Zhilei Zhang vs. Joe Joyce II | TNT Sport - 23 September 2023

[jamesmcdonnell]

Joyce had a rematch clause somehow?

Boy you can always tell when a Promoters best laid plans get upset because he tries to get 'em back on track any which way he can

That's a promoter and managers job.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Think Joyce will survive a tough first 5 rounds then take over and stop zhang. Just needs to respect zhang a power a tiny bit, and should hold and wrestle a bit early to eat into zhang a tiny stamina…,

I bet on zhang ko for the value last fight, probably gunna be Joyce ko for the value this fight….

Hmm. That's counting on the fact that his eye doesn't blow up again.

Also think Zhang probably has more boxing ability than Joyce. Joyce lacks the ability to create angles, he's got the mobility of a railway dining car.

Joyces best bet would be to throw jabs to the body to stop Zhang spamming his 'block jab' move.

I'm not sure Joyce will be able to wrestle effectively with Zhang, Zhang is a very very big man, and he may also leave himself open to uppercuts on the inside. Zhang has good punching technique.

[gilgamesh]

Joyce had a rematch clause somehow?

Boy you can always tell when a Promoters best laid plans get upset because he tries to get 'em back on track any which way he can

That's a promoter and managers job.

Of course. It's just a sh*tty deal for the guy who upset the apple cart, and has to now do it twice. If Joyce had won he'd have never looked twice at Zhang again.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Joyce had a rematch clause somehow?

Boy you can always tell when a Promoters best laid plans get upset because he tries to get 'em back on track any which way he can

That's a promoter and managers job.

Of course. It's just a sh*tty deal for the guy who upset the apple cart, and has to now do it twice. If Joyce had won he'd have never looked twice at Zhang again.

Well, I am sure Zhang isn't complaining about the additional payday.

[gilgamesh]

That's a promoter and managers job.

Of course. It's just a sh*tty deal for the guy who upset the apple cart, and has to now do it twice. If Joyce had won he'd have never looked twice at Zhang again.

Well, I am sure Zhang isn't complaining about the additional payday.

I would imagine not, and as the old saying goes if you can beat a man once you can beat him twice.

[gregregegg]

Think Joyce will survive a tough first 5 rounds then take over and stop zhang. Just needs to respect zhang a power a tiny bit, and should hold and wrestle a bit early to eat into zhang a tiny stamina…,

I bet on zhang ko for the value last fight, probably gunna be Joyce ko for the value this fight….

Hmm. That's counting on the fact that his eye doesn't blow up again.

Also think Zhang probably has more boxing ability than Joyce. Joyce lacks the ability to create angles, he's got the mobility of a railway dining car.

Joyces best bet would be to throw jabs to the body to stop Zhang spamming his 'block jab' move.

I'm not sure Joyce will be able to wrestle effectively with Zhang, Zhang is a very very big man, and he may also leave himself open to uppercuts on the inside. Zhang has good punching technique.

I just think seeing as Joyce has the best cardio at heavyweight HR and zhang some of the worst early on I’d look to start some clinches, hang 260lb off him and be a pest until I got a warning… Joyce hugging, hanging and walking you back would be a fornicating workout… mix in a few body shots and the old bull zhang should be wellll and truely breathing witching 5 rounds…

Even if he gets tagged plenty eyes closing is always a touch of bad luck, zhang isn’t that acuarate…

Don’t get me wrong Joyce can lose, not going to master boxing southpaws in 6 months… but if his team is smart there are game plans that have him favourite for me if they implement them. But it’s close either way in terms of odds.

[HomicideHenry]

Joyce certainly has the ability to beat Zhang. I think they're really not far apart in ability or worth. Joyce just had the wrong tactic. He's relied so much on his toughness, that it cost him. I expect him to do much better the second time around.

[coneye]

Joyce certainly has the ability to beat Zhang. I think they're really not far apart in ability or worth. Joyce just had the wrong tactic. He's relied so much on his toughness, that it cost him. I expect him to do much better the second time around.

Don't really think he knows much else , think it will be pretty much a similar result , winner winner for Zhang though he gets another decent payday i would presume , after all no one else seems too keen on him , he's pretty much in the too hard basket now IF fURY REALLY WAS LOOKING FOR A DANCE PARTNER I'M SURE jOYCE WOULD OF STEPPED ASIDE

[HomicideHenry]

Joyce certainly has the ability to beat Zhang. I think they're really not far apart in ability or worth. Joyce just had the wrong tactic. He's relied so much on his toughness, that it cost him. I expect him to do much better the second time around.

