BoxRec

kikibalt wrote:Rick, call me and I'll tell who Joe and Rosie were....I don't want to use their real names here.

I'll call you, Frank.
That's something an old boxing guy would do, and pull in a young guy.
Only one winner, and it ain't you.

Louie Jaregui . . .

Nobody on this thread knows Louie J. better than Frank Baltazar. But I got to know him pretty well myself.
As a Jr. GG boxer, I fought a lot of Teamsters Gym fighters, and Louie was the head coach at Teamsters.
The one Teamsters boxer I fought the most was Gabe Gutierrez, and we fought six times during an 18 month period between 1969-71.
Three of our fights were as amateurs and then three as pros. As amateurs he and I were both 1-1-1, same as pros, 1-1-1. All close.

Gabe was five years older than me. When we first fought I was 17, and he was 22. We fought in one of two amateur fights on a thursday night Olympic pro card.
That was in July, 1969 and Gabe won a close three-rounder. A couple months later, in October, we fight again. The second fight was held at the China Lake Naval base located in the desert of all places, near Edwards Air Force Base. We all met downtown and a bus had been chartered to take us all to the Antelope Valley, the desert community where the base was located.
Marty Denkin was a former Navy man who had set up the fight card. It would be the first of two amateur cards held at the location.

We all met at the Teamsters Gym (I think that's where we met?) and a big chartered bus was waiting to drive the boxers and coachs to the base, about a two hour drive.
We are all on the bus, I'm sitting a few rows behind where Louie J. and his fighter, Gabe Gutierrez was sitting. I see Louie stand up and walk back to the empty seat next to me.
Louie sits down besides me, and everytime I start to nod off, he wakes me up with a joke or some stupid thing. I can't rest, and I knew that was his ploy.
Man, it pissed me off. I was just 17, and I could see what he was doing. At 17, I was smarter than Louie J. and I knew I was going to prove it in the ring.
I outboxed Gabe Gutierrez that night, easily. I was motivated by his coach's obvious BS. Afterwards, I thanked Louie for motivating me.
The fight was a draw, I know I won and so did Gabe, and so did Louie. Two months later, I beat him in the Diamond Belt finals.
That sent me to the '70 Golden Gloves Nationals, Louie's boxer was left in L.A.

We divided three pro fights the same way, but in the last match, I beat him up pretty bad. I was no longer 17, I was 19 and growing stronger.
I wanted to make sure I never had to look across the ring and see Gabe Gutierrez as my opponent. I finally owned him, but I had to grow into that reality.

For those wins I credit Louie. Teamsters Gym was a legendary L.A. boxing club. I enjoyed beating a Teamsters fighter.

Rick Farris wrote:

CNorkusJr wrote:http://boxingmemories.com/2011/03/26/ta ... ry-holmes/

Good written interview with Larry Holmes. Touches on a few subjects: Ali,Norton, MMA
on todays heavyweights. etc etc

Wasnt a huge Holmes fan but he comes across nice and seemingly down-to-earth in this interview.

Larry Holmes & Lennox Lewis, a difference in class . . .


Interesting story, Charlie. In 2007, we inducted Larry Holmes into the World Boxing Hall of Fame.
When Larry Holmes was notified of his pending induction, he immediatly made demands regarding first class air fare and lodging for himself, family and enourage.
We explained we were a non-profit organization, and would guarantee first class accomodations plus business class airfare for he and his wife.
We would also set up a media event, press conference, etc. etc. We'd treat him like a Hall of Famer, but we could not cover his entourage.
Holmes refused to attend unless we'd satisfy his demands. We treat all honorees the same, and that's the best we could do.
We also present them with a bronze statue, "The Fighter" created by a well known Bronze artist.
Mainly, we put a special prizefighter in the eyes of his fans once again. Boxers rarely walk away from the ring with much, even champs.
We try to give them something that they deserve and have earned. Holmes earned $millions. We who are honoring him are basicly working people.
Holmes was surly, said we could mail him his bronze. He wasn't coming.

