BoxRec

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 03:15

goose 5 wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 02:25 Anyone calling for Crawford to fight Bivol or Benavidez must not like him. They would destroy Bud.

Both Crawford and Bivol defeated Canelo in a similar one sided fashion. There's no gap in size. It's a competetive matchup.

You're joking right?

Coco wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 04:48 In the end Bud had superior hand speed, and got off with more shots

Coco I think you're selling him short there. His footwork and sense of distance surely also deserves a shout out - some beautiful little pivots and never really let Canelo get set unless he wanted to mix it up himself. Canelo's frustration told the story.

handsofstone wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 05:03 116-112 Crawford, well deserved but there were a lot of close competitive rounds, first 3 not much happened, Canelo was trying to dig that left hand to the body and right hand up top, Crawford fought the whole fight southpaw, his jab was excellent, sharp left, as the rounds wore on he held his feet more and got the better of the exchanges, we've seen Alvarez struggle with speed before but he keeps coming, landed now and again but Crawford was brilliant, not a classic but high level chess match

Hands I always love your write-ups (rely on them when I haven't seen a fight myself!), but I think we probably have a different definition of competitive on this occasion. Felt Crawford pretty much had his way here and dictated the flow of the fight. Felt Canelo was always a step behind once that opening feeling out round was done and dusted.

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:24

Coco wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 04:48 In the end Bud had superior hand speed, and got off with more shots

Coco I think you're selling him short there. His footwork and sense of distance surely also deserves a shout out - some beautiful little pivots and never really let Canelo get set unless he wanted to mix it up himself. Canelo's frustration told the story.

Crawford had it won after 9 rounds. Those head spinning counters were beautiful.

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:28

handsofstone wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 05:03 116-112 Crawford, well deserved but there were a lot of close competitive rounds, first 3 not much happened, Canelo was trying to dig that left hand to the body and right hand up top, Crawford fought the whole fight southpaw, his jab was excellent, sharp left, as the rounds wore on he held his feet more and got the better of the exchanges, we've seen Alvarez struggle with speed before but he keeps coming, landed now and again but Crawford was brilliant, not a classic but high level chess match

Hands I always love your write-ups (rely on them when I haven't seen a fight myself!), but I think we probably have a different definition of competitive on this occasion. Felt Crawford pretty much had his way here and dictated the flow of the fight. Felt Canelo was always a step behind once that opening feeling out round was done and dusted.

Cheers Des, although I did think Crawford always looked comfortable as far as punches landed I didn't see much early rounds, , I've got a say some of the punch stats surprised me in a few rounds

I'm not a Canelo hater, but let's call it straight, in my opinion

GGG 1st and 2nd fight - GGG wins
Lara - Lara win or draw at worst
Mayweather - Clear loss not close
Bivol - Clear loss not close
Crawford - Clear loss not close

These are the elite fighters he fought

He has some good wins, Smith, Cotto, Charlo, Plant, ageing Kovalev, but these are not elite fighters.

He will deservedly go straight into the hall of fame, but under strict scrutiny he has fallen short at the very top elite level.

handsofstone wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:35

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:28

handsofstone wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 05:03 116-112 Crawford, well deserved but there were a lot of close competitive rounds, first 3 not much happened, Canelo was trying to dig that left hand to the body and right hand up top, Crawford fought the whole fight southpaw, his jab was excellent, sharp left, as the rounds wore on he held his feet more and got the better of the exchanges, we've seen Alvarez struggle with speed before but he keeps coming, landed now and again but Crawford was brilliant, not a classic but high level chess match

Hands I always love your write-ups (rely on them when I haven't seen a fight myself!), but I think we probably have a different definition of competitive on this occasion. Felt Crawford pretty much had his way here and dictated the flow of the fight. Felt Canelo was always a step behind once that opening feeling out round was done and dusted.

