Classic American West Coast Boxing

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Just thought I'd say this is the best thread I think anywhere on the web related to sports. Keep up the great work. Been reading for years but only recently started posting.

Chris,thanks for the kind words. Appreciate it.

[chrisjs1985]

I drive past this building every day to get to work.

The Garland

Rick Farris's West Coast Boxing Hall of Fame Banquet will take place at the end of September. As always I'll be looking forward to taking it all in. Rick is a good pal and he seats me and my wife at "his" table. Monica,Rick's wife will be there. She's so happy for Rick.Putting on a show like that is very taxing. A lot of money comes out of Rick's pocket to tie things together,but in the end he might have second thoughts about doing it again,but his labor of love will eventually quell any post negative feelings. Dan Hanley,the second in command,does as much as possible,but Dan resides in The Windy City and the contacts are just not there. Dan used to watch the replays of the fights from the Olympic with his dad,Pops,on the tube in Chi Town. He rapidly grew fond of the Mandos and the Reds and the Boys:School and Golden ,the fighters migrating north from Mexico. There wasn't much happening in Chicago on the boxing end.

The event will be held at The Garland Hotel in North Hollywood. The hotel rests on the edge of Studio City and I always think of The Garland being in Studio City. Rick lives a few blocks from The Garland. Rick's dad worked in the studios and Rick followed his path. Between learning his trade as a lighting technician in the film industry and being a fighter during LA's Golden Period of boxing,Rick has a wealth of memories and stories coming from the inside he can share.But going back every year to that area where the streets are named after canyons that wind their way up into the hills,I feel the erosion of a place that once catered to the stars.I ride along Ventura Boulevard today and can't find a decent eatery. It's all these Johnny Come Lately Sushi restaurants or the run on the mill fast food joints. The Boulevard is dirty and dim like the life has been sucked out of it. There's no more Clark Gables or Claire Trevors to catch a glimpse of spinning down the road in a lemon colored T Bird. The School Boys and Golden Boys and Aileen Eaton's baby Mando can only come to view in our minds Mrs. Eaton who threw Mickey Cohen out Olympic was a tough ol' gal with plenty of class to complement her bravado.The Olympic Auditorium is some sort of a Chinese Church now. Uncle Jimmy Lennon ,to the cute little Lennon sisters, whose voice resonated introducing the combatants will remain unforgettable. But that's all gone .


The Garland Hotel is standing. I don't want think of it with superficial adjectives like "tall" and "proud." It's there. The moderate size swimming pool always has a ring around it. The restaurant is overpriced and the food is average. In all the rooms there is a channel on the TV that gives a history of Beverly Garland,the actress who the hotel is named after. Her husband, who was a developer, built the hotel.It has a few hundred rooms.It isn't The Ambassador Hotel,but that structure was torn down years ago. I always watch that documentary of Beverly Garland. That wasn't her real name. She began her screen career in 1950. She was in the first Lone Ranger episode. She wasn't on the top of the marquee like a Liz Taylor or a Kate Hepburn. She was a steady professional who worked on all sides of of film making. Her credits run into the hundreds.She was always one of my favorites.You know how it is if you have a favorite. I like watching her on the screen more than Liz Taylor or Kathryn Hepburn. But Beverly Garland is gone too. Her hotel remains. Ventura Boulevard remains. The building nee the Olympic Auditorium remains But it doesn't look the same. And the people that are gone are only seen in our minds. If I close my eyes I can see everything much better



The once great Olympic Auditorium. Now A Chinese crosswoed puzzle

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Chris,above the main doors there used to be a mural of the very popular Mexican fighter,Bert Colima. He was one of the first big draws at the Olympic. As you can see they painted over his image.




Bert Colima

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The Light Of New York

Very few of the great Mexican champions fought in New York City,especially at the iconic Madison Square Garden. Baby Arizmendi had a few fights at the Garden ,but that was back in the 1930's. I'm thinking about the guys I laid my eyes on :Olivares,Saldivar,Castillo,Herrera,Canto. Salvador Sanchez fought his last fight in New York.Julio Cesar Sr. fought twice in New York,but was never brought back after 1986.Jose Napoles fought Pete Toro in a non title go in Madison Square Garden,but that was it. I'd have to say the most common Mexican face inside the Big Apple boxing venues was Gaspar Ortega.I counted on the Boxrec record listings a healthy total of 20 times Ortega was on the card at either Madison Square Garden or St. Nicks Arena.Isaac Logart,Rudell Stitch,Denny Moyer,Florentino Fernandez,Benny Paret,and Emile Griffith were on the list. No slouches there. I think I heard one time that Ortega was on television during the 50's more than any other pug around.

I remember after Ortega lost the title fight against Emile Griffith in Los Angeles. Gaspar was still calling Tijuana his home. He was quite a celebrity,even when he came up short against Emile. That fight in 61 was Gaspar's last big hurrahAfter that he bounced around fighting mostly in small venues in Mexico although he got a trip to Rome to fight Benvenuti.He loost a decision. Benvenuti was too big and Gaspar was too old. Trying to defeat an Italian fighter in The Boot you needed to bring a gun into the ring with you to have a chance and then you'd lose anyway on a disqualification. But it a chance sighting of Ortega in Tijuana after that Griffith fight that still sticks out in my mind.Ortega lived in the Colonia Morelos by the army cuartel near downtown My father used to take me to get haircuts at a barber shop in Colonia Morelos next to that army base. There was a park there. There still is. After me and my dad got the haircuts(25 cents a haircut U.S. money)we walked to the park to buy an ice cream from the guy with the little cart that had the ice cream packed in dry ice. It was a sunny day I remember and the park was crowded with mothers with their kids.The parks down there aren't big fancy places,but it don't cost nothing to go unless you use the bathroom and then it was nickel. The guy at the door would ask you if you were gonna' take a crap. If you said "yes" then he'd hand you some sheets of toilet paper. They don't leave rolls of toilet paper in the stalls down there. If they did everyone would be walking out of there with the rolls.Anyway, we didn't use the bathroom that day.We just sat on a bench and watched everyone at their leisurely pace Then all of a sudden there's a big commotion at the end of the park. A powder blue T Bird convertible comes swirling to a stop next to the park and I see this Mexican dude at the wheel with this platinum blonde at his side. it was Gaspar Ortega and some gringa dame.Well ,everybody starts running towards his car.It was like MacArthur returning from the war. Ortega is hugging everyone he can hold onto and then tells the ice cream guy to come over and give all the kids ice cream on his dime. Even though Ortega wasn't wearing any crown,he held court that afternoon like he was the King of England.


