BoxRec

jamamb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 14:26 fury turned pro at 20

wilder at 23

the dyke is 29 or something, so its a bit different. at 29 fury and wilder had both won world title. dyke should at least at minimum be moved like arslanbek has , with some solid prospect testers in there

I agree. The comparisons are not apples to apples at all. It's hard to compare their situations.

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 14:01

Ilya Muromets wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 13:56



OK point taken.

Ilya, your first points in an earlier post were more spot on. Dychko had a great am career and should be way ahead of where he is at this point. He'll be 29 next month and doesn't show much improvement from the start of his career. He's going nowhere.

Being 29 at HW in 2019 is pretty irrelevant, especially given Dychko's "big" name. He's already in the WBA top fifteen, so he's exactly one "good" win away from cracking the top ten. He may even crack it after beating the great Nate Heaven.

The second point about showing improvements is moot. This division is weak as I've seen it. A fighter of Dychko's supposed caliber won't learn anything from fighting anyone outside the top ten...a top ten where the likes of Gerald Washington, Kyotaro Fujimoto, and Tyrone Spong reside.

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:09

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 14:01
Ilya, your first points in an earlier post were more spot on. Dychko had a great am career and should be way ahead of where he is at this point. He'll be 29 next month and doesn't show much improvement from the start of his career. He's going nowhere.

Being 29 at HW in 2019 is pretty irrelevant, especially given Dychko's "big" name. He's already in the WBA top fifteen, so he's exactly one "good" win away from cracking the top ten. He may even crack it after beating the great Nate Heaven.

The second point about showing improvements is moot. This division is weak as I've seen it. A fighter of Dychko's supposed caliber won't learn anything from fighting anyone outside the top ten...a top ten where the likes of Gerald Washington, Kyotaro Fujimoto, and Tyrone Spong reside.

Being ranked 15 by any org means nothing as no one recognizes all fighters in their rankings. Dychko is behind on development and isn't helping his cause by fighting Heaven. Where is he on BoxRec? 73rd.

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:30

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:09

Being 29 at HW in 2019 is pretty irrelevant, especially given Dychko's "big" name. He's already in the WBA top fifteen, so he's exactly one "good" win away from cracking the top ten. He may even crack it after beating the great Nate Heaven.

The second point about showing improvements is moot. This division is weak as I've seen it. A fighter of Dychko's supposed caliber won't learn anything from fighting anyone outside the top ten...a top ten where the likes of Gerald Washington, Kyotaro Fujimoto, and Tyrone Spong reside.

Being ranked 15 by any org means nothing as no one recognizes all fighters in their rankings. Dychko is behind on development and isn't helping his cause by fighting Heaven. Where is he on BoxRec? 73rd.

Wait, you're saying his ranking in the WBA doesn't matter, but then mention his boxrec ranking?

Trust me, I get it, he doesn't have a steak tough resume; and yet he's already landed a top 15 ranking which puts him in line for a title shot.

And here come development again. Who is he behind? What is the marker? What exact development is it that you think a 29 year old with 200 amateur fights is going to get? What is it that he needs? This isn't a kid without a jab or some random who picks his feet up when he throws. Getting some rounds against a tough journey would likely help his conditioning, but at this point that's about it.

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:38

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:30

Being ranked 15 by any org means nothing as no one recognizes all fighters in their rankings. Dychko is behind on development and isn't helping his cause by fighting Heaven. Where is he on BoxRec? 73rd.

Wait, you're saying his ranking in the WBA doesn't matter, but then mention his boxrec ranking?

Trust me, I get it, he doesn't have a steak tough resume; and yet he's already landed a top 15 ranking which puts him in line for a title shot.

And here come development again. Who is he behind? What is the marker? What exact development is it that you think a 29 year old with 200 amateur fights is going to get? What is it that he needs? This isn't a kid without a jab or some random who picks his feet up when he throws. Getting some rounds against a tough journey would likely help his conditioning, but at this point that's about it.

