Will Morales go down as the best Mexican fighter ever??

[Graham Brett]

I'm not sure about the fighters who Morales was steered clear but I remember a fair debate showing Barrera had been forced to take the harder path.

Also I think Hamed would have beat Morales. Hamed lost to Barrera but so did Morales. I think it was just a bad style match up for Hamed and I don't buy the fact that Morales is a league above - look at comparative opponents - Hamed was ko'ing fighters in 2 that went 12 with Morales.

Tell me an opponent that Morales beat (other than Barrera) that a Prime Hamed would have any trouble with. I don't think Pacman could stay out the way of Hameds power. British fighters are talked down too much imo.

How would Hamed have beaten Morales who is a better counter puncher than Barrera and has longer reach and is just as strong. Hamed was a decent fighter but lacked heart and would have been beaten just the same way as Barrera beat him. You forgot to mention that every fight between Morales and Barrera have been close and could have gone either way but there was a huge margin between Barrera and Hamed.
Pacman and Hamed would be a great fight but could Hamed handle the pressure that Manny would put on him in the early rounds i don't know.

The thing is did Hamed beat any great fighters in there prime he lost to the first good fighter he fought and he couldn't have beaten any of the 3 good Mexican fighters in his division at the moment in my opinion.

Morales would be more likely to get dragged into a war and catch a big shot - Barreras faster and a better counter puncher imo. On my card Hamed lost by about 2-3points from memory he won a few rounds in there and I believe could beat BArrera if he fought the right fight and was at his best.

Barrera wasnt the first GOOD fighter he fought - he fought loads of top fighters. You should look into some of the guys he fought - they werent ATGs but u cant be an ATG if you get beat by the best in the division can you? Maybe they'd be seen as great if Hamed hadn't beat them? Same as Hopkins now people say he hasnt beat greats but hes fought good opp.

Yes but Barrerra was the first World Class Fighter Hamed fought who wasnt on the way down. Although Hameds people thought Barrera was on the way down, otherwise they wouldnt have made the match.

A lot of people say if Hamed was at his best he would have beaten Barerra. Trash.

No one mentioned Hamed being past his best before the opening bell of the Barrera fight.

Hamed got beat by a better fighter and did not possess the qualities to come back, avange his defeat and prove himself a great fighter.

Hamed was very talented, an awesome puncher and a very good fighter.

But not a great one.

[Twinkle Toes]

Hamed wasnt at his best against Barrera, and that isn't trash talking.

Most British fight fans knew that Hamed's focus had long gone come the Barrera fight.

There was a documentary made in the build up to that fight, and the way Hamed approached it was fornicating farcical.

A fully focused/committed Hamed like the one that fought Robinson, would have beaten Barrera in my opinion.

[KOJOE90]

Hamed wasnt at his best against Barrera, and that isn't trash talking.

Most British fight fans knew that Hamed's focus had long gone come the Barrera fight.

There was a documentary made in the build up to that fight, and the way Hamed approached it was fornicating farcical..

Agreed, Hamed had lost a lot of his hunger for the fight game by the time he fought Barrera.

A fully focused/committed Hamed like the one that fought Robinson, would have beaten Barrera in my opinion.

Well, it would have been a lot more competative in my opinion.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

How would Hamed have beaten Morales who is a better counter puncher than Barrera and has longer reach and is just as strong. Hamed was a decent fighter but lacked heart and would have been beaten just the same way as Barrera beat him. You forgot to mention that every fight between Morales and Barrera have been close and could have gone either way but there was a huge margin between Barrera and Hamed.
Pacman and Hamed would be a great fight but could Hamed handle the pressure that Manny would put on him in the early rounds i don't know.

The thing is did Hamed beat any great fighters in there prime he lost to the first good fighter he fought and he couldn't have beaten any of the 3 good Mexican fighters in his division at the moment in my opinion.

Morales would be more likely to get dragged into a war and catch a big shot - Barreras faster and a better counter puncher imo. On my card Hamed lost by about 2-3points from memory he won a few rounds in there and I believe could beat BArrera if he fought the right fight and was at his best.

Barrera wasnt the first GOOD fighter he fought - he fought loads of top fighters. You should look into some of the guys he fought - they werent ATGs but u cant be an ATG if you get beat by the best in the division can you? Maybe they'd be seen as great if Hamed hadn't beat them? Same as Hopkins now people say he hasnt beat greats but hes fought good opp.

Yes but Barrerra was the first World Class Fighter Hamed fought who wasnt on the way down. Although Hameds people thought Barrera was on the way down, otherwise they wouldnt have made the match.

A lot of people say if Hamed was at his best he would have beaten Barerra. Trash.

No one mentioned Hamed being past his best before the opening bell of the Barrera fight.

Hamed got beat by a better fighter and did not possess the qualities to come back, avange his defeat and prove himself a great fighter.

Hamed was very talented, an awesome puncher and a very good fighter.

But not a great one.

If you believe 2001 Hamed was a patch on the 1995 Hamed then there is no point in debating with you. A combination fleet footed Hamed would beat Barrera easily.

The only reason Hameds opponents were on the way down was because they fought Hamed, power like that really destroys a fighter and makes it hard to come back from.

