BoxRec

crusader wrote:
Speed is relevant given that Sanders relied on his quick hands to deliver many of his knockouts; what made him dangerous was not so much that he could bang as it was that he could bang quickly.

Yes, I agree. I don't get your point. Originally you said that Haye was faster and more explosive than Sanders and seemed to be suggesting that this means since Wlad dealt with Haye he could deal with Sanders. But I said speed is irrelevant because Haye threw punches from Austria, with the size differential negating his speed, while Corrie was able to get in range and punch in bunches, which made his speed more of a weapon, even though he may technically be less quick than Haye (which is debatable in itself).

Just a final thought. The 'better paced' Wlad hasn't been tested by anyone capable with a degree of aggression, unless you count 2005 and Sam Peter (which I did) and he got badly hurt and could have conceivably lost. It's my position that the 'improvements' Wlad made were hardly evidenced by anything when you consider the dire opposition he has faced. Haye was the best he faced, but the style matchup favoured Wlad considerably. And no, Haye didn't 'put punches together' at any time. He was perfect for Wlad, low output, pot shotting, smaller guy. And still Wlad managed to stink the place out.

Plus you know I already feel Corrie was a considerably bigger puncher than Haye which is the level of power that would get Wlad to panic.

Anyway, agree to disagree and enjoyed the debate

I agree with riddick blowe. haye is better than sanders was but he was a very bad matchup for wlad not just because of his Speed but also because he was willing to eat punches to Counter. sanders had no head movement and just stood in there taking some punches and firing back quickly.

against haye Wladimir was able to intimidate haye with his power making him to stay outside and wait which is wladimirs game.

Wladimir would always have a tough time against sanders.

I don't agree however that brewster would beat prime wlad. unlike sanders brewster was getting beat up until wlad gassed. prime wlad would pace himself more and win a boring Points decision against prime brewster.

Yes, I agree. I don't get your point. Originally you said that Haye was faster and more explosive than Sanders and seemed to be suggesting that this means since Wlad dealt with Haye he could deal with Sanders. But I said speed is irrelevant because Haye threw punches from Austria, with the size differential negating his speed, while Corrie was able to get in range and punch in bunches, which made his speed more of a weapon, even though he may technically be less quick than Haye (which is debatable in itself).

I already said that I believe much of what you consider Haye throwing wild shots from out of range was a product of Wlad making him miss badly due to well-timed and executed footwork. Sanders hit Wlad with straight lefts from outside in their short fight, so I don't think it was just a matter of where the punches were coming from. I also think that Wlad was more susceptible to a charging attack because his movement wasn't as effective as it is now, which made him a more hittable target and perhaps therefore encouraged Sanders to come forward as he was.

Just a final thought. The 'better paced' Wlad hasn't been tested by anyone capable with a degree of aggression, unless you count 2005 and Sam Peter (which I did) and he got badly hurt and could have conceivably lost. It's my position that the 'improvements' Wlad made were hardly evidenced by anything when you consider the dire opposition he has faced. Haye was the best he faced, but the style matchup favoured Wlad considerably. And no, Haye didn't 'put punches together' at any time. He was perfect for Wlad, low output, pot shotting, smaller guy. And still Wlad managed to stink the place out.

I think Wlad is better than he was in 2005 when he started transitioning to his new style, and even then he clearly beat Peter and showed he can successfully overcome multiple knockdowns and hard-hitting, aggressive opponents. I also think that Sanders is generally overrated and believe it's debatable that he was significantly better than Peter.

To me the improvements are clear. The more frequent and quicker footwork is apparent even when comparing Wlad's bouts with some of his less impressive challengers of distinct periods of his career, and the lower output mitigates significantly against gassing, which was the main reason for his losses to Purrity and Brewster, the latter of whom was actually more aggressive in the rematch but wasn't facing an exhausted Wlad (and talk of Brewster being anything other than a punching bag until Wlad gassed in the first fight is nonsense).

Haye did put together punches occasionally, though admittedly he did it infrequently. When he did Wlad just took another step back and moved out of range as he did with single shots. Obviously many people thought it was a dreadful fight, but Wlad puts winning before entertaining and he won by a landslide.

Plus you know I already feel Corrie was a considerably bigger puncher than Haye which is the level of power that would get Wlad to panic.

Sanders may well punch harder, but I don't see a considerable gap in power between him and Haye.

Anyway, agree to disagree and enjoyed the debate

As always

the biggest difference between sanders and haye is that sanders is not afraid to get punched in the face to stay in the range and fire back.

haye is a better boxer than sanders and has great speed and power too but he doesn't like to go where it hurts and is a more defensive fighter. haye is a great boxer but he is a safety first guy who does not like to get hit.

Glazkov is the most overrated Heavyweight in the division. If he doesn't get knocked out on NBC he's either getting the win or the draw.

What happened to that Undefeated Heavyweight thread?

I had Glazkov

dwise26 wrote:Glazkov is the most overrated Heavyweight in the division. If he doesn't get knocked out on NBC he's either getting the win or the draw.

Is he overrated? Seems most people share your sentiment...

Poor division with Glazkov being it's Nr.5.

Man, HW boxing is so pathetic you can barely find words to describe it.
When you see Christian Hammer being Nr.14, it really makes you wanna cry.

That's the sanctioning bodies fault, not the divisions. When will people realize that corrupt political rankings don't accurately reflect anything.

I love how people, mainly Klitschko fanboys, claim that the division only "looks" weak because the Klits are so dominant.

No, the division is clearly weak.

You know the division is a mess when Glazkov, a so-called contender, can barely beat journeyman Rossey.

And Fury, another top contender, hasn't fought a huge HW yet. And while he has a decent resume, he hasn't looked impressive against his opponents.