LOL! if you're gonna quote me get it right. I said rankings by any 'org' meaning sanctioning bodies, or was that difficult to understand? So you're saying Dychko doesn't need any more development after having 200 am fights? Ok! You'd put him up against the elite now? Good luck! LMFAO! Nice try though.

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:44

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:38

Wait, you're saying his ranking in the WBA doesn't matter, but then mention his boxrec ranking?

Trust me, I get it, he doesn't have a steak tough resume; and yet he's already landed a top 15 ranking which puts him in line for a title shot.

And here come development again. Who is he behind? What is the marker? What exact development is it that you think a 29 year old with 200 amateur fights is going to get? What is it that he needs? This isn't a kid without a jab or some random who picks his feet up when he throws. Getting some rounds against a tough journey would likely help his conditioning, but at this point that's about it.

LOL! if you're gonna quote me get it right. I said rankings by any 'org' meaning sanctioning bodies, or was that difficult to understand? So you're saying Dychko doesn't need any more development after having 200 am fights? Ok! You'd put him up against the elite now? Good luck! LMFAO! Nice try though.

I know what you said, it still makes no sense. You have to be ranked by an org in order to get a title shot. Were you unaware of this?

Who is he behind in terms of development? What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills? Kevin Johnson? Amir Mansour? Michael Wallisch? Michael Sprott maybe?

Edit: I should clarify I'm not saying he can't improve and learn; it's that the division is so weak there aren't many out there to actually push him and that at 29 he's likely set in his ways. This isn't Valuev learning on the job.

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:49

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:44

LOL! if you're gonna quote me get it right. I said rankings by any 'org' meaning sanctioning bodies, or was that difficult to understand? So you're saying Dychko doesn't need any more development after having 200 am fights? Ok! You'd put him up against the elite now? Good luck! LMFAO! Nice try though.

I know what you said, it still makes no sense. You have to be ranked by an org in order to get a title shot. Were you unaware of this?

Who is he behind in terms of development? What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills? Kevin Johnson? Amir Mansour? Michael Wallisch? Michael Sprott maybe?

Edit: I should clarify I'm not saying he can't improve and learn; it's that the division is so weak there aren't many out there to actually push him and that at 29 he's likely set in his ways. This isn't Valuev learning on the job.

Who is he behind? Let's start who he faced in the amateurs:
Anthony Joshua
Filip Hrgovic
Joe Joyce

That's a good start, no?

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:11

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 17:49

I know what you said, it still makes no sense. You have to be ranked by an org in order to get a title shot. Were you unaware of this?

Who is he behind in terms of development? What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills? Kevin Johnson? Amir Mansour? Michael Wallisch? Michael Sprott maybe?

Edit: I should clarify I'm not saying he can't improve and learn; it's that the division is so weak there aren't many out there to actually push him and that at 29 he's likely set in his ways. This isn't Valuev learning on the job.

Who is he behind? Let's start who he faced in the amateurs:
Anthony Joshua
Filip Hrgovic
Joe Joyce

That's a good start, no?

I may be wrong but I assume you mean in resume? Check AJ's first nine...he didn't see the fourth round until his 15th fight. He's not learning special secrets knocking out 50 year old Matt Skelton in two rounds. Hrgovic got heat for fighting Greg Corbin. Amir Mansour is almost 50 and Kevin Johnson doesn't try. Dychko is right on par with almost every other prospect out there. They all fight knockovers to start.

Joyce has the best resume of all through nine. He's also the oldest, the slowest, and the least likely to have lasting success and he knows it hence his impatience.

So that's one question answered. How about the others: What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills?

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:31

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:11

Who is he behind? Let's start who he faced in the amateurs:
Anthony Joshua
Filip Hrgovic
Joe Joyce

That's a good start, no?

