep himself out of trouble on the streets. With boxing, styles effect boxers differently. Comparing Holmes with Green is like comparing an apple with an orange, both are boxers but that's where the comparison ends. Some boxers are great gym fighters and suck in the ring before an audience. Mitch Green could come alive in the ring and showed this when he extended an unbeaten Mike Tyson to the full ten round distance when Mike was flattening just about everybody they put in front of him. And of course, he wasn't afraid to take on Mike in the street later on, much to his regret as Tyson kicked his ass. Green was too much a street thug to make it in boxing, but he was still a rough guy who more than once made a top heavyweight look bad.

You bring up a good point about gym fighters, however. We had a guy in L.A. during the 60's and early 70's, who for awhile was my stablemate under Johnny Flores. Rod Contreras was a good lightweight, who killed a guy in the ring during the early 60's. This really affected him, and he quit for a few years. He then came back, and became a popular L.A. prelim kid about the time Mando Ramos and Ruben Navarro were on their way up. One day in the late 60's, former world champ Hiroshi Kobayashi is in town preparing to take on Bobby Valdez in an Olympic Auditorium main event. Contreras gets into the ring with Kobayashi for a sparring session. Contreras was considered a six-round fighter, but he beat the crap out of Kobayashi, and did so in a very cool, collected manner. As the Japanese boxer attacked aggressivly, Rod would stick him with a stiff jab and stop him in his tracks. Kobayashi soon got frustrated and really turned up the heat, Contreras, would just side-step, spin him and then counter with solid shots and combinations, then slide out of range. This went on for three rounds before Kobayashi stepped out of the ring bloody and fuming. He walked out of the gym and that was the last I saw of him until the following thursday night, when he flattened Valdez, leaving Bobby on the canvas unconcious.

[Rick Farris]

This is what I consider a true all-time British great.
Am I wrong? How does Hamed compare with the likes of this, and others I will mention in due course?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Jackie (Kid) Berg


Hall of Fame -Class of 1994
Modern Category
World Boxing Hall of Fame Inductee
Alias: The Whitechapel Whirlwind
Birth Name: Judah Bergman
Born: 1909-06-28
Birthplace: Whitechapel, London, United Kingdom
Died: 1991-04-22 (Age:81)
Nationality: United Kingdom
Hometown: Whitechapel, London, United Kingdom
Stance: Orthodox
Height: 5′ 9″ / 175cm

Bouts- 192.
157-26-9 (61KO's)

Trainer: Ray Arcel
Managers: Harry Levine - Sol Gold


For Jackie Kid Berg fighting in the streets of the East End was as natural as breathing, he recalls:

My gang was mainly from my street. Sam Bibbikraut was the leader. Then there was Gussie, Sammy Front, Morrie Greenberg, maybe one or two others, younger brothers. We grew up together. I could lick Sam ? I could lick any of them. I was fighting every day, to survive! I had to fight, it was my way, you see ? When I was in the street, if anybody hit somebody I knew, I used to shield that person. I never wanted people to take liberties with me. What s right is right, but I never wanted people to take liberties. I always landed the first punch, whatever happened. I d get in first. If I m right or wrong, I m going to hit you, I m not going to wait until you bang me one. Gangs of gentiles used to sing bad things to us on the streets, often in front of old Jewish people and when we kids used to hear that, well, we didn t like it Our spirits used to be on fire, we d burn We would make a dash for them. We were always fighting. You had to fight! It was part of my nature.

Incredibly self disciplined, he schooled himself in the traditional standup British style of boxing. On crossing the Atlantic he reverted to the more elemental blood and snot form of brawling and made a big splash with the throngs on the American continent, to the chagrin of the traditionalist British boxing establishment. This perpetual motion, piston-shooting dynamo they called The Whitechapel Windmill, tossed leather non-stop from every possible angle until his ring foe dropped from sheer exhaustion. He was neither boxer nor puncher. There was little science to his methodology ? he just bored in and flailed away. But the theoretical underpinning of his tactics was based on the Napoleonic dictum that the best defence is a good offence. The majority of his opponents crumbled under the sheer volume of the attack.

