BoxRec

CNorkusJr wrote:Thanks Randy. Very kind words !

You pose a very good Question and scenario.
I will give you my thoughts on it,but first let me what I think my father would say about that.

For years, I have seen my father be interviewed by dozens of sports mags,newscasters,and newspapers. Many asked my father what he thought would be a result of a Norkus-Marciano match-up, the two non-title fights that was contracted to twice but for reasons never occurred, and a handshake on a possible title shot if he got by Ezzard Charles.
My father and his handlers chased Marciano, like any other Heavy out there. He did not fear Rocky. Both fighters knew each other well outside the ring, but that does not mean that they wouldn't take it to each other once in the ring. My father has always respected those who managed to capture the title belt. He wanted that title. He was a competetor.
When asked DURING his career, he always brought up Rocky's name and title, and tried to involve himself into some way of getting at it. This is reflected in his pre & post fight write ups I have. Even when he lost a fight-he always said that he was worth a shot against the champ at that time.
After his career, he softened a little, knowing that his career and title chase was past his time, he answered heartedly that he thought that Rocky could be beat. He cited that my father had "an equalizer" in his left hooks that floored many, and that Rocky was susceptable to lefts". He'd end the question with, "I do not know if I would have won the fight, but it sure would have been interesting".
Deep down, I think he thought he could have beaten him, which is exactly why my father had the heart to do battles, and I mean BATTLES" in the ring.
My father did not play with the mob and their rules, they used him in other ways, but my father would not go down for nobody.Though my father did not state this to me, its in my subsequent talks with many that this just might be the reason there was no title shot for him. Since Rocky also, feared no man- it makes little sense that Rocky ducked my father because of his strong lefts. Seriously doubtful and I make no insinuation of that.

My father with Jerry Quarry. Both had very strong similarities in both style and approach to their respective opponents. I believe my father would tell you, "Bring him on". No doubt about that. I do not like to compare fighters with two different generations. It is much easier to compare two fighters who are the same weight class from their own eras, but because boxing styles and rules and training techniques have changed alot, it is practically fruitless to compare "Marciano-Tyson" "Dempsey-Holmes" that we see out there.
Quarry and Norkus can be compared somewhat. Both had identical styles and hearts and both were bangers from the get go.Quarry might have more power than my father as I seen his legs do the work in his fights. But I think my father was more saavy in avoiding his punches and would capitialize on Jerrys mistakes on his misses. My father would catch him as he got more wild with his rights. Its what my father put in the bank each fight.
Both had good chins, but if Quarry landed squarely it could be over, same could be said about my father. I dont see it going the distance-a slugfest-somebody going to fall- anybody's call.

My father would have loved this match-up, especially if it was in the 1960's. Those two guys and the way they fought could have been a great series of fights and they both would have been a lot richer $$$$$ for it.
Joe DiMaggio once told my father that "he gave him a thrill watching his fights, and too bad that he missed fighting in the 1960's 70's , as he would easily been a millionaire because of it". My father nodded saying Thanks and laughed with Joe. DiMaggio was a huge boxing fan and attended many New York fights. My father had an open invite to eat at his fathers and brothers Restaurant on the Wharf in San Fran "DiMaggio's".

Randyman wrote:

CNorkusJr wrote:Thanks Randy. Very kind words !

You pose a very good Question and scenario.
I will give you my thoughts on it,but first let me what I think my father would say about that.

For years, I have seen my father be interviewed by dozens of sports mags,newscasters,and newspapers. Many asked my father what he thought would be a result of a Norkus-Marciano match-up, the two non-title fights that was contracted to twice but for reasons never occurred, and a handshake on a possible title shot if he got by Ezzard Charles.
My father and his handlers chased Marciano, like any other Heavy out there. He did not fear Rocky. Both fighters knew each other well outside the ring, but that does not mean that they wouldn't take it to each other once in the ring. My father has always respected those who managed to capture the title belt. He wanted that title. He was a competetor.
When asked DURING his career, he always brought up Rocky's name and title, and tried to involve himself into some way of getting at it. This is reflected in his pre & post fight write ups I have. Even when he lost a fight-he always said that he was worth a shot against the champ at that time.
After his career, he softened a little, knowing that his career and title chase was past his time, he answered heartedly that he thought that Rocky could be beat. He cited that my father had "an equalizer" in his left hooks that floored many, and that Rocky was susceptable to lefts". He'd end the question with, "I do not know if I would have won the fight, but it sure would have been interesting".
Deep down, I think he thought he could have beaten him, which is exactly why my father had the heart to do battles, and I mean BATTLES" in the ring.
My father did not play with the mob and their rules, they used him in other ways, but my father would not go down for nobody.Though my father did not state this to me, its in my subsequent talks with many that this just might be the reason there was no title shot for him. Since Rocky also, feared no man- it makes little sense that Rocky ducked my father because of his strong lefts. Seriously doubtful and I make no insinuation of that.

