BoxRec

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

crusader wrote:So what if Barrera was stopped a grand total of once in his long career? That didn't stop (hahahahah) him from beating Naz and never showing any signs of being hurt in the process.

Hamed's level of opposition didn't come close to MAB's either. When you've fought JMM, Pacquiao x2, and Morales x3 losses are almost sure to happen, and he was clearly wayyyyy past his best when he fought Khan.

The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

Pacquiao stopped Barrera too so Khan wasn't the only stoppage.

Khan won on points. I remember that daft John Coyle somehow gave him a 10-8 round.

Eh? Barrera was stopped on a cut

Is the world going mad

The fight was stopped on a cut then went to the cards.

Jesus no I'm going mad.

But pacquiao did stop MAB.

crusader wrote:The fight was stopped on a cut then went to the cards.

Yes it was a technical decision officially.

Counter-puncher wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

crusader wrote:So what if Barrera was stopped a grand total of once in his long career? That didn't stop (hahahahah) him from beating Naz and never showing any signs of being hurt in the process.

Hamed's level of opposition didn't come close to MAB's either. When you've fought JMM, Pacquiao x2, and Morales x3 losses are almost sure to happen, and he was clearly wayyyyy past his best when he fought Khan.

The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

Pacquiao stopped Barrera too so Khan wasn't the only stoppage.

Whoopsie!

hamed was the real deal. so was barrera. they were chalk and cheese , but youve got to say that hamed threw his talent and atg potential away. poor discipline and immaturity isnt good for a long and successful career in boxing.

Didn't Barrera get battered by Junior Jones but for some reason Jones won by DQ?

jimcook wrote:hamed was the real deal. so was barrera. they were chalk and cheese , but youve got to say that hamed threw his talent and atg potential away. poor discipline and immaturity isnt good for a long and successful career in boxing.

I think Barerra was mentally tougher, he was prepared to put in the work necessary to maximise his talent.

Hamed probably had more natural talent, but his reaction after losing to Barrera said it all, he popped like a bubble, and after one poor comeback, retired. Hamed was not prepared for defeat, in the words of Mr Han.

"We are all ready to win Mr Hamed, just as we are born, knowing only life - it is defeat that you must learn to prepare for."

Like many great punchers, Naz won a world title then stopped doing all the good technical things that enabled him to arrive on the scene so impressively. As with Julian Jackson, Mike Tyson, Dwight Muhammad Qawi, and plenty more, he had a brilliant short prime, won some high profile fights, but became a much more one dimensional puncher and far easier to hit.


I disliked him at the time, actually picked Barrera to beat him - albeit not in the manner that MAB ended up doing so.

Counter-puncher wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

crusader wrote:So what if Barrera was stopped a grand total of once in his long career? That didn't stop (hahahahah) him from beating Naz and never showing any signs of being hurt in the process.

Hamed's level of opposition didn't come close to MAB's either. When you've fought JMM, Pacquiao x2, and Morales x3 losses are almost sure to happen, and he was clearly wayyyyy past his best when he fought Khan.

The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

Pacquiao stopped Barrera too so Khan wasn't the only stoppage.

Khan was not classed as a stoppage, as it was a head clash, so it went to the score cards, where Khan was way in front and won on points.

Anzi wrote:

Counter-puncher wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

Pacquiao stopped Barrera too so Khan wasn't the only stoppage.

Khan was not classed as a stoppage, as it was a head clash, so it went to the score cards, where Khan was way in front and won on points.

Yeah the officiating for that one stank to be honest. Should have either been a NC, or let Barrera continue. Somehow the bleeding was not serious enough at the end of round 3, yet precisely the same cut and same bleeding, was enough to stop it at the end of round 4 (I think it was), thus it becoming a technical decision rather than a no contest.

I'd have been interested to see what happened if Barrera hadn't got cut.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

crusader wrote:So what if Barrera was stopped a grand total of once in his long career? That didn't stop (hahahahah) him from beating Naz and never showing any signs of being hurt in the process.

