BoxRec

youngrell wrote:31 KO's in 35 wins says puncher to me.

A fair amount of which came against Argie binmen tbh.

jago9139 wrote:

JamieM wrote:Maidana went distance with khan in which he didn't actually have him down did he? Wouldn't say thts a puncher . He can hit hard but didn't think hard enough to trouble broner. Fair play but it's not actually known what rios has used yet I don't think. All hearsay?

Johnny - enhancers etc all improve strength . That's why they are used in all aspects of sport
Unfortunately. Although the theory of your a puncher or not would be ideal not like that and punch power can be altered through drug use hence why it's banned and not legalised

Lets not Forget that Ariza was Khan's strength and conditioning coach when he fought Maidana, and Khan has been put down by lighter punches since, any coincidence ?

What are you saying, that Ariza gave Khan some magic steroid that stops people being knocked down???

And what is it people think Maidana is supposedly taking in that video, another magic video that makes you win a fight you are already winning?

I don't like Ariza, but some of this is ridiculous.

JamieM wrote:Spot on. Im sorry but I really have a feeling hell fail the test, if he does he needs to be banned for life, what I found strange was that the way he was rocking broner. Didnt expect that as broner has been known to take a shot quite well. For me Ariza is a cheat and although it will never be proved I also think mayweather was right about pacmans camp regarding the exact same issues! Thats now Margarito and Rios failed from Robert Garcias Gym, anyone else?

Brandon Rios failed drug test was for a drug that helps cut weight not helps strength .Wouldn't explain how Maidana was rocking Broner. Let's not forget Maidana is known as a big puncher. We cant judge Maidana on what Rios did same strength and conditioning coach or not.

banjo wrote:

youngrell wrote:31 KO's in 35 wins says puncher to me.

A fair amount of which came against Argie binmen tbh.

That's a tad harsh. Most of his opponents had largely winning records and he's stopped Ortiz, Lopez, Soto Karass among others and had Broner, Khan and a few other decent guys all over the shop too. The guy can punch.

Wa1nuts wrote:

jago9139 wrote:

JamieM wrote:Maidana went distance with khan in which he didn't actually have him down did he? Wouldn't say thts a puncher . He can hit hard but didn't think hard enough to trouble broner. Fair play but it's not actually known what rios has used yet I don't think. All hearsay?

Johnny - enhancers etc all improve strength . That's why they are used in all aspects of sport
Unfortunately. Although the theory of your a puncher or not would be ideal not like that and punch power can be altered through drug use hence why it's banned and not legalised

Lets not Forget that Ariza was Khan's strength and conditioning coach when he fought Maidana, and Khan has been put down by lighter punches since, any coincidence ?

What are you saying, that Ariza gave Khan some magic steroid that stops people being knocked down???

And what is it people think Maidana is supposedly taking in that video, another magic video that makes you win a fight you are already winning?

I don't like Ariza, but some of this is ridiculous.

Not Saying that at all, what i am saying is controversy seems to follow Ariza, and Khan has not looked as strong and as durable as he appeared in the Maidana fighnt since parting company with Mr Ariza.

If Maidana is found to be using an illegal item - cue for Broner hype to get back on track!!!

jago9139 wrote: Not Saying that at all, what i am saying is controversy seems to follow Ariza, and Khan has not looked as strong and as durable as he appeared in the Maidana fighnt since parting company with Mr Ariza.

So what are you saying then? What you're implying seems fairly obvious but you're not saying that, are you?

SNG wrote:

jago9139 wrote: Not Saying that at all, what i am saying is controversy seems to follow Ariza, and Khan has not looked as strong and as durable as he appeared in the Maidana fighnt since parting company with Mr Ariza.

So what are you saying then? What you're implying seems fairly obvious but you're not saying that, are you?

Maybe the Maidana fight was his peak, maybe he will come again? I also disagree because he looked far stronger in the Judah fight than the Maidana. He bullied Zab in there.