I may be wrong but I assume you mean in resume? Check AJ's first nine...he didn't see the fourth round until his 15th fight. He's not learning special secrets knocking out 50 year old Matt Skelton in two rounds. Hrgovic got heat for fighting Greg Corbin. Amir Mansour is almost 50 and Kevin Johnson doesn't try. Dychko is right on par with almost every other prospect out there.

Joyce has the best resume of all through nine. He's also the oldest, the slowest, and the least likely to have lasting success.

So that's one question answered. How about the others: What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills?

No, not resume. Although that's a part of it. Just watch them fight. They were all in the ams together and look at all four of them today. That's all you have to do. Dychko is behind. It's plain as day. He's going to be 29. He couldn't beat any of the three that he came up in the ams with. Not sure what you're trying to argue about. He can't contend at a high level yet and certainly hasn't showed it. To develop those skills he has to have step up fights against guys who will provide the environment in the ring he needs. He's not doing that. That's what all fighters do. Going back and saying "well AJ at ninth fight..." is ludicrous. We're not comparing a 29 y/o AJ to a 25 Y/O Efe Ajagba. It's a similar aged fighter with a more extensive amateur career that is bogging down in the pros. OMG! I'm literally LOL!!!

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:37

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:31

I may be wrong but I assume you mean in resume? Check AJ's first nine...he didn't see the fourth round until his 15th fight. He's not learning special secrets knocking out 50 year old Matt Skelton in two rounds. Hrgovic got heat for fighting Greg Corbin. Amir Mansour is almost 50 and Kevin Johnson doesn't try. Dychko is right on par with almost every other prospect out there.

Joyce has the best resume of all through nine. He's also the oldest, the slowest, and the least likely to have lasting success.

So that's one question answered. How about the others: What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills?

No, not resume. Although that's a part of it. Just watch them fight. They were all in the ams together and look at all four of them today. That's all you have to do. Dychko is behind. It's plain as day. He's going to be 29. He couldn't beat any of the three that he came up in the ams with. Not sure what you're trying to argue about. He can't contend at a high level yet and certainly hasn't showed it. To develop those skills he has to have step up fights against guys who will provide the environment in the ring he needs. He's not doing that. That's what all fighters do. Going back and saying "well AJ at ninth fight..." is ludicrous. We're not comparing a 29 y/o AJ to a 25 Y/O Efe Ajagba. It's a similar aged fighter with a more extensive amateur career that is bogging down in the pros. OMG! I'm literally LOL!!!

Dychko is tall, uses his jab well and has good power.

AJ's been a pro for six years, of course he'll be more advanced than someone who has been a pro for two. That's why looking at them at similar stages of their careers is important. Hrgovic and Dychko have beaten similar opponents. You're not making any sense. Like none at all.

What skills is he lacking and who does he fight to build them?

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:41

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:37

No, not resume. Although that's a part of it. Just watch them fight. They were all in the ams together and look at all four of them today. That's all you have to do. Dychko is behind. It's plain as day. He's going to be 29. He couldn't beat any of the three that he came up in the ams with. Not sure what you're trying to argue about. He can't contend at a high level yet and certainly hasn't showed it. To develop those skills he has to have step up fights against guys who will provide the environment in the ring he needs. He's not doing that. That's what all fighters do. Going back and saying "well AJ at ninth fight..." is ludicrous. We're not comparing a 29 y/o AJ to a 25 Y/O Efe Ajagba. It's a similar aged fighter with a more extensive amateur career that is bogging down in the pros. OMG! I'm literally LOL!!!

Dychko is tall, uses his jab well and has good power.

AJ's been a pro for six years, of course he'll be more advanced than someone who has been a pro for two. That's why looking at them at similar stages of their careers is important. Hrgovic and Dychko have beaten similar opponents. You're not making any sense. Like none at all.

What skills is he lacking and who does he fight to build them?

So now it's wrong to compare your well developed HW to AJ? I'm sorry you are having difficulty understanding. I've taken enough time on this guy. We'll take this up in another year, how's that?

