BoxRec

tallsdav wrote: It's no better than dog fighting....

......Morally it's the right thing to do and it's a sad day for boxing when those responsible for putting these shows on are exonerated from decisions like this.

Terrible analogy. Nonsensical in fact.

The morality line is interesting, but if the board clear someone to fight I think that's end of story. A promoter is certainly not more qualified to overturn that decision

squared circle wrote:

tallsdav wrote: It's no better than dog fighting....

......Morally it's the right thing to do and it's a sad day for boxing when those responsible for putting these shows on are exonerated from decisions like this.

Terrible analogy. Nonsensical in fact.

The morality line is interesting, but if the board clear someone to fight I think that's end of story. A promoter is certainly not more qualified to overturn that decision

Hmm i'm pretty sure it's far from nonsensical. Does Toney 'really' want to fight, for the love of the sport. Obviously not. He is fighting because he has to.

This is really not a case of what the paperwork says, it's really down to just right or wrong. Everybody should aim to do the right thing in this case, despite what the medical records say. That includes the broadcaster, promoters, manager, board and even the fans.

It's not like it's a game of darts, the guy is going to be put in a ring arena where winner stays on!

Dog fighting is barbaric, illegal and the combatants have zero say in it. There is 0% "sport" involved.

If you think that is a good analogy then I'll leave it there mate.

If Toney can pass a medical - then clearly the medical tests in boxing are pathetically inadequate, the guy clearly has neurological damage - it doesn't take a qualified doctor to see that. He is slurring, mumbling and incoherent.

christ, he had pituitary damage over a decade ago, and has probably taken thousands of shots in sparring since then, plus hundreds in the ring.

The point is, Matchroom must be made if they let him fight, it makes them, and boxing as a whole look bad. They would probably have to pay him off as he will have a contract, but letting him fight is a huge mistake - imagine if he ends up in hospital after the fight - how are they going to look then.

Do they really want a mumbling incoherent fighter as a promotion to the show? My god, Hearn Jr has really taken his eye off the ball here.

I really hope, for their own, and Toney's own sake, they pull him out of the show. Sure, he will probably fight somewhere else, but so what, that's no excuse for having a bill with a fighter who is clearly brain damaged and shot to shit.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:If Toney can pass a medical - then clearly the medical tests in boxing are pathetically inadequate, the guy clearly has neurological damage - it doesn't take a qualified doctor to see that. He is slurring, mumbling and incoherent.

christ, he had pituitary damage over a decade ago, and has probably taken thousands of shots in sparring since then, plus hundreds in the ring.

The point is, Matchroom must be made if they let him fight, it makes them, and boxing as a whole look bad. They would probably have to pay him off as he will have a contract, but letting him fight is a huge mistake - imagine if he ends up in hospital after the fight - how are they going to look then.

Do they really want a mumbling incoherent fighter as a promotion to the show? My god, Hearn Jr has really taken his eye off the ball here.

I really hope, for their own, and Toney's own sake, they pull him out of the show. Sure, he will probably fight somewhere else, but so what, that's no excuse for having a bill with a fighter who is clearly brain damaged and shot to poo.

Great post. It's too simple to say that 'he's passed his medical so he's ok to fight". Surely the human element has to come into play here and it's up to the promoter to show some compassion and not invite a fighter has shot and damaged as Toney to fight just for the sake of a promotion.

Hearn's always banging on about the fighters being first, well this is awful from him. A synovial marketing move. Typical salesman trait I guess, and that's what Hearn is a salesman dressed up smartly. I honestly don't know how someone could agree
to having Toney fight on this show, sometimes you have to make a human decision not a business one.

This really bursts the bubble that Hearn is some Florence Nightingale for boxing, he isnt, he is as cold and calculating a buisnessman as FW and all the rest, in fact I very much doubt that FW would have Toney anywhere near one of his promotions at this point. We saw really what Hearn jr is when he persuaded SKY to dump Ricky Hatton. Like his father it is the money first which matters. As for Toney passing 'medicals' I would like to know what medicals these were?... I find it extraordinary that Danny Williams is unable to get approval by the BBBC to fight here, yet Toney is it seems. I guess perhaps having a contract with Matchroom gives a fighter a certain healthy glow that he wouldnt perhaps otherwise have?. I would say that anyone who denies that Toney has brain damage is probably neurologically challenged themselves, or simply unable to face facts because it might sit unfavorably with their conscience. Toney isn't just damaged he is badly damaged and an accident waiting to happen with big red lights on. This whole situation is simply disgusting, I love boxing but stuff like this which is produced by a mixture of greed and stupidity is poison to the sport. We wonder why boxing is nolonger a mainstream sport and then see stuff like this happening. The wonder really is that boxing still exists at all as a televised 'sport', allbeit barely in this country. I expect someone to come here and tell me if I dont like it then simply dont watch it, but for me that isnt enough, I am exercising my right as a fan of boxing and boxers to speak out about this disgrace. Shame on SKY and Shame on Matchroom, if anything happens to Toney, I hope both have to face the consequences.

