BoxRec

crusader wrote:'That punch would've dropped anyone/fighter x' reasoning is often based largely on the reaction of the fighter who actually took the shot, but that calls into question their own durability.

Whyte is nothing more than a solid puncher and the shot didn't look particularly impressive to me. Del took loads of clean punches from him without being wobbled like AJ was...

I don't think anyone claimed the shot would have dropped anyone. But I'd be amazed if it didn't drop Wlad.

Boxerbeetle wrote:

crusader wrote:'That punch would've dropped anyone/fighter x' reasoning is often based largely on the reaction of the fighter who actually took the shot, but that calls into question their own durability.

Whyte is nothing more than a solid puncher and the shot didn't look particularly impressive to me. Del took loads of clean punches from him without being wobbled like AJ was...

I don't think anyone claimed the shot would have dropped anyone. But I'd be amazed if it didn't drop Wlad.

I'm not sure. I could see Wlad holding, fiddling, buying time.... it wasn't the perfect shot.

Boxerbeetle wrote:

crusader wrote:'That punch would've dropped anyone/fighter x' reasoning is often based largely on the reaction of the fighter who actually took the shot, but that calls into question their own durability.

Whyte is nothing more than a solid puncher and the shot didn't look particularly impressive to me. Del took loads of clean punches from him without being wobbled like AJ was...

I don't think anyone claimed the shot would have dropped anyone. But I'd be amazed if it didn't drop Wlad.

Wlad, the 'fighter x' in the scenario.

What was so good about the shot? Are you mainly rating it on the fact that AJ was hurt? It wouldn't surprise me at all if Wlad just got rocked and held, rather than going down.

crusader wrote:

Boxerbeetle wrote:

crusader wrote:'That punch would've dropped anyone/fighter x' reasoning is often based largely on the reaction of the fighter who actually took the shot, but that calls into question their own durability.

Whyte is nothing more than a solid puncher and the shot didn't look particularly impressive to me. Del took loads of clean punches from him without being wobbled like AJ was...

I don't think anyone claimed the shot would have dropped anyone. But I'd be amazed if it didn't drop Wlad.

Wlad, the 'fighter x' in the scenario.

What was so good about the shot? Are you mainly rating it on the fact that AJ was hurt? It wouldn't surprise me at all if Wlad just got rocked and held, rather than going down.

No, mainly rating it on the fact that Wlad's chin is awful.

Do you think any landed power shot from Whyte would fold him?

How do you separate the effect the shot had from AJ's own durability? It didn't look like a special punch to me, and IMO it's hardly clear that Wlad would go down from it.

Boxerbeetle wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:

Boxerbeetle wrote:
Well I thought it was obvious - what's confusing you?

Uhm, what does any of that have to do with AJ's chin though? Just because a former champion with a notoriously shite chin may go down from the shot means nothing.

It does when he's fighting the guy we're talking about

So they both have sub par chins, Wlads may be the weaker, we all know that. Your context is fcking stupid and has no relevance to anything.

tobyh5 wrote:

Boxerbeetle wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:
Uhm, what does any of that have to do with AJ's chin though? Just because a former champion with a notoriously shite chin may go down from the shot means nothing.

It does when he's fighting the guy we're talking about

So they both have sub par chins, Wlads may be the weaker, we all know that. Your context is fcking stupid and has no relevance to anything.

You sound like a fun guy.

tobyh5 wrote:

Boxerbeetle wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:
Uhm, what does any of that have to do with AJ's chin though? Just because a former champion with a notoriously shite chin may go down from the shot means nothing.

It does when he's fighting the guy we're talking about

So they both have sub par chins, Wlads may be the weaker, we all know that. Your context is fcking stupid and has no relevance to anything.

Toby, man, you're being all needlessly abrasive and vehement and irascible again, WTF gets into you, you can't even say it's roid-rage can you man it's not like you do it all the time but fvck me sometimes you don't half act like a dick.

Counter-puncher wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:

Boxerbeetle wrote:
It does when he's fighting the guy we're talking about

So they both have sub par chins, Wlads may be the weaker, we all know that. Your context is fcking stupid and has no relevance to anything.

Toby, man, you're being all needlessly abrasive and vehement and irascible again, WTF gets into you, you can't even say it's roid-rage can you man it's not like you do it all the time but fvck me sometimes you don't half act like a dick.