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:59

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:41

Dychko is tall, uses his jab well and has good power.

AJ's been a pro for six years, of course he'll be more advanced than someone who has been a pro for two. That's why looking at them at similar stages of their careers is important. Hrgovic and Dychko have beaten similar opponents. You're not making any sense. Like none at all.

What skills is he lacking and who does he fight to build them?

So now it's wrong to compare your well developed HW to AJ? I'm sorry you are having difficulty understanding. I've taken enough time on this guy. We'll take this up in another year, how's that?

I never compared current AJ to Dychko, that's some side conversation you had in your own mind. Here's what I said since you've clearly forgotten:

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Jul 2019, 20:19 I'm not sure what people are expecting. Dychko's first nine have been just fine for a HW, especially in 2019. He missed some time due to promotional issues but his first nine opponents are better than Wilder or Ruiz and close to Fury and AJ. Just cuz Joe and Hrgovic are being moved a little faster doesn't mean Dychko's doing it wrong.

And yes, I'd be happy to revisit this a year from now. Maybe by then you'll have answers to the two other questions I asked

But seriously, have a good one!

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 19:03

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:59

So now it's wrong to compare your well developed HW to AJ? I'm sorry you are having difficulty understanding. I've taken enough time on this guy. We'll take this up in another year, how's that?

I never compared current AJ to Dychko, that's some side conversation you had in your own mind. Here's what I said since you've clearly forgotten:

punchoutsb wrote: ↑05 Jul 2019, 20:19 I'm not sure what people are expecting. Dychko's first nine have been just fine for a HW, especially in 2019. He missed some time due to promotional issues but his first nine opponents are better than Wilder or Ruiz and close to Fury and AJ. Just cuz Joe and Hrgovic are being moved a little faster doesn't mean Dychko's doing it wrong.

And yes, I'd be happy to revisit this a year from now. Maybe by then you'll have answers to the two other questions I asked

But seriously, have a good one!

You too.

oogiebe wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:37

punchoutsb wrote: ↑06 Jul 2019, 18:31

I may be wrong but I assume you mean in resume? Check AJ's first nine...he didn't see the fourth round until his 15th fight. He's not learning special secrets knocking out 50 year old Matt Skelton in two rounds. Hrgovic got heat for fighting Greg Corbin. Amir Mansour is almost 50 and Kevin Johnson doesn't try. Dychko is right on par with almost every other prospect out there.

Joyce has the best resume of all through nine. He's also the oldest, the slowest, and the least likely to have lasting success.

So that's one question answered. How about the others: What is it exactly he needs to further develop? Who does he fight to develop these skills?

No, not resume. Although that's a part of it. Just watch them fight. They were all in the ams together and look at all four of them today. That's all you have to do. Dychko is behind. It's plain as day. He's going to be 29. He couldn't beat any of the three that he came up in the ams with. Not sure what you're trying to argue about. He can't contend at a high level yet and certainly hasn't showed it. To develop those skills he has to have step up fights against guys who will provide the environment in the ring he needs. He's not doing that. That's what all fighters do. Going back and saying "well AJ at ninth fight..." is ludicrous. We're not comparing a 29 y/o AJ to a 25 Y/O Efe Ajagba. It's a similar aged fighter with a more extensive amateur career that is bogging down in the pros. OMG! I'm literally LOL!!!

BTW, this is what I was referencing from you regarding your comparing AJ to Dychko. Not to extend our endless exhange. I hope Dychko steps up his next fight. If he doesn't have a few step up fights, he'll either never be a contender or he'll be thrown in with someone who is levels above his current competition which is rarely good.