Cheers Des, although I did think Crawford always looked comfortable as far as punches landed I didn't see much early rounds, , I've got a say some of the punch stats surprised me in a few rounds

forcefraser wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:38 I'm not a Canelo hater, but let's call it straight, in my opinion

GGG 1st and 2nd fight - GGG wins
Lara - Lara win or draw at worst
Mayweather - Clear loss not close
Bivol - Clear loss not close
Crawford - Clear loss not close

These are the elite fighters he fought

He has some good wins, Smith, Cotto, Charlo, Plant, ageing Kovalev, but these are not elite fighters.

He will deservedly go straight into the hall of fame, but under strict scrutiny he has fallen short at the very top elite level.

That's my take as well - has always looked one-paced and out of ideas when faced with a world-class mover. He's a tank with great head movement, shot selection etc, but he falls short from elite IMO because of that constant inability to solve the puzzles posed by superior boxers.
And while he's always been incredibly robust, we tend to forget about his 'magic' meat as well...

forcefraser wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:38 I'm not a Canelo hater, but let's call it straight, in my opinion

GGG 1st and 2nd fight - GGG wins
Lara - Lara win or draw at worst
Mayweather - Clear loss not close
Bivol - Clear loss not close
Crawford - Clear loss not close

These are the elite fighters he fought

He has some good wins, Smith, Cotto, Charlo, Plant, ageing Kovalev, but these are not elite fighters.

He will deservedly go straight into the hall of fame, but under strict scrutiny he has fallen short at the very top elite level.

Yea amazing what being canelo can do for you… shame, GGG really deserved his praise as one of the best ever, but getting sucked for years then robbed really stains his career looking back on it.

Yep credit to Canelo for taking all those fights, but the wrong style really does make him look a bit pedestrian. If the judges were honest, his record would look considerably worse.

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:24

Coco wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 04:48 In the end Bud had superior hand speed, and got off with more shots

Coco I think you're selling him short there. His footwork and sense of distance surely also deserves a shout out - some beautiful little pivots and never really let Canelo get set unless he wanted to mix it up himself. Canelo's frustration told the story.

You are quite right, I put it in a very basic way, maybe that was the end result, but to get there is much more intricate, his feet were fabulous, you can't get the shots off without measuring the distance correctly, and having your feet right.

If I'm going to be very harsh towards Canelo, he can be outboxed at absolute elite level, PBF and Bud.
Khan did too, and it was close enough v BJS.

With the latter two, he worked the puzzle out and got to them.

Whereas v PBF and Bud he just couldn't.

Was of course well beat by the bigger Biv too.

For Bud, giving away so much weight, it is one of the great wins.

Also it's one of PBFs wins that goes a bit under the radar

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:03 Yep credit to Canelo for taking all those fights, but the wrong style really does make him look a bit pedestrian. If the judges were honest, his record would look considerably worse.

61-6-1

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:22

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 03:15

goose 5 wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 02:25 Anyone calling for Crawford to fight Bivol or Benavidez must not like him. They would destroy Bud.

Both Crawford and Bivol defeated Canelo in a similar one sided fashion. There's no gap in size. It's a competetive matchup.

You're joking right?

Is something said wrong?

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:10

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:22

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 03:15

Both Crawford and Bivol defeated Canelo in a similar one sided fashion. There's no gap in size. It's a competetive matchup.

You're joking right?

Is something said wrong?

Both things:
1. There is a significant gap in size between Crawford and Bivol.
2. It wouldn't be a competitive match-up.

Styles make fights - what made Canelo all right for Bud, makes Bivol all wrong for him.

Bivol is 6ft tall and a career light heavy who fights long and tall, has fast hands and wonderful timing and distancing. I couldn't think of a worse match-up for Crawford quite frankly.

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 03:24

Canelo, Spence, Porter... fair enough. The rest is a bunch of B and C-levelers. And even then, Porter was shot and Canelo ... not shot, but on the decline.

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:19

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:10

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:22
You're joking right?

Is something said wrong?

Both things:
1. There is a significant gap in size between Crawford and Bivol.
2. It wouldn't be a competitive match-up.

Styles make fights - what made Canelo all right for Bud, makes Bivol all wrong for him.