fatcity69 wrote:This really bursts the bubble that Hearn is some Florence Nightingale for boxing, he isnt, he is as cold and calculating a buisnessman as FW and all the rest, in fact I very much doubt that FW would have Toney anywhere near one of his promotions at this point. We saw really what Hearn jr is when he persuaded SKY to dump Ricky Hatton. Like his father it is the money first which matters. As for Toney passing 'medicals' I would like to know what medicals these were?... I find it extraordinary that Danny Williams is unable to get approval by the BBBC to fight here, yet Toney is it seems. I guess perhaps having a contract with Matchroom gives a fighter a certain healthy glow that he wouldnt perhaps otherwise have?. I would say that anyone who denies that Toney has brain damage is probably neurologically challenged themselves, or simply unable to face facts because it might sit unfavorably with their conscience. Toney isn't just damaged he is badly damaged and an accident waiting to happen with big red lights on. This whole situation is simply disgusting, I love boxing but stuff like this which is produced by a mixture of greed and stupidity is poison to the sport. We wonder why boxing is nolonger a mainstream sport and then see stuff like this happening. The wonder really is that boxing still exists at all as a televised 'sport', allbeit barely in this country. I expect someone to come here and tell me if I dont like it then simply dont watch it, but for me that isnt enough, I am exercising my right as a fan of boxing and boxers to speak out about this disgrace. Shame on SKY and Shame on Matchroom, if anything happens to Toney, I hope both have to face the consequences.

I actually agree, was going to say the same about Warren - I remember he told Danny Williams to quit after the beating from Vitali K - I don't remember if he was promoting Danny at that point or not....I think he was. I also recall that he ended up having to Pay danny's wages as the promoter of the event never paid up.

squared circle wrote:

TJ77 wrote:

squared circle wrote:This thread is rubbish. He's cleared to fight. Let him fight.

2 pages of debate usually means a thread is a talking point.
Your opinion is as valid as anyone else's.
He should not be fighting IMO

Rubbish was harsh. I meant I don't see the point.

BBBofC have cleared him so its a non-issue.

Unless you are saying he should get special treatment based on the fact he is an arguable ATG.

Or you are saying Sky or Matchroom should have veto to overrule board decisions and/or have more relevant medical expertise than the Board.

Neither really mate im saying if I can see he isn't right they shouldn't allow profit and kudos blind them.Like I say its my opinion that they should be ashamed for seeing 1st hand that he is in a state that's not great regardless of any piece of paper stating otherwise.

fatcity69 wrote:This really bursts the bubble that Hearn is some Florence Nightingale for boxing, he isnt, he is as cold and calculating a buisnessman as FW and all the rest, in fact I very much doubt that FW would have Toney anywhere near one of his promotions at this point. We saw really what Hearn jr is when he persuaded SKY to dump Ricky Hatton. Like his father it is the money first which matters. As for Toney passing 'medicals' I would like to know what medicals these were?... I find it extraordinary that Danny Williams is unable to get approval by the BBBC to fight here, yet Toney is it seems. I guess perhaps having a contract with Matchroom gives a fighter a certain healthy glow that he wouldnt perhaps otherwise have?. I would say that anyone who denies that Toney has brain damage is probably neurologically challenged themselves, or simply unable to face facts because it might sit unfavorably with their conscience. Toney isn't just damaged he is badly damaged and an accident waiting to happen with big red lights on. This whole situation is simply disgusting, I love boxing but stuff like this which is produced by a mixture of greed and stupidity is poison to the sport. We wonder why boxing is nolonger a mainstream sport and then see stuff like this happening. The wonder really is that boxing still exists at all as a televised 'sport', allbeit barely in this country. I expect someone to come here and tell me if I dont like it then simply dont watch it, but for me that isnt enough, I am exercising my right as a fan of boxing and boxers to speak out about this disgrace. Shame on SKY and Shame on Matchroom, if anything happens to Toney, I hope both have to face the consequences.

Amen brother

Will Boxing News make the point that clearly Toney shouldn't be fighting and its a poor move on Matchroom's part or will they not question it?