This is a joke fight, and to be honest so have every one of Dychko's pro fights so far. I'd like him to do well but that's the truth.

the world's biggest dyke is finally back in action, in 5 days vs the once solid prospect tester but now shot to bits dennis bahktov

8 straight losses for den, 6 straight times not going the distance, winless since 2014

the sad thing is, with how inactive dyke's been, even this huge mismatch is a step in the right direction for him since he's actually going to fight again

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 20:12 the world's biggest dyke is finally back in action, in 5 days vs the once solid prospect tester but now shot to bits dennis bahktov

8 straight losses for den, 6 straight times not going the distance, winless since 2014

the sad thing is, with how inactive dyke's been, even this huge mismatch is a step in the right direction for him since he's actually going to fight again

Waste of talent. He's done. Time has run out on him. He needed some development and never got it. Can't make up for lost time.

pretty much what i think too. his only possibile saving grace may be that a llot of hws today still get shots or contend into their late 30s, and he;s still 30 or something. if he were to get a sudden push, maybe he could work his way into a meaningful spot

but then if my auntie had wheels she'd be a car, hard to expect much to of a push when he's gone nowhere for 5 years. i'd bet either he retires undefeated, something like 15-0 with no meaningful wins, or one of these days he's gonna have stagnated so much that some dude brought into lose manages to level him

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 20:48 pretty much what i think too. his only possibile saving grace may be that a llot of hws today still get shots or contend into their late 30s, and he;s still 30 or something. if he were to get a sudden push, maybe he could work his way into a meaningful spot

but then if my auntie had wheels she'd be a car, hard to expect much to of a push when he's gone nowhere for 5 years. i'd bet either he retires undefeated, something like 15-0 with no meaningful wins, or one of these days he's gonna have stagnated so much that some dude brought into lose manages to level him

Must be more to the story then we know. Can't just be plain horrible management.

maybe heart just aint in it

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 20:54 maybe heart just aint in it

Sure could be. I wonder if EO still thinks he beats Efe now.

There are recent photos of Ivan Dychko in the gym with the likes of Tyson Fury, Joseph Parker, Jared Anderson and Efe Ajagba.

Ivan Dychko is also scheduled to face Denis Bakhtov this weekend, which is a pretty terrible opponent, but the fighter from Kazakhstan has been inactive for two years.

So as long as he fights again soon, I'll give him a free pass on this occasion.

oogiebe wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 20:58

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑05 Jul 2021, 20:54 maybe heart just aint in it

Sure could be. I wonder if EO still thinks he beats Efe now.

Honestly? I don’t expect Ivan Dychko to be capable of beating ANY half-decent heavyweight right now.

He’s only engaged in two horrendous mismatches within the last three years and has been inactive for the last two of them.

His next opponent, Denis Bakhtov, has lost every single bout he’s competed in within the last EIGHTY months, which equates to eight consecutive defeats since 2014.

That said, I do know that Dychko has been sharing the gym (and also sparring) with a lot of big-name heavyweights, which are experiences he might have learned from… but who really knows for certain whether this is the case or not?

So until I see him fight again, the jury is out.

I have to assume that (at this point in time) Dychko has regressed and the slate has been wiped clean.

And what I mean by this, is that he’s likely forgotten everything he would have learned from the pro bouts he engaged in during 2017 and 2018.

Even if Ivan Dychko disposes of Denis Bakhtov with consummate ease this weekend, we wouldn’t have learned anything about his current fighting ability from this bout, because the opponent he is facing is embarrassingly dire!

Anyway, the reason why I was initially intrigued about the Kazakhstani heavyweight, was his amateur pedigree.

In the amateurs, Ivan Dychko has won two silvers and one bronze in the world championships, including two bronze medals in the Olympics.

He also competed in 199 amateur bouts, losing only 18 of them, which includes victories over the likes of Zhang Zhilei, Filip Hrgovic, Erislandy Savon and Efe Ajagba.

So he was once a prospect that deserved our attention, but not anymore - inactivity has probably ruined him.

Only time will tell whether Dychko is capable of rekindling my interest in him.

dyke at his peak as an am had lovely fluid movement and boxing for a big guy. though seemed a bit physically weak

ffs someone retire bakhtov