I guess
tone of voice is not transferable on the keyboard as it was not abrasive in my mind. However if read that way, which i sure can see how it can and would be, I apologise.

tobyh5 wrote:

Counter-puncher wrote:

tobyh5 wrote:
So they both have sub par chins, Wlads may be the weaker, we all know that. Your context is fcking stupid and has no relevance to anything.

Toby, man, you're being all needlessly abrasive and vehement and irascible again, WTF gets into you, you can't even say it's roid-rage can you man it's not like you do it all the time but fvck me sometimes you don't half act like a dick.

I guess
tone of voice is not transferable on the keyboard as it was not abrasive in my mind. However if read that way, which i sure can see how it can and would be, I apologise.

Get a hotel lovers and make it up doggy style!

crusader wrote:'That punch would've dropped anyone/fighter x' reasoning is often based largely on the reaction of the fighter who actually took the shot, but that calls into question their own durability.

Whyte is nothing more than a solid puncher and the shot didn't look particularly impressive to me. Del took loads of clean punches from him without being wobbled like AJ was...

I also don't think that Whyte punch had AJ in that much trouble, it didn't take him that long to recover. He wobbled, without doubt, but it was not a show-stopping punch.

AJ was clearly hurt, but it's not like he was nearly out of the there.

Wlad got tagged by a flush overhand right from Haye in the 12th round of their fight, and he clinched and then looked fine a few seconds later. I'm not sure what was so much better about the shot from Whyte, who isn't the puncher Haye was. Again, it seems to me like people are just rating that punch based on how AJ reacted (rocked but not massively so), but that's a matter of his durability and not Wlad's.

I think they both have more than enough power to hurt the other, but Wlad is past it and can't pull the trigger nearly as well anymore. I expect AJ to overwhelm the old guy in the first 4 or so.

I can't stop singing "When Wlad Lands Clean" to the tune of the ABC's 1987 hit 'When Smokey Sings." It gives it a really joyful feel.

When Wlad lands cleeeeeeeeaaaaan. . .

Not sure what the rhyme would be. Following ABC's template I suppose it would be something along the lines of "Camp Eddie hears violins"?

Yes it's a quiet Thursday morning.

AJ becomes the bully. Wlad is shot. Hasn't thrown a punch in 2 years (you can take out the Fury "fight"). After years of negative jab and hold, double step back don't engage, boxing why all of a sudden at 41 years old is he going to change his spots and be this aggressive, positive, head hunter?
I just cannot see it - AJ too big, too fast, too powerful, too mean.
#obsessed doesn't make it so.

Bit of cat and mouse in the early rounds but AJ catches up with him for stoppage round 6-8.

Tuan_Jim wrote:I can't stop singing "When Wlad Lands Clean" to the tune of the ABC's 1987 hit 'When Smokey Sings." It gives it a really joyful feel.

When Wlad lands cleeeeeeeeaaaaan. . .

Not sure what the rhyme would be. Following ABC's template I suppose it would be something along the lines of "Camp Eddie hears violins"?

Yes it's a quiet Thursday morning.

I prefer to sing it to when love takes over by Kelly Rowlands

Thejambo wrote:AJ becomes the bully. Wlad is shot. Hasn't thrown a punch in 2 years (you can take out the Fury "fight"). After years of negative jab and hold, double step back don't engage, boxing why all of a sudden at 41 years old is he going to change his spots and be this aggressive, positive, head hunter?
I just cannot see it - AJ too big, too fast, too powerful, too mean.
#obsessed doesn't make it so.

Bit of cat and mouse in the early rounds but AJ catches up with him for stoppage round 6-8.

I don't think Wlad becomes an aggresive, positive head hunter

I think Wlad sticks to his modus operandi and jabs, holds, steps back, controls range with long straight shots and sets traps.
Unlike Fury, Joshua might walk into those traps.

5-10 Years ago I'd have put heavy money on Wlad walking him into lots of jabs and a couple of devastating right hands, while negating much of Joshua's best work with spoiling tactics and cute defensive movement

I'm not sure it will work now though as Wlad is almost certainly over the hill. Which makes the above a bit of a moot point. But at his best he wouldn't have had to go looking for AJ, he could have lured him in and we would have known how well Joshua takes a solid right hand.

On Saturday however, I think once Joshua start feeling confident in there, 41 year old Wlad will go into his shell.

Respect to AJ for taking this. If he wins, Wlad is past it, or he loses. Either way people will still put the boot in. I don't really mind who wins this but am looking forward to the fight. However, if I can get 9/4 on a WK win, it has to be worth a shot. The only outcome I can really see is WK landing clean on him from behind the guard and AJ moonwalking to the canvas.

