BoxRec

JimJim2009 wrote:I regard it as borderline cheating Markp, and I regard you as a knob

On that bombshell, I bow out before it starts getting silly....

JimJim2009 wrote:I regard it as borderline cheating Markp, and I regard you as a knob

On that bombshell, I bow out before it starts getting silly....

Borderline Cheating huh? You know what I regard as borderline cheating then too? Haye's rabbit punching. He does it all the time, vs Mormeck, the final finishing punch was "borderline" tho Mormeck was really hurt by the punch that came just before which is still a fair victory, vs Barrett the 2nd KD was clearly from an illegal punch to the back of the head, and while holding. VS Ruiz too there were punches to the back of the head.
See? its just so easy to outline your bias !

Fair enough Raff, I don't argue with that, I've not noticed Haye's rabbit punching to that extent but I'm sure you're right. Yes, it shows my bias. I am biased, I prefer Haye. Guilty as chargedon that score... :)

From a lay person's point of view though, and I'm sure I'll get slated for saying this, give me a bit of rabbit punching any day of the week, over Wlad K's antics. At least with rabbit punching, you can do it back to the other guy if you're on the receiving end. Wlad is always taller, with a longer reach, than the opponent, so his antics can't be adopted by the other guy. Same with low blows - was it Ricky Hatton who took a low blow from Tzsyu, and once action resumed (after a break, to recover, I think) he gave one right back ? Although rabbit punching and low blows are illegal, there's at least an equality to it, in that you can do it back to the other guy. I'm not advocating cheating of course.

My argument is based on Wlad K being boring. Its safety first, borderline cheat tactics, and lots of folk are fed up with it. If Haye rabbit punches as much as you say, and I'm not arguing otherwise, at least it doesn't, in itself, make for crap boring fights. I don't work all week, and set aside my Saturday night, to watch a fight like Wlad K vs his last few challengers. Its like watching paint dry, no wonder HBO have pulled the plug.

If there is such a thing as reincarnation, it would be just if Wlad K returned, same size as he is now, as a fighter in a hundred years, when heavyweights are eight foot tall and have 120 inch reaches. See how he likes it

I never said I approved Wlad's holding tactics. But this wasn't a Wlad thread wasn't it? There has already been planty of threads discussing Wlad's tactics.
This thread was regarding Haye's reputation for refusing Wlad's offer to fight him.

Raff, at some point during posting six and a half thousand messages on this forum, haven't you ever veered onto a related topic ?! If not, you're a better man than me

Apologies for having a moan at Wlad's tactics, I will castigate myself for the rest of the night

JimJim2009 wrote:Raff, at some point during posting six and a half thousand messages on this forum, haven't you ever veered onto a related topic ?! If not, you're a better man than me

Apologies for having a moan at Wlad's tactics, I will castigate myself for the rest of the night

Good man.

JimJim2009 wrote:Raff, at some point during posting six and a half thousand messages on this forum, haven't you ever veered onto a related topic ?! If not, you're a better man than me

Apologies for having a moan at Wlad's tactics, I will castigate myself for the rest of the night

Sorry, and excuse my french, but what exactly does "Veered" and "Castigate" mean?

BForce wrote:
1. Audley Harrison WBC
2. David Haye WBC International
3. Tyson Fury European/Commonwealth/British
4. Vitali Klitschko
5. Wladimir Klitschko
6. Odlanier Solis
7. Alexander Povetkin
8. Kubrat Pulev
9. Robert Helenius
10. David Price

What an excellent top ten. I don't even think Raff can disagree with that list. The chimp has a good idea as to what that list is worth though.

Haye never stood a chance against Wlad. He's gone from looking awesome at cruiserweight to looking average at heavyweight. If he had an ounce of belief that he could beat Wlad he would have taken 50-50 when it was offered and took his chance but he didn't. Getting mad at Raphael or Klitscko won't change the reality of the situation, Haye is the one you all should be mad at.

FLINT ISLAND wrote:
And didnt respond to a personal challenge in a youtibe message Wald gave him and offered him a very very genrous 50/50 deal.

Hilarious on so many levels..

i'd rather see borderline offensive work than borderline defensive work. wlad not only leaves his jabbing arm out, hugs in close and turns away from his opponent (by the way, is this not COWARDLY, sinc eppl are using this word?) but also fell on an opponent and kneed him in the leg, crippling the challenger (tony thompson, i think) for the bulk of the fight.

i can see a disaster happening. wlad turning away and haye rabbit punching...

It amazes me on forums how people can so often let their biases come in the way of a discussion and talk about something that isn't even related to the topic. Happens in every thread.

Autobarn wrote:i'm surprised dan raphael wrote that.

the thing is, no one knows what haye is doing. turns down wlad, ignores audley. it seems like he isn't doing anything boxing related at the moment and maybe there is another reason, that has nothing to do with "ducking."

he either isn't focusing on boxing right now, or he's lining up a fight with vitali klitschko as i see it.

