BoxRec

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

ValMar wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:It's like if I said Germany was a nasty place to be in the late 30's- early 40's and you responded I was there last year and it was lovely.

OK, I claim that Tyson Fury would have been at top ten HW in 1988, and 1998, and 2008. You do not think so, obviously.....I am off topic, again....Sorry.....Tyson Fury is not a part of this thread..........

Ok.

ValMar wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

ValMar wrote:
OK, I claim that Tyson Fury would have been at top ten HW in 1988, and 1998, and 2008. You do not think so, obviously.....I am off topic, again....Sorry.....Tyson Fury is not a part of this thread..........

Ok.

Thinking is not SaadOffTheDeck his forte.

You butchered it.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Fury would have been a punching bag in the late 80's-90's.

The only men I can see doing that would have been either Holyfield, Bowe or Lewis. Mike Tyson may have been just too much on the small side. I can't really see old Foreman and old Holmes doing much, considering Tommy Morrison outboxed George wide, etc. I think Michael Moorer would have also been too small. I think prime Briggs was simply too raw, hell Foreman outboxed him and was robbed. Etc.

When you got a guy nearly seven feet, whose got good speed, whose a switch hitter, and made the most dominate heavyweight since Joe Louis barely land anything... What makes you believe guys 6'2" and 210 pounds going to outbox someone that unorthodox, fast and big? Because most of the guys from the 80s and 90s were the size of cruiserweights today.

It boggles my mind a bit.

I can't envision a scenario where fury lasts 3 minutes with Witherspoon

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I can't envision a scenario where fury lasts 3 minutes with Witherspoon

Spoon was one of the most underrated heavyweights of all time, for sure, but we're also talking about the same Spoon who lost to the likes of Everett Bigfoot Martin, Brian Nielsen and Larry Donald.... There's a reason why Spoon never could keep a title for long..

None of them were tall guys with their heads on a tee.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:None of them were tall guys with their heads on a tee.

Outside of Cunningham... I've seldom ever seen anyone land a flush shot on Furys head, face, chin... When he decisioned KLITSCHKO I don't think anyone currently could ever land on the man... Much less men who were incredibly inconsistent in the 80s and 90s.

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I can't envision a scenario where fury lasts 3 minutes with Witherspoon

Spoon was one of the most underrated heavyweights of all time, for sure, but we're also talking about the same Spoon who lost to the likes of Everett Bigfoot Martin, Brian Nielsen and Larry Donald.... There's a reason why Spoon never could keep a title for long..

Witherspoon was inconsistent, but he almost beat Larry Holmes. Would Fury have been competitive against Holmes in their primes?

RScarf1 wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:I can't envision a scenario where fury lasts 3 minutes with Witherspoon

Spoon was one of the most underrated heavyweights of all time, for sure, but we're also talking about the same Spoon who lost to the likes of Everett Bigfoot Martin, Brian Nielsen and Larry Donald.... There's a reason why Spoon never could keep a title for long..

Witherspoon was inconsistent, but he almost beat Larry Holmes. Would Fury have been competitive against Holmes in their primes?

Holmes I always considered to be probably the greatest heavyweight champion there was. By time Spoon got to Larry, he was starting to lose that luster. But even Larry Holmes could be lazy, doing only just enough to win, and never going completely all out. I think by the time Larry Holmes fought Spoon, he was disinterested. He considered all contenders to be the same ability and worth, so he overlooked Spoon.

As for Tyson Fury against someone like Larry Holmes, itd be a very interesting contest. I think Tyson Fury would try to outbox, and we'd see Holmes being the aggressor (pleasantly) and after a while Fury would be forced into a dog fight with Larry Holmes, and it'd be awesome. I'd lean towards Larry Holmes to edge the decision, but Fury would be competitive because (on the whole) he was everything Gerry Cooney didn't have and desperately needed.

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:None of them were tall guys with their heads on a tee.

