BoxRec

E wrote:

Carbo wrote:

E wrote:Oh I just got this....Come on carbo it's not that out of order. I think it's fairly funny I'm afraid....

Yes, absolutely hilarious to mock a true warrior of the ring because of his sexuality with the kind of joke a seven year old would view as base and childish.

Why don't you go the whole hog and start mocking blacks, hispanics and jews, too?

Come on. Grow up, eh?

Look, I respect Emile Griffith an AWFUL lot for coming out in a macho sport - it is virtually unknown for any pro sportsman to come out, let alone in boxing.

But all I'm saying is that the joke, whilst being childish, is fairly tongue in cheek, and is not spiteful. There is no need for your over-the-top holier than though thought-fascism.

The gays I know would chuckle, they would just find it a bit silly.

I love the way people such as yourself get 'offended' at everything on behalf of other groups who probably wouldn't give a sh1t anyway.

Well, if you respect him for doing something, why do you feel the need to mock him for the very same thing?

The joke was not tongue in cheek, which is something altogether different. While I know it was not designed to deliberately hurt, and whether or not you know a whole gaggle of gays who would laugh at it, I know that Griffith would be hurt by it.

Here you have one of the all time greats, and what's he remembered for? Being gay. Not for being brave enough to come out in a macho, openly homophobic sport (and clearly homophobic fans), but remembered in a nudge-nudge, arses to the wall, lads kind of not one of us way.

It's a little bit pathetic, to be honest. And not a little sad.

Now, enough said on this subject. Let's let it drop.

Hardest man in boxing, ever, for the all round package of toughness, meanness, indestructibility, and the ability to induce fear and live up to the billing is, without debate, Roberto Duran.

At lightweight, he was quite literally a killer. I cannot imagine anyone in the history of boxing at that weight even coming close to stopping him. Over fifteen rounds, by hook or by crook, he would wear you down, hurt you bad and put you in the hospital. If you were lucky. And he looked like a frickin' pirate.

not quite the last word carbo. to the poster named E, i dont care if you "found it funny i'm afraid" because it only tells us a lot about you and your attitude. the original comment was a boneheads jape that reinforced a stereotype that i and any intelligent person would not even raise a titter at. i guarantee you that in bennie's stats about griffiths number of fights, in not one did the fighter even think about what his opponent looked like. griffith was all business in the ring and a nice guy outside of it. what he did in the privacy of his home i am not in the least interested. and i'll add that every one of you who thought the jape was funny better think yourselves lucky that you never faced emile in the ring. although for one i'd have liked to have seen all of you torn to shreds.

to the thread i'll posit that oliver mccall had an unbelievable chin but was not one of our sports hard men. tyson? a hard man? get outta here. history shows he was more like a bully. evander...now theres a true hard bast..rd.

At lightweight, he was quite literally a killer. I cannot imagine anyone in the history of boxing at that weight even coming close to stopping him. Over fifteen rounds, by hook or by crook, he would wear you down, hurt you bad and put you in the hospital. If you were lucky. And he looked like a frickin' pirate.[/quote]

That was f*cking brilliantly put.

I think the quitting of Duran against Leonard kind of goes against him.

charlieb wrote:Am I missing something?

Mike Tyson.

Mike Tyson is still a bad ass, knocking fools out....

..in a way:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVXFob1KZlw

stujones wrote:I think the quitting of Duran against Leonard kind of goes against him.

I think the Thomas Hearns KO is worst - Duran got destroyed there - which is a major blow to him being one of the hardest men ever in the ring

Tyson was more the bully type - thats just the way he was he folded when someone could take him to the edge - Evander was a hard man

Peak George Foreman was a hrad bastard too - even a old george foreman was a hard bastard - he got stopped by Ali but that was more him punching himself out

FLINT ISLAND wrote:

stujones wrote:I think the quitting of Duran against Leonard kind of goes against him.

I think the Thomas Hearns KO is worst - Duran got destroyed there - which is a major blow to him being one of the hardest men ever in the ring

Not in my book it isn't.

A single KO defeat against one of the hardest straight punchers from around that weight ever? He is still an animal in my books despite that loss.

The fight that ruined the mystique of Manos de Piedra for me was the lame injury defeat to club fighter Pat Lawlor on the Tyson Ruddock undercard.

I was gutted to see a bloated and aged looking Duran retire with a dodgy looking arm injury - he looked an absolute mess that night.

Still, on overall balance across his vast Hall of Fame career he still must go down as one of the baddest mutha fookers there has ever been.

I remeber Duran fought William Joppy - when Duran was a bloated middle aged has been - what a mess

did anyone ever see Duran doing the speedball with his head - the guy was nuts

FLINT ISLAND wrote:did anyone ever see Duran doing the speedball with his head - the guy was nuts

His skipping whilst crouching is even more impressive for my money..