Many many years later as I was talking to Gaspar Ortega.at one of the boxing conventions in Los Angeles,I mentioned to him about how me and my dad saw him the park after the Griffith fight treating everyone to ice cream. However, I left out the part about the girl he was with. Gaspar's wife was sitting next to him when I brought the story up. I'm sure he appreciated leaving that unsaid



Gaspar Ortega




Luces de Nueva York(Lights of New York)-Sonora Santanera


Sasha Montenegro ,the gal in red dress,re enforced the urge that I liked girls.

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Gaspar Ortega's and my better halves at the World Boxing Hall of Fame banquet back in 2010.

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A Rubber Suit

I know it was after I saw Sugar Ray Robinson in that exhibition match with Mike Nixon at The Olympic Auditorium. That was on the undercard of the Armando Muniz/Thurman Durden fight in June of 1973. Robinson put on a show that night dancing around Nixon mostly not really wanting to mix it up with him. I think afterwards Nixon had wished he hadn't gone through with the show. It was all contoured around Robinson with the 2 minute round stipulation going for only 2 frames. Robinson made Nixon look pretty inept.Nixon that night was about as popular as a case of the flu. But it wasn't long after that that I saw Sugar Ray Robinson again. I was with my father at the Stardust Hotel in Mission Valley in San Diego. I don't recall the purpose,but it was in the hotel lobby that my father caught sight of Sugar Ray Robinson. What Robinson was doing there I never asked.But my father lit up like a Christmas tree when he saw Robinson.One time before in 1968 when my dad and I went to the Stardust to watch Luis Rodriguez train outside by the pool finishing up his work in preparation for his fight against Rafael Gutierrez ,Robinson showed up and my father approached him. They evidently knew each other.My father acting like he was a big Don all full of himself ,wrapped his arm around Robinson like Robby was somebody to play with.
"Hey Sugar how's it goin?"kind of thing with my father squeezing him like a California grapefruit.
Robinson looked like a little boy kind of taken aback and smiled meekly.
"Hey Joe what are you doing here?",he looked up still in my father's vise grip
I told it before. The time Robinson was standing outside the Meadowmoor Dairy after the Outfit run milk machine wanted to put Robinson's name on their carton of chocolate milk.As usual Robinson wanted to be the whole cow instead of just giving some milk and the deal fell through Well Robinson almost got shot full of holes that day because the wise guys had put out a contract on some Shyster lawyer who double crossed them who was in the parking lot with his wife when the suit he was wearing got ventilated from a burst of shotgun slugs. Robinson thought they were shooting at him. My father was at the dairy that day and ran outside to see a trembling Sugar Ray sweating bullets(no pun intended) after the smoke had cleared. Robby always had gone along with the Outfit about" carrying" his opponents in Chicago so the mob could beat the bookies out of their money by betting Robinson's fights to last the distance.Robinson thought that maybe he had misunderstood a direction. My father teased him with a big hearty ha ha that they wouldn't think of offing the great Sugar Ray Robinson.

But Robinson sure had a long list of dago fighters that he had put in the loss column And then Robinson not being the most bashful guy on the block,the mob guys(and the Italian community in general) were always seeking a spaghetti eater that would take on Robinson and make his face look like someone had emptied the contents of a can of Ragu and smeared it all over his face. A lot tried,but like just about all of Robinson's opponents,especially early on,Robinson would leave the ring, after making sure his hair was combed back in place,looking more debonair than chef Boy R Dee.

LaMotta put some pretty good hits on him. To hear the Little Italy gang at the pool hall in Chicago yack about it,Jake's only fight with Robinson was when he put the first loss on Robinson in Detroit. But then later,after Robinson made his comeback,Carmen Basilio beat Robinson in Yankee Stadium to earn the middleweight crown. There was no love lost on Robby by the ex Marine Basilio.. After Carmen had won the fight they were putting up his picture next to Pope Pius Xii on all the walls in the Southwest Side of Chicago. Taylor Street sold more pizzas than in all of Napoli.

But that was a long time ago. It was later in the lobby of the Stardust with my dad that there was Sugar Ray Robinson standing by himself. My father caught sight of him and gave him the ol' bums rush again. but this time Robby got a little flustered. He pulled away when my father tried to grab him..I looked at Robinson's face all contorted with bewilderment. My father backed off right away..His aggressiveness evaporated immediately. Standing slightly apart from him my father could see that it was a distant Sugar Ray Robinson now. For one of the few times in my life I saw that my father was at a loss for words.We both walked away leaving Robinson in the lobby.My father had no comment on the matter all the way back to the house.


Just before his passing I read somewhere that Robinson would from time to time drop by the Main Street Gym in LA. He'd hit the heavy bag wearing a rubber suit. One day while hitting the bag,he muttered ,perspiration beading on his face,breathing heavily,that he had a few more pounds to take off before he got down to middleweight to fight LaMotta. I bet no one said a word to him.


Sugar Ray Robinson

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Basilio digging into Sugar Ray Robinson

Ray Robinson fought just about everybody except Charlie Burley and just about everybody was asked by someone in the media what was it like to have fought Sugar Ray Robinson. Carmen Basilio was probably probed more than any of Robinson's opponents that question.Every time I saw him interviewed about how great Sugar Ray was as a fighter,Basilio was kind of nonchalant with his answers.
"He was tall."
"He could take a punch."
Nothing exclaimed that what would make you think that Basilio considered him the greatest P4P who ever lived like most historians would admit. When Basilio would be asked that question if he thought Robinson to be the greatest P4P,Basilio would shrug his shoulders and shake his head.
"Naw. Willie Pep was the greatest P5P."
At least Carmen gave it to another paisan.

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Greaseball Heaven

Like I was saying yesterday about Carmen Basilio's lack of superlatives describing the abilities of Sugar Ray Robinson- a lot of short answers that you couldn't put inside a thimble. Tom Brokaw wrote the book "The Greatest Generation".I'm sure Carmen Basilio could have been the metaphor. He toiled on the family onion farm early.Didn't want to do that for the rest of his life. Dreamed of being a boxing champion.then joined the Marines at the start of the war because the Marines were the toughest outfit,came out of the service got married,began his quest as a fighter to fulfil his dream of being a champ. Basilio wasn't the most gifted guy to put on the gloves,but what he lacked in physical ability,he made up for by not taking "no" for an answer and being in top shape. He played it close to the vest and was guided through the ranks with a team composed of paisans Johnny DeJohn,Joe Nitro,Al Silvani,and Angelo Dundee.He sometimes wondered about DeJohn and Nitro. They were close to Frankie Carbo and Blinky Palermo.DeJohn and Nitro were always owing money to the bookies and they had a cash cow with Basilio.Now Carmen wasn't the type of guy to lie down for nobody,but he got the feeling the stars were ajar in some of his fights when either the ref wouldn't let him work on the inside that was to his liking or that he should have got his hand raised after the final bell but was left with his arms dangling by his sides.

