BoxRec

To rely on someones honesty and integrity in this game is more than inept and naive, it's downright stupid

Coco wrote:To rely on someones honesty and integrity in this game is more than inept and naive, it's downright stupid

Couldn't have put it any better myself Coco. And Spud, we're not just talking boxing here, we're talking business and life in general. Would you sell your house, for example, based on a handshake, or would you expect to go through a proper process including legally binding contracts... I'd be surprised if 'trust' would be sufficient for you?

Coco & Deserter - if you would ask me if I would rely on a handshake in boxing - f*cking no chance - and whilst Hennessy can be accused of being naive - I still believe we are losing sight of the FACT he has been shafted good and proper.

I want to stress something else on Hennessy again - come on one of you pick up on it - its only a short time ago Hennessy was being touted as the man to take over from Mr W arren as this countries top promoter.

Absolutely loads of you were stating how good his shows were - what a good move it was gaining the contract at ITV and what a good stable of fighters he had at one point.

Yes yes I concede to be the full package you simply have to have the ability to negoitiate with people that you may not necessarily like to gain a TV contract and it now clearly seems Hennessy does not have a friend in any of the TV Companies - but does that make it necessary for him to get the slating he has on here!!! - he still puts on good shows and ask yourself this there are a lot of boxers who stay with Hennessy and McCracken - why is that??

My Mrs is now giving me a slating - she says she cannot understand why I am sticking up for Meaty Mick - FFS I cant win!!!!

Spud wrote:I want to stress something else on Hennessy again - come on one of you pick up on it - its only a short time ago Hennessy was being touted as the man to take over from Mr W arren as this countries top promoter.

Absolutely loads of you were stating how good his shows were - what a good move it was gaining the contract at ITV and what a good stable of fighters he had at one point.

Yes yes I concede to be the full package you simply have to have the ability to negoitiate with people that you may not necessarily like to gain a TV contract and it now clearly seems Hennessy does not have a friend in any of the TV Companies - but does that make it necessary for him to get the slating he has on here!!! - he still puts on good shows and ask yourself this there are a lot of boxers who stay with Hennessy and McCracken - why is that??

My Mrs is now giving me a slating - she says she cannot understand why I am sticking up for Meaty Mick - FFS I cant win!!!!

There's a difference between being a decent guy who's well thought of, and a strong promoter. If you want to swim with the sharks you'll need more than popularity.
By the way, we only have Hennessey's word that he's been shafted on the 'handshake' deal.

Deserter wrote:

Spud wrote:I want to stress something else on Hennessy again - come on one of you pick up on it - its only a short time ago Hennessy was being touted as the man to take over from Mr W arren as this countries top promoter.

Absolutely loads of you were stating how good his shows were - what a good move it was gaining the contract at ITV and what a good stable of fighters he had at one point.

Yes yes I concede to be the full package you simply have to have the ability to negoitiate with people that you may not necessarily like to gain a TV contract and it now clearly seems Hennessy does not have a friend in any of the TV Companies - but does that make it necessary for him to get the slating he has on here!!! - he still puts on good shows and ask yourself this there are a lot of boxers who stay with Hennessy and McCracken - why is that??

My Mrs is now giving me a slating - she says she cannot understand why I am sticking up for Meaty Mick - FFS I cant win!!!!

There's a difference between being a decent guy who's well thought of, and a strong promoter. If you want to swim with the sharks you'll need more than popularity.
By the way, we only have Hennessey's word that he's been shafted on the 'handshake' deal.

Hennessy simply would not lie about that sort of thing - he is not that sort of bloke.

Many many times I have heard and actually seen first hand - you need to have the ability of having no problem in selling your own granny to get on - its a horrible murky world and I have always stated the sometimes down right 2 faced world of boxing politics is more intriguing than the fights themselves.

Seriously many of you on here are applying logic too many times in how you think boxing works - big f*ck off mistake that one.

Spud wrote:Seriously many of you on here are applying logic too many times in how you think boxing works - big f*ck off mistake that one.