[Tantum]

Barrera and Marquez are about the same age, Morales is younger, he's only 28!

You've got to feel sorry for Marquez, he's been avoided like the plague his whole career, Hamed avoided him, so did Barrera, and so has Morales.

Barrera and Morales ducked him? That's the biggest crock of shit I've ever heard... Who the hell did Marquez beat before Robbie Peden? A bunch of padded records, and decently tough mexican fighters?

[felixthacat]

NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO NO !

[Sweet P]

Barrera and Marquez are about the same age, Morales is younger, he's only 28!

You've got to feel sorry for Marquez, he's been avoided like the plague his whole career, Hamed avoided him, so did Barrera, and so has Morales.

Barrera and Morales ducked him? That's the biggest crock of shit I've ever heard... Who the hell did Marquez beat before Robbie Peden? A bunch of padded records, and decently tough mexican fighters?

I agree Tantum and also James Morales delt with Pacman a lot better than Marquez did and would have to be favorite if they ever fought.

[Sweet P]

Morales would be more likely to get dragged into a war and catch a big shot - Barreras faster and a better counter puncher imo. On my card Hamed lost by about 2-3points from memory he won a few rounds in there and I believe could beat BArrera if he fought the right fight and was at his best.

Barrera wasnt the first GOOD fighter he fought - he fought loads of top fighters. You should look into some of the guys he fought - they werent ATGs but u cant be an ATG if you get beat by the best in the division can you? Maybe they'd be seen as great if Hamed hadn't beat them? Same as Hopkins now people say he hasnt beat greats but hes fought good opp.

Yes but Barrerra was the first World Class Fighter Hamed fought who wasnt on the way down. Although Hameds people thought Barrera was on the way down, otherwise they wouldnt have made the match.

A lot of people say if Hamed was at his best he would have beaten Barerra. Trash.

No one mentioned Hamed being past his best before the opening bell of the Barrera fight.

Hamed got beat by a better fighter and did not possess the qualities to come back, avange his defeat and prove himself a great fighter.

Hamed was very talented, an awesome puncher and a very good fighter.

But not a great one.

If you believe 2001 Hamed was a patch on the 1995 Hamed then there is no point in debating with you. A combination fleet footed Hamed would beat Barrera easily.

The only reason Hameds opponents were on the way down was because they fought Hamed, power like that really destroys a fighter and makes it hard to come back from.

Fleet footed my ass( You are talking like he was a 38 year old who couldn't move in the ring) he was the big favorite going into the fight and was not good enough to change his style and beat Barrera he didn't win more than 2 rounds and lost by at least 5-6 . Morales Barrera and Pacquio will all go down in the history books as better than Hamed and he only has himself to blame he took the cowardly way out after losing and didn't have the guts to ask for a rematch.

[Graham Brett]

Morales would be more likely to get dragged into a war and catch a big shot - Barreras faster and a better counter puncher imo. On my card Hamed lost by about 2-3points from memory he won a few rounds in there and I believe could beat BArrera if he fought the right fight and was at his best.

Barrera wasnt the first GOOD fighter he fought - he fought loads of top fighters. You should look into some of the guys he fought - they werent ATGs but u cant be an ATG if you get beat by the best in the division can you? Maybe they'd be seen as great if Hamed hadn't beat them? Same as Hopkins now people say he hasnt beat greats but hes fought good opp.

Yes but Barrerra was the first World Class Fighter Hamed fought who wasnt on the way down. Although Hameds people thought Barrera was on the way down, otherwise they wouldnt have made the match.

A lot of people say if Hamed was at his best he would have beaten Barerra. Trash.

No one mentioned Hamed being past his best before the opening bell of the Barrera fight.

Hamed got beat by a better fighter and did not possess the qualities to come back, avange his defeat and prove himself a great fighter.

Hamed was very talented, an awesome puncher and a very good fighter.

But not a great one.

If you believe 2001 Hamed was a patch on the 1995 Hamed then there is no point in debating with you. A combination fleet footed Hamed would beat Barrera easily.

The only reason Hameds opponents were on the way down was because they fought Hamed, power like that really destroys a fighter and makes it hard to come back from.

You ought to look at Hamed's record and that of his opponents at the time of fighting him before making comments like that.

If you dont want to debate with me, fine, but your views seem unbalanced.

Incidentally, have you ever boxed? If you have you would know that power is only useful if you can land your shots.

Against Barrera, Hamed was incapable of this.

[jamesmcdonnell]

I don't see Hamed beating Morales at all. Morales has a granite jaw, and is technically too good to fall for Hamed's style. He also had significant height and reach advantages.

[Graham Brett]

I don't see Hamed beating Morales at all. Morales has a granite jaw, and is technically too good to fall for Hamed's style. He also had significant height and reach advantages.

I agree. Why cant some people accept that Hamed wasnt quite as good as his considerable hype. He appealed to the masses and I think this clouds peoples judgement.

Guys like Morales are just better than him, period. Accept it, get over it.

[J]

morales and mab just sneak in a top ten in my book.
see below.