But with all that said Carmen Basilio was a two time world champion. He held up the honor of Brokaw's Greatest Generation.Next to Marciano.Basilio was my father's favorite fighter. Besides they were also both Italian and Marines in the war. I remember listening on the radio when Basilio beat Robinson for the middleweight championship. (There was nothing like listening to the blow by blows of a fight on the radio to keep you on the edge of your seat).When Carmen was announced the winner by Johnny Addie I thought my dad was going to kiss the floor.

Carmen lost the rematch in Chicago. Carmen thought the judges let his plumb sized injury to his eye influence their scoring. He also said that he never felt comfortable fighting in Chicago When Basilio got the chance to fight Gene Fullmer for the title,Carmen was the favorite. Fullmer was very crude in the ring. The oddsmakers thought that Carmen had the skills to get a another belt. But Basilio was a "small" middleweight. It was obvious early that Fullmer was too strong for Basilio.and Gene was not only rugged but had a tough beard. Basilio took a pounding. It was a terrific fight and Basilio was visibly upset when they stopped it. The rematch was a carbon copy. He fought three more times after that decisioning welters Gaspar Ortega and Don Jordan,but flopped against Paul Pender in his last bid for the middleweight championship.

The man they built the International Hall of Fame in his hometown of Canastota was a guy who saw things as black or white.. Oh,he had a code of honor.He was loyal to friends and family.When Tony DeMarco's son took ill Carmen was there to back up the guy he had fought in two thrilling title fights. When Basilio's nephew Billy Backus was getting ready to fight Jose Napoles in Los Angeles in their rematch,the Latinos in the Southland said that Mantequilla would make Billy "toast" the second time around.
"They don't know anything about how hot a dago's blood can get,"snarled Basilio at the scribes.
When Napoles put the battered Backus down for the second time and the docs examined his face and said that Billy had had enough,a throng of aficianados jumped into the ring. Too bad boxing doesn't allow for a tag team partner like in wrestling. There's an upset Basilio waving his arms wanting to take them all on at the same time.

Basilio didn't starve to death after his career ended. He was sought out by fans and writers,but he wasn't the eloquent speaker nor had the wit and charm.He didn't put a filter in his mouth before he spoke. In the HBO documentary on Sugar Ray Robinson,they just couldn't leave out his comment on what he thought of Robinson's passing.
"I didn't care about the son of a bitch. He was the most arrogant son of a bitch who ever lived."
Now that was priceless.

Dan Hanley told me that one time at the World Boxing Hall of Fame ceremony,Basilio was being inducted.Hanley asked Basilio a question about who he thought was going to win in some upcoming big fight.
"Well it can't be any tougher than fighting a n----r!"roared Basilio so they could hear it all the way out to Catalina Island.

I remember it was a few years before Basilio died. Brian Kenny was doing a round robin discussion about Sugar Ray Robinson.On the panel was Bert Sugar,Lou Duva,Angelo Dundee,and Carmen Basilio. Dundee was beside Basilio.It seemed like Angelo was watching over a feeble Basilio. Of course when it got to be Basilio's turn to appraise Robinson,Basilio was with the short answers again.
"He was all right."
I think that was the highest accolade bestowed. Kenny wanted more out of Carmen and when Basilio wouldn't come through ,Kenny started to tease him.
"Hey Carmen show us that left hook you used against Robinson,"smirked Kenny.
Well,from his seat Basilio flicked out a punch .. It was goofy looking not to say embarrassing..Kenny laughed and asked him to do it again.
"C'mon Carmen let's see you do that again,"egged Kenny.
Carmen repeated the effort.Duva and Dundee were a little uneasy in their seats. Sugar thought it was one big joke and of course had to chuckle. Too bad Basilio couldn't have caught lightning in a bottle and punched Kenny right on the nose.

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Liniment

A fighter doesn't necessarily get into boxing because he thinks one day he's going to be the champ.Oh,he may put on an act that he's going to get to the top of the ladder,but the longer he flounders the less he talks about wearing the crown. He usually goes through a run of managers. Maybe in the beginning there's a little hysteria,but after getting his lumps from no name fighters in no name towns in no name arenas on the undercards of no name maineventers,the energy slowly drains away. Victor was one of those fighters. I saw him fight a few times at the old Coliseum. He didn't have a strong attribute physically;He was a lightweight,but he was short even for a 135 pounder. He lacked a reach.He was an arm puncher.Quickness wasn't his forte. He followed his opponents ambling along while the other guy's punches bounced off his body. Victor was like a little tank without a big gun getting pot shot at will by what anything the infantry could shoot him with.I don't think I ever saw him dominate another fighter.He had to have lost way more than he won.I never saw him win a fight.But I never saw him off his feet,but that doesn't mean to say that the refs didn't step in and call it off off because Victor was so far behind and they were afraid that he'd get some serious damage and the refs didn't want that to happen on their watch. I guess you could say Victor could take it. He would have made Hemingway proud.

I don't know how many fights Victor had under his belt just like I don't know how many wives he went through.After the commission wouldn't let him fight anymore,Victior called home the Mars Hotel in the downtown area before the developers came in and gentrified everything turning it into condos and trendy clubs. Of course Victor didn't survive that transition. But by the time they began remodeling,I'd lost track of Victor. The last time I saw him was sometime in the mid 1980's. He was living at The Mars in a small run down studio with a pull out bed and a hot plate on his night stand. I climbed up the stairs and rapped on his door in the dimly lit threadbare carpeted hallway. Victor opened the door and smiled.
"Hey Rog,c'mon in and make yourself home,"said the grizzled old fighter.
I sat down in a frayed armed easy chair.There was another like chair on the opposite side of a small table. Victor plopped down in that chair and picked up the remote control and turned on the small TV that was on a cart. I could see that the antenna was a crooked metal hanger that had been twisted around so many times that it looked like it had been run over by a train. The TV's picture was hazy and the sound was turned down real low. I can't even remember what was on
"So Roger,what brings you around?"asked the old pug"
"I dropped by to see how your were doing,"I answered.