Ray Arcel, his legendary trainer of many world champions, attempted to understand his wild nature:

Berg was a tense bundle of nervous energy, impulsive and fanatically superstitious. Training him was one nightmare after another. We could never let him out of our sight. Normally you tuck fighters into bed and switch off the lights and lock the door from the outside for insurance. Now you can relax. But with Berg, lights-out signalled the start of war-games. Would he or wouldn t he break loose? We put extra padlocks on the door, barred the window and stationed somebody in the room to watch him. Somehow he still escaped, off chasing girls.

The only ritual that seemed to calm him, as well as fighting, were his religious superstitions: Marching into a fight, a tallit was hung around his shoulders and a tephillin was strapped around his arms and forehead. The normally riotous fight mob remained silent as he went through the long dramatic ritual of unwinding the leather straps from around his body, kissing them tenderly and placing them in a gold embroidered velvet bag. He handed the bag to me saying, Please take care of this, Ray. Some sceptics sneered: He goes through that routine to pull in the cloak and suitors. It s using religion for financial gain. It s sacrilegious. True, he wasn t what you call a religious Jew. But he was superstitious beyond reason.

When I put the question to him one day, he seemed embarrassed: It s comforting to have God on your side no matter what your doing, he told me soberly. During his peak, there seemed to be the mark of Divine spirit with Berg. He moved to the United States in 1928 and the following year he scored a win over junior welterweight champion Mushy Callahan in a non-title bout. Berg opened the 1930 campaign with a decision over the great Tony Canzoneri and promoters quickly matched him with Callahan again with the title on the line

and then Berg shot a left for the face while driving a right for the body. Callahan plunged at once with a double-handed attack for the mid-section and they were at it like a pair of tiger cats. Fists were flying with the utmost rapidity, with Berg speeding up and lashing out almost faster than the eye could follow. Callahan tried an uppercut, but Berg caught this on his forearms and at once hooked a right to the head and shot a left to the mouth. Again the Englishman speeded up and, swinging or hooking with all the force and speed of which he was capable, drove the American to the ropes. Smashed up against these the American had to lean on his man and was reproved by the referee.

The end came a few seconds before the start of the eleventh round:

"The referee was leaning over the ropes with his back to the ring. A towel appeared like a comet in Callahan s corner. There was a gasp of surprise; then cheers and yells that shook the smoke-laden air. Callahan had retired. His once broken nose had been broken again. His left eye was closed. Misery ? dazed misery ? was reflected on his badly used face. Boxing Magazine, Feb 26th 1930.

Berg returned to the United States and made six successful title defences. He also scored a 10-round decision over Kid Chocolate in a non-title fight. Chocolate, who later won the world featherweight and junior lightweight titles, was unbeaten in 160 amateur and pro fights before meeting Berg. By the year's end, Berg was considered the best pound-for-pound fighter in the world.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

More British (England) greats to follow.
The wags on the British forum are obviously lost balls in high grass.

[bennie]

Ron Lyle is 70 today.

[bennie]

Klompton posted this on Eastside and kindly allowed me to post it here:

"I just found out that Rough and Tough Leon Thompson who fought out of Chicago died on November 5, 2010. Thompson was one heck of an interesting character. He served as a sparring partner for Tony Zale and although basically self managed he was occasionally helped by Sam Pian and Art Winch. I had the pleasure of meeting Mr Thompson and spent an afternoon looking through his scrapbook and listening to tales of all the fighters he knew. He had sparred with Marcel Cerdan for the press prior to Cerdan's first bout with Zale. He liked Cerdan but figured he would have never beaten LaMotta or even a prime Zale. He said all Cerdan could say in English was "You good boy."