Don't really think he knows much else , think it will be pretty much a similar result , winner winner for Zhang though he gets another decent payday i would presume , after all no one else seems too keen on him , he's pretty much in the too hard basket now IF fURY REALLY WAS LOOKING FOR A DANCE PARTNER I'M SURE jOYCE WOULD OF STEPPED ASIDE

Well if people remember I did say that I thought that Joe Joyce was european level and nothing more. So it was no surprise to me when he lost, but... I see nothing particularly special in Zhang that Joyce couldn't overcome if he properly tweaked his defense.

[coneye]

Joyce certainly has the ability to beat Zhang. I think they're really not far apart in ability or worth. Joyce just had the wrong tactic. He's relied so much on his toughness, that it cost him. I expect him to do much better the second time around.

Don't really think he knows much else , think it will be pretty much a similar result , winner winner for Zhang though he gets another decent payday i would presume , after all no one else seems too keen on him , he's pretty much in the too hard basket now IF fURY REALLY WAS LOOKING FOR A DANCE PARTNER I'M SURE jOYCE WOULD OF STEPPED ASIDE

Well if people remember I did say that I thought that Joe Joyce was european level and nothing more. So it was no surprise to me when he lost, but... I see nothing particularly special in Zhang that Joyce couldn't overcome if he properly tweaked his defense.

Theres the problem , boxing is all about muscle memory , you practice and practice in the gym till its second nature , you slip , you counter and so thorth , Jocye had no muscle memory , for a southpaw , you can't just change you have to practice , so unless he's been sparring and working on what to do since the last fight , i doubt he'll change too much , he may a bit till he stands in front and gets hit again

[Coco]

Don't really think he knows much else , think it will be pretty much a similar result , winner winner for Zhang though he gets another decent payday i would presume , after all no one else seems too keen on him , he's pretty much in the too hard basket now IF fURY REALLY WAS LOOKING FOR A DANCE PARTNER I'M SURE jOYCE WOULD OF STEPPED ASIDE

Well if people remember I did say that I thought that Joe Joyce was european level and nothing more. So it was no surprise to me when he lost, but... I see nothing particularly special in Zhang that Joyce couldn't overcome if he properly tweaked his defense.

Theres the problem , boxing is all about muscle memory , you practice and practice in the gym till its second nature , you slip , you counter and so thorth , Jocye had no muscle memory , for a southpaw , you can't just change you have to practice , so unless he's been sparring and working on what to do since the last fight , i doubt he'll change too much , he may a bit till he stands in front and gets hit again

Maybe that's because Joyce didn't start boxing until he was 21.

You are right about the slipping and sliding, where you put your feet etc, it's drilled into you so much that it's instinctive and natural, you don't need to think about it, it's done in the split second.

[The Gratest]

I just don't see how Joyce can adapt and get away from that straight left of Zhang. His style is built on his toughness, endurance, chin, walking through opponents punches and wearing them down. His jab was taken away, he couldn't do anything with his left hook, and there's no way he's beating Zhang to the punch by leading with a straight right. I suppose he could work on his footwork and constantly circling clockwise, but Zhang's speed of punch and power will always be a risk when he stops to punch.
If he goes for broke from the start and tries to get to Zhang's questionable stamina, might be a tactic, but runs the risk of getting outpunched by the quicker hands of Zhang.
His face needs to hold up, but we've seen before with eye damage, it tends to surface again in subsequent fights.

[Frostieballs]

I just don't see how Joyce can adapt and get away from that straight left of Zhang. His style is built on his toughness, endurance, chin, walking through opponents punches and wearing them down. His jab was taken away, he couldn't do anything with his left hook, and there's no way he's beating Zhang to the punch by leading with a straight right. I suppose he could work on his footwork and constantly circling clockwise, but Zhang's speed of punch and power will always be a risk when he stops to punch.
If he goes for broke from the start and tries to get to Zhang's questionable stamina, might be a tactic, but runs the risk of getting outpunched by the quicker hands of Zhang.
His face needs to hold up, but we've seen before with eye damage, it tends to surface again in subsequent fights.

Exactly the same thing will happen with the eye unless he changes something. It wasn’t a freak injury or clash of heads, it was getting battered all night.

[coneye]

Well if people remember I did say that I thought that Joe Joyce was european level and nothing more. So it was no surprise to me when he lost, but... I see nothing particularly special in Zhang that Joyce couldn't overcome if he properly tweaked his defense.

Theres the problem , boxing is all about muscle memory , you practice and practice in the gym till its second nature , you slip , you counter and so thorth , Jocye had no muscle memory , for a southpaw , you can't just change you have to practice , so unless he's been sparring and working on what to do since the last fight , i doubt he'll change too much , he may a bit till he stands in front and gets hit again

Maybe that's because Joyce didn't start boxing until he was 21.

