herol graham/ roberto duran- did they ever spar?

[Pugilist-specialist]

just spoke to Dominic Ingle and he says that as far as he knows, Bomber never sparred Roberto Duran.

certainly never when he was with them

Dan, try Brendan. He told me a long time ago that he did.

Just give it up, mate.

No I won't.
I've spoken to Brendan and Herol since and I'm 100% right.
Why don't you do some research before making a fool of yourself.

[Pugilist-specialist]

They did spar together.
I've been told Duran became very angry at his inability to hit Graham, and Graham was sacked.

you were told wrong, that was Alan Minter who had him as a sparring partner at the Thomas a Becket, but sent him back after a few days,

No I wasn't.

[mahatma]

well done pugilist specialist for finally proving your point then, any details of when,where etc

[Pugilist-specialist]

Cheers mahatma
It was before the Duran-Sims fight in June 1986. Herol and Barry McGuigan were over with Barney Eastwood and both boxed on the same show.

[mahatma]

i was a great fan of both of these fighters, id heard from a good source that they had sparred but i wasnt sure if he d got it wrong so threw it out to the forum and enjoyed the response!

[beagleboy]

Your best trying to Speak to Spud, Twenty Six or Big Lennox on this issue, particularly Spud.

"Having just spoken to a member of Team Duran......"
etc.etc.etc

[Gaz_73]

Kalambay also went on to beat Steve Collins, who was a pretty useful fighter.....

JJ did indeed knock Bomber's teeth out and he fought the fourth round angry....a real shame as he was boxing circles around him and was well on the way to victory, probably by stoppage.

Like Naz and a lot of Ingle fighters, people seem to think that finding their style boring means that they are not any good, which couldn't be further from the truth.

I never got to see the second Kalanbay-Graham fight. How did that one go down?

[Arbachakov]

Could have gone either way, but both of them looked very washed up and just had a war.Not much of the boxing skills on display they were known for.It's a great forgotten war though.

Kalambay was down twice in one round early, but came back into it and had Graham rocked quite a few times.I thought it looked quite obvious Herol's chin was gone after the Jackson fight.the ref took some highly debatable points away from Graham that cancelled out his knockdown advantage and caused a fair bit of controversy, but i don't think the fight is really the robbery it's often made out to be.

[Mimmy]

I don't think bomber was over rated, I think Herol was in a era of very good middleweight boxers. I do not think we would ever get that standard together in one era ever again.

If Herol was at his peak today he would have won a version no doubt about it. i'm sure he would have given any of the Brits such as Benn and Eubank a very good fight. I think he would have beaten Eubank by pure frustration, wether he would have beaten Nigel benn on power im not sure, but he would have certainly frustrated Benn.

[TerribleTerry]

Could have gone either way, but both of them looked very washed up and just had a war.Not much of the boxing skills on display they were known for.It's a great forgotten war though.

Kalambay was down twice in one round early, but came back into it and had Graham rocked quite a few times.I thought it looked quite obvious Herol's chin was gone after the Jackson fight.the ref took some highly debatable points away from Graham that cancelled out his knockdown advantage and caused a fair bit of controversy, but i don't think the fight is really the robbery it's often made out to be.

Havent seen that fight for a long time - IIRC the BBC showed it on a delayed tape on a Sat or Sunday afternoon..

[Pugilist-specialist]

Herol speaks about this sparring in his autobiography.

[Old bones Ian]

Its a shame he never got a shot as a Light-Middle, when he was at the top of his game in 1983.
Davey Moore was champion then, and although he was decent , i can't see him beating Herol

[stujones]

Eastman KO'd Graham AND Collins (comebacking) in sparring? Just a shame he fought with hardly any intensity when he actually fought. One of the most frustrating fighters ever.

[Quixall]

He HAD his chances and lost, he wasn't better than Benn, Watson or Eubank and many other British fighters through the years. You'd think he never got the chance at a title shot, the way some people go on, But He DID and lost.