Hamed's level of opposition didn't come close to MAB's either. When you've fought JMM, Pacquiao x2, and Morales x3 losses are almost sure to happen, and he was clearly wayyyyy past his best when he fought Khan.

The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

He was not stopped on cuts, it went to points, through a head clash. You only get stopped if it was caused by a punch.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote:

Counter-puncher wrote:
Pacquiao stopped Barrera too so Khan wasn't the only stoppage.

Khan was not classed as a stoppage, as it was a head clash, so it went to the score cards, where Khan was way in front and won on points.

Yeah the officiating for that one stank to be honest. Should have either been a NC, or let Barrera continue. Somehow the bleeding was not serious enough at the end of round 3, yet precisely the same cut and same bleeding, was enough to stop it at the end of round 4 (I think it was), thus it becoming a technical decision rather than a no contest.

I'd have been interested to see what happened if Barrera hadn't got cut.

It was going into his eyes, he could not see well, of cause it had to be stopped.

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

crusader wrote:So what if Barrera was stopped a grand total of once in his long career? That didn't stop (hahahahah) him from beating Naz and never showing any signs of being hurt in the process.

Hamed's level of opposition didn't come close to MAB's either. When you've fought JMM, Pacquiao x2, and Morales x3 losses are almost sure to happen, and he was clearly wayyyyy past his best when he fought Khan.

The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

He was not stopped on cuts, it went to points, through a head clash. You only get stopped if it was caused by a punch.

The fight was stopped on the doctor's advice, as the cut was due to a clash of heads, it then goes to the scorecards, if more than 4 rounds are completed. If he was stopped on cuts from a punch, that would be a TKO, rather than a TD.

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote: Khan was not classed as a stoppage, as it was a head clash, so it went to the score cards, where Khan was way in front and won on points.

Yeah the officiating for that one stank to be honest. Should have either been a NC, or let Barrera continue. Somehow the bleeding was not serious enough at the end of round 3, yet precisely the same cut and same bleeding, was enough to stop it at the end of round 4 (I think it was), thus it becoming a technical decision rather than a no contest.

I'd have been interested to see what happened if Barrera hadn't got cut.

It was going into his eyes, he could not see well, of cause it had to be stopped.

It was also going into his eyes in round 2, and 3. The difference was if they stopped the fight then, it would have been a no contest.

Some points worth making, in and against Naz's favour:

Regarding Naz facing smaller or older. Naz himself moved up from super bantam so he could have the title shot. And if they were older, look at it from the POV of the talent pool that Bungu, Johnson, Kelley, Vazquez, were coming from. Just look at the number of championship fights and rounds they'd had. Even the guys he beat less impressively, Soto, McCullough and Medina were all either coming off a big win or extremely seasoned and world class.

The UK was an outstanding time for featherweight boxing and Naz was the top man. Around this time we had McMillan, Hodkinson, Davison, Ingle, Brodie. Nothing to take for granted being the best of this era. But for Naz to take on top names from Mexico, Puerto Rico, South Africa, and America as well, in quick succession, often against guys at the time holding championships, is rare for a fighter from these shores.

Naz didn't have great prep for MAB; Steve Robinson didn't have ideal prep for Hamed.

Naz had a prime, then like many fighters, went downhill and flopped dramatically with no way back. Unlike someone of Barrera's caliber, who can keep adding to their game. It's interesting Naz chided Barrera for being unable to avoid right hands versus Junior Jones. Then Barrera skilled up, and executed a brilliant plan to outbox Hamed. Who cares about the "prime for prime" nonsense? This is schoolboy talk. It happens when it happens. Even in a Marvel comic book, circumstances and timing will have an effect upon the outcome of a big rumble!

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
Yeah the officiating for that one stank to be honest. Should have either been a NC, or let Barrera continue. Somehow the bleeding was not serious enough at the end of round 3, yet precisely the same cut and same bleeding, was enough to stop it at the end of round 4 (I think it was), thus it becoming a technical decision rather than a no contest.

I'd have been interested to see what happened if Barrera hadn't got cut.