He was friends with Jackie Conn and talked about how once he and Jackie had gone to get a rub down and the masseuse kept bragging about how he knew Jackie Conn, Billy's brother. Jackie kept on asking him questions and to every reply he answered "is that so?" Finally the masseuse said "are you trying to be some kind of a wise guy?" and Jackie said "You dont really know Jackie Conn do you?" and shot him a knowing glance to make sure he knew that the real Jackie Conn was sitting in front of him. The Masseuse demured and was quiet for the rest of the time.

He told another story of Anton Raadick who he also knew. He said Raadick was a real nice guy and had beaten Joey LaMotta in a fight pretty good. Jake wanted to avenge his brothers loss. Raadick would only agree to fight LaMotta on the idea that if Raadick won he would get the knew Leopard skin robe LaMotta had just ordered. LaMotta agreed. Thompson was ringside and said at one point Raadick was seemingly beating the hell out of LaMotta. Battering him against the ropes. The crowd couldnt believe it and then suddenly LaMotta stood up straight as a statue, flexed his muscles in an old time bodybuilder pose, and absolutely blitzed Raadick. The crowd went nuts and LaMotta ended up winning an easy decision and keeping his robe.

He also knew Ezzard Charles when Charles was the champ. He said one time the local commissioner called a meeting of all the boxers to review some new rules. Thompson had this stuff they used to use on the farm called "apple balm". He didnt know what it was but it smelled god awful. He took some of that stuff and smeared it on the door handle. Charles was one of the first to come in and wouldnt you know, he hung his brand new camel hair coat on that door handle. A few minutes later he grabbed his coat and sat down and as the room filled up all the black fighters who idolized Charles gathered around him. Thompson watched and said one by one you could see them all sniffing and pricking up their nostrils, shooting sideways glances at Charles. Before you knew it every seat sorrounding Charles was empty, and the champ was left wondering what was going on.

He said that at one point Sugar Ray Robinson's management was interested in signing him and bringing him into their stable but they were black and he was a white boy from Kentucky and said back then you just didnt do that. Old Leon was great guy who wore his cauliflower ear like a badge of honor. Im sad to see him go."

[Rick Farris]

Ron Lyle is 70 today.

A Ron Lyle memory . . .

I first saw Ron Lyle in the 1970 National Golden Gloves "Tourament of Champions", held in Las Vegas at the Convention Center.
This was my second trip to the Golden Gloves Nationals, having been a member of the Los Angeles team that competed in Kansas City in 1969.
Only this time, in 1970, Los Angeles was not allowed to send a team to the Golden Gloves Nationals. Most of us had fought for Aileen Eaton, who was putting on amateur bouts on the undercard of the Thursday night professional cards at the Olympic Auditorium. The AAU said it would be OK for Mrs. Eaton to do so, provided she "kick back" a thousand bucks to the organization from her weekly proceeds. Eaton refused to accomodate the corrupt amateur organization, so they took it out on the boxers.

The Managers & Coaches Association got together and came up with a plan to make it possible for the L.A. boys to compete in the Golden Gloves. We staged our own tournament and called it the "Diamond Belt Championships". It was conducted the same as the annual Western Regional GG's tourney was, and the finals held at the Olympic. The winners of the open class titles (I won the bantam title) would travel to Las Vegas and compete in the Nevada tourney in Las Vegas, which also included boxers from Arizona and New Mexico. We were all listed as residents of Henderson, Nevada, where an L.A. rep had a home. There were ten weight divisions to rep Nevada in the Nationals, which just so happened to be held in Las Vegas that year. The Los Angeles amateurs were superior to those from Nevada, Arizona and New Mexico, and all but one of the Nevada GG's titles were won by L.A. fighters. My close friend and stablemate, Al "Kit" Boursse' would be the heavyweight rep on the Nevada team, and I would go as the 118lb. rep.