Macallum was always going to be a difficult fight, the Jackson fight............well, literally one in a million punch

He would have beaten Brewer easily but was just too old at that time !!

Great fighter and certainly on a par with Benn, Eubank and Watson without question.

[stujones]

Yes, I would say McCallum and Jackson are every bit as good as fighters who who Benn and Eubank took their chance against.

The WBO wasn't considered a "proper" title for years after Benn beat Dewitt (who I thought was a faded fighter when he fought Nigel). Eubank off course, got his chance against Benn and then got a vacant title fight from.

[ed robinson]

Howard Eastman did knock out Herol but by all accounts the Collins incident was more Steve kind of blacking out, I think they'd just started to work together and it was at the Lennox Lewis College. Howard was very strong and naturally heavy handed - due to his connections with the Duff empire through the Mancini's he sparred with Richie Woodhall and Robert McCracken early in his career. Apparently he had some incredibly brutal spars with Adrian Dodson as well and Mick Carney always told me that Howard was one of the few able to stand up to a young David Haye in sparring. Howard just seemed to lack a second gear and after Dennie's cousin Tony Mancini passed away, he never really listened to his trainers enough - even though he did work hard.

Eric Guy would remember Benn sparring with Duran in London but I was told that Roberto was in poor shape and even had to borrow a pair of trainers to move around with Nigel. Obviously he was out worked but still showed enough of the old moves to remind the Dark Destroyer who he was sharing the ring with.

In my mind Herol at his peak would have beaten Benn, Eubank and Watson. Just an opinion. Herol's head was all over the shop when he lost his unbeaten record to Kalambay. Bomber gave McCallum a good run for his money, ended the fledgling career of poor Rod Douglas - who was a top prospect. Solid fighters like Johnny Melfah were never quite the same after losing to him. Ayub Kalule, Lindell Holmes... Herol was a nightmare to face.

[Bricks]

i've seen footage of him sparring with Benn and also read they came close to fighting but Duran didnt fancy it.

Duran didn't fancy it! That is a contradiction in terms.

Duran would of fought anyone but at this stage of his career he knew he was past his best and fighting at a un-natural weight so wanted no part of a young fighter like Benn. No brainer really

Duran would have fought benn in a heartbeat if there was any point. But why would he fight for peanuts against a upcoming banger like Benn who bought nothing to the table in 1988/89?. Duran wanted SRL for a third megabucks meeting. HE fought a guy who was just as dangerous as benn in Iran Barkley in early 89 to get to SRL........

When they sparred (see it on youtube) benn was going at it hard and banging duran hard, but benn is 164-5 in shape and duran is 175 and fat and out of shape and just concentrating on getting his body ready and pulling off the occasional slick defensive moves and counter.....it was hard sparring and benn had the upper hand, but in a real fight the pre watson/post watson miami benn gets schooled by duran over the distance and gets stopped.
The post post watson 1989 benn added stamina, lateral movement and skillful boxing to the power, intimidation and warrior spirit he had pre watson......but he was still an incomplete fighter and the 1989 duran was still a very skillfull boxer with a good right hand.

[crusader]

He HAD his chances and lost, he wasn't better than Benn, Watson or Eubank and many other British fighters through the years. You'd think he never got the chance at a title shot, the way some people go on, But He DID and lost.

Macallum was always going to be a difficult fight, the Jackson fight............well, literally one in a million punch
He would have beaten Brewer easily but was just too old at that time !!

Great fighter and certainly on a par with Benn, Eubank and Watson without question.

One in a million? Why so? Those types of shots were common place in Julian Jackson bouts.

Graham was a very good fighter, but he got his chances and always fell short, whether by close decision or brutal KO; whether against McCallum, Kalambay, or Brewer. I wouldn't favor him against the likes of Benn and Eubank, who proved they could come through when it mattered.

[Bricks]

He HAD his chances and lost, he wasn't better than Benn, Watson or Eubank and many other British fighters through the years. You'd think he never got the chance at a title shot, the way some people go on, But He DID and lost.