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

fatcity69 wrote:This really bursts the bubble that Hearn is some Florence Nightingale for boxing, he isnt, he is as cold and calculating a buisnessman as FW and all the rest, in fact I very much doubt that FW would have Toney anywhere near one of his promotions at this point. We saw really what Hearn jr is when he persuaded SKY to dump Ricky Hatton. Like his father it is the money first which matters. As for Toney passing 'medicals' I would like to know what medicals these were?... I find it extraordinary that Danny Williams is unable to get approval by the BBBC to fight here, yet Toney is it seems. I guess perhaps having a contract with Matchroom gives a fighter a certain healthy glow that he wouldnt perhaps otherwise have?. I would say that anyone who denies that Toney has brain damage is probably neurologically challenged themselves, or simply unable to face facts because it might sit unfavorably with their conscience. Toney isn't just damaged he is badly damaged and an accident waiting to happen with big red lights on. This whole situation is simply disgusting, I love boxing but stuff like this which is produced by a mixture of greed and stupidity is poison to the sport. We wonder why boxing is nolonger a mainstream sport and then see stuff like this happening. The wonder really is that boxing still exists at all as a televised 'sport', allbeit barely in this country. I expect someone to come here and tell me if I dont like it then simply dont watch it, but for me that isnt enough, I am exercising my right as a fan of boxing and boxers to speak out about this disgrace. Shame on SKY and Shame on Matchroom, if anything happens to Toney, I hope both have to face the consequences.

I actually agree, was going to say the same about Warren - I remember he told Danny Williams to quit after the beating from Vitali K - I don't remember if he was promoting Danny at that point or not....I think he was. I also recall that he ended up having to Pay danny's wages as the promoter of the event never paid up.

Makes a change lol.

It's not a healthy line up to be fair. I can't see why people are crying about toney fighting in this when he normally fights at a higher level .however eddy is meant to be a purist & this is porn.

I don't like reading people calling one of my favourite fighters a dick head ! That's wrong, it's all he knows how to do like Ali there ain't no quit in them down to there own detrement.
Farnell shouldn't criticise I'd guarantee if he wasn't refused he'd be fighting till the end

TJ77 wrote:Allowing James Toney to compete in prize fighter is shameful.
He was a great fighter he is now virtually incoherent has major shakes looks to be in the early stages of Parkinsons.
Its bad enough when top fighters go on speaking tours when they barely have the ability to speak properly desperate for money.
Now we are using them as cannon fodder.
I don't watch prize fighter anyway cos its poo this is no major koo.
Its barbaric to wheel out a great man who cant quit because your format is on its last leg's and you want a ratings boost.

Mate I will tell you Matchroom are a great organisation to work with ,they genuinely look after every need of the fighters and there team.
Always get put in very good hotels and there organisational skills are supberb.
Under no circumstances would they allow a fighter to partake in a contest unless he could do himself justice, now this isn't me trying to big them up its just the truth

TJ77 wrote:Allowing James Toney to compete in prize fighter is shameful.
He was a great fighter he is now virtually incoherent has major shakes looks to be in the early stages of Parkinsons.
Its bad enough when top fighters go on speaking tours when they barely have the ability to speak properly desperate for money.
Now we are using them as cannon fodder.
I don't watch prize fighter anyway cos its poo this is no major koo.
Its barbaric to wheel out a great man who cant quit because your format is on its last leg's and you want a ratings boost.

Mate I will tell you Matchroom are a great organisation to work with ,they genuinely look after every need of the fighters and there team.
Always get put in very good hotels and there organisational skills are supberb.
Under no circumstances would they allow a fighter to partake in a contest unless he could do himself justice, now this isn't me trying to big them up its just the truth

billy nelson wrote:

TJ77 wrote:Allowing James Toney to compete in prize fighter is shameful.
He was a great fighter he is now virtually incoherent has major shakes looks to be in the early stages of Parkinsons.
Its bad enough when top fighters go on speaking tours when they barely have the ability to speak properly desperate for money.
Now we are using them as cannon fodder.
I don't watch prize fighter anyway cos its poo this is no major koo.
Its barbaric to wheel out a great man who cant quit because your format is on its last leg's and you want a ratings boost.

Mate I will tell you Matchroom are a great organisation to work with ,they genuinely look after every need of the fighters and there team.
Always get put in very good hotels and there organisational skills are supberb.
Under no circumstances would they allow a fighter to partake in a contest unless he could do himself justice, now this isn't me trying to big them up its just the truth

Nothing to do with the fact you work with them then.

In all fairness to Billy, Ricky is contracted to them and not Billy ! Why would he need to lie ?

billy nelson wrote:

TJ77 wrote:Allowing James Toney to compete in prize fighter is shameful.
He was a great fighter he is now virtually incoherent has major shakes looks to be in the early stages of Parkinsons.
Its bad enough when top fighters go on speaking tours when they barely have the ability to speak properly desperate for money.
Now we are using them as cannon fodder.
I don't watch prize fighter anyway cos its poo this is no major koo.
Its barbaric to wheel out a great man who cant quit because your format is on its last leg's and you want a ratings boost.