I won my first two bouts, but lost in the quarter finals of eliminations after a close fight with a boxer from Texas.
My buddy Al also made it to the quarter finals, where he faced a guy from Colorado, named Ron Lyle.
Lyle had flattened his first two opponents and was rumored to be the "next Sonny Liston."
Boursse' had been working as a sparring partner for Jerry Quarry, and the previous year had traveled with Quarry to N.Y. where he had worked with Jerry at Grossinger's for his title bout against Joe Frazier in Madison Square Garden. This was going to be an interesting match, I expected.

Boursse' was able to keep himself from getting hurt when sparring with Quarry by boxing Jerry, and I expected him to do the same with Lyle. To my surprise, Boursse' went toe-to-toe with the Denver heavyweight and as the bell rang ending the first round, the crowd at the L.V. Convention Center was on it's feet. Both had landed solid blows and both had been rocked. In round two, the war resumed but I could see the Boursse's left eye was closing. He began taking solid shots from Lyle and I saw a leg buckle after catching one on the chin. Boursse' grabbed Lyle and held, attempting to clear his head. The ref broke the clinch and stopped the action. He looked closely at Boursse' and then allowed the action to resume. Lyle then landed another shot which made Al reel across the ring backwards. The bout was stopped and Lyle was awarded a second round TKO victory. After the fight, Al was quiet. He'd never before been stopped, and he'd never be stopped again in his career, as an amateur or professional. He later admitted that he'd never felt such a strong punch, not even from Jerry.

Of course, it would be Jerry Quarry who would hand Ron Lyle his first professional defeat, and Jerry did so easily.
I recall watching the Quarry-Lyle bout with Boursse', and I could see by the strange smile on my buddy's face that he was happy that Quarry had avenged his only TKO loss.

By the way, my late friend Alan "Kit" Boursee' would have turned 61 last July.
R.I.P. Kit.

Those were some good times, great days.


-Rick Farris

[Rick Farris]

Another English warrior of distinction:
-------------------------------------------

Len Wickwar


Born: 1911-03-11
Died: 1980-06-00 (Age:69)
Nationality: United Kingdom
Hometown: Leicester, East Midlands, United Kingdom
Manager: George Biddles

Wickwar is believed to have had more bouts than any boxer in history (465). At the very least he has more than any boxer in the BoxRec database. With 337 wins, he has more victories than any boxer that can be found in the database as well.

[kikibalt]

Another English warrior of distinction:
-------------------------------------------

Len Wickwar


Born: 1911-03-11
Died: 1980-06-00 (Age:69)
Nationality: United Kingdom
Hometown: Leicester, East Midlands, United Kingdom
Manager: George Biddles

Wickwar is believed to have had more bouts than any boxer in history (465). At the very least he has more than any boxer in the BoxRec database. With 337 wins, he has more victories than any boxer that can be found in the database as well.

Hogan Kid Bassey, former featherweight champion, was manages by George Biddles..

[scartissue]

This was in January last year and he was out until the December, when he lost on points in a six-rounder in Belfast. The Derby man has ability but clearly lost it in front of the cameras. I remember a lanky American fighter dancing like that prior to a fight with Jimmy Paul on the Heans-Duran bill in Vegas in June 1984 and then getting poleaxed.

Bennie I saw that fight live, Alvin ''too sweet'' Hayes came out break dancing with a mask on and his friends carried a boom box the size of a station wagon into the ring and then he proceeded to get drilled by Jimmy Paul.

Yeah, they showed it over here. Hayes had ability and obviously knew it but Paul, a future world champion of course, really drilled him with the right hand in the fifth round.
Sadly, Alvin never really got over it and I think he's brown bread now.

Oh,man, I remember that fight. When Paul pole-axed him Hayes ended up unconcious with his two legs folded up under him. Truly, how he went down was frightening. But if you guys want to see another bout in this vein of cockiness, watch the one rounder between Booker T. Word and Anthony Hembrick. It's on youtube. What a bizarre, well-choreographed dance routine between Hembrick and his cornermen. Pity there was a guy in the other corner.