We sent Larry Holmes a message. We told him that he would be inducted into the WBHOF, as he is deserving and was voted in.
However, we will not send him his bronze. We will also not acknowledge him in the banquet, or discuss his induction in the media.
He was told that if he should one day like to attend a future WBHOF banquet, we'd cover his flight & accomodations, and present him the bronze on stage.
No appearance - No bronze or accomodations, etc.

The following year we induct Lennox Lewis. What a difference. Lennox was already committed to call a fight for HBO on the date of our banquet.
Lewis said he really wanted to attend the event, and since he was the biggest name being inducted that year we decided to push the date of the event back one month, to accomodate the former 3-time heavyweight champ. Lennox Lewis was so grateful he refused to accept our offer of airline tickets and hotel room, etc. Lennox said he'd cover any travel and lodging expenses, all he wanted was four seats, for himself, wife, mother and attorney. What a gentleman! Such a class act is Lennox Lewis. Many of us who post here were at the event, and Randy put together a great video.

I'm disappointed Larry Holmes could not show that championship class you want from a great heavyweight.
However, Lennox Lewis made us forget all about Larry Holmes.

Randy's 2008 WBHOF Video :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Av6c8sVK6no

Great story Rick, and I agree whole-heartedly on the greed of Larry Holmes.
I know the story goes that "he" still feels he takes a backseat when it comes to comparing him high on the Greatest Heavywt. Champions list. He feels shorthanded on that subject.
When Ring 8 honored him 2 years ago, he pulled the same crap. He demanded the roof, but what I gather(I dont sit on the dinner committee) he finally agreed to a $10,000 payment after urging of some friends who were accomodated(table of ten) as well.Also, it was brought out that Gerry Cooney was going to be there and he made a remark that he didnt want to be upstaged by holding back. During his speech(most were 5-10 mins, his was 40 mins) and muttered to a point of hardly understanding him, but clearly he remarked that he felt slighted when he was getting close to Marciano's unbeaten mark. He felt that because of his color he didnt get the "attention-media or otherwise" that he felt he deserved.
Though in his defense he did not shun autograph or picture takers and seemed happy taking pictures with Gerry Cooney and whomever slid in.
He might have a point about his feeling of not getting the respect he might deserve for a very good career, but still letting people know about it today hurts his post career image even more, I feel.
On another comparison, Joe Frazier and son Marvis appeared last year, and demanded nothing. I think Ring 8 provided limo service from and to Philly,and overnite accomodations which Ring 8 were more than glad to provide for a great guy and champ. Very Gracious.

L.A. Boxing Trivia . . .

Boxing promoter Cal Eaton's son, Bobby, was a lawyer who married the daughter of California Governor Goodwin Knight.
Aileen LeBell was a secretary for Olympic Auditorium owner Frank Garbutt. She had two sons, Mike and Gene.
The Olympic was losing money under those who were running it.
Mrs. LeBell told her boss she could do better running the Olympic, and he put her in charge.
At the time, Cal Eaton was an inspector for the Calif. Athletic Commission. He and LeBell met and married. The rest is history.

AlFrancis wrote:

Boxingnut wrote:

AlFrancis wrote:Where about in Liverpool are you nut?

Huyton, Alan. You kindly added me on facebook, my name is Rob Morris.

Alright Rob!

Alright Alan! I think i have told you this before but it is a good story I think. I used to work with a lad who was a bit of a crook, a nasty piece of work tbh and his dad was a crook also. He told me his dad used to drink with yours around Anfield and that one day he had offered your dad £10k for his Lonsdale belt and your dad told him to go and f**k himself!! Not sure if its true, I kind of hope it is!!

