Bowe in the ibhof

[Old bones Ian]

1993-2003

Best heavyweights?

Decent bunch of fun, veterans, punchers, gutsy gate keepers, ticket sellers. How many matches of those did we see. Precious few.

Lewis, Holyfield, Bowe, Tyson

Klitschko, Moorer, Byrd, Tua

Briggs, Foreman, Ibeabuchi, Mercer, Golota

Botha, Holmes, Witherspoon, Bruno, Grant,

Morrison, Ruiz, McCall.

And out of that lot Lewis faced 12, going 12-1-1 with 9 KO's. Bowe faced 2 , going 4-1 with 1 KO.

Its no choice who is rated better, but for natural talent Bowe had it to be up there with the best, but he isn't

[stujones]

I think Michael Moorer has much of a claim in being in the IBOF as Bowe.... infact, I would say more of a claim.

Multiple world champion, that same 1 big name scalp.... plus his run in the lesser weights.

[DavidPayne]

Amen.

Lewis should be lauded for the management of his career despite forces working to keep him out and for remaining in tact and wealthy in retirement, and staying retired.

Discipline and dedication are skills too.

[thepocketrocket]

I always thought both Bowe and Holy would have beaten Lewis in the early 90's. We saw the trouble Lewis had with an ageing Holy.

Still, the fact that these fights never happened is nothing to do with Lewis. And David is right, discipline and dedication are certainly underrated qualities!

[Old bones Ian]

I think Michael Moorer has much of a claim in being in the IBOF as Bowe.... infact, I would say more of a claim.

Multiple world champion, that same 1 big name scalp.... plus his run in the lesser weights.

How about Chris Byrd as well he has Vitali, Tua, Holyfield in his win column

[lillywhite14]

Thinking Holy or Bowe would have beat Lewis back then is still never th same as them actually beating them though, especially when Lewis was always more than able and willing to fight em at any point.

I had Bowe-Lewis back then as a pure 50-50 fight. Which is what it's so annoying the never fought. Potential all time great trilogy lost there.
Holy? Never thought me matched up too well with Lewis personally, he didn't have too much trouble with older version, in fact the first fight was a stroll in the park ( which in turn led to Lennox being his sometims over confident self in the rematch imo ) He would have stood a better chance against the younger Lennox but I would still have favoured Lewis.

[Syntax Error]

Despite his undoubted talent & his fights with Holyfield alone prove how good he was, I do think there is still an element of Bowe missing the boat so to speak.

I don't care about busines, he should have fought Lewis in 1993: it was the biggest HW fight out there potentially.

Any other fighter in his shoes would have been chomping at the bit to put Lewis in his place.

The ironic thing, in hindsight, Bowe would have taken Lewis in 1993, as he was in his pomp & Lewis hadn't quite matured yet & was still pretty reckless & over reliant on his big Right hand, but alas, thanks to Newman & Bowe, we will never know.

If you don't care about business it is a good job you aren't looking after fighters careers.

'Putting someone in their place' by the way is what happens in WWF. Bank balances are looked at in the real world and a risk-reward analysis.

Very true. Can we confirm that Bowe and his management viewed Lewis as a high risk opponent?

We can can't we? We can all agree on that from both sides of the debate?

Can we also accept that Bowe v Holyfield and Lewis v Ruddock were qualifiers for a bigger bout between the winners and was fairly conclusively 'agreed to'.

Can we also accept Bowe struggled with Holy and Lewis, surprisingly destroyed a guy supposedly teak tough who Tyson struggled to put away?

Can we accept Bowe reneged on the deal by dumping the WBC belt, melodramatically, you know the belt with Ali and Louis' face on in the bin?

So, Bowe may not have been a coward, he fought some hard men in his career. But he opted for more money in holding fights while waiting on the rich, presumed easier pickings of Holyfield II? Agreed?

Sound business sense? Arguably.

However, Lewis is the one with $100mill in the bank a secure legacy with victories over everyone he fought. He fought Grant when should have fought Ruiz but that aside he did everything asked of him I believe.

Bowe, is skint, desperate and we're debating his place.

Now that is the benefit of hindsight and there are infinite variable and perspectives to be applied to this longer term result.

But Bowe was supposed to fight Lewis. He didn't, it was HIS choice. That's ducking, and I believe, with my Doctorate in Psychology from the online University of Oregano, that he deeply regrets not fighting him.

Because at his best, he may well have beaten Lewis. But history now written, consensus is, Lewis would have.

Solid post.

Cannot disagree with a word of it.

[thepocketrocket]

Thinking Holy or Bowe would have beat Lewis back then is still never th same as them actually beating them though, especially when Lewis was always more than able and willing to fight em at any point.

I had Bowe-Lewis back then as a pure 50-50 fight. Which is what it's so annoying the never fought. Potential all time great trilogy lost there.
Holy? Never thought me matched up too well with Lewis personally, he didn't have too much trouble with older version, in fact the first fight was a stroll in the park ( which in turn led to Lennox being his sometims over confident self in the rematch imo ) He would have stood a better chance against the younger Lennox but I would still have favoured Lewis.

There are plenty, including Boxing News who has Holy winning the second fight

[JimJim2009]

Amen.

Lewis should be lauded for the management of his career despite forces working to keep him out and for remaining in tact and wealthy in retirement, and staying retired.

Discipline and dedication are skills too.

Agree one million percent. He should be acclaimed for leaving on his terms, and keeping his money. So many can't do either, tragically.

[ClivePatrickLyons]

Always find the idea he 'ducked' Lewis because he was scared almost laughable, and a theory perpetuated by the Lewis fan club.

Lennox was talented but was no way near as big a draw (and payday) as the likes of Holy and Tyson.

Only an idiot would have fought Lewis for a piss poor pay day instead of going against those two (presuming he got through Holy 2)

WELL STATED.

[thepocketrocket]

Thinking Holy or Bowe would have beat Lewis back then is still never th same as them actually beating them though, especially when Lewis was always more than able and willing to fight em at any point.

I had Bowe-Lewis back then as a pure 50-50 fight. Which is what it's so annoying the never fought. Potential all time great trilogy lost there.
Holy? Never thought me matched up too well with Lewis personally, he didn't have too much trouble with older version, in fact the first fight was a stroll in the park ( which in turn led to Lennox being his sometims over confident self in the rematch imo ) He would have stood a better chance against the younger Lennox but I would still have favoured Lewis.

There are plenty, including Boxing News who has Holy winning the second fight

There were accusations that it was a sympathy vote for Lewis, following fight 1, but I think he took it by a few points.

It was definitely close Terry, and Lewis may well have got it (I should watch it again) Just countering the idea that Lewis didn't have too much trouble with Holy.

[lillywhite14]

He didn't have too much trouble, in the first fight. By his own admission he took the second fight lightly as he found the first one so easy.

Those who thought he lost the rematch must have scored the first fight close. Lewis won both, the first at a canter the second by a few points.

[thepocketrocket]

He didn't have too much trouble, in the first fight. By his own admission he took the second fight lightly as he found the first one so easy.

Those who thought he lost the rematch must have scored the first fight close. Lewis won both, the first at a canter the second by a few points.

Bit of a fanboy comment, but hey ho.

Both fights were close, and this is the Holy who was about to go life and death with John Ruiz. Methinks the younger version may have done even better against Lewis