BoxRec

how many opponents has wilder starched out cold? szpilka and stiverne on the second try? joshua starched whyte id say and has dropped/hurt pretty much everyone he hits.

and btw wilder, while a great puncher, i dont think punches as hard as you think. are you actually going by evidence mate? in another thread you said as soon as wilders right lands its over, yet look at all the opponents who got hit yet still went rounds. and duhaupas and stiverne the first time got hit with tons but didnt even get dropped. and chinny molina kept getting back up till the 10th yet was a 3 round job for aj. and like ortiz molina got up to hurt wilder, not like he was immediately done

wilders the better puncher i think but lets not get out of control with him having some type of instant death touch or something. i think they both have plenty to hurt the other

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 02:30 Their punching power isn't close

Joshua needs referee stoppages against punch bags, wilder starches them cold. Bruno did the same vs punch bags. He hit harder than Joshua too.

Takam was a referee stoppage I grant you but not too sure of the rest. Wlad never seemed to have any issue with his stoppage, he'd been down twice and shipped a massive uppercut. Pretty sure Joshua did starch Whyte pretty cold.

They're both big punchers obviously and could easily have anyone in massive bother. No point pretending otherwise so to pretend one is inherently more powerful to any great extent stinks of bias.

and duhaupas was a 100 percent standing stoppage too, unlike takam he was never even dropped, and he took loads of flush shots for 10 + rounds. funny enough both takam and duhaup were stopped far harder by povetkin

ya i think they both have more then enough pop to hurt each other

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 02:30 Their punching power isn't close

Joshua needs referee stoppages against punch bags, wilder starches them cold. Bruno did the same vs punch bags. He hit harder than Joshua too.

Does he? Not at a decent level he doesn't. Didn't starch Ortiz, didn't starch duhappas.

nitro5912 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:05

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 02:30 Their punching power isn't close

Joshua needs referee stoppages against punch bags, wilder starches them cold. Bruno did the same vs punch bags. He hit harder than Joshua too.

Does he? Not at a decent level he doesn't. Didn't starch Ortiz, didn't starch duhappas.

Wilder has put people to sleep in the ring. Bruno also put people to sleep. I'm talking about having someone kipping on the canvas. Wilder and Bruno did that to their punch bags. Joshua needed referee stoppages. Its ridiculous to say he hits as hard as Bruno or wilder. That doesn't mean he can't KO wilder of course. But to say his power is on par just isn't realistic I'm afraid.

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:28

nitro5912 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:05

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 02:30 Their punching power isn't close

Joshua needs referee stoppages against punch bags, wilder starches them cold. Bruno did the same vs punch bags. He hit harder than Joshua too.

Does he? Not at a decent level he doesn't. Didn't starch Ortiz, didn't starch duhappas.

Wilder has put people to sleep in the ring. Bruno also put people to sleep. I'm talking about having someone kipping on the canvas. Wilder and Bruno did that to their punch bags. Joshua needed referee stoppages. Its ridiculous to say he hits as hard as Bruno or wilder. That doesn't mean he can't KO wilder of course. But to say his power is on par just isn't realistic I'm afraid.

What sort of referee stoppage did Whyte get? From memory he was out of it, half draped over a rope with no chance of getting up if the count was a full minute.

If Wilder hit as hard as you suggest you think he'd be doing it a lot more often.

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:28

nitro5912 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:05

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 02:30 Their punching power isn't close

Joshua needs referee stoppages against punch bags, wilder starches them cold. Bruno did the same vs punch bags. He hit harder than Joshua too.

Does he? Not at a decent level he doesn't. Didn't starch Ortiz, didn't starch duhappas.

Wilder has put people to sleep in the ring. Bruno also put people to sleep. I'm talking about having someone kipping on the canvas. Wilder and Bruno did that to their punch bags. Joshua needed referee stoppages. Its ridiculous to say he hits as hard as Bruno or wilder. That doesn't mean he can't KO wilder of course. But to say his power is on par just isn't realistic I'm afraid.

But who has wilder done that to that is on par with Whyte?

Wilder has starched punch bags, well done, AJ stopped all his lunch bags. Maybe not put them to sleep, but they weren't fit to continue.