Mate I will tell you Matchroom are a great organisation to work with ,they genuinely look after every need of the fighters and there team.
Always get put in very good hotels and there organisational skills are supberb.
Under no circumstances would they allow a fighter to partake in a contest unless he could do himself justice, now this isn't me trying to big them up its just the truth

Billy im usually a fan of the way Matchroom operate but Toney shouldn't be fighting 7nder there banner IMO.
Doing yourself justice if your James Toney would be staying as far away from shit formats that detract from your legacy. He needs the dough and its being put up by Sky and Matchroom .Im glad they look after your every need be nice if they could do that for a man who's financial need and in ability to accept his career is over looks to have already significantly damaged his health.
Instead of providing platforms for it.

billy nelson wrote:

TJ77 wrote:Allowing James Toney to compete in prize fighter is shameful.
He was a great fighter he is now virtually incoherent has major shakes looks to be in the early stages of Parkinsons.
Its bad enough when top fighters go on speaking tours when they barely have the ability to speak properly desperate for money.
Now we are using them as cannon fodder.
I don't watch prize fighter anyway cos its poo this is no major koo.
Its barbaric to wheel out a great man who cant quit because your format is on its last leg's and you want a ratings boost.

Mate I will tell you Matchroom are a great organisation to work with ,they genuinely look after every need of the fighters and there team.
Always get put in very good hotels and there organisational skills are supberb.
Under no circumstances would they allow a fighter to partake in a contest unless he could do himself justice, now this isn't me trying to big them up its just the truth

I wont argue with any of that Billy, as you are better qualified to comment than me.

But would you put toney in that prizefighter?

some real ninnys on here. toney isnt going in against david haye in a 12 rounder, it's a powder puff prizefighter - he probably wont even take a shot.

if the board pass him, let him fight. if you dont want to watch it then dont, its simple. this is boxing, it's hard, it's brutal and people get hurt for cash. stop the press, not all of them get boners while doing it.

veriton wrote:some real ninnys on here. toney isnt going in against david haye in a 12 rounder, it's a powder puff prizefighter - he probably wont even take a shot.

if the board pass him, let him fight. if you dont want to watch it then dont, its simple. this is boxing, it's hard, it's brutal and people get hurt for cash. stop the press, not all of them get boners while doing it.

Stop the press this is forum where people who have an opinion can voice it.
If im a real "ninny" for being a bit concerned that someone who was arguably an ATG who appears to be desperate and willing to continue boxing for peanuts when he clearly shouldn't be then fair enough im a ninny.
And you mate are a numpty ..."people get hurt for cash" great analogy of our sport.

Prizefighter is a disgrace:

Matt Legg - who?
Brian Minto - who?
Jason Gavern - who?
Michael Sprott - solid stepping stone
James Toney - drugs cheat/punch drunk/too old/just a name
Damian Wills - who?
Larry Olubamiwo - drugs cheat
Tom Little - beat by Dallas, basically a novice

TJ77 wrote:

veriton wrote:some real ninnys on here. toney isnt going in against david haye in a 12 rounder, it's a powder puff prizefighter - he probably wont even take a shot.

if the board pass him, let him fight. if you dont want to watch it then dont, its simple. this is boxing, it's hard, it's brutal and people get hurt for cash. stop the press, not all of them get boners while doing it.

Stop the press this is forum where people who have an opinion can voice it.
If im a real "ninny" for being a bit concerned that someone who was arguably an ATG who appears to be desperate and willing to continue boxing for peanuts when he clearly shouldn't be then fair enough im a ninny.
And you mate are a numpty ..."people get hurt for cash" great analogy of our sport.

no one said you couldnt voice an opinion, just dont expect it to be taken seriously when it doesnt make sense. not sure what being an all-time great has to do with it, seen plenty get busted up over and over again. it's how most end up.

good luck with tuning in only for 50-50 fights between healthy and ambitious boxers, you wont have too much to watch

I'll settle for healthy and ambitious your right 50/50 are few and far between.
It makes sense to a good portion of the posters evidently and your argument to me is nonsense its how it is so get on with it.
When he is dribbling down himself and cant control the tremors has no money for proper care like Ali or Roach and living in a country with no nhs at least we can all say we had no part in it but we will have
Were supposed to learn from the past not revel in repeating it.

This thread has created 4 pages of debate, so I suppose we are all talking about it

I'm not a Prizefighter fan generally, but may now turn over and have a look!

rossij8 wrote:This thread has created 4 pages of debate, so I suppose we are all talking about it

I'm not a Prizefighter fan generally, but may now turn over and have a look!

Funny