You are right about the slipping and sliding, where you put your feet etc, it's drilled into you so much that it's instinctive and natural, you don't need to think about it, it's done in the split second.

It could still work for him , he just has to bring in a trainer who fully understands southpaws , and then fully commit to working , working and working somemore to get it right , needs to be made to spar has a southpaw , to grasp what its about , Zang is'nt that good he' just found out and relized Joe did'nt know what he was doing that night , and he did'nt otherwise he would'nt off got hit with the same punch over and over again and again .

I find it incredible his trainers who i presume are well paid did'nt seem to spot and do something about his lack of ability there

[tigermoth87]

Rematch clauses are one of many things killing boxing.
Just boring--we saw Joyce get whooped once. Zhang should be moving on to a a shot at a world title.

[Ruthless-RKO]

HW division is literally at a standstill.

[Ezzard]

I love rematches. Great eras are defined by great rivalries created by rematches.

[jamesmcdonnell]

HW division is literally at a standstill.

Even Bunce had an article in the Telegraph the other day, which basically said he's bored shitless of the heavyweight division, and the endless merry go round of bullshit and rumours.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Theres the problem , boxing is all about muscle memory , you practice and practice in the gym till its second nature , you slip , you counter and so thorth , Jocye had no muscle memory , for a southpaw , you can't just change you have to practice , so unless he's been sparring and working on what to do since the last fight , i doubt he'll change too much , he may a bit till he stands in front and gets hit again

Maybe that's because Joyce didn't start boxing until he was 21.

You are right about the slipping and sliding, where you put your feet etc, it's drilled into you so much that it's instinctive and natural, you don't need to think about it, it's done in the split second.

It could still work for him , he just has to bring in a trainer who fully understands southpaws , and then fully commit to working , working and working somemore to get it right , needs to be made to spar has a southpaw , to grasp what its about , Zang is'nt that good he' just found out and relized Joe did'nt know what he was doing that night , and he did'nt otherwise he would'nt off got hit with the same punch over and over again and again .

I find it incredible his trainers who i presume are well paid did'nt seem to spot and do something about his lack of ability there

Yes, it's not like Zhang did anything that complicated, mainly he just threw the straight left fast and hard, over and over again. That and using his right glove to palm away at the jab, preventing Joyce from setting up his own right hand.

[Terminator666]

Joyce gets beat up again surely. Don’t see how he can win

[JamesPhilips]

Joyce gets beat up again surely. Don’t see how he can win

I think Zhang was beginning to run out of gas oddly. Joyce just needs to box clever and train for a southpaw

[Manchester Hitman]

Joyce gets beat up again surely. Don’t see how he can win

Joe was actually slowly starting to turn the tide just before the stoppage. It’s all ifs and maybes, but if the eye hadn’t have gone the next 6 rounds would have been very interesting.

He can definitely win the rematch and that’s what I’m expecting will happen.

[jameswilson]

Joyce gets beat up again surely. Don’t see how he can win

Joe was actually slowly starting to turn the tide just before the stoppage. It’s all ifs and maybes, but if the eye hadn’t have gone the next 6 rounds would have been very interesting.

He can definitely win the rematch and that’s what I’m expecting will happen.

Literally like saying had Usyk not outboxed AJ in both their fights AJ would have won.

[jameswilson]

HW division is literally at a standstill.

Tbf I don’t think Fury would have fought Joyce in September so Joyce losing has given us an extra heavyweight meaningful fight. And let’s be honest every single one of us are gonna be tuning in as the first fight was good and you know this one will be exciting too.

[Ruthless-RKO]

Zhilei Zhang Says Joyce Rematch Now Only 60% Likely: “They Made A Mistake”

“It looks like the rematch is the direction we’re heading in, but we’re still trying to figure out all the details. At one point I believe the Tyson Fury fight was on the radar for both teams, but it’s the rematch that got in the way, so that’s the direction we’re heading in.

“It’s up there. I would say a little more than 60 per cent [likely]. We’re looking at – what allegedly said was September – and that’s what we’re looking at right now. But it’s not my job. I just train – do my training every day.”

It seems Zhang has indeed missed out a shot at Tyson Fury’s WBC belt with Joyce activating the rematch clause – something he believes was the wrong choice.

“I would have chosen to fight one or two interim fights if I was him. I don’t know why his team is in such a rush to make it happen. I feel like his team made a mistake for the first fight, and now they’re probably going to make the second mistake, and if I beat Joe Joyce again his career’s going to end.

Their team didn’t do comprehensive homework on what I do; what I am. They need to study me more. That’s the mistake. They underestimated me.”