It will end in a KO

But how much has Wlad got left

If Wlad does land clean, it could well be over. I watched the Whyte shot many times, in HD and slowed it and it wasn't even that great a shot. It hit him high on the jaw, almost by the ear. And Joshua was wobbled and admitted it in dressing room afterwards with his imitation of his own legs going.

There are many stories that Joshua has been down, badly wobbled in sparring. Joe Joyce is the latest rumour.

Joshua usually just overpowers his opponents and his strength and power freak his opponents out. He's quite accurate. But very open to jab and straight rights.

I tell you what this is one fight where no result would surprise me and for once is worth the hype, and I would certainly pay for it. It's rare to get a fight with so many factors to consider and so dangerous to both boxers.

The last time a big fight got me so excited was Fury-Haye (and I'm a cynical old bugger.)

Pretty sure i read a wlad quote where he is going to do a fury to joshua and outbox him and frustrate him. If thats the case he won't be landing many punches let alone throwing them.

I cant see wlad changing his style at his age. I always believed that sportsmen at the top level usually resort to there training which is drilled into them ovwr the years. For 10years he performwd the jab and grab to wear opponents down. He will end up reverting to type.

My gut feeling is that Wlad will not land clean, Joshua will prevent that from happening and land clean first.... I then have a sneaky feeling it will be covered up as a "klitchsko was caught cold" and there will be either a rematch or Klitchsko will get a shot at Wilder / Parker before the year is out.

Matchrooom know of the dodgy chin, and have decided to get another massive HW record breaking title fight on Eddies CV before the train crashes. Losing to a man that dominated for 10 years is nothing to be ashamed of. Wlad, is/was, whatever your opinion, is elite.

Losing to a skinny slugger with bambi legs in Wilder, or a fat 'pikey' in Fury, is not Eddie could handle.

boxingknockout wrote:If Wlad does land clean, it could well be over. I watched the Whyte shot many times, in HD and slowed it and it wasn't even that great a shot. It hit him high on the jaw, almost by the ear. And Joshua was wobbled and admitted it in dressing room afterwards with his imitation of his own legs going.

There are many stories that Joshua has been down, badly wobbled in sparring. Joe Joyce is the latest rumour.

Joshua usually just overpowers his opponents and his strength and power freak his opponents out. He's quite accurate. But very open to jab and straight rights.

I tell you what this is one fight where no result would surprise me and for once is worth the hype, and I would certainly pay for it. It's rare to get a fight with so many factors to consider and so dangerous to both boxers.

The last time a big fight got me so excited was Fury-Haye (and I'm a cynical old bugger.)

I'm with you. Really looking forward to it

boxingknockout wrote:If Wlad does land clean, it could well be over. I watched the Whyte shot many times, in HD and slowed it and it wasn't even that great a shot. It hit him high on the jaw, almost by the ear. And Joshua was wobbled and admitted it in dressing room afterwards with his imitation of his own legs going.

There are many stories that Joshua has been down, badly wobbled in sparring. Joe Joyce is the latest rumour.

Joshua usually just overpowers his opponents and his strength and power freak his opponents out. He's quite accurate. But very open to jab and straight rights.

I tell you what this is one fight where no result would surprise me and for once is worth the hype, and I would certainly pay for it. It's rare to get a fight with so many factors to consider and so dangerous to both boxers.

The last time a big fight got me so excited was Fury-Haye (and I'm a cynical old bugger.)

I've said it once before and I'll say it again, I'm not sure what it is that people have seen from Joshua which makes them feel he'll walk onto anything. He's got a very tight defence.

As far as the punch which Joshua shipped against Whyte goes, you'd be surprised about where he took the punch. I mean that same punch sent Whyte on his way. Taking the punch round the ear/side of the head shakes up the vestibular system to no ends, means you're sure for a wobble!

The one thing I think I worry about, is if Klitschko doesn't become the aggressor. I don't think people realise how much Joshua is a counter fighter. Watch the Martin, Breazeale and Molina fights. How many times does Joshua engage first? Even against the ultra-negative Molina, Joshua just stalked him, and waited for him to engage, then offloaded the counter right. If Klitschko is gun shy, it might be a very cagey start.

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On Saturday however, I think once Joshua start feeling confident in there, 41 year old Wlad will go into his shell.[/quote]

I agree