Wilder has the edge in power no doubt, but you make out that AJ is feather fisted.

This fight will come down to not who lands first because many top level fighters eat both guys punches,wilder has lots of late stoppages but who boxes with the best defence.

I think AJ does that better.

dirk2686 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:43

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:28

nitro5912 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:05

Does he? Not at a decent level he doesn't. Didn't starch Ortiz, didn't starch duhappas.

Wilder has put people to sleep in the ring. Bruno also put people to sleep. I'm talking about having someone kipping on the canvas. Wilder and Bruno did that to their punch bags. Joshua needed referee stoppages. Its ridiculous to say he hits as hard as Bruno or wilder. That doesn't mean he can't KO wilder of course. But to say his power is on par just isn't realistic I'm afraid.

What sort of referee stoppage did Whyte get? From memory he was out of it, half draped over a rope with no chance of getting up if the count was a full minute.

If Wilder hit as hard as you suggest you think he'd be doing it a lot more often.

If you look at Wilder's and Bruno's early fights, there is a huge difference between their stoppages and Joshua's. Its pretty clear. Look up their highlight kos on YouTube.

Obviously Joshua can still beat Wilder. Wilder has more 1 punch power and I believe Joshua will be on queer street if he takes one. Bruno and joshua both look like they would benefit from oil being applied to their joints in the ring. Wilder may go from a clean shot but for me I think wilder is far more dangerous with one punch and I think he will clip joshua, who will go down heavily from a clean shot as we saw vs wlad. Joshuas stamina for me is another concern along with him being unable to understand the term "head movement". Wilder has his limitations and an early Joshua stoppage wouldn't surprise me either but I really can't see Joshua avoiding the right hand from wilder for too long.

dirk2686 wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 14:44

fightfaninfrance wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 14:43 Genuine question. Will AJ get a visa? Martin Murray never fought in US due visa issues and a few others.

I’m not comparing Murray and AJ just an example.

I hope he goes over there as common sense prevails. He’d really light it up over there with a big KO win. He has the star factor they’ll love

Why wouldn't he?

Criminal record relating to drugs, I assume.

J-C wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:54

dirk2686 wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 14:44

fightfaninfrance wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 14:43 Genuine question. Will AJ get a visa? Martin Murray never fought in US due visa issues and a few others.

I’m not comparing Murray and AJ just an example.

I hope he goes over there as common sense prevails. He’d really light it up over there with a big KO win. He has the star factor they’ll love

Why wouldn't he?

Criminal record relating to drugs

He didn't even get a suspended sentence. Community order for carrying eight ounces of cannabis. It's hardly like he's importing heroin. He'll be fine.

dirk2686 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:57

J-C wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:54

dirk2686 wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 14:44

Why wouldn't he?

Criminal record relating to drugs

He didn't even get a suspended sentence. Community order for carrying eight ounces of cannabis. It's hardly like he's importing heroin. He'll be fine.

Good to know. I'd actually like the fight in America,

nitro5912 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:46

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:28

nitro5912 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:05

Does he? Not at a decent level he doesn't. Didn't starch Ortiz, didn't starch duhappas.

Wilder has put people to sleep in the ring. Bruno also put people to sleep. I'm talking about having someone kipping on the canvas. Wilder and Bruno did that to their punch bags. Joshua needed referee stoppages. Its ridiculous to say he hits as hard as Bruno or wilder. That doesn't mean he can't KO wilder of course. But to say his power is on par just isn't realistic I'm afraid.

But who has wilder done that to that is on par with Whyte?

Wilder has starched punch bags, well done, AJ stopped all his lunch bags. Maybe not put them to sleep, but they weren't fit to continue.

Wilder has the edge in power no doubt, but you make out that AJ is feather fisted.

This fight will come down to not who lands first because many top level fighters eat both guys punches,wilder has lots of late stoppages but who boxes with the best defence.

I think AJ does that better.

I don't really rate whyte myself. Went life and death with a used up chisora and looked novicey and out of shape vs Joshua. Still managed to have him on queer street in the second round. I doubt he can beat guys like duahaupas, povetkin, baby miller, pulev etc.

