BoxRec

diddy wrote:Is there any hope? Serious question.

There has GOT to be a better way to score these fights.

Maybe FIVE judges?

Use the press at ringside and take an average?

Have a computer score them?

I can see why there is corruption in some cases of building up a young fighter but there's no rational explanation for the Bradley-Chaves result. It benefits...nobody.

It's gotten just so, so, so bad something has gotta change. And soon.

My short answer is more elite level fighters who fight each other when they are both in their primes. But that seldom happens!

Here’s my short list:

In title unification matches, allow 15 rounds an option.

Have a super six tournament once every four years. And invite all champions and top contenders.

Create a boxing TV channel like NFL network has. 1 hour a day on news, clips and events would be nice.

I’d like to see the promoters invest in boxing gyms or at least help to keep them open.

Put the game on NBC CBS ABC and FOX so regular poor schlubs like me can tune in and enjoy.
They need a superstar like this Sammy Vasquez. Clean cut, army veteran who has KO stopping power.
I like Iron Mike's Russian Khytrov and I love Golovkin. Golovkin should be a house hold name but
he aint cause people cant afford HBO. When I watch boxing now I gotta go to my daughters in the
suburbs cause I cant afford these channels no more.

...and baseball players should be making blue-collar wages, say a yard a week.

That's going to happen.....

danamba7 wrote:

cold187 wrote:easy - one governing body

like FIFA, IAAF, IOC, ICC just to name a few

FIFA are the worst organization ever to be involved in sport.

Followed by the IOC.

Tanzio wrote:After the Sweet Pea v Chavez decision, I became a largely disinterested, very casual fan who would check results and watch some rounds if a big fight was on at the bar I was in. I decided that it was not worth my valuable time. It took me over a decade to come back and begin following boxing closely again, thanks partially to the fact that personal and business circumstances left some time for it if I chose to spend it that way.

Given my business circumstances over the last year to two years, coupled with the pure corruption of the boxing industry, I am no longer interested in spending much of the most valuable commodity I possess (my time) on the sport, or money for that matter.

Too many other worthwhile endeavors to invest in.

WTF ?
You were the guy defending Bradley's farce over Pac a few years ago, you bum.

victor-romeo wrote:Boxing has always been rigged

Yes.
Why ?

BETTING.

Remove the betting, and the judging will be fair.
But then, the sport itself might disappear..

Three things I think might help, although doubt any are realistic at this time;

1) Make random blood and urine testing mandatory all year-round.

2) Get rid of PPV fights all together - give the sport back to the fans instead of greedy promoters and prima donnas. More exposure on regular TV would help the sport. Imagine 100 million watching instead of 1 million? PPV fights will keep decreasing anyway because of online streaming.

3) Increase the number of judges to five.

Here's an idea. Have a random collection of 100 seat-assigned tickets from the live crowd. Put the tickets in a cardboard box and have one of the ring card girls pull out three tickets at random, then go to the people in those seats and have them act as judges. They can't do any worse and will really be concentrating on the action because of the sudden responsibility.

The ridiculous sums of money made from some of these PPVs need to be divided up so that a percentage of the cash is invested in the sport. Problem with that is none of the participants have any interest in doing it. So it comes back to a single governing body (fantasy) or a billionaire boxing fan turned czar to force things to happen to save the sport, at least in North America. Fortunately, there is just enough poverty in Europe and South America to provide future participants, as the top performers generally constitute only a small fraction of all pro boxers.

Cap wrote:Here's an idea. Have a random collection of 100 seat-assigned tickets from the live crowd. Put the tickets in a cardboard box and have one of the ring card girls pull out three tickets at random, then go to the people in those seats and have them act as judges. They can't do any worse and will really be concentrating on the action because of the sudden responsibility.

The ridiculous sums of money made from some of these PPVs need to be divided up so that a percentage of the cash is invested in the sport. Problem with that is none of the participants have any interest in doing it. So it comes back to a single governing body (fantasy) or a billionaire boxing fan turned czar to force things to happen to save the sport, at least in North America. Fortunately, there is just enough poverty in Europe and South America to provide future participants, as the top performers generally constitute only a small fraction of all pro boxers.

The first part made me chuckle a little, but I really like the idea! They should try it for a couple fights, unofficially of course, to see how the results compare? I do think the more judges the better. Less chance of the stuff we have been seeing.

I agree that PPV's are ruining boxing, and taking away exposure from so many that simply can't afford it. Politics and greedy people end up ruining a lot of things. People that control the politics, unfortunately, are the ones that are the greediest and have the most money. Money drives everything. Once Arum dies and Floyd retires, things will improve. I say that as a Floyd fan and an Arum hater.

Haymon needs to die too.