Scartissue

[Rick Farris]

More to help ignorant Brits learn their boxing history.
How does this compare to the record of Lewis or Hamed???
----------------------------------------------------------------------

Jimmy Wilde

record: 134-4-3 (100KO's)
Alias: The Mighty Atom
Born: 1892-05-12
Birthplace: Quakers Yard, Wales, United Kingdom
Died: 1969-03-10 (Age:76)
Nationality: United Kingdom
Hometown: Quakers Yard, Wales, United Kingdom
Height: 5′ 2½″ / 159cm
Reach: 66″ / 168cm
Flyweight
Manager: Teddy Lewis


Jimmy Wilde, commonly nicknamed "The Mighty Atom," was so frail-looking and white that he was also referred to as "The Ghost with a hammer in his hand." His other nicknames included "The Indian Famine" and "The Furious Freak."

He was at his best fighting weight at 6 stone 10lbs. Historian Gilbert Odd wrote in Boxing News, April 4, 1969:
"He came in at a time when flyweights were plentiful and competition extremely high. Never made 8st in his fighting life!

"Record books show he started in 1911 but it is taken for granted that he had been fighting professionally for at least 4 years before that. 100s of his bouts , fought on the top spit to an audience of miners on pay night or in the Saturday night booth run by "Professor" Jack Scarrott on the vacant piece of land at the top of the street took place before anyone thought of recording contests. Even printed record is not complete. Wilde's claim that he had at least 800 fights is probably greatly exaggerated, but it was a great deal more than the 139 listed. Never suffered hand injuries. Never put a bandage on until he fought in London. Thought it cramped the fist. Never had a lesson in his life bar the few in his bedroom from Dai Davies, the father of the girl he was courting. Was married and a father by 1912. In 1916 joined the army and was sent to Aldershot as PT instructor. At 29 after such continued and strenuous activity, his natural fighting instincts deserted him when he fought Pete (Kid) Herman. Retired for 2 & half years; came back disastrously."

The January 1941 The Ring magazine published a retrospective on Wilde. He had been born at 8 Station Road, Pontygwaith, Tylorstown, Wales, in 1892. He was the son of a miner and became a miner, too. Married at age 18, he became a booth fighter, taking on men weighing as much as 12 stones (170-pounders), and amassing a reported record of some 864 bouts. He first came into prominence in 1912 when he beat Billy Padden for the English Paperweight Title.

Fighting Style: (according to Jan. 1941 The Ring):
"Wilde's strength and his hitting power, considering his size and weight, were simply amazing. He was a highly skilled boxer and the power of his punches was almost magical.

"Wilde always believed in avoiding any tactics that would reduce his stamina, hence instead of blocking the blows of his opponent, he had a knack of sidestepping an inch or two when the delivery was made and invariably got out of their range. The only time in his entire career where this method could not be used with effect was in his bout with Pancho Villa, but in that contest Jimmy met a boy who was just coming while Wilde, the champion, had already seen his best days.

"His sense of distance was uncanny. He could stand within range of a blow when it started but when an opponent let it loose, a little jerk of the head or the body and the punch landed in space.

"Always on his toes, his body executing a wavelike motion, his gloves resting on his hips without a semblance of a guard, his knees slightly bent, he proved a bewildering subject for any opponent. He always kept his man guessing, feinted him into knots and then connected with his terrific right, said to be the heaviest punch ever delivered by a fellow his weight. These are the qualities which Jimmy Wilde possessed and which enabled him to take his rank among the truly great Supermen."