He was a complete fighter - there is no facet of his game that was lacking in my book.

Grimm, Cobb, Wepner, LaMotta, Marciano, Basilio, Jeffries, Sullivan, Stander, Frazier....

Can name alot of 'hard men' who fought. As for the unlicensed world, Shaw, McLean, Waldron, Fields, Gorman, Sykes, and Bronson were all hard bastards.

TerribleTerry wrote:

FLINT ISLAND wrote:

stujones wrote:I think the quitting of Duran against Leonard kind of goes against him.

I think the Thomas Hearns KO is worst - Duran got destroyed there - which is a major blow to him being one of the hardest men ever in the ring

Not in my book it isn't.

A single KO defeat against one of the hardest straight punchers from around that weight ever? He is still an animal in my books despite that loss.

The fight that ruined the mystique of Manos de Piedra for me was the lame injury defeat to club fighter Pat Lawlor on the Tyson Ruddock undercard.

I was gutted to see a bloated and aged looking Duran retire with a dodgy looking arm injury - he looked an absolute mess that night.

Still, on overall balance across his vast Hall of Fame career he still must go down as one of the baddest mutha fookers there has ever been.

Yes, I remember that fight.... good to see Duran did redeem himself a little with some credible performances after that.

I don't think any KO defeat affects someone hardness.... someones "hardness" is mainly a psychological thing, ability to take pain. A chilling KO shot is entirely physical... I am sure if Duran was capable of getting up, he would have.

Micky Ward showed hardness in the 2nd Gatti fight... how he saw the final bell is beyond me.

Another shout might be Danny Williams... might be a strange one, has known to lose fights psychologically (I thought Sam's jab early was what beat Danny), has been known to freeze (Francis 1), not the most durable.... but still HARD as nails. Potter, the Klitchsko beating, even the first McDermott fight - where he was all over the place showed he is HARD as nails.

HomicideHenry wrote:Grimm, Cobb, Wepner, LaMotta, Marciano, Basilio, Jeffries, Sullivan, Stander, Frazier....

Can name alot of 'hard men' who fought. As for the unlicensed world, Shaw, McLean, Waldron, Fields, Gorman, Sykes, and Bronson were all hard bastards.

you forgot too mention dave courtney DD

hurlock wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Grimm, Cobb, Wepner, LaMotta, Marciano, Basilio, Jeffries, Sullivan, Stander, Frazier....

Can name alot of 'hard men' who fought. As for the unlicensed world, Shaw, McLean, Waldron, Fields, Gorman, Sykes, and Bronson were all hard bastards.

you forgot too mention dave courtney DD

Don't forget Joe Savage!

If he walked away a bit earlier i'd say Wayne McCullogh(sp?) would be in with a shout.

I'm going for Andrew Gerrard (and his ilk) Gerrard was a 1980s heavyweight journeyman who fought all the top prospects home and abroad - going to Africa even! 50 fights and was only stopped inside the distance on 5 occasions! Thats a hard bastard! And his face proved it.

hurlock wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:Grimm, Cobb, Wepner, LaMotta, Marciano, Basilio, Jeffries, Sullivan, Stander, Frazier....

Can name alot of 'hard men' who fought. As for the unlicensed world, Shaw, McLean, Waldron, Fields, Gorman, Sykes, and Bronson were all hard bastards.

you forgot too mention dave courtney DD

I F*cking hate that plastic c*nt and as for Joe Savage

Good man, Asterix. The difference between repeated 15-rounders and repeated 12-rounders is huge. Without knowing the numbers for Ottke or Hopkins, I have it thus:

Most world title rounds ever boxed (top 10):

Emile Griffith 339

Abe Attell 337

Hilario Zapata 303

Sugar Ray Robinson 288

Muhammad Ali 270

Eusebio Pedroza 266
Miguel Canto 266

Manuel Ortiz 260

Tony Canzoneri 259

Larry Holmes 254

Hard man: Tony f\/cking Zale

Carbo wrote:Hard man: Tony f\/cking Zale

One of the hardest ever (The Man of Steel), but he began his boxing pre-war.

Edit: Oh, I'm getting confused with the best post post-war chins, here. Sory, Carbo. Zale is a great call and a great, great body puncher.

Matthew Saad Muhammad, Bobby Chacon, Bazooka Limon, Mickey Ward, Tex Cobb, Mustafa Hamsho, George Chuvalo

DavidPayne wrote:Holyfield was a hard man. Beat Tyson in the staredown.

But it has to be an old-timer, Dempsey was a tough fella.

He scared Tyson half to death during the staredown for fight 2.

Tyson knew in his heart at that point that there was no way he was going to beat Holyfield, hence the biting incidents.

Carbo wrote:Hard man: Tony f\/cking Zale

Very hard fighter, good call.

as a boxer andre the giant he would have killed every1