Victor was wearing a thin white T Shirt. I could see the food stains on it. He was in need of a shave. His hair was uncombed.His olive skin was full of lines.Victor had a horse face with thick iron gray eyebrows that were like eaves over his brown eyes that looked you straight in the eye when he talked . Around those eyes you could see the old scars. There was no cartilage worth mentioning in his flattened nose.His purplish mouth sometimes would open and show his crooked teeth,but there were very few of those left.He still looked like he could make the scales at 135 but now as he sat back in the chair,I could see the bloated paunch. His arms were thin and he had lost most of the muscle tone,but Victor always had the sioft looking Mexican body that genetically derived from the Indians.


I began sensing a strong smell of liniment. Then I noticed a half empty bottle of the stuff on the table that was between us.
"Roger,I shouldn't have fought so long.I'm a sick man.There's not a day that goes by that I'm not in some sort of pain."
"How many fights did you have?"
"I don't know.Over a hundred. I knew that I couldn't beat the best,but it was the only thing I knew how to do."
"You made some money."
"You know better than that. Between my wives and buying everyone in the world a drink,I never could save a dime."
"So how are you feeling?"
"I told you I can't take the pain anymore. Everyday it's pills and more pills. I can't get out of bed sometimes.I wish I'd get the dementia so that it might take my mind off it. To tell you the truth with all the shots I took I thought that would come first.."
"So what are you going to do?"
"Just sit here and take it."
"Well you always were good at taking it,"I said making a futile stab at reassuring him.
"That's easy for you to say."he said as he shifted in the chair grimacing.
"Is there anything I can do?"again trying to smooth the situation.
"Yeah.When you leave go down to the store on the corner and get me a bottle of liniment."
"Sure.Does it help?"
"No.But I'm thinking of maybe drinking it."
"Hey get a grip on yourself,"I said meaning it.
"I was just kidding. The only thing I was good at was taking it. I wouldn't want to lose that image."


My art on the cover of The World Boxing Hall of Fame program several years back



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A Bag Of Nuts

If you're a real famous athlete the chances of you staying in your sport after retirement as a trainer or manager is slight. Babe Ruth was a bench coach,Ty Cobb,Sandy Koufax,Willie Mays,Hank Aaron,Mickey(citing some examples)walked away from baseball.Ted Williams managed the Senators for a time but was a portrait in frustration. Jim Brown,Jerry Rice,O.J.,Joe Montana,Dick Butkus disappeared from the gridiron after their last games. We saw them in the TV booth but that was it.Bart Starr head coached the Packers like his teammate Forrest Gregg did later,but without anything coming close to the Lombardi glory days. Mike,Magic,Kareem,Wilt,Malone never were on the bench coaching them up There were exceptions. Bird,West,and Russell coached some winning teams.,but their tenures didn't last long. The elite player can control his efforts,but trying to transfer their talents into their charges is often a frustrating experience. The standards that the superstar adheres to is a mountain with a summit that is out of reach for the garden style variety pro. Boxing is a similar copy. Louis,Robinson,Ali,Mayweather,Marciano weren't seen in the gym ,arms straddling the ring ropes,towel draped around their necks, studying some young prospect instructing him on the fundamentals and techniques that the non pareil made look like it was just all second nature.

I think Archie Moore got more satisfaction keeping his Any Boys Can Club open to the neighborhood kids than telling George Foreman how to beat Muhammad Ali. Romulo Rodarte,who has a handful of youngsters in the legendary CREA Gym in Tijuana,is assured that he can keep then away from the riff raff that lurks outside. J.C. Chavez,Jibaro, and Maromero were under his wing once,but now those old champs are relegated to pictures on the wall.


Boxing is one of the few sports where you can hear the fans shout,"Kill him!" Cockfighting is another. Boxing is a sport that either you love or can't understand why anyone would do that. It's an enigma.Fans of the sport are usually the most vehement. The anti pugilist would rather watch reruns than see a fight live on the television.


The ex fighters that I've been around are in a special caste system. Maybe you think they keep in touch with each other all the time. Most often the only time they cross paths is at a boxing event.Then you see them huddle together to reminisce about old times. I never try to interrupt that camaraderie.The pundits and scribes that think they can run with those guys sometimes try to sneak in and feel they belong,but fighters being mostly congenial sorts,usually will just break up the huddle and relocate to another side of the room.


It unnerves me to see writers on the dais at a boxing convention waiting for their award and see an ex pug who took too many shots and never made it beyond the "promotor's fighter" who could be called on at the 11th hour to fill the bill on the card when an opponent failed to show up and then usually come out on the losing end sitting at a back table. But I've never sensed any resentment. No sour grapes. The ex fighter is glad to be there. He listens to the scribblers when they get to the microphone and share their stories(often ignoring the timeclock).I would rather hear what the bread and butter guys have to say. The Alis and Sugar Rays have volumes of words in the archives. The film in the cans documenting their lives can be seen with a log on to Netflix or the YouTube. Sundance Festivals are no strangers to their histories The books would sate library shelves.

With all said,if you're a boxing nut,your shell will keep impenetrable. If not,that shell will get shucked and thrown on the floor.




Rocky Marciano

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Jack And Joe

Everybody hated Jack Johnson. Well,maybe his mother loved him. And I think his last wife did. He had a brother who looked out after his nightclub in Harlem that he sold later to Owney Madden who renamed it the Cotton Club. Johnson never got on his soap box to champion civil rights for blacks. Booket T. Washington of Tuskegee was disappointed with him.Johnson went around with white women two timing them with a wink of an eye. The other black heavyweights he had fought on his path to Tommy Burns he shunned after the police kept Tommy from getting killed in Australia.His championship fights were in places way out west like Colma,CA,Reno,and Las Vegas New Mexico.Then when they tried to nab him with the Mann Act he went to Paris and blubbered around the ring with Jim Johnson(who was a black fighter but paled in comparison to Langford,Jeanette,and McVey) and Frank Moran.After Willard wore him down under a torrid Havana sun Johnson was arrested crossing into San Diego on the Mann beef. Johnson proclaimed that he spoke five or six languages,was a nutrionist of acumen,a bass viol player of note,and a insightful historian.He wrote his autobiography at an early age after he was released from Leavenworth.After entertaining everyone with exhibitions in prison Johnson fought fights that resembled exhibitions in burgs like Juarez,Nogales ,and Wichita.The Apple finally wanted to see him but that wasn't until 1945 when he gave Joe Jeanette a rematch in a 3 round show for the cameras. Johnson died at the wheel after being refused a meal by the red neck owner of a diner in North Carolina.He was driving up to see Louis/Conn II when he couldn't make the turn .He never had much respect for the speed limit..Louis's people made the point with the Brown Bomber not to mimic Lil' Arthur in any manner while the Joe Jacobs of the world finagled his shot against Braddock.