Why? Raphael is in the pocket of certain promoters and fight figures and he gets briefed by them to write what they want.
Do you think he bothered to get a Haye side to the story?

gobbles wrote:

Autobarn wrote:i'm surprised dan raphael wrote that.

the thing is, no one knows what haye is doing. turns down wlad, ignores audley. it seems like he isn't doing anything boxing related at the moment and maybe there is another reason, that has nothing to do with "ducking."

he either isn't focusing on boxing right now, or he's lining up a fight with vitali klitschko as i see it.

Why? Raphael is in the pocket of certain promoters and fight figures and he gets briefed by them to write what they want.
Do you think he bothered to get a Haye side to the story?

What is Haye's side to the story at this point?

All Sauerland said was that the camps could not agree on financial details. Klitschko's team responded that the issue was over PPV money and that team Haye was not willing to split it 50/50. It would be nice if Haye's side came out from their cave and made a response. Perhaps they could tell us what the financial holdup really is. You would think it would benefit them to do so, yet they haven't come out with any details or counters after the statement by Shelly Finkel.

Khaosai-Galaxy wrote:

FLINT ISLAND wrote:
And didnt respond to a personal challenge in a youtibe message Wald gave him and offered him a very very genrous 50/50 deal.

Hilarious on so many levels..

Mocking me ?

My spelling might be bad because I rushed the post.

And Wlads video message might be cringe worthy

BUT

Haye looks a even bigger tit in all of this after all his antics - now he just wants to sell out and pretend he is THEE World Heavyweight Champion to all the British Mainstream people and hope they buy it.

I mean have you seen Hayes new official Magazine he has got out........

It describes Haye V Valuev as the most significant Heavyweight title fight in years

What bogus garbage.

Valuev was not the main man at the weight - and even John Ruiz and Pensioner Holyfield was unlucky in decsions against him.

Haye is disappointing in that he has lowered his standards and is now just pretending he is the man instead of facing the 2 main men to prove if he really can be the main man.

gobbles wrote:

Autobarn wrote:i'm surprised dan raphael wrote that.

the thing is, no one knows what haye is doing. turns down wlad, ignores audley. it seems like he isn't doing anything boxing related at the moment and maybe there is another reason, that has nothing to do with "ducking."

he either isn't focusing on boxing right now, or he's lining up a fight with vitali klitschko as i see it.

Why? Raphael is in the pocket of certain promoters and fight figures and he gets briefed by them to write what they want.
Do you think he bothered to get a Haye side to the story?

what i meant is that raphael is supposed to be a well connected writer, and i thought he'd check with both sides, rather than spewing this drivel that should have been a wet explosion in his toilet bowl.

Raphael, like everyone else, saw Haye engage in extravagant behaviour in order to get the Klitschkos to fight him for 2 years. When a 50:50 offer comes out from Wlad with no options and Haye doesn't take it, it only opens him up for ridicule after everything he has done.

Wlad won the WBO title in Oct 2000, and made defences against a series of WBO approved soft touches like Jefferson, Shufford & McCline, and a 41 year old Ray Mercer. While he was doing that, Lennox Lewis was the universally recognised world champion facing better opponents.

Wlad and Lennox were around, active and competing for world titles over a several year period, but they never fought. Unless we're going to blame Lennox for that, maybe it suited Wlad's long term plan to avoid Lennox ?

Ten years later, another British boxer wins a major version of the world heavyweight title and there's some fight fans coming on here saying "oh its all wrong, he'll lose credibility if he doesn't fight Wlad". Stuff the greedy Klitschko's, stuff anoraks, and stuff Dan Raphael, do your own thing David, that's what I say. With any luck Povetkin will beat Wlad into retirement.

How hard did Wlad try to get a fight with Lennox Lewis ten years ago, when Lennox was established, and at the top of his game, while Wlad was losing to Byrd and Sanders ?

The way some Wlarse-kissers on here are talking, you'd think Wlad K turned pro in a world title eliminator, unified the titles inside of five fights, and has been taking on all comers ever since. He hasn't, he has carefully picked and chosen his opponents along the way like every clever fighter - Haye included - does.

Haye has only held the WBA belt for eight month's, for pete's sake :surprised:

JimJim2009 wrote:Wlad won the WBO title in Oct 2000, and made defences against a series of WBO approved soft touches like Jefferson, Shufford & McCline, and a 41 year old Ray Mercer. While he was doing that, Lennox Lewis was the universally recognised world champion facing better opponents.

Wlad and Lennox were around, active and competing for world titles over a several year period, but they never fought. Unless we're going to blame Lennox for that, maybe it suited Wlad's long term plan to avoid Lennox ?

Ten years later, another British boxer wins a major version of the world heavyweight title and there's some fight fans coming on here saying "oh its all wrong, he'll lose credibility if he doesn't fight Wlad". Stuff the greedy Klitschko's, stuff anoraks, and stuff Dan Raphael, do your own thing David, that's what I say. With any luck Povetkin will beat Wlad into retirement.

How hard did Wlad try to get a fight with Lennox Lewis ten years ago, when Lennox was established, and at the top of his game, while Wlad was losing to Byrd and Sanders ?