And so it begins. Formal investigation launched.

johnnygreaves wrote:In all title fights over here , even area titles theres a compulsory test. Also I'm not at all saying its right but would any sort of pill/injection make one punch harder. ? Your a knockout puncher or you aren't. I thought its in your technique. Please edumacate me

I'm with you on this. I did steroids (mild doses, only twice) for weight loss/muscle retention/weight lifting (not cheating! not competitive) ad it didn't make me punch harder. What did was practise, technique and timing.

Also don't think Maidana needed drugs to be able to deck Broner given his natural power and natural weight advantage.

I dont care what anyone says I believe Maidana cheated, I just dont believe that the difference in him was achieved through Garcia training him, thats me though. Also on the subject of steroids there are different kind of steroids and most athletes use the type that will enhance performance. Of course you get steroids that help dietary and you also get steroids that can help clear a cold or clear up rashes etc. But they are not type I believe to be used mainly. Broner is acting like a complete tool but do you blame him? This isnt a game of chess and there life is in the hands of cheats . Doesnt seem to be a drug test carried out straight after the fight it seems.

Fight Hype have interviewed Ariza and have reviewed the footage... Maidana and Ariza seem to be in the clear. You can check it out on their website.

Parson Cross wrote:And so it begins. Formal investigation launched.

Its a proper shame because now the cloud of suspicion will always be at Maidana's door.

Thinking of this from a selfish perspective, I was pleased, nope delighted Maidana whooped Broners butt, but now I am p*ssed off because Broner is going to come out with all the bullsh*t of "the only reason why I lost was because I was cheated!!"

Irrespective of any drug test results, this thread has been like a quick handy guide for candidates for the Ignore list.

Thank you to all who have participated & outed yourselves. I'd never have guessed that Maidana wasn't a puncher without your help. I imagine Victor Ortiz, Victor Cayo & Jesus Soto Karass would have liked this pointed out to them before being brutally KO'd in each instance.

I think we should have a sticky-half-baked bullshit nonsense & totally random conspiracy theory thread, perhaps?--in which people are encouraged to post, & then you can just select the obvious fvckwits to block so they don't darken your day. The amount of time this would save in the long run is inestimable.

Regardless of whether MM cheated or not, Broner has been well and truly exposed in his last 2 fights and will cherry pick the rest of his career.

Spud wrote:

Parson Cross wrote:And so it begins. Formal investigation launched.

Its a proper shame because now the cloud of suspicion will always be at Maidana's door.

Thinking of this from a selfish perspective, I was pleased, nope delighted Maidana whooped Broners butt, but now I am p*ssed off because Broner is going to come out with all the bullsh*t of "the only reason why I lost was because I was cheated!!"

A cheat is a cheat at the end of the day... I'm waiting for this investigation to reach a conclusion - but if Maidana is found guilty then he should sling his hook. If he is found innocent then I hope there will never be a cloud over him.... he will be regularly tested and hopefully will be clean.

Broner would have the right to come out with this apparent "bullshit".... but a lot more fighters, irrespective of what Maidana did, are going to be a lot more confident facing Broner now than they were before Saturday.... its still going to take quite something from Broner to get back to the leagues of where he was before.

Give me an arrogant fraud over a cheat.

For those who want Ariza banned for the Rios issue, would you extend that to the Mayweather team for offences around Jleon Love and Mickey Bey?

jago9139 wrote:

JamieM wrote:Maidana went distance with khan in which he didn't actually have him down did he? Wouldn't say thts a puncher . He can hit hard but didn't think hard enough to trouble broner. Fair play but it's not actually known what rios has used yet I don't think. All hearsay?

Johnny - enhancers etc all improve strength . That's why they are used in all aspects of sport
Unfortunately. Although the theory of your a puncher or not would be ideal not like that and punch power can be altered through drug use hence why it's banned and not legalised

Lets not Forget that Ariza was Khan's strength and conditioning coach when he fought Maidana, and Khan has been put down by lighter punches since, any coincidence ?