But Joe Louis wasn't like Jack Johnson on the exterior. Joe was shy. He didn't speak five or six languages. His mother wanted him to play the violin but when Joe left the house with his violin for his lesson he made a detour for the gym. He never owned a bistro and never married a white gal but that doesn't mean that Joe never tasted alabaster flesh. He may have been timorous a bit when having to speak in front of a crowd but that didn't deter a crowd blonds like Sonia Henie and Lana Turner wanting to see if Louis was a champion in the bedroom. Lena Horne the black temptress with the Anglo facial features also wanted to see. During the war Joe the enlisted man fought for the troops cuffing their drill sergeants around in the camps on the mainland. Johnson was in Paris during the war to end all subsequent ones far from the poison gas eating chateaubriands and sipping Chateau Rothschild from long stemmed glasses. Both scuffled to make ends meet after fighting. When Louis died he was buried at Arlington,Johnson at Graceland Cemetery in Chicago.


We don't know for sure who would have won between them in their primes. That's for the debators to argue. I'll make it quick with my two cents for what it's worth. I'd have to go with Johnson. Defensively he was one of the best. He'd pick off ,tie up,and smother Joe's stalking attacks. But I love Joe Louis. I don't hate Jack Johnson but I'm a lot more fond of Joe Louis. If you two guys are in the heavenly garden of boxing(Johnson would be a longshot to have had St. Peter hold the doors open)and want to settle the matter I hope Joe catches The Galveston Giant leaning against the ropes flashing that gold tooth and throws that short hook and like what happened with when Johnson flattened Ketchel Louis finds that gold tooth imbedded in his glove







Joe Louis Was A Fighting Man

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Way Out West

If the Classic American West Coast Boxing thread had to focus their attention on the heavyweight division,the editors would had to re name it something else. Maybe something like There Were Some Classic American Heavyweights Who Fought From Time To Time In California Jerry Quarry was probably the only legit California heavyweight who was born in the Sunshine State,got his start here,and was laid to rest California,.though he was never the champ,He had some big fights against the top heavyweights in Los Angeles,mainly at The Olympic Auditorium.You can put Machen,Ellis,Spencer,London,and Patterson twice on the record. But when Jerry took the next step up it was in New York in The Garden against Frazier who beat him pretty good twice.Jerry was picked as Ali's comeback opponent in Atlanta and once Jerry started to bleed it was soon over. Later in Las Vegas, Jerry stayed with Muhammad longer but still came out on the losing end. Jerry had some surprising wins against three heavyweights who could wallop:Lyle,Foster,and Shavers ,but those wins weren't on the Coast. So Jerry's the heavyweight out here that carried the torch for the big men although the flame flickered.

Max Baer started his boxing career in California,but after winning the title from Carnera he never fought on the West Coast again. But he liked California,especially ingratiating himself with the "Beautiful People" of Hollywood. He was in that movie in 1934 The Prizefighter and the Lady with Myrna Loy typecast has a big overgrown kid who at the end of the movie got to fight Carnera for the championship. Later he fought Primo for the real thing and won the crown ,but frittered it away in his next fight with Jimmy Braddock..Then Joe Louis put Max down in The Garden with Max on one knee looking up at Arthur Donovan taking the count of ten. He had a hard time explaining that one.

Marciano fought the Englishman Cockell in San Francisco in a foul filled title fight. Louis never defended his title out West. Ditto for Dempsey. Patterson and Liston the same..No world title bouts for Ali near the saltwater.Vitali klitschko put the part of the belt he held on the line against an out of shape Chris Arreola at the Forum.The fight was mostly forgettable. I can't see Joshua fighting out here.Wilder and Povetkin would be a stretch. It looks like with these boys the title fights are going to take place on the other side of the pond. London.Frankfurt,Moscow,maybe Madison Square Garden, But when it comes to this thread the themes will revolve around the fighters whose heads barely clear the top ring rope.

Hey! I just remembered that yesterday I mentioned Jack Johnson's fight(maybe it was an exhibition) against Stanley Ketchel. The fight was in Colma,California. That's up near San Francisco. That counts as a really big heavyweight championship fight. Too bad there couldn't have been more of them.



Jack Johnson

[BoxBuzz]

And here it is folks, this thread has now surpassed One Million views. That's a testament to the quality of these contributions. I have learned as much from this thread as I have from any combination of boxing books you'd care to assemble.

It's a magnificent resource, and often times you can just think of a name of a boxer or a venue pop it in the search field, click the search field and inevitably find some sort of relevant historical fact, editorial opinion, or observation linked to that boxing topic. Especially in regards to U.S. West Coast boxing activity.

Every once in a while you can also get info on some great restaurants, good musicians,and get a peek at some relevant videos, and/or wonderful artistry somehow connected to the sweet science as well.

It's a damn precious resource.

[dagosd2000]

Just The Facts Ma'am

""Get your facts first,then you can distort them as you please."
That's what Mark Twain said.
But he made it sound like that the facts are just the plain 'ol.If you have the facts then you can pinch them here and poke them in the ribs there. You can transform the facts into something maybe that shines a bright light on yourself or casts a shadow on someone you disfavor Maybe you retell it so you can satisfy what the listener wants to hear. Papa Hemingway said that a liar can make a story more interesting than someone was actually there. Lawyers will tell you an eyewitness often can't separate the forest from the trees.When Jack Webb put together his show "Dragnet" he wanted it to be as authentic and factual as possible. He'd go down to the police station everyday and thoroughly write down everything he saw close as could be to the real thing.He wanted to make the show real.He wanted just the facts.But the cops liked Barney Miller better than Dragnet. Barney Miller was more dynamic,more entertaining.Barney Miller breathed a humanness into its characters.Cops wanted the public to think that's how they really were even it meant taking poetic license from time to time.

Archie Moore used to say the best fighter he ever fought was Charlie Burley. Or was it the toughest fighter he ever fought?The trickiest? But you can log on a blog site and people will tell you the best,toughest,and trickiest fighter Moore ever stepped inside the ring with was Ezzard Charles He couldn't beat Charles in three scraps. Then Rocky Marciano beat the Mongoose to a pulp.Rocky didn't have a lot of tricks up his gloves,but to see Arch on his butt hanging onto the bottom ring strand ,eyes swollen,gasping for air-well that could open a thread on the forum.Ever watch the Patterson fight? Archie was never in it.We can throw out his performance with Clay.That was one of those fights that shouldn't have been made.So what are the facts in this paragraph? Only who won and lost and Archie said it was Burley who was the best he ever faced.