Frank, Roberto Duran "El Cholo", did you ever see him in sparring?, i've read he took no prisoner's in sparring.
He KO'D Angelo Dundee's middleweight contender Vinnie Curto in sparring when he was lightweight champion at Miami's
5TH. ST Gym.....

Cholo wrote:Frank, Roberto Duran "El Cholo", did you ever see him in sparring?, i've read he took no prisoner's in sparring.
He KO'D Angelo Dundee's middleweight contender Vinnie Curto in sparring when he was lightweight champion at Miami's
5TH. ST Gym.....

No, I never seen Duran sparring, I was never in a gym when he was there. I did see him fight live a couple of times though.

kikibalt wrote:

Did the nationals warm up to him in the end?

Panzerfaust wrote:

kikibalt wrote:

Did the nationals warm up to him in the end?

Nope!!

Duran with British fighters Errol Christie and Michael Harris in 1988

Boxingnut wrote:

AlFrancis wrote:

Boxingnut wrote: Huyton, Alan. You kindly added me on facebook, my name is Rob Morris.

Alright Rob!

Alright Alan! I think i have told you this before but it is a good story I think. I used to work with a lad who was a bit of a crook, a nasty piece of work tbh and his dad was a crook also. He told me his dad used to drink with yours around Anfield and that one day he had offered your dad £10k for his Lonsdale belt and your dad told him to go and f**k himself!! Not sure if its true, I kind of hope it is!!

He kept hold of it Rob there was never a chance he'd sell it. As it happens it's gonna be displayed at the new Liverpool museum that open's in July. Conteh has lent some of his stuff as well. There is a sporting section and they're gonna have the belt and his MBE for the next three years.

The Ring-Feb, 1954
Art Aragon, California's "Golden Boy"a Welterweight contender who was the Golden State's outstanding fighter for 1953.
Golden Boy Art Aragon regained much of his luster, glitter and glamor at the Olympic Auditorium before an enthusiastic crowd of 7500 by scoring a one-sided victory over Danny(Bang Bang) Womber. Gross gate was $20,217.-the smallest Aragon has drawn at the Olympic this year.
It was still a tremendous tribute to the coloful kid from the San Fernando Valley, for both Aragon and Womber were "losers" when they entered the ring. Both had dropped a duke to Ramon Fuentes in recent months.
Let me stay with this commercial aspect 'arf a mo'.
Fuentes, fter beating Aragon, met Womber a month ago, Womber was fresh from a win over Wilbur Wilson, which had come over very nicely on TV and had been viewed by many thousand Angelenos.
Well, Fuentes and Womber, both "winners" drew a gross gate of $14,173: Aragon and Womber both "losers", grossed as stated above, $20,127. There's magic in the name Aragon.
There may be better drawing cards in California in the years to come: there certainly haven't been any has good in the years gone by! Imagine: $154, 826, gross in FOUR fights. 1953 ! ! !
As to the fight itself, Aragon was a serious minded, most determined young man, and the crowed like the new Aragon. Art new it was a case of MUST: he had to win, or else. He landed by far the harder punches, staggered the courageous Womber time and again. Bang-Bang got banged plenty and miraculously remained upright. Aragon opened at 2-1. went to 2 1/2 -1 at ring-time;he won like a 5-to-1 shot. Certainly he's right back in the picture... Frank did you see the Womber fight...

bennie wrote:

Duran with British fighters Errol Christie and Michael Harris in 1988

Bennie, This photo was taken around the same time Duran sparred with Nigel Benn, you can see this on youtube, Duran just played with Benn, some idiots think Benn would have beaten "EL CHOLO"......

A little L.A. boxing history from the Eastside . . .

Babe McCoy and his partner Johnny Keyes were managing boxers when McCoy filled in for an ailing Joe Waterman, serving as matchmaker at the Ocean Park Arena.
McCoy would take over as matchmaker at the Olympic around 1940, but not before he and Keyes attempted promoting boxing at the old Eastside Arena.
The Eastside Arena was located in East Los Angeles at the corner of 9th & Lorena.