Bivol is 6ft tall and a career light heavy who fights long and tall, has fast hands and wonderful timing and distancing. I couldn't think of a worse match-up for Crawford quite frankly.

Bivol is 6ft, while Crawford is 5'9. And Crawford's reach is bigger, 75 vs 72.

Crawford can make weight quite naturally. His movement is better with more angles, his arsenal is more versatile. His reflexes are superior clearly.

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:19

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:10

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 06:22
You're joking right?

Is something said wrong?

Both things:
1. There is a significant gap in size between Crawford and Bivol.
2. It wouldn't be a competitive match-up.

Styles make fights - what made Canelo all right for Bud, makes Bivol all wrong for him.

Bivol is 6ft tall and a career light heavy who fights long and tall, has fast hands and wonderful timing and distancing. I couldn't think of a worse match-up for Crawford quite frankly.

While Biv would be my favourite, it is still a very competitive match up.
Biv is just that bit bigger and stronger again

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 03:24

I used to like Crawford but must say he’s very arrogant and disrespectful decorating his living room like that

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:27

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:19

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:10

Is something said wrong?

Both things:
1. There is a significant gap in size between Crawford and Bivol.
2. It wouldn't be a competitive match-up.

Styles make fights - what made Canelo all right for Bud, makes Bivol all wrong for him.

Bivol is 6ft tall and a career light heavy who fights long and tall, has fast hands and wonderful timing and distancing. I couldn't think of a worse match-up for Crawford quite frankly.

Bivol is 6ft, while Crawford is 5'9. And Crawford's reach is bigger, 75 vs 72.

Crawford can make weight quite naturally. His movement is better with more angles, his arsenal is more versatile. His reflexes are superior clearly.

OK mate, you keep telling yourself that. I would genuinely be surprised if even Crawford himself sees it like that.

You only have to watch the Madrimov fight to see why Bivol, who is a far bigger, better version of Madrimov, is all wrong for Bud. And I say that as a huge Crawford fan who regards him as the p4p no.1 (and also called exactly how he'd beat Canelo).

Boxerbeetle wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:31

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 03:24

I used to like Crawford but must say he’s very arrogant and disrespectful decorating his living room like that

I agree, it's a step too far

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:32

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:27

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:19
Both things:
1. There is a significant gap in size between Crawford and Bivol.
2. It wouldn't be a competitive match-up.

Styles make fights - what made Canelo all right for Bud, makes Bivol all wrong for him.

Bivol is 6ft tall and a career light heavy who fights long and tall, has fast hands and wonderful timing and distancing. I couldn't think of a worse match-up for Crawford quite frankly.

Bivol is 6ft, while Crawford is 5'9. And Crawford's reach is bigger, 75 vs 72.

Crawford can make weight quite naturally. His movement is better with more angles, his arsenal is more versatile. His reflexes are superior clearly.

OK mate, you keep telling yourself that. I would genuinely be surprised if even Crawford himself sees it like that.

You only have to watch the Madrimov fight to see why Bivol, who is a far bigger, better version of Madrimov, is all wrong for Bud. And I say that as a huge Crawford fan who regards him as the p4p no.1 (and also called exactly how he'd beat Canelo).

I don't see why this can't be competetive.

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:35

Deserter wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:32

DrDuke wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:27

Bivol is 6ft, while Crawford is 5'9. And Crawford's reach is bigger, 75 vs 72.

Crawford can make weight quite naturally. His movement is better with more angles, his arsenal is more versatile. His reflexes are superior clearly.

OK mate, you keep telling yourself that. I would genuinely be surprised if even Crawford himself sees it like that.

You only have to watch the Madrimov fight to see why Bivol, who is a far bigger, better version of Madrimov, is all wrong for Bud. And I say that as a huge Crawford fan who regards him as the p4p no.1 (and also called exactly how he'd beat Canelo).

I don't see why this can't be competetive.

You're entitled to your opinion, but Canelo was tailor-made for Bud. By contrast, Bivol is literally the fighter you'd design to give him fits.

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑14 Sep 2025, 07:39

Along stop folk comparing them

They are fighters to be spoken about in the same breath