But human beings are not content with the just the facts-whatever they might be. I've told stories about Irish Bob Murphy retold to me from his buddies that bellied up to the bar at The Arizona Café in Ocean Beach. I don't know how many times Murphy's exploits were passed on night after night over beer bottles and cocktail glasses,but I'm sure there were a few embellishments,a tweek,something to make the listener want to give his left arm to have been there. Go back aways in the thread and you'll find those tales of Irish Bob .scripted by dagsd2000.Oh,I might have added something that was an itsy bitsy fabrication. But then I might have had too much to drink.




Jack Webb aka Sgt. Joe Friday

[dagosd2000]

Swinging The Blues-Count Basie.
Archie Moore said he loved Count Basie. I'll take his word for it as fact

[dagosd2000]

Before Hours

"Is it OK if I take a picture?"i asked.
"The gym isn't open until later in the day,"said one of the two young men that was cleaning up.He was washing down the ring mat with Pine Sol,a very familiar smell in a boxing gym. The other young fella' was cleaning the big mirror that the fighters use to shadow box in front of with soap and water.
I had climbed up the stairs to the second floor.That's where the gym is.It belongs to Erik Morales. Erik Morales's Gym is above the family owned store on the corner in The Zona Norte.I think the family rents out the store now. It's one of those little abarottes that sells beer,sodas.candy,snacks,milk-things you want in a hurry. There's a couple of video games in the back. There's always some kids playing those games enthusiastically.The payoff is a free game or two.The gym is around the corner a little ways from the store. The gym is upstairs. A window overlooks the street ,but there's no sign in the window or out front that let's you know that there's gym upstairs,let alone a gym owned by Erik Morales the former world champion. But everyone in the neighborhood knows about the gym. Anyone with a even a slight interest in boxing in Tijuana knows where Erik Morales's gym is in The Zona Norte.

The two young young men probably trained at the gym.Whether they were amateurs or pros or just in there for the exercise I didn't ask. They were friendly enough.They gave me a strange look for an instance,but then went on cleaning while I took a picture.
"The fighters come in around 4 o'clock ,"said the fella' wiping down the mat..
He was lanky with thick black hair.bronze skinned, having the Indian facial features. The other fella' was shorter,but looked similar to the other one. Both were wearing white T shirts,faded jeans,and had crucifixes strung around their necks.
"Does Erik Morales ever come in ?"I asked after taking a picture.
"Oh yes. But we never know when.,"said the one cleaning the mirror.


I thanked them for letting me use my camera. They nodded,smiled,and then went back to cleaning up. As I walked down the stairs back to my car that was parked on the lonely street,I thought about the first time Morales fought Manny Pacquiao. The PacMan was on a streak and hotter than a two dollar pistol.but Manny went up a half a division and found a Morales who stood up to him and wasn't about to back down. It was a crossroad fight for both fighters. Pacquiao dug deep to redeem himself in the rematch.. Erik looked early like he did in fight number one,but then got wore down by a cyclone named Manny Pacquiao. The third go looked like Erik was defeated before he entered the ring.He was in the midst of a four fight losing streak.


Mexicans always liked Manny Pacquiao. He didn't shoot his mouth off. He was a punching machine. He knocked his opponents into the next zip code. So when Erik Morales traded toe to toe with Pacquiao in that first fight,Mexicans hoped that Erik would continue the pace. But they knew he'd have to face Manny again. There were no questions about how Manny would behave. He wasn't a guy to let down. He never shifts to a lower gear. Erik Morales,however courageously he battled Pacquiao in fight number one,there was some doubt in the minds of the aficianados. Erik would have to duplicate the effort.-a superhuman force. After an Olympian triumph,the letdown followed.After his sensational victory,Erik gained weight to fight for some kind of lightweight title and lost looking uninspired.Now the public wanted him to fight Pacquiao again. I had a bad feeling. The aficianados had their fingers crossed. Erik knew he'd have to go 12 hard rounds like before in order to win again. He'd put it on the line at first,but it in the middle rounds the exchanges between the two morphed into Manny beating up Erik with Erik responding with punches that lacked the will. Finally,there were no more punches coming from Erik's . Manny had broken him. They had to fight the rubber match. I don't think many thought Erik could muster up much. In three rounds all was said and done.


After the last fight, Manny continued embellishing his glory as one of the all time greats. He's still around leaving his mark. The promoters squeezed what was left out of Erik's legacy and had him in there winning one of those phantom titles, and eventually losing his belt in his 61st fight,his last.

Maybe Erik was no Manny Pacquiao,but not many can say they are on that plane. But when Erik beat Pacquiao at his own game in that first fight, he won the hearts of the Mexican boxing fans. That's a hell of load to carry and to keep it from dropping. Same on Manny's end. Mexico.The Philippines. The people living in the villages,the pueblos,the barrios-they want a corner in their minds where they can go to find some audacity.

It would have been nice to find Erik Morales in his gym that late morning in The Zona Norte.It wouldn't have been audacious,but it would have been nice just ask how things are going..



Erik Morales



Erik Morales's Gym

[chrisjs1985]

Good piece. Morales was simply a warrior and a high skilled one too. One of the Boxing treasures of the last quarter century. I think that Pacquaio win fight the first fight is what moved him closely to the top 5 on the all-time Mexico list. My old roommate was a big Morales fan as were/are many of my closest friends. I'm a Marquez guy but always respected Morales and anticipated his fights.

Have you ever visited Romanza gym? Your description of the location of the gym reminds me of Romanza. I went to Mexico City twice (September of 2007 and March of 2008) and the first time just by pure coincidence I was sat next to Enrique Sanchez on the plane. Sanchez had told me that I really should check out Romanza gym and wrote down some directions for me. I didn't go on that trip due to having limited time but when I went back in March of 2008 I made the point to go since Juan Manuel Marquez was in training for the Pacquaio re-match (which I would be going to).

This was before you could just drop an address into your phone and the taxi's in that area weren't carrying GPS so it wasn't easy to find going down these little streets and then all of a sudden the taxi driver says "gym" and I see the Romanza sign. It's a small place located above a tiny little store and I just walked up the stairs and the first thing you see is a room without a ring and then a tiny little corridor with Nacho's office on one side and a shower room on the other and then you enter the room with the ring, the bags etc; The first thing I saw in that room was Marquez' technique he was sparring some Japanese fighter who was about 160 lbs. I was in luck that day. I got to see Marquez spar about 10 rounds, do a full routine, Abner Mares was there just hanging out and got to meet and talk to Marquez and Nacho.