Boxing was at it's best when small clubs developed attractions that would go on to headline at larger clubs. This was true in Los Angeles as thruout the America.
If you won at Ocean Park, you might secure a match at the Hollywood Legion or the Olympic. Like in other sports, if you made it in the minor leagues, the majors awaited.


-Rick Farris

Cholo wrote:The Ring-Feb, 1954
Art Aragon, California's "Golden Boy"a Welterweight contender who was the Golden State's outstanding fighter for 1953.
Golden Boy Art Aragon regained much of his luster, glitter and glamor at the Olympic Auditorium before an enthusiastic crowd of 7500 by scoring a one-sided victory over Danny(Bang Bang) Womber. Gross gate was $20,217.-the smallest Aragon has drawn at the Olympic this year.
It was still a tremendous tribute to the coloful kid from the San Fernando Valley, for both Aragon and Womber were "losers" when they entered the ring. Both had dropped a duke to Ramon Fuentes in recent months.
Let me stay with this commercial aspect 'arf a mo'.
Fuentes, fter beating Aragon, met Womber a month ago, Womber was fresh from a win over Wilbur Wilson, which had come over very nicely on TV and had been viewed by many thousand Angelenos.
Well, Fuentes and Womber, both "winners" drew a gross gate of $14,173: Aragon and Womber both "losers", grossed as stated above, $20,127. There's magic in the name Aragon.
There may be better drawing cards in California in the years to come: there certainly haven't been any has good in the years gone by! Imagine: $154, 826, gross in FOUR fights. 1953 ! ! !
As to the fight itself, Aragon was a serious minded, most determined young man, and the crowed like the new Aragon. Art new it was a case of MUST: he had to win, or else. He landed by far the harder punches, staggered the courageous Womber time and again. Bang-Bang got banged plenty and miraculously remained upright. Aragon opened at 2-1. went to 2 1/2 -1 at ring-time;he won like a 5-to-1 shot. Certainly he's right back in the picture... Frank did you see the Womber fight...

Paul, I didn't see the Womber fight, I did see Ramon Fuentes whup Art though!!

Cholo wrote:Frank, Roberto Duran "El Cholo", did you ever see him in sparring?, i've read he took no prisoner's in sparring.
He KO'D Angelo Dundee's middleweight contender Vinnie Curto in sparring when he was lightweight champion at Miami's
5TH. ST Gym.....

I've seen Roberto Duran sparring on two occasions. The first time was in 1973, when I boxed with Duran (and hit the canvas) prior to his ten-round non-title bout with Mexican champ, Javiar Ayala, at the Sports Arena.

Ten years later, long after I was out of boxing, I went to the Main Street Gym to see Duran training for his match with Pepino Cuevas.
Duran battered his sparring partners. Young or old, big or small, great or not-so-great, Duran would fight them all the same in the gym.

Roberto Duran is one of my all-time favorites, maybe my favorite of all.

Cholo wrote:

bennie wrote:

Duran with British fighters Errol Christie and Michael Harris in 1988

Bennie, This photo was taken around the same time Duran sparred with Nigel Benn, you can see this on youtube, Duran just played with Benn, some idiots think Benn would have beaten "EL CHOLO"......

Yes, Duran toys with Benn, shoving him around like a little boy when Benn tries for the sneaky knockout.

AlFrancis wrote:

Boxingnut wrote:

AlFrancis wrote:
Alright Rob!

Alright Alan! I think i have told you this before but it is a good story I think. I used to work with a lad who was a bit of a crook, a nasty piece of work tbh and his dad was a crook also. He told me his dad used to drink with yours around Anfield and that one day he had offered your dad £10k for his Lonsdale belt and your dad told him to go and f**k himself!! Not sure if its true, I kind of hope it is!!