We may need to have to LIVE WITH bad decisions when they occurs and SIMPLY the GOVERNING BODIES work their procedure in the such instances(?). I mean, THINK ABOUT IT FOR A MOMENT AND JUST HOW THAT RELATES TO OTHER "Worldly matters". The Justice System etc./Now.. where I see an improvement can come is in regulating the Governing bodies better. John Wilkinson ex-boxer has his UWBCAFO-I Organization which ECHELONS the Sport into two echelons. Est. March/2007. I can bring that here. By & large we need to keep boxing contained and it is the WBC WBA IBF WBO we need to COUNT ON/ even if they are not PERFECT. The Ibo can lead the charge at '2e'. The whole of the Sports world IGNORES BOXING on account of the goverence spread! & "Ring magazine" was WRONG under Nigel Collins the some years ago to JUNK all the Organizations and pronounce themselves "KINGS". Why.....dope Nigel couldn't even figure inactivity. A boxer could be champ 12 years w/o fighting how THEY "pronounced" their STUPID "war!" The UWBCAFO-I is the ADMIN answer. Why do the first major four even ALLOW Wladimir Klitschko & now (new) Golovkin to hold "Ibo" garbage alongside their hardware?
BIG MISTAKE!

IBO IBA = "Etc"./WBC WBA IBF WBO & STOP.

Badhusker wrote:Three things I think might help, although doubt any are realistic at this time;

1) Make random blood and urine testing mandatory all year-round.

2) Get rid of PPV fights all together - give the sport back to the fans instead of greedy promoters and prima donnas. More exposure on regular TV would help the sport. Imagine 100 million watching instead of 1 million? PPV fights will keep decreasing anyway because of online streaming.

3) Increase the number of judges to five.

1) Why? People want their generation of athletes to be bigger, faster, stronger than ever before. PED's are prolific in every sport. Better to supervise them rather than intensify the clearly failing system currently employed. They should be legalized.

2) Completely agree.

3) On paper that should help. Corruption tends to find it's ways into dark corners though, so I'm not sure if it would help.

crow wrote:

victor-romeo wrote:Boxing has always been rigged

Yes.
Why ?

BETTING.

Remove the betting, and the judging will be fair.
But then, the sport itself might disappear..

True. But my question is how/why does anyone give a crap about this sport anymore without betting on it? I mean why watch otherwise? The scoring is awful. The best guys rarely ever fight each other. What's in it for the fan if they dont have some personal investment? I guess I sound like a jaded american who views boxing as fourth-rate sport. In other countries I know it's much more popular but from an american perspective it's really hard to care anymore without wagering.

crow wrote:

victor-romeo wrote:Boxing has always been rigged

Yes.
Why ?

BETTING.

Remove the betting, and the judging will be fair.
But then, the sport itself might disappear..

Further to your point the corruption is what makes it EASY to bet on. 95% of the time you know where the corruption might lie so you just go with that.

THEN...you get a result like Diego Chaves getting a draw in VEGAS against Tim Bradley and that makes you reconsider everything you think you know. There is no reason whatsoever to rob Bradley in america at the benefit of Diego f'n Chaves from Argentina who nobody gives a crap about. So if its not corruption it's sheer incompetency and there inlies the point of this thread.

punchoutsb wrote:

Badhusker wrote:Three things I think might help, although doubt any are realistic at this time;

1) Make random blood and urine testing mandatory all year-round.

2) Get rid of PPV fights all together - give the sport back to the fans instead of greedy promoters and prima donnas. More exposure on regular TV would help the sport. Imagine 100 million watching instead of 1 million? PPV fights will keep decreasing anyway because of online streaming.

3) Increase the number of judges to five.

1) Why? People want their generation of athletes to be bigger, faster, stronger than ever before. PED's are prolific in every sport. Better to supervise them rather than intensify the clearly failing system currently employed. They should be legalized.

2) Completely agree.

3) On paper that should help. Corruption tends to find it's ways into dark corners though, so I'm not sure if it would help.

I am in strong disagreement. Number one it sends the wrong message to kids, especially in the high school level. I am for stricter rules, and a life-time ban for anyone that tests positive, even for the first time. Make it a level playing field but a natural one based on good nutrition and hard work. If athletes know they risk a lifetime ban, they will be very careful what they put in their bodies.

Badhusker wrote:

punchoutsb wrote:

Badhusker wrote:Three things I think might help, although doubt any are realistic at this time;

1) Make random blood and urine testing mandatory all year-round.

2) Get rid of PPV fights all together - give the sport back to the fans instead of greedy promoters and prima donnas. More exposure on regular TV would help the sport. Imagine 100 million watching instead of 1 million? PPV fights will keep decreasing anyway because of online streaming.

3) Increase the number of judges to five.