Outside of Cunningham... I've seldom ever seen anyone land a flush shot on Furys head, face, chin... When he decisioned KLITSCHKO I don't think anyone currently could ever land on the man... Much less men who were incredibly inconsistent in the 80s and 90s.

He was wide open against wlad. Mike weaver would have flattened him.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:None of them were tall guys with their heads on a tee.

Outside of Cunningham... I've seldom ever seen anyone land a flush shot on Furys head, face, chin... When he decisioned KLITSCHKO I don't think anyone currently could ever land on the man... Much less men who were incredibly inconsistent in the 80s and 90s.

He was wide open against wlad. Mike weaver would have flattened him.

And KLITSCHKO would have flattened Weaver. This whole "woulda shoulda coulda" shit is cute and all Saad but let's be honest here... Weaver was one of the most inconsistent fighters of all time regardless of weight class... Despite all his muscles, he wouldn't have been able to touch KLITSCHKO let alone Fury... I absolutely hate Anthony Joshua, but he'd axe Weaver too. Probably so would Wilder.

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:
Outside of Cunningham... I've seldom ever seen anyone land a flush shot on Furys head, face, chin... When he decisioned KLITSCHKO I don't think anyone currently could ever land on the man... Much less men who were incredibly inconsistent in the 80s and 90s.

He was wide open against wlad. Mike weaver would have flattened him.

And KLITSCHKO would have flattened Weaver. This whole "woulda shoulda coulda" poo is cute and all Saad but let's be honest here... Weaver was one of the most inconsistent fighters of all time regardless of weight class... Despite all his muscles, he wouldn't have been able to touch KLITSCHKO let alone Fury... I absolutely hate Anthony Joshua, but he'd axe Weaver too. Probably so would Wilder.

He would have dropped fury like he shot him.there is nothing cute or honest about pretending fury is Pernell Whitaker. Very tough guy who moves well for his size, absolutely frightfully poor defensively for the too level.

LMFAOOOOO
Kinda hard to substantiate that Saad when Fury accomplished more than Weaver and UNLIKE Weaver actually defeated the undisputed, unbeatable champion of his era.

HomicideHenry wrote:LMFAOOOOO
Kinda hard to substantiate that Saad when Fury accomplished more than Weaver and UNLIKE Weaver actually defeated the undisputed, unbeatable champion of his era.

None of that would matter when mike's left hook crashed into Fury's chin. Laughable you dismiss it entirely. But, you're Rufus, you make people laugh.

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:LMFAOOOOO
Kinda hard to substantiate that Saad when Fury accomplished more than Weaver and UNLIKE Weaver actually defeated the undisputed, unbeatable champion of his era.

None of that would matter when mike's left hook crashed into Fury's chin. Laughable you dismiss it entirely. But, you're Rufus, you make people laugh.

I'm sorry but... There's no way in hell you're going to convince me a man just barely over 6' and 210 pounds, with DOUBLE DIGIT LOSSES... Is going to beat KLITSCHKO, let alone Fury.

gilgamesh wrote:

Heretic wrote:Even Pulev has better resume than Wilder... I would actually even give him decent chance of beating Wilder.

How does Pulev have a better resume than Wilder?

By having beaten Chisora, Thompson, Ustinov and Dimitrenko.

Heck even Walker would be one of the best names on Wilders resume.

Heretic wrote:

gilgamesh wrote:

Heretic wrote:Even Pulev has better resume than Wilder... I would actually even give him decent chance of beating Wilder.

How does Pulev have a better resume than Wilder?

By having beaten Chisora, Thompson, Ustinov and Dimitrenko.

Heck even Walker would be one of the best names on Wilders resume.

Ustinov and Dimitrenko never meant much to begin with. Thompson didn't mean much by the time Pulev got him. Chisora is a solid Top 25-ish type. I hate Wilder, but he's beaten guys that are at least as good as Chisora already, and that's the best win you're mentioning for Pulev there.