He kept hold of it Rob there was never a chance he'd sell it. As it happens it's gonna be displayed at the new Liverpool museum that open's in July. Conteh has lent some of his stuff as well. There is a sporting section and they're gonna have the belt and his MBE for the next three years.

Didn't he win two Belts, Al?

Throughout the time that I followed Larry Holmes' career, I got the impression that he has the first dollar that he ever earned. To be sure, such an extreme may be going a little too far, but I do believe that it is a good thing when boxers are able to secure their financial futures for themselves and their families.

There were a number of other boxers who had reputations for being tight with a buck. Among most famous of them were Rocky Marciano and Luis Firpo. Believe it or not, it is probable that Firpo was far tighter with a buck than Marciano.

- Chuck Johnston

Rick Farris wrote:

Cholo wrote:Frank, Roberto Duran "El Cholo", did you ever see him in sparring?, i've read he took no prisoner's in sparring.
He KO'D Angelo Dundee's middleweight contender Vinnie Curto in sparring when he was lightweight champion at Miami's
5TH. ST Gym.....

I've seen Roberto Duran sparring on two occasions. The first time was in 1973, when I boxed with Duran (and hit the canvas) prior to his ten-round non-title bout with Mexican champ, Javiar Ayala, at the Sports Arena.

Ten years later, long after I was out of boxing, I went to the Main Street Gym to see Duran training for his match with Pepino Cuevas.
Duran battered his sparring partners. Young or old, big or small, great or not-so-great, Duran would fight them all the same in the gym.

Roberto Duran is one of my all-time favorites, maybe my favorite of all.

Rick, you sparred with Duran....

Frank, Fuentes was a good fighter, boxed many times on TV.....

AlFrancis wrote:

Boxingnut wrote:

AlFrancis wrote:
Alright Rob!

Alright Alan! I think i have told you this before but it is a good story I think. I used to work with a lad who was a bit of a crook, a nasty piece of work tbh and his dad was a crook also. He told me his dad used to drink with yours around Anfield and that one day he had offered your dad £10k for his Lonsdale belt and your dad told him to go and f**k himself!! Not sure if its true, I kind of hope it is!!

He kept hold of it Rob there was never a chance he'd sell it. As it happens it's gonna be displayed at the new Liverpool museum that open's in July. Conteh has lent some of his stuff as well. There is a sporting section and they're gonna have the belt and his MBE for the next three years.

That is awesome Alan I will have to go there when it opens. I am so glad your dad kept it; to think some criminal could buy it on the cheap when your dad sweated blood for it. I am seething just thinking about it!! Great to see your photos on fb from the WBC night of champions in Cardiff as well. You must have been very proud.

More on Babe McCoy . . .

For the record, I only know of two boxers that Babe McCoy actually "managed", and they were heavyweight Tom Patrick, and Jackie Leonard.
In later years, Jackie Leonard would end up promoting boxing at the Hollywood Legion Stadium. That's a story in it's self, to be discussed later.


-Rick Farris

Boxingnut wrote:

AlFrancis wrote:

Boxingnut wrote: Alright Alan! I think i have told you this before but it is a good story I think. I used to work with a lad who was a bit of a crook, a nasty piece of work tbh and his dad was a crook also. He told me his dad used to drink with yours around Anfield and that one day he had offered your dad £10k for his Lonsdale belt and your dad told him to go and f**k himself!! Not sure if its true, I kind of hope it is!!

He kept hold of it Rob there was never a chance he'd sell it. As it happens it's gonna be displayed at the new Liverpool museum that open's in July. Conteh has lent some of his stuff as well. There is a sporting section and they're gonna have the belt and his MBE for the next three years.

That is awesome Alan I will have to go there when it opens. I am so glad your dad kept it; to think some criminal could buy it on the cheap when your dad sweated blood for it. I am seething just thinking about it!! Great to see your photos on fb from the WBC night of champions in Cardiff as well. You must have been very proud.

Thanks Alan & Rob. I'm enjoying all of this!