I was initially gonna be appalled at your suggestion Graham was overated, and no better than Benn or watson or eubank.

Those 3 didnt have road blocks called Marvin Hagler/Thomas Hearns and Sugar Ray Leonard fighting each other once a year in their way for two of their best years (1985/86). They didnt have to make time fighting a formidable guy like Sumbu Kalambay for peanuts to keep their top ranking.......by the time he did fight for his first title against Mike McCallum, who was far more formidable than Benn or Eubanks in 89-92, Graham was actually past his best but lost out on a draw and a lucrative rematch as he lost a bogus point for throwing mccallum down....THATS UNLUCKY.......than he fights a murderous puncher and strong world champion like Julian Jackson and makes the biggest mistake of his life, getting uncharacteristically aggressive when he was bitchslapping his man for 2 rounds and gets put on the floor for the first time in 40 plus fights and put unconscious......THATS UNLUCKY......than he defies the odds and comes back 6 years after being defined as a totally shot fighter, he floors the world champ hes fighting charles brewer twice.....than in a ten second spell suddenly becomes Frank Bruno and gets stopped 7 minutes away from his dream after he has done 30 minutes masterfully.....THATS DAMN UNLUCKY again......so you cant blame Herol for being a little sad at the tag....especially when if his career had come along 5 years later he would have also had lucrative WBO titles to win and defend against Watson and Benn and Eubanks who he would have handled in their 1988-1991 incarnations at his peak.........fact is they neeve wanted to fight him when they traded around the wbo title....he would have stunk them out of the joint....... I will say this though by 1994 imo both eubanks and benn were at their peak and better than Graham at his peak......Watson we never know how much better he would have got...

[TJ77]

He claims in his book to have sparred two rounds with duran while he was preparing for the first leonard fight before getting sacked as duran was frustated at not being able to tag him.if you.read the guys book.he has no reason to lie about that as he is very honest in it .

[Pugilist-specialist]

Herol speaks about this sparring in his autobiography.

That doesn't necessarily mean anything. I don't know either way. Plenty of autobiographies have entries that could be attributed to a faulty memory, or embellishment, or out and out lies.

Ah, the old internet conspiracy theory.

[stevieb_8006]

He HAD his chances and lost, he wasn't better than Benn, Watson or Eubank and many other British fighters through the years. You'd think he never got the chance at a title shot, the way some people go on, But He DID and lost.

So true. 3 chances and still came up short. Thats not bad luck.

[oliverc]

with respect i think Graham would be all wrong for watson- watson was somewhat stiff and not the quickest of foot or hand and Graham would be too fluid and unorthodox for him IMO

Plus Graham arguably beat the great McCallum who stopped Watson

No way (and I say that more politely than it sounds). I was right in McCallum's corner, next to the late, great Dennie Mancini (who was helping Team McCallum out strictly as the pro he was) and he turned to me at the end and said "lucky to get the split", relating to Graham.
In the States it would have been wide, unanimous.

There's no way that fight would've 'been wide' for either fighter, anywhere.

[Bricks]

like bennie mentioned Herol was no 1 contender in the world in 86 in a very tough era....the post hagler era 87-93 era was imo one of the most talented mw eras in history....any 1 of this bunch at their peak would be the number 1 or 2 at 160 today......mccallum,kalambay,graham,benn,eubanks,nunn,barkley,tate,toney,jackson, collins....and i dont even include the up n commers hopkins,jones jnr and mclellan.

[Counter-puncher]

like bennie mentioned Herol was no 1 contender in the world in 86 in a very tough era....the post hagler era 87-93 era was imo one of the most talented mw eras in history....any 1 of this bunch at their peak would be the number 1 or 2 at 160 today......mccallum,kalambay,graham,benn,eubanks,nunn,barkley,tate,toney,jackson, collins....and i dont even include the up n commers hopkins,jones jnr and mclellan.

reggie johnson, too.