It was going into his eyes, he could not see well, of cause it had to be stopped.

It was also going into his eyes in round 2, and 3. The difference was if they stopped the fight then, it would have been a no contest.

They have to give the corner time to fix it and it got worse.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
The one stoppage on his resume was on cuts too, and Khan never came close to hurting him, despite Barrera being way past it.

I just don't see any version of Naz beating Barrera, he was too good for him.

He was not stopped on cuts, it went to points, through a head clash. You only get stopped if it was caused by a punch.

The fight was stopped on the doctor's advice, as the cut was due to a clash of heads, it then goes to the scorecards, if more than 4 rounds are completed. If he was stopped on cuts from a punch, that would be a TKO, rather than a TD.

You said he had been stopped on his record ?

Autobarn wrote:Some points worth making, in and against Naz's favour:

Regarding Naz facing smaller or older. Naz himself moved up from super bantam so he could have the title shot. And if they were older, look at it from the POV of the talent pool that Bungu, Johnson, Kelley, Vazquez, were coming from. Just look at the number of championship fights and rounds they'd had. Even the guys he beat less impressively, Soto, McCullough and Medina were all either coming off a big win or extremely seasoned and world class.

The UK was an outstanding time for featherweight boxing and Naz was the top man. Around this time we had McMillan, Hodkinson, Davison, Ingle, Brodie. Nothing to take for granted being the best of this era. But for Naz to take on top names from Mexico, Puerto Rico, South Africa, and America as well, in quick succession, often against guys at the time holding championships, is rare for a fighter from these shores.

Naz didn't have great prep for MAB; Steve Robinson didn't have ideal prep for Hamed.

Naz had a prime, then like many fighters, went downhill and flopped dramatically with no way back. Unlike someone of Barrera's caliber, who can keep adding to their game. It's interesting Naz chided Barrera for being unable to avoid right hands versus Junior Jones. Then Barrera skilled up, and executed a brilliant plan to outbox Hamed. Who cares about the "prime for prime" nonsense? This is schoolboy talk. It happens when it happens. Even in a Marvel comic book, circumstances and timing will have an effect upon the outcome of a big rumble!

Well said mate and very true.

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote:He was not stopped on cuts, it went to points, through a head clash. You only get stopped if it was caused by a punch.

The fight was stopped on the doctor's advice, as the cut was due to a clash of heads, it then goes to the scorecards, if more than 4 rounds are completed. If he was stopped on cuts from a punch, that would be a TKO, rather than a TD.

You said he had been stopped on his record ?

The fight was stopped, due to a cut, and taken to the scorecards. Do you have some sort of mental deficiency. Do you not know what the term 'stopped' means?

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote:It was going into his eyes, he could not see well, of cause it had to be stopped.

It was also going into his eyes in round 2, and 3. The difference was if they stopped the fight then, it would have been a no contest.

They have to give the corner time to fix it and it got worse.

Horseshite. He bled like a stuck pig from the moment the cut happened. If you can't see that they were letting it go to the scorecards, you must be mad or naïve.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Anzi wrote:

jamesmcdonnell wrote:
It was also going into his eyes in round 2, and 3. The difference was if they stopped the fight then, it would have been a no contest.

They have to give the corner time to fix it and it got worse.

Horseshite. He bled like a stuck pig from the moment the cut happened. If you can't see that they were letting it go to the scorecards, you must be mad or naïve.

no you don't understand the boxing industry, the ref should give the corner the chance to fix it, one of my fighters had a cut and it was stopped to early, I did not get the chance to fix it, afterwards the Doctor and the ref got some stick, from people there.

banjo wrote:Didn't Barrera get battered by Junior Jones but for some reason Jones won by DQ?

He was face down on the floor, clearly not in a position to continue and his trainer jumped into the ring throwing a wet sponge about. Got him DQ'd as a result.

Rematch he lost again but on points.

It's probably why Hamed thought he would win fairly easily. Jones was known as a chinny banger who couldn't take it so when MAB didn't bang him out he probably underestimated his power/abilities.