Spud, it's actually the opposite. You're the one who's guilty of naivity - those of us involved in business know that trust is never sufficient which is why 'legal eagles' like Loynesy make such a killing over the need for contracts and dispute resolution

The tournament is a brilliant concept but to my mind badly organized. No fighter should be given home advantage, they should all have to fight on neutral ground. Boxing politics and money have ruined a great sporting event.

WildWaylon wrote:Boxing politics and money have ruined a great sporting event.

As with many fights - you are spot on.

Where has this "handshake" stuff come from.... I'm sorry, I think its BS. It was said on ITV when the super six was announced that Froch faced a daunting task travelling to face Abraham.

Where was the handshake then. Where was HS press to say this is not the case. Why has it only been a concern SINCE the Kessler fight.

It was COMMON knowledge that Froch was going to fight Abraham away.

In addition, Saurland (the true best promoter in Europe ) is being potrayed as the "bad guy" here. Abraham had just travelled to fight Dirrell.... I'm sure he wouldn't have agreed (verbally, handshake or whatever) for Abraham to travel again.

One of them had to travel.

Spud wrote:I had Kessler winning the fight - comfortably - however with that said:

Is this on a second viewing cause you said it was "mighty close" on the live round by round thread. I actually agreed with your 7 rounds to 5 verdict (although there wasn't much of a case for Froch winning any of those 7 rounds).

Spud wrote:I want to stress something else on Hennessy again - come on one of you pick up on it - its only a short time ago Hennessy was being touted as the man to take over from Mr W arren as this countries top promoter.

Absolutely loads of you were stating how good his shows were - what a good move it was gaining the contract at ITV and what a good stable of fighters he had at one point.

Yes yes I concede to be the full package you simply have to have the ability to negoitiate with people that you may not necessarily like to gain a TV contract and it now clearly seems Hennessy does not have a friend in any of the TV Companies - but does that make it necessary for him to get the slating he has on here!!! - he still puts on good shows and ask yourself this there are a lot of boxers who stay with Hennessy and McCracken - why is that??

My Mrs is now giving me a slating - she says she cannot understand why I am sticking up for Meaty Mick - FFS I cant win!!!!

Now, I agree with large portions of this.... I will actually go further and suggest Hennessy has got some excellent negotiating skills. How many other promoters have had two seperate long term deals with terrestial TV.... that takes some skills, especially in this climate and with those in charge of sport with the BBC and ITV - both of whom had a long hiatus from the game when Hennessy signed for them.

and between these big, career changing deals, he secured some exclusive rights from Sky and some highlight rights from Eurosport (in a deal which showed some fights not screened on ITV in full).

However, and I don't want to speculate what happened but when Hennessy signed his agreement with ITV, rumours persisted that he cut off some ties. His previous TV company were not happy and at the time it seemed like his contract with ITV seemed a little over ambitious. He had a good stable, and made a great start with Thaxton winning the EBU title, but Jonno soon lost it, and with that loss saw pretty much the end of Jon as a headline act - remembering the agreement included a certain number of shows a year.

Now I don't want to speculate what caused the pull out from ITV - mainly cause I feel the thread might get pulled if I stress my opinion. I just remember thinking it seemed very ambitious to have as many shows a year as ITV wanted.

However - what I find utterly flabberghasting is many many people on here only a shortWith regards to the "handshake" comments - Dennis Hobson always did his agreements with Clinton Woods on this basis and he also did in other areas which many would argue was his downfall - you could argue when Hennessy shook hands he was relying on the honesty and integrity of others he shook hands with - whilst yes in the "dishonest" world of boxing this was a massively wrong - but for Hennessy to be honest and to have his integrity still intact for me speaks volumes.

Handshakes should be honoured both ways - totally agree with Spud on this one.
A handshake was orginally a mutual show of trust, as in the using of your weapon hand to greet an opponent. However, as others have found out, sometimes those who shake hands with, and you believe to be honourable, are often holding a weapon in their left!

I agree though, honourable men respect a handshake and Mick should not be criticised for doing so - it's the other hand at fault.

