BBBoc boss on contract disputes and non-payment rumours

[dondada]

I completely understand where you are coming from but as i have said above, the courts will expect wronged parties to have attempted to settle disputes within the jurisdiction of the relevant governing bodies. If not, they may just throw the case back UNTIL you have exhausted all appropriate avenues.

As frustrating as it may be, ignoring the Board's process may actually end up costing you time, not gaining it.

Et, voila.

[Glyn Leach]

I completely understand where you are coming from but as i have said above, the courts will expect wronged parties to have attempted to settle disputes within the jurisdiction of the relevant governing bodies. If not, they may just throw the case back UNTIL you have exhausted all appropriate avenues.

As frustrating as it may be, ignoring the Board's process may actually end up costing you time, not gaining it.

Jane Couch appealed to the Board for a licence several times, got nowhere.
Michael Watson appealed to them for compensation, got nowhere.
THEN they got legal and won. The Board needs to be reminded that it has duties towards its members from time to time. I think that time has come around again. Easy for me to wish a test case on a licence holder, but if that's what it takes to drag the Board into the modern era, someone might have to take one for the team. It'll happen, the climate's right, just like it was before. The Board are living in fear at the moment.

[Boxing Pirate]

This is the most disturbing and upsetting thread on this forum in years.

For whatever reasons boxers and its licence holders do not like officially grassing people up regardless of who they are, as such I feel the BBBofC are duty bound to act on tip offs and substantiated rumours.

The BBBofC response on this matter is in my view the most weak and pathetic cop out they have ever come out with regardless of whatever controversy has happened over the years.

[Boxing Pirate]

Unless the BBBofC act on the rumours and tip offs, concerning boxers, other licence holders and people associated with not being paid for long periods of time on various promoters shows, then the boxer will be tied to his contract with the promoter as no official complaint has been received. If no complaint has been received then the BBBofC may act on behalf of the non paying promoter in stopping a boxer from fighting on another show.

[whiskey]

I think you can serve a withdrawal notice on any contract for non-payment.

If a builder was given a contract to build 20 houses, then 5 houses in his payment bounced he could serve 1 weeks notice and withdraw from site, until the dispute is resolved.

But thing is this, all modern companies credit search potential customers that they can actually pay for goods / services provided. Including CCJ's or history of bust / non-payment.

If a guy wants £100k of work, but experian or riskdisk.com say his credit is £5k then he won't get anywhere fast.

He'll have to go pro-forma (pay up front , never in credit) and/or have parent company guarantee , which means if they default or go bust, then the parent company HAS to pay the debt.

Companies with a history of CCJ's, going bust and then re-starting in any trade, normally are given wide berth after a while anyway by others in the same industry.

Managers have a duty of care to their own fighters to ensure that work procured for their services is paid ! Failure to do that could see the manager and/or the paymaster both in a court for it.

It gets worse when it's the same person.

[Wake up call]

What rights have the fighters got if they go through the small claims court?

[josco]

Did Joe Calzaghe ever get paid? Did the BBBofC have a view on that particular disute?

[Glyn Leach]

What rights have the fighters got if they go through the small claims court?

I was wondering that. It's becoming stupid. Every day another case of late or non payment seems to come to light. It's disgraceful. But if the fighters don't put it in writing to the Board, nothing will happen it seems. And if they won't even go that far, what's the likelihood of them going to court? And what the hell are their managers doing to help them? Bills, rents, mortgages need paying, this is serious stuff.

What's needed is a very goodwilled solicitor (???) to guide them through whatever processes are available. I know of one who is handling a dispute with the Board at the moment (I think you might too Wake Up). A lot to ask I know, but it would be great if he would apply himself to this situation also. It really does need sorting out.

[twenty six]

There is no such thing as a Solicitor operating on a "goodwill" basis !

[Boxing Pirate]

Is there something in fighters contracts where they have to firstly to go through the BBBofC where there is a dispute prior to seeking legal satsifaction.

A bit like when you want to go to an employer tribunal, you have to seek all possible avenues through your employer before it can get to the tribunal.