I wouldn't say AJ is better defensively. He blocks the left hook well but looks open straight punches down the middle. Wilder uses his legs mainly for defence along with keeping his right hand cocked and certainly looks to have more fluidity to his movement overall. Joshua movement looks like he needs to be serviced at the car garage at times.

My pick in the fight would be a wilder KO win but I don't think its a certainty either way. I think Joshua's left hook is the punch that could land on wilder pretty effectively. He gets good extension on that and he can kind of reach with it so I think wilder might get surprised by that. I've seen Joshua throw the right to the body and leap in with that left hook, that's how I see him getting to wilder.

I'm not really sure what the difference between early stoppages means. Wilder was able to build up a list of stoppages like this because he was fighting eight round no hope jobs at the stage when Joshua was fighting Wladimir Klitschko.

The geuinely big fights take place in the US. Joshua aside, and to easily refute my claim, just name all the massive, competitive fights that have taken place in the UK and explain why Floyd "MONEY" Mayweather hasn't legged it over here to tap into the UK's massive cash potential.

Metal Fingers wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:33 The geuinely big fights take place in the US. Joshua aside, and to easily refute my claim, just name all the massive, competitive fights that have taken place in the UK and explain why Floyd "MONEY" Mayweather hasn't legged it over here to tap into the UK's massive cash potential.

Because Floyd earned a fortune in the US. Wilder doesn't. He earns about ten percent of Joshua does at best.

KiwiRider wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 19:50 The PPV will bring in most of the money. And Joshua sells PPV around the world. So maybe the UK and USA will bring the lions share of buys, but there is a whole fan base outside of that as well.
I'm guessing here;
USA $80
UK £40
Rest of the world £35-40
Soon adds up.
The only shame is going to be the ticket prices if it is in the US. Joshua has been selling affordable tickets in the UK (even if you need oxygen at those heights) giving average income fans a chance at the spectacle. This will be a wealthy persons fight to be at, and that's a bit of a shame really.

Eddie and stubhub have been selling £40 tickets for £200 for O2 fights for years. These will actually work out cheaper.

Metal Fingers wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:33 The geuinely big fights take place in the US. Joshua aside, and to easily refute my claim, just name all the massive, competitive fights that have taken place in the UK and explain why Floyd "MONEY" Mayweather hasn't legged it over here to tap into the UK's massive cash potential.

There is always more money in the US. This will be Wilders first PPV and the way they market this fight, its sure to sell well.

Two unbeaten heavyweights fighting for all the marbles.
Combined record of something like 70-0 (68KOs)
American trying to bring all the belts home
Trash talk in the lead up by both, Joshua won't be getting in Wilders grill pre-fight like he did vs Breazeale though

Wilders done 1 million viewers in his last few fights and they got to see him call out Joshua. Anyone who has watched Wilders last two fights would definitely be interested in watching Wilder vs Joshua. They can do more buys with the right marketing.

***No need for chartered accountants to reply.

mickey1975 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:42

KiwiRider wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 19:50 The PPV will bring in most of the money. And Joshua sells PPV around the world. So maybe the UK and USA will bring the lions share of buys, but there is a whole fan base outside of that as well.
I'm guessing here;
USA $80
UK £40
Rest of the world £35-40
Soon adds up.
The only shame is going to be the ticket prices if it is in the US. Joshua has been selling affordable tickets in the UK (even if you need oxygen at those heights) giving average income fans a chance at the spectacle. This will be a wealthy persons fight to be at, and that's a bit of a shame really.

Eddie and stubhub have been selling £40 tickets for £200 for O2 fights for years. These will actually work out cheaper.

Oh, I didn't know that.
I just see them on line and wistfully think: that's good value £40 for the atmos and stuff, wish I could go

dirk2686 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:57

J-C wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 03:54

dirk2686 wrote: ↑17 May 2018, 14:44

Why wouldn't he?

Criminal record relating to drugs

He didn't even get a suspended sentence. Community order for carrying eight ounces of cannabis. It's hardly like he's importing heroin. He'll be fine.

Cheers Dirk!