He saved his ring earnings and lived quite well. He became President of the National Union of Boxers, and wrote an autobiography, Fighting Was My Busines

Measurements:

Height: 5 feet 2"
Reach: 68 inches
Chest (normal): 32"
Chest (expanded): 34"
Neck: 12"
Thigh: 15"
Waist: 22"
Calf: 10"
Ankle: 8"
Biceps: 10"
Forearm: 10"
Wrist: 6"

[scartissue]

All this talk about Prince Naseem really grinds my gears. The dude is a 'could-have-been'. Granted, he won the 126 lb. title and unified it somewhat and he was fun to watch. But his lack of humility really got me during his post-fight interviews and the way he dumped his manager/trainer Brendan Ingle, the man that had been with him and taught him since Naseem was a kid (Ingle also trained Herol Graham and Johnny Nelson - note the Ingle signature in styles). It was going to be interesting what was going to be Naz's reaction the first time he lost. What did Arthur Danahar do after his 14 round war with Eric Boon? Rematch! How about Peter Kane after being stopped in 13 by Benny Lynch (Actor and ex-pug Victor McGlagen walked out of the arena stating, "That was the finest 13 rounds of boxing I have ever seen.")? Rematch! Or Kevin Finnegan going 15 rounds 3 times with Minter and losing all by a hair. Hell, even Roy Jones, whose heart was always questioned by me, at least signed a 3rd fight with Tarver because he wanted to remove the stain of his loss. And he was knocked cold in the 2nd fight. I'll always give him credit for that. Hamed never did go looking for a rematch. It was like he had read nothing but his press clippings and just couldn't come to grips with the fact that he lost and lost decisively. I find it to be a disgrace to talk of him in the same breath as some teak-tough Brits as Dave (Boy) Green, Boza Edwards, Dave Charnley, who hadn't the inate skill as a Naseem yet, far exceeded him in the ticker department. Those are some of the fighters I revere and will talk about when I'm a geezer, not the inglorious 'tuck-tail and run' career of Prince Naseem Hamed. Can you imagine if he had a pair of balls, scrutinized his loss to Barrera, came back to beat him and had a rubber match? We may be talking about the great Barrerra-Hamed trilogy today, instead we got Barrera chasing the bully from the playground. And the bully never came around again.

Scartissue

[Rick Farris]

Message for impressionable young Brits:
When you say "Best ever" remember that "ever" includes time before the year you were born.
It also includes times when people were tougher and had to fight more than once or twice a year.
Keep reading on, and a couple American boxing historians will school you on your boxing heritage.
Just because you have nothing today, doesn't reflect the past.
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Ted (Kid) Lewis

Record: 234 bouts / 193-28-13 (80 KO's)
World Boxing Hall of Fame - Class 1992
Old Timer Category
Alias: The Aldgate Sphinx
Birth Name: Gershon Mendeloff
Born: 1893-10-28
Birthplace: St George's, London, United Kingdom
Died: 1970-10-20 (Age:76)
Height: 5′ 8½″
Trainers: Mannie Seamon, Zelig Goodman.
Generally credited with being the first fighter to use a mouthpiece; at the very least he was the first notable fighter to use one.

[Rick Farris]

To my friends . . .

Please don't play "peace maker" here.
We are talking boxing history which is far more important than friendly rationalization.
If you enjoyed Prince Hamed, great. Just don't attempt to put him in the same class with true all-time greats.
Like someone once said, opinions are like ass holes, everybody has one.
I back mine with facts, not youthful ignorance.
Let us fight. Confrontation is what leads to peace and understanding.
So far all I have encountered is unarmed opposition.

[Rick Farris]

Keep in mind impressionale young Brits, that back in the day we only had eight undisputed world champs.
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Peter Kane


Record: 93 bouts / 84-7-2 (54 KO's)
Born: 1918-02-28
Birthplace: Golborne, Lancashire, United Kingdom
Died: 1991-07-23 (Age:73)
Nationality: United Kingdom
Hometown: Liverpool, Merseyside, United Kingdom


Was British and EBU (European) bantamweight title holder, Kane also fought Benny Lynch for the world batamweight title in 1930 Kane fought Benny Lynch for the World Flyweight Title, yet Lynch weighed 119lbs 7oz and had to pay a forfeit. The match was made at 118lbs.