[twenty six]

Read my earlier post on Weds mate.
Yes - Board first before civil action.

[bripez]

The process (either via the BBBofC and/or the legal route) is secondary.

The first problem is that (for obvious reasons outlined earlier in this thread), boxers are unwilling to take this step of making it "official" - and the way the sport is run, who can blame them ?

It is not like football where a footballer can effectively "go on strike" before they are sold to another club and continue to pick up 50 grand a week or whatever.

If a boxer raises their head above the parrapet they may find that they don't work again ..... there are only literally one or two boxers in the country who have the ability to do this, and one has already done it.

[Boxing Pirate]

The BBBoC thing is a formality. It wouldn't get to that point if there was any chance of reconciliation. The board are not proactive enough a body in my opinion. you hear horror stories about the 'support' they offer when 'representing' UK fighters boxing on foreign soil.

Exactly.

The support they offer whilst they willingly accept the hospitality of the promoter the night before a show.

[josco]

Back under the carpet it all goes, along with dodgy referees, journeymen paid to lose and all the rest of it.

[Glyn Leach]

The picture isn't at all pretty, but then it rarely is with any non electable body, be it a government or a company board. Allowing anyone to do what the eff they want without there being a risk of losing their job, without havingnto answer to anybody, is never a good thing. This Board would be absolutely terrified of the prospect of election because they know full well that a high percentage of them would be voted out. Granted there are relatively few Board employees as such, but a greater number get to enjoy the priviliges of position and they do not want that taken away from them - by the very people who pay for the Board's existence, who clearly are not happy at the moment.

[Final round]

Has anyone made a official complaint of non- payment in writing to the board yet, so they can act in accordance with their policy.
It must be frustrating when the licence holders are complaining about things not been done when they are the ones responsible for lack of action...

[bripez]

It must be frustrating when the licence holders are complaining about things not been done when they are the ones responsible for lack of action...

So what would you do if you were one of the boxers ? - it is easy when the question is hypothetical, but a bit different if you are a boxer who wants to work in the future.

Not frustrating, more a good excuse for doing nothing.

[Loynesy]

There is no such thing as a Solicitor operating on a "goodwill" basis !

That's a bit of a generalisation. I've given hundreds of free hours of legal advice over my career, and many of my contempories have done the same.

[Final round]

It must be frustrating when the licence holders are complaining about things not been done when they are the ones responsible for lack of action...

So what would you do if you were one of the boxers ? - it is easy when the question is hypothetical, but a bit different if you are a boxer who wants to work in the future.

Not frustrating, more a good excuse for doing nothing.

I would demand money for services rendered of course! , go and see them and try and come to an agreement for payment, if they are not forthcoming go to the board inform them of everything that has taken place in writing. Even if you don't work with that promoter again (there are other promoters out there) and hopefully If they are pulled up and/or has there license suspended it would serve as a warning to others.
but what do I know

[Wake up call]

It must be frustrating when the licence holders are complaining about things not been done when they are the ones responsible for lack of action...

So what would you do if you were one of the boxers ? - it is easy when the question is hypothetical, but a bit different if you are a boxer who wants to work in the future.

Not frustrating, more a good excuse for doing nothing.

I would demand money for services rendered of course! , go and see them and try and come to an agreement for payment, if they are not forthcoming go to the board inform them of everything that has taken place in writing. Even if you don't work with that promoter again (there are other promoters out there) and hopefully If they are pulled up and/or has there license suspended it would serve as a warning to others.
but what do I know

Yes but say the promoter in question is also your manager as well as your promoter.

Say, for example, you go to the board and they deem you have been paid because you received a cheque - which bounced.

You cannot go fight on other shows because you bound by a contract to the guy who ripped you off - and now you definitely aren't getting paid by him because you dobbed him to the board.

[leforge]

So what would you do if you were one of the boxers ? - it is easy when the question is hypothetical, but a bit different if you are a boxer who wants to work in the future.

Not frustrating, more a good excuse for doing nothing.