As history tells us - Germans and Italians have never been that honorable have they!

boxingchat wrote:However - what I find utterly flabberghasting is many many people on here only a shortWith regards to the "handshake" comments - Dennis Hobson always did his agreements with Clinton Woods on this basis and he also did in other areas which many would argue was his downfall - you could argue when Hennessy shook hands he was relying on the honesty and integrity of others he shook hands with - whilst yes in the "dishonest" world of boxing this was a massively wrong - but for Hennessy to be honest and to have his integrity still intact for me speaks volumes.

Handshakes should be honoured both ways - totally agree with Spud on this one.
A handshake was orginally a mutual show of trust, as in the using of your weapon hand to greet an opponent. However, as others have found out, sometimes those who shake hands with, and you believe to be honourable, are often holding a weapon in their left!

I agree though, honourable men respect a handshake and Mick should not be criticised for doing so - it's the other hand at fault.

As history tells us - Germans and Italians have never been that honorable have they!

this must be irony...

boxingchat wrote:However - what I find utterly flabberghasting is many many people on here only a shortWith regards to the "handshake" comments - Dennis Hobson always did his agreements with Clinton Woods on this basis and he also did in other areas which many would argue was his downfall - you could argue when Hennessy shook hands he was relying on the honesty and integrity of others he shook hands with - whilst yes in the "dishonest" world of boxing this was a massively wrong - but for Hennessy to be honest and to have his integrity still intact for me speaks volumes.

Handshakes should be honoured both ways - totally agree with Spud on this one.
A handshake was orginally a mutual show of trust, as in the using of your weapon hand to greet an opponent. However, as others have found out, sometimes those who shake hands with, and you believe to be honourable, are often holding a weapon in their left!

I agree though, honourable men respect a handshake and Mick should not be criticised for doing so - it's the other hand at fault.

As history tells us - Germans and Italians have never been that honorable have they!

So FW would happily deal with a handshake on this basis??

Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

Quote"A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book"

Quite right!

A verbal contract is binding in UK law by the way....proving it is another thing entirely

I still say Hennessy IS the best manager/promoter in Britain. I would barely be following British boxing if it wasn't for the way his guides his boxers.

boxingchat wrote:Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

FW was apparently let down on handshakes/verbal agreements with Hatton and JC. Would your boss still do that? Moreover they were his fighters he had relationships with, what about with foreign promoters?

boxingchat wrote:Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

I though Eubank didnt have the proverbial to piss in?

boxingchat wrote:A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

What about a man who hides behind legal loopholes and snide manoeuvrings??
Save your p1ssed view on dignity, honour and respect for people that actually regard your view.

boxingchat wrote:Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

Actually, whilst I'm on it, what about Warren honouring his own word:

1) I'll never work with Danny Williams again
2) If Haye beats Enzo I'll retire from boxing promoting

In the words of Jim Royal: Honour, my arse!

boxingchat wrote:Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CO-jsOiJ ... re=related

7:50 onwards.

WildWaylon wrote:The tournament is a brilliant concept but to my mind badly organized. No fighter should be given home advantage, they should all have to fight on neutral ground. Boxing politics and money have ruined a great sporting event.

Yes, but on neutral ground, the crowds are going to be insignificant.

However, the fact that Andre Ward has every fight in the US, is clearly wrong.

MecnunK wrote:

boxingchat wrote:Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CO-jsOiJ ... re=related

7:50 onwards.

The piece of paper was just that just for the TV cameras. I was there I know.

boxingchat wrote:

MecnunK wrote:

boxingchat wrote:Eubank never signed a contract in his life. His was a handshake throughout his career. Many others have done so honourably as well. others however have not. A man who goes back on a written agreement can hide behind it as strictly business. A man who goes back on handshake betrays himself as well and is not a man in my book.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CO-jsOiJ ... re=related

7:50 onwards.

The piece of paper was just that just for the TV cameras. I was there I know.

Fair enough. I just recalled the famous meeting on TV and also on Jonathan Ross's show and thought a piece of paper was signed.