My father with Jerry Quarry. Both had very strong similarities in both style and approach to their respective opponents. I believe my father would tell you, "Bring him on". No doubt about that. I do not like to compare fighters with two different generations. It is much easier to compare two fighters who are the same weight class from their own eras, but because boxing styles and rules and training techniques have changed alot, it is practically fruitless to compare "Marciano-Tyson" "Dempsey-Holmes" that we see out there.
Quarry and Norkus can be compared somewhat. Both had identical styles and hearts and both were bangers from the get go.Quarry might have more power than my father as I seen his legs do the work in his fights. But I think my father was more saavy in avoiding his punches and would capitialize on Jerrys mistakes on his misses. My father would catch him as he got more wild with his rights. Its what my father put in the bank each fight.
Both had good chins, but if Quarry landed squarely it could be over, same could be said about my father. I dont see it going the distance-a slugfest-somebody going to fall- anybody's call.

My father would have loved this match-up, especially if it was in the 1960's. Those two guys and the way they fought could have been a great series of fights and they both would have been a lot richer $$$$$ for it.
Joe DiMaggio once told my father that "he gave him a thrill watching his fights, and too bad that he missed fighting in the 1960's 70's , as he would easily been a millionaire because of it". My father nodded saying Thanks and laughed with Joe. DiMaggio was a huge boxing fan and attended many New York fights. My father had an open invite to eat at his fathers and brothers Restaurant on the Wharf in San Fran "DiMaggio's".

Charlie, thanks for the great answer. You gave a very unbiased analysis. Coming from the son of Charley Norkus that really means something. From the dvd's that you have sent I've learned quite a bit just by watching him. That's why I posed the question. Plus, I just finished reading the Quarry book and it got me thinking. Lot's of respect for your Pops and Jerry, epitomes of a long gone era of heavyweight boxing. Thanks too for the added tidbit on Marciano. Interesting. What would a real fighter be if not for his belief that he can win against anyone?

Thanks
Randy

Cholo wrote:Frank, were you at the Aragon/Miceli fight? i have this old newspaper clipping, LOS ANGELES-Art Aragon, with both eyes swollen shut and a broken ankle, insisted today he is "definitely not" going to hang up his gloves because of the brutal, bloody beating he took from New York's Joe Micelli. In fact, he demanded a rematch.
The veteran New York middleweight won a unanimous 10 round decision over the Los Angeles fighter before nearly 10,000 fans at the Olympic Auditorium last night after cutting Aragon's face into a bloody mess with a steady flurry of hard left hooks and uppercuts.
The Golden Boy, who apparently fought with a broken right ankle from the first round on, went down twice during the bout in which he had been the 2-1 favorite..... I couldn't see fighter's today fighting 10 rounds with a broken ankle.. Gutsy fighter Art Aragon....

Cholo wrote:Frank, were you at the Aragon/Miceli fight? i have this old newspaper clipping, LOS ANGELES-Art Aragon, with both eyes swollen shut and a broken ankle, insisted today he is "definitely not" going to hang up his gloves because of the brutal, bloody beating he took from New York's Joe Micelli. In fact, he demanded a rematch.
The veteran New York middleweight won a unanimous 10 round decision over the Los Angeles fighter before nearly 10,000 fans at the Olympic Auditorium last night after cutting Aragon's face into a bloody mess with a steady flurry of hard left hooks and uppercuts.
The Golden Boy, who apparently fought with a broken right ankle from the first round on, went down twice during the bout in which he had been the 2-1 favorite..... I couldn't see fighter's today fighting 10 rounds with a broken ankle.. Gutsy fighter Art Aragon....