I would demand money for services rendered of course! , go and see them and try and come to an agreement for payment, if they are not forthcoming go to the board inform them of everything that has taken place in writing. Even if you don't work with that promoter again (there are other promoters out there) and hopefully If they are pulled up and/or has there license suspended it would serve as a warning to others.
but what do I know

Yes but say the promoter in question is also your manager as well as your promoter.

Say, for example, you go to the board and they deem you have been paid because you received a cheque - which bounced.

You cannot go fight on other shows because you bound by a contract to the guy who ripped you off - and now you definitely aren't getting paid by him because you dobbed him to the board.

The board are useless. I would write a letter to the board after I instructed a solcitor.

[Final round]

So what would you do if you were one of the boxers ? - it is easy when the question is hypothetical, but a bit different if you are a boxer who wants to work in the future.

Not frustrating, more a good excuse for doing nothing.

I would demand money for services rendered of course! , go and see them and try and come to an agreement for payment, if they are not forthcoming go to the board inform them of everything that has taken place in writing. Even if you don't work with that promoter again (there are other promoters out there) and hopefully If they are pulled up and/or has there license suspended it would serve as a warning to others.
but what do I know

Yes but say the promoter in question is also your manager as well as your promoter.

Say, for example, you go to the board and they deem you have been paid because you received a cheque - which bounced.

You cannot go fight on other shows because you bound by a contract to the guy who ripped you off - and now you definitely aren't getting paid by him because you dobbed him to the board.

If the promoter refuses to issue another cheque because his first bounced, write to board with statement or letter from bank saying you've still not being paid and if you are under contract isn't he breaking the terms of the contract by not paying. I'd also see a solicitor after writing to the board if they don't think anything is wrong

[Wake up call]

I would demand money for services rendered of course! , go and see them and try and come to an agreement for payment, if they are not forthcoming go to the board inform them of everything that has taken place in writing. Even if you don't work with that promoter again (there are other promoters out there) and hopefully If they are pulled up and/or has there license suspended it would serve as a warning to others.
but what do I know

Yes but say the promoter in question is also your manager as well as your promoter.

Say, for example, you go to the board and they deem you have been paid because you received a cheque - which bounced.

You cannot go fight on other shows because you bound by a contract to the guy who ripped you off - and now you definitely aren't getting paid by him because you dobbed him to the board.

If the promoter refuses to issue another cheque because his first bounced, write to board with statement or letter from bank saying you've still not being paid and if you are under contract isn't he breaking the terms of the contract by not paying. I'd also see a solicitor after writing to the board if they don't think anything is wrong

It's not that they don't think anything is wrong, it's the fact they like the bite needed to do anything about it when a certain promoter is involved.

Stirring up a hornet's nest with the board and a solicitor is probably the best action long term but what you are failing to grasp is that boxers do not think like that. They would much rather sit on their hands and hope to be paid at a later date.

I'm sure the promoter in question will eventually settle his debts, but that doesn't make it right that he is paying fighters months after they have risked their lives in the ring.

[Final round]

Yes but say the promoter in question is also your manager as well as your promoter.

Say, for example, you go to the board and they deem you have been paid because you received a cheque - which bounced.

You cannot go fight on other shows because you bound by a contract to the guy who ripped you off - and now you definitely aren't getting paid by him because you dobbed him to the board.

If the promoter refuses to issue another cheque because his first bounced, write to board with statement or letter from bank saying you've still not being paid and if you are under contract isn't he breaking the terms of the contract by not paying. I'd also see a solicitor after writing to the board if they don't think anything is wrong

It's not that they don't think anything is wrong, it's the fact they like the bite needed to do anything about it when a certain promoter is involved.

Stirring up a hornet's nest with the board and a solicitor is probably the best action long term but what you are failing to grasp is that boxers do not think like that. They would much rather sit on their hands and hope to be paid at a later date.

I'm sure the promoter in question will eventually settle his debts, but that doesn't make it right that he is paying fighters months after they have risked their lives in the ring.

Yes I completely agree the fighters should be paid on time for their services but the Board cannot take the bullet for the fighters lack of action. I mean the board can't properly act against a promoter/manager on heresay can they.

[bripez]

Yeah, you guys are right - it is all the boxers fault ....................