1) Why? People want their generation of athletes to be bigger, faster, stronger than ever before. PED's are prolific in every sport. Better to supervise them rather than intensify the clearly failing system currently employed. They should be legalized.

2) Completely agree.

3) On paper that should help. Corruption tends to find it's ways into dark corners though, so I'm not sure if it would help.

I am in strong disagreement. Number one it sends the wrong message to kids, especially in the high school level. I am for stricter rules, and a life-time ban for anyone that tests positive, even for the first time. Make it a level playing field but a natural one based on good nutrition and hard work. If athletes know they risk a lifetime ban, they will be very careful what they put in their bodies.

You're opinion is a very admirable one. And believe me, I'm a natural is better guy myself. I'm a competitive lifter and strongman, and have boxed and competed as an amateur mixed martial artist.

But I still feel PED's should be legalized. We ask so much of our athletes, it's stupid to limit them. Supervise and educate. They're not gonna shrink your nuts and kill you if you follow proper protocols and don't abuse them.

I've also heard the level playing field side before...but how can you really control that? This is a sport for poor people, essentially. How can you control that they are all getting the best nutrition? Can you control their facilities and coaches? Level playing fields don't exist. And for those who feels steroids turn you into some kind of killer, watch John McDermott vs Larry Olubamiwo again...

I'd be perfectly fine with keeping steroids illegal...as long as tobacco and alcohol are also made illegal in society and sports. Their negative effects are far worse.

IF BOXING WERE A REAL SPORT:

Random testing for all banned substances and 2-year suspension if caught. Jail time for dispensers of banned substances. Lifetime suspensions for coaches who dispense banned substances. Immediate post-fight inquests into questionable decisions and heavy fines and lifetime suspensions for any judge who is found to be corrupt; suspensions if they are merely incompetent.

A percentage of PPV to go toward health plan and pension for pro boxers. An international agreement between national boxing commissions to uphold sanctions and suspensions against boxers, managers, and promoters. National commissions to license judges with annual tests for competency. An international agreement for national commissions to utilize centralized reporting and a workable computerized ranking system for ALL professional boxers. A ban on all boxers from any nation which refuses to comply with suspensions or is found to be issuing false reports.

For scoring I think you wanna change the scoring.

-For a close round score it 10-9, for a clear round score it 10-8, I think many of the bad scorecard fights I've seen would be resolved with this method instead of the 10-9. The 10-9 concept for winning a round rarely awards a fighter for a clearly superior round if there isn't a knockdown. Knockdowns would deduct a point as usual. Scoring has evolved as time has went on. It used to be last man standing, then it was by rounds (knockdowns didn't play) & now its 10-9 with knockdowns in play. I think its about time to evolve it again.

-I think there should be clear & concise guidelines on what wins a round. Judges should know it, fighters should know it, trainers should know it & fans should know it. Right now there are only soft guidelines & it would seem as if any judge can be subjective & decide on their own how to interpret these guidelines. The way boxing judging works would be like if a random NFL ref could decide the QB hitting the goalpost with a pass can be a touchdown too.

-I think you need to judge the judges. This is a companion change with the above. I think there should be some sort of ranking system employed for judges with training to improve them, suspensions for bad performances & with rises in the level of the fights they judge for consistently good performances & drops for those less consistent.

Put it back on NBC CBS and abc so poor people like me can watch it. It will get all them ghetto kids back involved like In the olden days when the sport was in its prime. I gotta get a ride to my daughters house to watch hbo and Showtime. It's bullshit

Any culture that tells their children that athletes are role models is diseased.

JeanClaude Van Damme wrote:Any culture that tells their children that athletes are role models is diseased.

Why? To be a great athlete you need dedication determination and lots of training just as you do in real life the exact same things that make a great doctor or barrister

JeanClaude Van Damme wrote:Any culture that tells their children that athletes are role models is diseased.

Idk about this, as a child I think many people are your role models for different reasons. Now if you said any culture where Paris Hilton & Kim Kardashain are widely respected as role models is diseased I'd agree with you.

stevedoc wrote:

JeanClaude Van Damme wrote:Any culture that tells their children that athletes are role models is diseased.

Why? To be a great athlete you need dedication determination and lots of training just as you do in real life the exact same things that make a great doctor or barrister

Dedication and a good pharmacist.

Professional athletes should become role models for what they do off the field. Too many are scumbags. Being a winner doesn't change that.

ReggieDiggs wrote:

JeanClaude Van Damme wrote:Any culture that tells their children that athletes are role models is diseased.

Idk about this, as a child I think many people are your role models for different reasons. Now if you said any culture where Paris Hilton & Kim Kardashain are widely respected as role models is diseased I'd agree with you.

Athletes wife those nasty skanks.