One thing that stood out about that gym was that there were windows but nowhere to let air in so it's very hot in there. There's old pictures on the walls of the likes of Gilberto Roman, Daniel Zaragoza and even a picture of Rafael Marquez but there was none of Juan Manuel which I found a little odd. That's probably changed now. Some would say the place could use a lick of paint but I disagree. I love these old gyms like that. It felt like what I'd imagine it was like when it was opened.

[dagosd2000]

Good piece. Morales was simply a warrior and a high skilled one too. One of the Boxing treasures of the last quarter century. I think that Pacquaio win fight the first fight is what moved him closely to the top 5 on the all-time Mexico list. My old roommate was a big Morales fan as were/are many of my closest friends. I'm a Marquez guy but always respected Morales and anticipated his fights.

Have you ever visited Romanza gym? Your description of the location of the gym reminds me of Romanza. I went to Mexico City twice (September of 2007 and March of 2008) and the first time just by pure coincidence I was sat next to Enrique Sanchez on the plane. Sanchez had told me that I really should check out Romanza gym and wrote down some directions for me. I didn't go on that trip due to having limited time but when I went back in March of 2008 I made the point to go since Juan Manuel Marquez was in training for the Pacquaio re-match (which I would be going to).

This was before you could just drop an address into your phone and the taxi's in that area weren't carrying GPS so it wasn't easy to find going down these little streets and then all of a sudden the taxi driver says "gym" and I see the Romanza sign. It's a small place located above a tiny little store and I just walked up the stairs and the first thing you see is a room without a ring and then a tiny little corridor with Nacho's office on one side and a shower room on the other and then you enter the room with the ring, the bags etc; The first thing I saw in that room was Marquez' technique he was sparring some Japanese fighter who was about 160 lbs. I was in luck that day. I got to see Marquez spar about 10 rounds, do a full routine, Abner Mares was there just hanging out and got to meet and talk to Marquez and Nacho.

One thing that stood out about that gym was that there were windows but nowhere to let air in so it's very hot in there. There's old pictures on the walls of the likes of Gilberto Roman, Daniel Zaragoza and even a picture of Rafael Marquez but there was none of Juan Manuel which I found a little odd. That's probably changed now. Some would say the place could use a lick of paint but I disagree. I love these old gyms like that. It felt like what I'd imagine it was like when it was opened.

Chris
Interesting description of the Romanza Gym. I've never been there. I have seen a few fights at the Arena Coliseo in Mexico City. Saw Olivares's last fight as a pro there.Lost by KO in a scheduled 4 rounder.It was supposed to be a send off,an homage to the great bantamweight. There was a big turnout with a lot of former fighters and celebrities,music,beauty contetants. But the kid Olivares was fighting didn't follow the script and knocked him out.


I know what you're saying about those old gyms,especially in Mexico. They still have the hand painted signs out front.The gyms in Tijuana haven't changed their faces. It's traditional to keep it the way it was. What would be the point of whitewashing the painted sign and putting up a nean one? :bag


Makito's Gym
Located on Constitution Street ,downtown Tijuana

[chrisjs1985]

Good piece. Morales was simply a warrior and a high skilled one too. One of the Boxing treasures of the last quarter century. I think that Pacquaio win fight the first fight is what moved him closely to the top 5 on the all-time Mexico list. My old roommate was a big Morales fan as were/are many of my closest friends. I'm a Marquez guy but always respected Morales and anticipated his fights.

Have you ever visited Romanza gym? Your description of the location of the gym reminds me of Romanza. I went to Mexico City twice (September of 2007 and March of 2008) and the first time just by pure coincidence I was sat next to Enrique Sanchez on the plane. Sanchez had told me that I really should check out Romanza gym and wrote down some directions for me. I didn't go on that trip due to having limited time but when I went back in March of 2008 I made the point to go since Juan Manuel Marquez was in training for the Pacquaio re-match (which I would be going to).

This was before you could just drop an address into your phone and the taxi's in that area weren't carrying GPS so it wasn't easy to find going down these little streets and then all of a sudden the taxi driver says "gym" and I see the Romanza sign. It's a small place located above a tiny little store and I just walked up the stairs and the first thing you see is a room without a ring and then a tiny little corridor with Nacho's office on one side and a shower room on the other and then you enter the room with the ring, the bags etc; The first thing I saw in that room was Marquez' technique he was sparring some Japanese fighter who was about 160 lbs. I was in luck that day. I got to see Marquez spar about 10 rounds, do a full routine, Abner Mares was there just hanging out and got to meet and talk to Marquez and Nacho.

One thing that stood out about that gym was that there were windows but nowhere to let air in so it's very hot in there. There's old pictures on the walls of the likes of Gilberto Roman, Daniel Zaragoza and even a picture of Rafael Marquez but there was none of Juan Manuel which I found a little odd. That's probably changed now. Some would say the place could use a lick of paint but I disagree. I love these old gyms like that. It felt like what I'd imagine it was like when it was opened.

Chris
Interesting description of the Romanza Gym. I've never been there. I have seen a few fights at the Arena Coliseo in Mexico City. Saw Olivares's last fight as a pro there.Lost by KO in a scheduled 4 rounder.It was supposed to be a send off,an homage to the great bantamweight. There was a big turnout with a lot of former fighters and celebrities,music,beauty contetants. But the kid Olivares was fighting didn't follow the script and knocked him out.


I know what you're saying about those old gyms,especially in Mexico. They still have the hand painted signs out front.The gyms in Tijuana haven't changed their faces. It's traditional to keep it the way it was. What would be the point of whitewashing the painted sign and putting up a nean one? :bag


Makito's Gym
Located on Constitution Street ,downtown Tijuana

I highly recommend going to see Romanza gym especially whilst Nacho is still around if you will be in Mexico City anytime soon. That's awesome you got to see Olivares live despite the result! I was born in 1985, so missed his career but he's one of my all-time favorites. I often re-watch his fights. I've love to have seen him back in the days fighting so often at The Forum, The Sports Arena etc; Truly a glorious chapter in Boxing history not just Californian or Mexican Boxing history.

How often did you get to see him live and against whom?

I should have really made my trips to Mexico City more Boxing related. Like I said I went to Romanza and that's it. I'd love to have set an interview up with Olivares and I really dropped the ball not going to Santiago Tianguistenco to see Salvador Sanchez' grave. The sucky thing is that I had actually planned to do that but for one reason or another didn't make the 45-minute trip.