I'd say Wilder has a stronger resume, but mainly on depth. I honestly don't think it's clear that he's beaten anyone better than Chisora, or that more than one of his opponents were as good as Chisora.

As for Thompson, he was definitely old, though he did score one of his best wins right before losing to Pulev, and one of his other best wins right after.

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:

HomicideHenry wrote:LMFAOOOOO
Kinda hard to substantiate that Saad when Fury accomplished more than Weaver and UNLIKE Weaver actually defeated the undisputed, unbeatable champion of his era.

None of that would matter when mike's left hook crashed into Fury's chin. Laughable you dismiss it entirely. But, you're Rufus, you make people laugh.

I'm sorry but... There's no way in hell you're going to convince me a man just barely over 6' and 210 pounds, with DOUBLE DIGIT LOSSES... Is going to beat KLITSCHKO, let alone Fury.

Ross purity ring a bell?

HomicideHenry wrote:

SaadOffTheDeck wrote:Fury would have been a punching bag in the late 80's-90's.

The only men I can see doing that would have been either Holyfield, Bowe or Lewis. Mike Tyson may have been just too much on the small side. I can't really see old Foreman and old Holmes doing much, considering Tommy Morrison outboxed George wide, etc. I think Michael Moorer would have also been too small. I think prime Briggs was simply too raw, hell Foreman outboxed him and was robbed. Etc.

When you got a guy nearly seven feet, whose got good speed, whose a switch hitter, and made the most dominate heavyweight since Joe Louis barely land anything... What makes you believe guys 6'2" and 210 pounds going to outbox someone that unorthodox, fast and big? Because most of the guys from the 80s and 90s were the size of cruiserweights today.

It boggles my mind a bit.

You are on the right tracks here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yb9PU0x79_8

Here you can see what is the problem you face when the opponent has too much size on you.

Cunningham is 190 cm (6′ 3″ for people still stuck in the stone age) and he looks like child next to Fury.

Not that I said weaver would beat wlad, he'd definitely have a punchers chance. Early wlad would likely stop him early, like weaver would do to fury. I would never try to convince you of anything. You quoted me, we're talking, I'm right.

The fact that there are people convinced of Fury's greatness sickens me. I wouldn't pick that sack of sh*t to beat any noteworthy Heavyweight of any era. Including this one.

He happened to be in the ring the night Wlad decided he was tired of defending his title. That's all he ever did, and then he proceeded to become a giant fatass, and quit Boxing robbing us of the chance to see him knocked on his sorry ass. F*ck Tyson Fury. He would've lost the rematch to Wlad, and he knows it, that's why he never fought again.

gilgamesh wrote:

Heretic wrote:

gilgamesh wrote:
How does Pulev have a better resume than Wilder?

By having beaten Chisora, Thompson, Ustinov and Dimitrenko.

Heck even Walker would be one of the best names on Wilders resume.

Ustinov and Dimitrenko never meant much to begin with. Thompson didn't mean much by the time Pulev got him. Chisora is a solid Top 25-ish type. I hate Wilder, but he's beaten guys that are at least as good as Chisora already, and that's the best win you're mentioning for Pulev there.

Well Thompson was only beat by Wlad at that point (Not counting the kirkland loss here) and he still had enough in the tank to derail Price and Solis.

I would pick Chisora and the Thompson from Pulev fight to beat everyone of Wilders opponents. Well Stiverne and Chisora would be quite even. Styles makes fights and all that...

Dimitrenko is on the same level as Duhaupas, Szpilka and Scott.

Ustinov is hard to judge... Huge guy that did pretty well in kickboxing. Only loss is against Pulev. Hard to say how he would have done against Wilders opponents.

Stiverne is only one that I consider as somehow worthy challenger for one of those paper titles.

Ustinov is easy to judge. He's a slow, plodding, light hitting big man. Not good.