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Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 20 May 2019, 10:26
by WildWaylon
AJ and Whyte are come forward fighters and are ideal for Wilder. Fury moves in and out and has far better all round movement so he is harder to hit. AJ is quite static and IMO very beatable for Wilder. Whyte has improved a lot and I think he would be a lot more trouble for Wilder, even so, I would expect Wilder to win.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 20 May 2019, 11:53
by Twinkle Toes
Joshua in 3 - Wilder isn't going to know what hit him.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 09:57
by stujones
Always said a good orthodox (as in fights traditionally, not as in the stance) boxer should annihilate and embarrass Wilder. With those wild telegraphed swings.... a half baked (and if you ask me still overated) Fury did in patches back in December.
However, what this fight showcased yet again is Wilder's power and it got me thinking about AJ..... is AJ's own power a tad over rated..... lets look at the evidence in his most telling fights.
Povetkin - yes stunning KO, but Povetkin has been hurt and floored a few times previously.
Takam - despite recording a stoppage win, it wasn't the same manner as Chisora (who is not renowned for his one punch KO power). Takam wasn't badly hurt at all, badly cut yes, but not badly hurt..... again a late replacement.
Parker - People started calling Parker "iron chinned" based on his display vs AJ..... yet he was floored and hurt more vs Whyte.
Breazele - as been noted, took a 7 round pounding vs AJ - couldn't withstand a round vs Wilder.
Klitchsko - A famously chinny fighter, withstood a lot form AJ before wilting.
Whyte - Yes only KO defeat on his resume, but Whyte has also been hurt by light punching Parker, Helenius and Chisora.
The manner of the Wilder vs Breazele fight just got me thinking, perhaps AJ won't get Wilder out of there as early as I thought and then he could perhaps walk onto one of the telegraphed swings and it could be curtains. AJ should be clever enough to humilate Wilder (who I will always think of as an awful boxer - no matter how many highlight reel KOs he gets) - but perhaps this Breazele fight raises a question mark over AJs power, or perhaps a better way to phrase it gives Wilder fans more hope that Deontay can take AJ's shots.
Still think AJ in about 6 one sided rounds, but Wilder does have that punch.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 12:31
by jamamb
stujones wrote: ↑23 May 2019, 09:57
Always said a good orthodox (as in fights traditionally, not as in the stance) boxer should annihilate and embarrass Wilder. With those wild telegraphed swings.... a half baked (and if you ask me still overated) Fury did in patches back in December.
However, what this fight showcased yet again is Wilder's power and it got me thinking about AJ..... is AJ's own power a tad over rated..... lets look at the evidence in his most telling fights.
Povetkin - yes stunning KO, but Povetkin has been hurt and floored a few times previously.
Takam - despite recording a stoppage win, it wasn't the same manner as Chisora (who is not renowned for his one punch KO power). Takam wasn't badly hurt at all, badly cut yes, but not badly hurt..... again a late replacement.
Parker - People started calling Parker "iron chinned" based on his display vs AJ..... yet he was floored and hurt more vs Whyte.
Breazele - as been noted, took a 7 round pounding vs AJ - couldn't withstand a round vs Wilder.
Klitchsko - A famously chinny fighter, withstood a lot form AJ before wilting.
Whyte - Yes only KO defeat on his resume, but Whyte has also been hurt by light punching Parker, Helenius and Chisora.
The manner of the Wilder vs Breazele fight just got me thinking, perhaps AJ won't get Wilder out of there as early as I thought and then he could perhaps walk onto one of the telegraphed swings and it could be curtains. AJ should be clever enough to humilate Wilder (who I will always think of as an awful boxer - no matter how many highlight reel KOs he gets) - but perhaps this Breazele fight raises a question mark over AJs power, or perhaps a better way to phrase it gives Wilder fans more hope that Deontay can take AJ's shots.
Still think AJ in about 6 one sided rounds, but Wilder does have that punch.
you can easily cherry pick wilders power like that too
molina---stopped in 1 by arreola and some journeyman, 3 by aj , down loads of times vs not good fighters, yet goes 9 vs wilder
duhaupas--dropped by some journeyman, ktfo in 6 by pov, yet took everything wilder had for 11 and didnt go down
szpilka---dropped a bunch of times by mike mollo and stopped by average at best punching jennings. then stopped in just 4 rounds by kownaci even though he went 9 vs wilder
arreola---down a bunch of times vs not great opponents and stopped more brutally and faster by stiverne then wilder did. took a sustained beating from wilder without getting brutally stopped. instead he retired on his stool
washington---a chinny nervous fighter who kownacki easily destroyed in 2
stiveren---knocked out by a journyeyman with a losing record. stood up to everything wilder had and took loads of flush shots there first fight without being dropped or stopped.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 12:35
by oogiebe
It's just as clear that Wilder hits harder than AJ as AJ is the superior boxer.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 12:52
by jamamb
ya though thats not what was being posted, it was that ajs power is overrated, i dont think so and we can easily cherry pick wilders opponents and fights like ajs were
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 13:43
by oogiebe
jamamb wrote: ↑23 May 2019, 12:52
ya though thats not what was being posted, it was that ajs power is overrated, i dont think so and we can easily cherry pick wilders opponents and fights like ajs were
AJ's power isn't overrated. He's one of the hardest hitters in HW history. His record speaks for itself.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 14:55
by stujones
jamamb wrote: ↑23 May 2019, 12:52
ya though thats not what was being posted, it was that ajs power is overrated, i dont think so and we can easily cherry pick wilders opponents and fights like ajs were
Not saying he is a Tyson Fury esque power - it is just everytime he's stepped up and fought a geniune top ten fighter he's been extended - Beazele, Takam, Parker, Whyte, Povetkin, Klitchsko all saw half way or beyond. I think though the perception has been that those who have extended him must have a iron chin - Parker was especially noted for having an iron chin, as was Takam after their fight.... I think most people thought Breazele would give Wilder rounds based on the Joshua fight - eventually at some point we need re-evaluate.
Yes, I've been one in the past questioning when Wilder steps up does he carry his power...... Ortiz, Stiverne (fight 1), Fury only true top 10 fighters he's faced prior to Saturday and all extended him..... but Breazele for me was a definate top ten fighter, with a considered good chin and Wilder did something no one really predicted.
Not saying AJ cannot punch, but does he have that 1 KO punch to KO Wilder early? I'm starting to question it.
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 15:02
by jamamb
ajs only been past the 7th three times, not sure if anyone else in the division has so consistently ended fights as early. even wilder has been past that i think 7-8 times
i think they can both ko each other, but usually they both do go out of the early rounds
only inoue right now is consistenly bombing good fighters out early
Re: AJ v Wilder poll (19th May 2019) - post Breazeale
Posted: 23 May 2019, 15:11
by keirw
The thing with AJ is that he is very patient early in fights, almost to the point of caution. He likes to take his time, establish the jab, suss out his opponent's style.
This can work against him at times, like the Parker and Takam fights where both fighters adopted a defensive style and Joshua seemed to fall into a rythmn all too easily.
Wilder is completely different as he will throw bombs and take huge risks in doing so, Joshua will have the openings right in front of him from the first round. I see him takung advantage of them before long (provided he doesn't get caught himself, which isn't necessarily a given).