BoxRec

orbtastic wrote:http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/vault/ ... /index.htm

Nice find.

How about Donnell Holmes?
Of course JD Chapman and David Rodriguez also come to mind.

Jaclem wrote:harry "kid" mathews might fit in this one. decent light heavy ....well managed...but then moved into the heavy weight division for a match with marciano and got kayoed in the second round.

You have got to be kidding!

...kidding about what?

..kidding about what?

Jaclem wrote:..kidding about what?

About Mathews being a manufactured fighter. I've never heard anyone say that about Mathews nor does his record look anything like that of a protected manufactured fighter. His record looks fairly typical of that era, fighting every other month or so against an assortment of fighters ranging from journeyman to world class. Maybe he didn't deserve his crack at Marciano but I guess he qualified by beating Rex Layne. A manufactured fighter would probably not be matched with a top contender before given a shot at the title.

hhaehre wrote:

Jaclem wrote:..kidding about what?

About Mathews being a manufactured fighter. I've never heard anyone say that about Mathews nor does his record look anything like that of a protected manufactured fighter. His record looks fairly typical of that era, fighting every other month or so against an assortment of fighters ranging from journeyman to world class. Maybe he didn't deserve his crack at Marciano but I guess he qualified by beating Rex Layne. A manufactured fighter would probably not be matched with a top contender before given a shot at the title.

Actually Matthews did not get a crack at Marciano's title, it was Marciano just before his shot at Walcott. I believe that was what got Rocky his title shot. I think Matthews was alright BTW, as a matter of fact, Don Cockell got his shot by beating Matthews. I would not call Harry manufactured.

I will say who was manufactured and that was Jose 'The Threat' Baret. Can't recall where he came out - whether it was Venezuela or the DR - but he ran off a string over no-hopers and had everyone buzzing until he stepped up against Marlon Starling and was promptly blown away. The mags then changed their tune and started referring to him as 'Not yet' Baret or 'No sweat' Baret. Then he he gets stopped by coke-fiend Floyd Mayweather Sr. (OK I'm being harsh). He was all attack and a good counter-puncher could poke holes in him. He quickly spiraled right down the same avenue he came up.

despite what LaMotta said denigrating Billy Fox's punching power, I knew guys that boxed Fox, both in the gym and in official matches and all I talked with said Fox was a terrific puncher but extremely crude. A friend of mine (George Bobon) had over a hundred amateur fights and was known as an "iron man" because he had never been off his feet, boxed Fox in Leiperville and decided to go toe to toe and was knocked unconscious for several minutes - he swore Fox could punch. Rocky Jones boxed Billy many times in the gym and claimed Fox was the hardest natural puncher he ever boxed but never learned the rudiments and techniques necessary. The Philly newspapers all suspected that the bouts he had with Harris, Bolden and a few others were tainted but that Fox had legitimately KO'd a lot of the others on his log.

Il Duce wrote:

Rover wrote:O'Grady beat Kenty, though. He was legitimately one of the best lightweights in the world. When I think of manufactured fighters, I think of guys who compiled glossy records and then got wiped out when they stepped up. Kenty was a step up, and O'Grady did well.

Sean became a good fighter later in his career,,,,,,,His win over a 'weakened' Hilmer Kenty was over-blown a bit.

As a teenager he was 'home-made'.

You could make that argument about Chavez, though (through his early career). Now, O'Grady's not Chavez, but he was one of the best lightweights in the world and doesn't fit this thread IMO.

Anyone remember a guy named Marty Jakubowski? He has a pretty great looking record until you realize he never beat anybody particularly noteworthy.

http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_ ... &cat=boxer

scartissue wrote:

hhaehre wrote:

Jaclem wrote:..kidding about what?

About Mathews being a manufactured fighter. I've never heard anyone say that about Mathews nor does his record look anything like that of a protected manufactured fighter. His record looks fairly typical of that era, fighting every other month or so against an assortment of fighters ranging from journeyman to world class. Maybe he didn't deserve his crack at Marciano but I guess he qualified by beating Rex Layne. A manufactured fighter would probably not be matched with a top contender before given a shot at the title.

Actually Matthews did not get a crack at Marciano's title, it was Marciano just before his shot at Walcott. I believe that was what got Rocky his title shot. I think Matthews was alright BTW, as a matter of fact, Don Cockell got his shot by beating Matthews. I would not call Harry manufactured.

I will say who was manufactured and that was Jose 'The Threat' Baret. Can't recall where he came out - whether it was Venezuela or the DR - but he ran off a string over no-hopers and had everyone buzzing until he stepped up against Marlon Starling and was promptly blown away. The mags then changed their tune and started referring to him as 'Not yet' Baret or 'No sweat' Baret. Then he he gets stopped by coke-fiend Floyd Mayweather Sr. (OK I'm being harsh). He was all attack and a good counter-puncher could poke holes in him. He quickly spiraled right down the same avenue he came up.