[dagosd2000]

Good piece. Morales was simply a warrior and a high skilled one too. One of the Boxing treasures of the last quarter century. I think that Pacquaio win fight the first fight is what moved him closely to the top 5 on the all-time Mexico list. My old roommate was a big Morales fan as were/are many of my closest friends. I'm a Marquez guy but always respected Morales and anticipated his fights.

Have you ever visited Romanza gym? Your description of the location of the gym reminds me of Romanza. I went to Mexico City twice (September of 2007 and March of 2008) and the first time just by pure coincidence I was sat next to Enrique Sanchez on the plane. Sanchez had told me that I really should check out Romanza gym and wrote down some directions for me. I didn't go on that trip due to having limited time but when I went back in March of 2008 I made the point to go since Juan Manuel Marquez was in training for the Pacquaio re-match (which I would be going to).

This was before you could just drop an address into your phone and the taxi's in that area weren't carrying GPS so it wasn't easy to find going down these little streets and then all of a sudden the taxi driver says "gym" and I see the Romanza sign. It's a small place located above a tiny little store and I just walked up the stairs and the first thing you see is a room without a ring and then a tiny little corridor with Nacho's office on one side and a shower room on the other and then you enter the room with the ring, the bags etc; The first thing I saw in that room was Marquez' technique he was sparring some Japanese fighter who was about 160 lbs. I was in luck that day. I got to see Marquez spar about 10 rounds, do a full routine, Abner Mares was there just hanging out and got to meet and talk to Marquez and Nacho.

One thing that stood out about that gym was that there were windows but nowhere to let air in so it's very hot in there. There's old pictures on the walls of the likes of Gilberto Roman, Daniel Zaragoza and even a picture of Rafael Marquez but there was none of Juan Manuel which I found a little odd. That's probably changed now. Some would say the place could use a lick of paint but I disagree. I love these old gyms like that. It felt like what I'd imagine it was like when it was opened.

Chris
Interesting description of the Romanza Gym. I've never been there. I have seen a few fights at the Arena Coliseo in Mexico City. Saw Olivares's last fight as a pro there.Lost by KO in a scheduled 4 rounder.It was supposed to be a send off,an homage to the great bantamweight. There was a big turnout with a lot of former fighters and celebrities,music,beauty contetants. But the kid Olivares was fighting didn't follow the script and knocked him out.


I know what you're saying about those old gyms,especially in Mexico. They still have the hand painted signs out front.The gyms in Tijuana haven't changed their faces. It's traditional to keep it the way it was. What would be the point of whitewashing the painted sign and putting up a nean one? :bag


Makito's Gym
Located on Constitution Street ,downtown Tijuana

I highly recommend going to see Romanza gym especially whilst Nacho is still around if you will be in Mexico City anytime soon. That's awesome you got to see Olivares live despite the result! I was born in 1985, so missed his career but he's one of my all-time favorites. I often re-watch his fights. I've love to have seen him back in the days fighting so often at The Forum, The Sports Arena etc; Truly a glorious chapter in Boxing history not just Californian or Mexican Boxing history.

How often did you get to see him live and against whom?

I should have really made my trips to Mexico City more Boxing related. Like I said I went to Romanza and that's it. I'd love to have set an interview up with Olivares and I really dropped the ball not going to Santiago Tianguistenco to see Salvador Sanchez' grave. The sucky thing is that I had actually planned to do that but for one reason or another didn't make the 45-minute trip.
[/quote

Chris
I saw Olivares defend his title against Jesus Pimentel at the Forum. it was a co feature with Napoles defending his title the first time against Hedgemon Lewis. I also saw him fight a Japanese fighter in a non title fight in the Tijuana bullring. Then the time at the Arena Coliseo in his last fight.I don't know if I'll ever get back to Mexico City.It's too big to get around. Olivares shows up from time to time at boxing shows up here and in Mexico. When I'd frequent Burke Emery's bar,Champs, near my condo,Burke liked to talk about the time he took Art Hafey to Monterrey to fight Olivares. Olivares was out of shape. In the fifth round Hafey dug his left hook into Ruben's gut. The force of the punch blew Olivares's mouthpiece out of his mouth and it landed somewhere at ringside.Probably the biggest win on Hafey's record.



A happy Ruben Oliveres today.

[chrisjs1985]

Hafey gave Olivares hell in the re-match too. I have been meaning to watch that documentary on Hafey "The Toy Bulldog" I know Olivares is interviewed in it and I think there is footage or at least stilled photos from that fight in there. So it was a body shot KO?

That's awesome that you got to see Olivares in his pomp and Napoles too. Two of the greatest fighters in history and two of the better fighters to watch ply their trade.

I know Olivares is often at Canastota, Carlos Ortiz too. I am planning my first trip there in June 2020 for when Marquez gets inducted so I hope they are there that summer.

[dagosd2000]

Hafey gave Olivares hell in the re-match too. I have been meaning to watch that documentary on Hafey "The Toy Bulldog" I know Olivares is interviewed in it and I think there is footage or at least stilled photos from that fight in there. So it was a body shot KO?

That's awesome that you got to see Olivares in his pomp and Napoles too. Two of the greatest fighters in history and two of the better fighters to watch ply their trade.

I know Olivares is often at Canastota, Carlos Ortiz too. I am planning my first trip there in June 2020 for when Marquez gets inducted so I hope they are there that summer.

Chris
I thought Hafey won the second fight in LA,but he was never connected with the right people. Olivares was a big draw with the Latinos. Hafey had trouble with tall featherweights who had reach and could punch. Arguello ko'd him and by the time Hafey met Little Red he was suffering from nerve damage in his arms and legs. He'll talk about his injuries in that documentary. Funny how figfhters are. Hafey gives a ton of credit to his manager and trainer Burke Emery for making him the fighter he was,but it was Burke who took him out of the country to fight a very tough Arguello in Nicaragua and then by the time Hafey faced Lopez he had no business being in the ring. When Burke would talk about fighters ,like Hafey and the other Canadian fighter in San Diego,Ronnie Wilson, that he worked with,he never mentioned that they got burned out fighting too often and not having enough time to heal their injuries between fights. I didn't get the feeling listening to him that he thought he mishandled those guys,but I think if they had someone else in their corner who was more careful they would have been a lot more successful.

[Chuck1052]

I had a ringside seat when I saw the bout between Danny "Little Red" Lopez and Art Hafey. Believe me, Hafey took an absolutely brutal beating throughout the bout before the referee finally stopped the fight in the seventh round. Hafey was tremendously game while occasionally landed a blow. But I could not believe that Hafey's corner didn't make any noticeable effort to get the bout stopped much sooner. In addition to being much smaller in height, Hafey had a fighting style that was made to order for Lopez.

- Chuck