He was also Pac's when he was rising through the weightclasses destroying everyone.

This guy needs to be investigated.

Tangent

Has a fighter who has suffered physically or financially after participating in a fight against a person who was later found to have taken (or acknowledged having done so) any type of PED, ever taken legal action against a sanctioning body/board for not doing enough to protect his well-being?

Aden wrote:Tangent

Has a fighter who has suffered physically or financially after participating in a fight against a person who was later found to have taken (or acknowledged having done so) any type of PED, ever taken legal action against a sanctioning body/board for not doing enough to protect his well-being?

Excellent question. I suspect the answer is no, i certainly havent heard of a case.

But i'd be surprized if the scenario doesn't crop up soon

Another question worth asking.
Should a fighter involved in something like we seen.with perez vs abdusalamov

On one hand it would be harsh on the opponent who is already struggling with the guilt of what has happened.
But on the other hand, if it transpires that either fighter was doping it would open a can of worms, but if i was the family of a seriously injured fighter, and the injury was caused by a drug cheat, i'd sure as hell want to know

davie wrote:

Aden wrote:Tangent

Has a fighter who has suffered physically or financially after participating in a fight against a person who was later found to have taken (or acknowledged having done so) any type of PED, ever taken legal action against a sanctioning body/board for not doing enough to protect his well-being?

Excellent question. I suspect the answer is no, i certainly havent heard of a case.

But i'd be surprized if the scenario doesn't crop up soon

Another question worth asking.
Should a fighter involved in something like we seen.with perez vs abdusalamov

On one hand it would be harsh on the opponent who is already struggling with the guilt of what has happened.
But on the other hand, if it transpires that either fighter was doping it would open a can of worms, but if i was the family of a seriously injured fighter, and the injury was caused by a drug cheat, i'd sure as hell want to know

I'm an even bigger American football fan than I am a boxing fan, so lets look for comparisons there for a moment...

Earlier this year the NFL agree to pay $765 million to resolve a class action lawsuit taken out against them by a group of former players who claimed that the league was responsible for their concussions.

Also, I see another class action/mass tort (please accept my apologies if any of my terminologies are incorrect, I'm not a lawyer) down the line against the league from players who will claim that the league did not do enough to protect them from other players who use(d) HGH. This will have to involve confessions and testimonies, etc but I see it as almost inevitable. The league has a reasonably good testing policy for steroids but they still do not conduct blood tests, so, as you can currently only detect HGH from blood tests, players can essentially use HGH with zero chance of being found out unless they are caught red-handed or admit guilt. So, if I were a boxer who felt wronged, I'd keep a close eye on how things go with the NFL and consider following their lead.

whats the chance its a glucose / caffeine tablet or something?

Finn wrote:whats the chance its a glucose / caffeine tablet or something?

if it was caffeine it would be too late in the fight to kick in.

glucose, well there's good evidence of even a mouth rinse with glucose having performance benefits.

There's something there and it's against the rules, which is bad crack from ariza who's not even that good anyway.

johnnygreaves wrote:In all title fights over here , even area titles theres a compulsory test. Also I'm not at all saying its right but would any sort of pill/injection make one punch harder. ? Your a knockout puncher or you aren't. I thought its in your technique. Please edumacate me

It's not just about punching harder though Johnny. What about blood boosters? The techniques that make you fitter. Given a choice would you want to face a guy who throws 180 punches a round because he's cheated? Loads of different ways of cheating with drugs and it has no place in a sport where the aim is to hurt your opponent.

tallsdav wrote:

Finn wrote:whats the chance its a glucose / caffeine tablet or something?

if it was caffeine it would be too late in the fight to kick in.

glucose, well there's good evidence of even a mouth rinse with glucose having performance benefits.

There's something there and it's against the rules, which is bad crack from ariza who's not even that good anyway.

what im thinking is surely its unlikely glucose or caffeine will show up on any drugs test.