Yeah, that is what got Rocky the title shot.

Have heard from reliable sources that both Ali-Liston bouts were manufactured, at least on the one side.

Have to put Mayweather post lightweight under the manufactured category too. Been very careful about maintaining that fraudulent 0.

montrealsuper wrote:Have heard from reliable sources that both Ali-Liston bouts were manufactured, at least on the one side.

Have to put Mayweather post lightweight under the manufactured category too. Been very careful about maintaining that fraudulent 0.

Yeah Oscar De La Hoya, Shane Mosley, Miguel Cotto, Zab Judah, Ricky Hatton, Juan Manuel Marquez...what a bunch of bums

gilgamesh wrote:

montrealsuper wrote:Have heard from reliable sources that both Ali-Liston bouts were manufactured, at least on the one side.

Have to put Mayweather post lightweight under the manufactured category too. Been very careful about maintaining that fraudulent 0.

Yeah Oscar De La Hoya, Shane Mosley, Miguel Cotto, Zab Judah, Ricky Hatton, Juan Manuel Marquez...what a bunch of bums

gilgamesh wrote:Anyone remember a guy named Marty Jakubowski? He has a pretty great looking record until you realize he never beat anybody particularly noteworthy.

http://boxrec.com/list_bouts.php?human_ ... &cat=boxer

Oh yeah, I remember him. His fight with Miguel Angel Gonzalez headlined the Los Conquistadores PPV, and for whatever reason the PPV went off in the middle of the 11th round.

Anyway, good call on him. I also remember when Chavez smoked him in a tuneup before Haugen.

I think a couple of Tito's victims deserve a mention: Hugo Pineda and Larry Barnes. Both had great records (36-1 and 39-1) going into the Tito fight. Neither had beaten anyone of note. Both were blown away in four rounds. Neither did anything of note after Tito.

Rover wrote:I think a couple of Tito's victims deserve a mention: Hugo Pineda and Larry Barnes. Both had great records (36-1 and 39-1) going into the Tito fight. Neither had beaten anyone of note. Both were blown away in four rounds. Neither did anything of note after Tito.

Good shouts, I have both of those fights. I remember looking up their records once and you're right. Nothing of note there.

Another one who comes to mind: Buck Smith.
I can't believe I didn't think of him earlier.
Lord, what a padded record. He was beaten every time he stepped up and feasted on club fighters.

Actually Hugo Pineda/Glen Johnson is entirely watchable, even if predictable.

Gotta give a shout out to Jay Bell, who fought McClellan. Somehow he piled up a 17-1-1 record and got to #8 WBC while feasting on weak comp. His title try was short...very short.

How about Terry Thomas. Boy, he sure had a nice record. His nose wasn't looking too nice when ole Duran got done with it. Thomas also got stopped by a shot Chavez nearly a decade later.

Rover wrote:Gotta give a shout out to Jay Bell, who fought McClellan. Somehow he piled up a 17-1-1 record and got to #8 WBC while feasting on weak comp. His title try was short...very short.

Wasn't he done in by a bodyshot in less than a minute?

gilgamesh wrote:

Rover wrote:Gotta give a shout out to Jay Bell, who fought McClellan. Somehow he piled up a 17-1-1 record and got to #8 WBC while feasting on weak comp. His title try was short...very short.

Wasn't he done in by a bodyshot in less than a minute?

It was either 20 or 30 seconds; can't remember.
The funny thing is that the other fight on that card (televised on Showtime) was Tito/Garcia, which didn't get out of the first either.

Rover wrote:

gilgamesh wrote:

Rover wrote:Gotta give a shout out to Jay Bell, who fought McClellan. Somehow he piled up a 17-1-1 record and got to #8 WBC while feasting on weak comp. His title try was short...very short.

Wasn't he done in by a bodyshot in less than a minute?

It was either 20 or 30 seconds; can't remember.
The funny thing is that the other fight on that card (televised on Showtime) was Tito/Garcia, which didn't get out of the first either.

Yeah that's the dude that Tito drops 3 or 4 times in the first right? I remember that one mostly for Ferdie Pacheco going "He needs to stop this fight...what's the matter with him, what's the matter with him?" at the referee allowing it to keep going after it was so clearly a mismatch that needed to be stopped ASAP.

Garcia was down 4 times.
The thing I remember most about that card wasn't either fight but the pre-fight talk with King. Tyson's appeal had just been denied by a 2:1 vote in Indiana of his rape conviction. It was hilarious listening to King try to play legal analyst and pronounce big legal words.