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:43

Metal Fingers wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:33 The geuinely big fights take place in the US. Joshua aside, and to easily refute my claim, just name all the massive, competitive fights that have taken place in the UK and explain why Floyd "MONEY" Mayweather hasn't legged it over here to tap into the UK's massive cash potential.

There is always more money in the US. This will be Wilders first PPV and the way they market this fight, its sure to sell well.

Two unbeaten heavyweights fighting for all the marbles.
Combined record of something like 70-0 (68KOs)
American trying to bring all the belts home
Trash talk in the lead up by both, Joshua won't be getting in Wilders grill pre-fight like he did vs Breazeale though

Wilders done 1 million viewers in his last few fights and they got to see him call out Joshua. Anyone who has watched Wilders last two fights would definitely be interested in watching Wilder vs Joshua. They can do more buys with the right marketing.

***No need for chartered accountants to reply.

I think the point is that free to air television and so on can give very artificial figures about a fighter's popularity.

Hughie Fury fought in front of a bigger audience on Channel 5 than Hatton and Mayweather did when they fought on Sky Box Office in one of the biggest fights involving a British fighter ever. But plainly nobody would say that Hughie Fury was more popular than Ricky Hatton. (Except possibly Mick.)

The reality is that measuring Wilder's popularity as someone who people are willing to pay a considerable amount of money to watch against a guy essentially unknown to the American general public is difficult if all you are measuring it against is a non-PPV audience.

This could ruin AJ in America. He’s obviously going to fight scared. He was very wary of Parker. No point in selling him as a killer then McCracken has him jabbing for 12. No way will he trade. He dodged a bullet with Wlad, they know it. Wilder would be all over him.

dirk2686 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 05:03

TheLeprechaun wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:43

Metal Fingers wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 04:33 The geuinely big fights take place in the US. Joshua aside, and to easily refute my claim, just name all the massive, competitive fights that have taken place in the UK and explain why Floyd "MONEY" Mayweather hasn't legged it over here to tap into the UK's massive cash potential.

There is always more money in the US. This will be Wilders first PPV and the way they market this fight, its sure to sell well.

Two unbeaten heavyweights fighting for all the marbles.
Combined record of something like 70-0 (68KOs)
American trying to bring all the belts home
Trash talk in the lead up by both, Joshua won't be getting in Wilders grill pre-fight like he did vs Breazeale though

Wilders done 1 million viewers in his last few fights and they got to see him call out Joshua. Anyone who has watched Wilders last two fights would definitely be interested in watching Wilder vs Joshua. They can do more buys with the right marketing.

***No need for chartered accountants to reply.

I think the point is that free to air television and so on can give very artificial figures about a fighter's popularity.

Hughie Fury fought in front of a bigger audience on Channel 5 than Hatton and Mayweather did when they fought on Sky Box Office in one of the biggest fights involving a British fighter ever. But plainly nobody would say that Hughie Fury was more popular than Ricky Hatton. (Except possibly Mick.)

The reality is that measuring Wilder's popularity as someone who people are willing to pay a considerable amount of money to watch against a guy essentially unknown to the American general public is difficult if all you are measuring it against is a non-PPV audience.

You mentioned the F word! Your stats will be on the rise again. Seek help, Dork.

mickey1975 wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 05:19 This could ruin AJ in America. He’s obviously going to fight scared. He was very wary of Parker. No point in selling him as a killer then McCracken has him jabbing for 12. No way will he trade. He dodged a bullet with Wlad, they know it. Wilder would be all over him.

Good to see you making stuff up again Mick.

It wasn't long ago posters were scoffing in chorus at even the possibility the fight could be held in the US. The list of reasons why it couldn't, shouldn't and just won't was absolutely endless.

Like a Boss wrote: ↑18 May 2018, 05:25 It wasn't long ago posters were scoffing in chorus at even the possibility the fight could be held in the US. The list of reasons why it couldn't, shouldn't and won'

I think everyone knew it always could be held in America. Haymon is very rich, Hearn has always been talking about pushing Joshua towards America.

The issue (which still hasn't been clarified) is how it can work financially in America given heavyweight boxing just isn't a big issue there.