The way some Wlarse-kissers on here are talking, you'd think Wlad K turned pro in a world title eliminator, unified the titles inside of five fights, and has been taking on all comers ever since. He hasn't, he has carefully picked and chosen his opponents along the way like every clever fighter - Haye included - does.

Haye has only held the WBA belt for eight month's, for pete's sake :surprised:

Wlad lost to Byrd? That sure is news to me. At least try and understand why people are making the comments before making pointless posts like this. I don't remember either Klit chasing Lennox up escalators or with T shirts with his head cut off. I don't remember Lennox offering Wlad a 50/50 deal. Why compare a 24 year old Wlad to a 29 year old Haye anyway. I don't like making pointless comparisons but since Haye is on record saying that he is better than Holyfield so why not compare them two. To start off Holy was a proper unified CW champ with all the recognised belts (unlike Haye). Haye had his first HW fight well over 3 years ago and is going to be fighting Audley next (almost certain). Evander had his first HW fight in 1988 and was undisputed HW champ in 2 years and so on.....I've always liked the way Haye fights but I definitely don't agree with some of the things he says and does and I always say so. Some of his nuthuggers spoil it for everyone by making stupid comments that clearly show an unhealthy bias.

Sorry, my mistake, mistook Ross Purity with Chris Byrd. Gizmo I bet you fell over your Wlad K jazz mags to point that out

...it's funny how some posters try to divert our attention from the TOPIC... just to remind that it's about HAYE and HIS immature and cowardly practices...

gizmo1 wrote:

JimJim2009 wrote:Wlad won the WBO title in Oct 2000, and made defences against a series of WBO approved soft touches like Jefferson, Shufford & McCline, and a 41 year old Ray Mercer. While he was doing that, Lennox Lewis was the universally recognised world champion facing better opponents.

Wlad and Lennox were around, active and competing for world titles over a several year period, but they never fought. Unless we're going to blame Lennox for that, maybe it suited Wlad's long term plan to avoid Lennox ?

Ten years later, another British boxer wins a major version of the world heavyweight title and there's some fight fans coming on here saying "oh its all wrong, he'll lose credibility if he doesn't fight Wlad". Stuff the greedy Klitschko's, stuff anoraks, and stuff Dan Raphael, do your own thing David, that's what I say. With any luck Povetkin will beat Wlad into retirement.

How hard did Wlad try to get a fight with Lennox Lewis ten years ago, when Lennox was established, and at the top of his game, while Wlad was losing to Byrd and Sanders ?

The way some Wlarse-kissers on here are talking, you'd think Wlad K turned pro in a world title eliminator, unified the titles inside of five fights, and has been taking on all comers ever since. He hasn't, he has carefully picked and chosen his opponents along the way like every clever fighter - Haye included - does.

Haye has only held the WBA belt for eight month's, for pete's sake :surprised:

Wlad lost to Byrd? That sure is news to me. At least try and understand why people are making the comments before making pointless posts like this. I don't remember either Klit chasing Lennox up escalators or with T shirts with his head cut off. I don't remember Lennox offering Wlad a 50/50 deal. Why compare a 24 year old Wlad to a 29 year old Haye anyway. I don't like making pointless comparisons but since Haye is on record saying that he is better than Holyfield so why not compare them two. To start off Holy was a proper unified CW champ with all the recognised belts (unlike Haye). Haye had his first HW fight well over 3 years ago and is going to be fighting Audley next (almost certain). Evander had his first HW fight in 1988 and was undisputed HW champ in 2 years and so on.....I've always liked the way Haye fights but I definitely don't agree with some of the things he says and does and I always say so. Some of his nuthuggers spoil it for everyone by making stupid comments that clearly show an unhealthy bias.

jimjim is either genuinely stupid or he can't comprehend the overall point that many have made about hayes talk and antics. he tries to make a parrallel with wlad and lennox and that tells me he genuinely is stupid enough that he doesnt see the talk and antics haye engaged in. i don't expect him to understand this post or your post. he is funny to read though, due to his stupidity.

greg wrote:...it's funny how some posters try to divert our attention from the TOPIC... just to remind that it's about HAYE and HIS immature and cowardly practices...

Exactly.

Everyone knows Haye is a good fighter.

Everyone knows Haye could fight the likes of John Ruiz and Joe Bloggs for his next five fights and probaly win by knockout of stoppage and boost his bank account with safe defences.

Everyone knows that Haye can bang hard - and is talented - and can make easy money.

This is about Hayes antics and promises and how he seems to have gone back on it all and taking the easier route.

Haye said he would always take the hard road - the tough challenges - the fights where it was all on the line - do it for all his fans - who want to see a true warrior - a fighter who talks the talk and walks the walk - a throwback - a Ali type.

Really ? - so why not take the fight - against either Klitshcko that 99.99% of fans want to see ?

Two legs good, four legs bad. Orwell explained it all in Animal Farm lads.

Whether Dan Raph's article is wrong or right doesn't justify the fact that it is a shockingly poor piece of journalism.

If he wanted to produce this piece he should have kept himself and his bloated ego out of it and done it on the basis of quoting Steward on the record. That's proper reporting. This is just pants.