kikibalt wrote:

Cholo wrote:Frank, were you at the Aragon/Miceli fight? i have this old newspaper clipping, LOS ANGELES-Art Aragon, with both eyes swollen shut and a broken ankle, insisted today he is "definitely not" going to hang up his gloves because of the brutal, bloody beating he took from New York's Joe Micelli. In fact, he demanded a rematch.
The veteran New York middleweight won a unanimous 10 round decision over the Los Angeles fighter before nearly 10,000 fans at the Olympic Auditorium last night after cutting Aragon's face into a bloody mess with a steady flurry of hard left hooks and uppercuts.
The Golden Boy, who apparently fought with a broken right ankle from the first round on, went down twice during the bout in which he had been the 2-1 favorite..... I couldn't see fighter's today fighting 10 rounds with a broken ankle.. Gutsy fighter Art Aragon....

Sorry to say I missed the Aragon/Miceli fight, don't remember why. probably low on funds....

Cholo wrote:

kikibalt wrote:

Cholo wrote:Frank, were you at the Aragon/Miceli fight? i have this old newspaper clipping, LOS ANGELES-Art Aragon, with both eyes swollen shut and a broken ankle, insisted today he is "definitely not" going to hang up his gloves because of the brutal, bloody beating he took from New York's Joe Micelli. In fact, he demanded a rematch.
The veteran New York middleweight won a unanimous 10 round decision over the Los Angeles fighter before nearly 10,000 fans at the Olympic Auditorium last night after cutting Aragon's face into a bloody mess with a steady flurry of hard left hooks and uppercuts.
The Golden Boy, who apparently fought with a broken right ankle from the first round on, went down twice during the bout in which he had been the 2-1 favorite..... I couldn't see fighter's today fighting 10 rounds with a broken ankle.. Gutsy fighter Art Aragon....

Sorry to say I missed the Aragon/Miceli fight, don't remember why. probably low on funds....

Frank....

bennie wrote:Just thinking about McMurtry - I wonder how many fighters later refereed a former opponent?

"Tomato-Can wrote of McMurtry on boxrec: "He was a referee in a lot of Pacific Northwest main events in the 60s and 70s. He never seemed to be in the way of the action and a little blood never scared him.
"A rated Heavyweight in the 1950s, he was big enough to handle the big guys and keep them from hugging all night."



McMurtry steers Boone Kirkman to a neutral corner

CNorkusJr wrote:
Thank You Frank for posting my dads link to Nardico 1 and Ezz Charles.Mucho Gracias.

Cholo wrote:Frank, you knew Keeny Teran? excellent boxer Keeny, i see there's a clip of Keeny Teran/Gil Cadilli fight on youtube
from the Hollywood Legion. The Gil Cadilli documentary is it available on dvd?..

Cholo wrote:Frank, you sparred Keeny, they say he was a sharp-shooting fighter, what was it like to be in there with Teran, Frank?..

BOXERJOSH wrote:How do I go about reserving a seat at the CBHOF luncheon in June? DD

kikibalt wrote:

BOXERJOSH wrote:How do I go about reserving a seat at the CBHOF luncheon in June? DD

Call Don Fraser at 818-761-4887. He'll tell you to send $50.00 and he'll send you the ticket....

BOXERJOSH wrote:

kikibalt wrote:

BOXERJOSH wrote:How do I go about reserving a seat at the CBHOF luncheon in June? DD

Call Don Fraser at 818-761-4887. He'll tell you to send $50.00 and he'll send you the ticket....

Thanks Frank, much appreciated. Can't wait to attend.

Flump wrote:

kikibalt wrote:

THEHAMMER321 wrote: Frank did the ref rule the last knockdown a slip or did he rule all of the knockdowns slips ? .

Just the last one, he gave Moore the 8 count on the first two, on the third; Moore without the ref's help wouldn't have been able to get up on his own...damn ref picked moore up!!.... ...I am still piss....

Sorry if this makes you worse kikibalt but this was the Boxing News report of the fight, thought you might like to see it, apologies in advance if you didn't, sounds like quite a scrap.