1. Willie Pep
2. Sandy Saddler
3. Salvador Sanchez
4. Azumah Nelson
5. Henry Armstrong
6. Eusebio Pedroza
7. Abe Attell
8. Alexis Arguello
10.marco Barerra
10.eric Morales

[jamesmcdonnell]

Err J, half those guys aren't mexican!

[Graham Brett]

Err J, half those guys aren't mexican!

Yeah, but their grandfathers were

[J]

Err J, half those guys aren't mexican!

fornicate ME IM NOT STUPID MATE..
was just my top ten feathers i was asked to compile recently so thought it was of interest.

[jamesmcdonnell]

Well it's not, so bugger off...

Ohh, revenge is sweet.

[J]

Well it's not, so bugger off...

Ohh, revenge is sweet.

HAHA CHUCKLING HERE.

[REAL_DEAL]

really i thought Henry Armstrong was mexican joking

[jamesmcdonnell]

morales and mab just sneak in a top ten in my book.
see below.

1. Willie Pep
2. Sandy Saddler
3. Salvador Sanchez
4. Azumah Nelson
5. Henry Armstrong
6. Eusebio Pedroza
7. Abe Attell
8. Alexis Arguello
10.marco Barerra
10.eric Morales

Not a bad list, but I always feel that Sanchez is a wee bit overrated. The fact he died so young gives him the advantage, because he never had to prove himself over such a long period of time.

Interestingly, according to boxrec, he was losing on two of three scorecards going into the last round against Nelson.

Nelson's record looks better and better with the passage of time...

[Hardhitters11]

Best mexican fighter...cough cough Chavez??

Sorry if I have missed the boat but couldnt be arsed to read thru the whole thread.

[jamesmcdonnell]

There's certainly an arguement for saying Chavez, although there is a fair bit of padding on his record, his amazing consistency cannot be overlooked.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

Yes but Barrerra was the first World Class Fighter Hamed fought who wasnt on the way down. Although Hameds people thought Barrera was on the way down, otherwise they wouldnt have made the match.

A lot of people say if Hamed was at his best he would have beaten Barerra. Trash.

No one mentioned Hamed being past his best before the opening bell of the Barrera fight.

Hamed got beat by a better fighter and did not possess the qualities to come back, avange his defeat and prove himself a great fighter.

Hamed was very talented, an awesome puncher and a very good fighter.

But not a great one.

If you believe 2001 Hamed was a patch on the 1995 Hamed then there is no point in debating with you. A combination fleet footed Hamed would beat Barrera easily.

The only reason Hameds opponents were on the way down was because they fought Hamed, power like that really destroys a fighter and makes it hard to come back from.

You ought to look at Hamed's record and that of his opponents at the time of fighting him before making comments like that.

If you dont want to debate with me, fine, but your views seem unbalanced.

Incidentally, have you ever boxed? If you have you would know that power is only useful if you can land your shots.

Against Barrera, Hamed was incapable of this.

Yes I boxed in my teens and still spar at least every month. Morales is easier to land on than Barrera. Hamed couldn't get his shots off against Barrera - Morales isn't Barrera. Morales can't really get his shots off on Barrera either. Hes not as fast, defensive and not as good a tactician as Barrera.

I mean maybe Morales would beat Hamed on a UD, I just edge for Hamed as I think its a better style match up for him than MAB

Hamed had some pretty decent names on his record AFTER A FIGHTER TAKES A BRUTAL KO THEY WILL UNDERACHIEVE. Thats a fact.

Look at Hameds record - Kelly, Johnson, Robinson, Vazquez, McCullough, Sotu, Bungu, Sanchez - these were the top guys at 126lbs.

Hamed did jump ship and could have done allot more but putting Morales in another league when Hamed did a better job on common opponents is bogus.

[Phenomenal-Nutrition]

Yes but Barrerra was the first World Class Fighter Hamed fought who wasnt on the way down. Although Hameds people thought Barrera was on the way down, otherwise they wouldnt have made the match.

A lot of people say if Hamed was at his best he would have beaten Barerra. Trash.

No one mentioned Hamed being past his best before the opening bell of the Barrera fight.

Hamed got beat by a better fighter and did not possess the qualities to come back, avange his defeat and prove himself a great fighter.

Hamed was very talented, an awesome puncher and a very good fighter.

But not a great one.

If you believe 2001 Hamed was a patch on the 1995 Hamed then there is no point in debating with you. A combination fleet footed Hamed would beat Barrera easily.

The only reason Hameds opponents were on the way down was because they fought Hamed, power like that really destroys a fighter and makes it hard to come back from.

Fleet footed my ass( You are talking like he was a 38 year old who couldn't move in the ring) he was the big favorite going into the fight and was not good enough to change his style and beat Barrera he didn't win more than 2 rounds and lost by at least 5-6 . Morales Barrera and Pacquio will all go down in the history books as better than Hamed and he only has himself to blame he took the cowardly way out after losing and didn't have the guts to ask for a rematch.

Compare Ingle Hamed to none Ingle Hamed - combination punching and better footwork were there under Ingle - so yes he was past his prime in 2001.

How could Pacquiao go down better than Naz? Did he dominate 126lbs for 6years? No he lost his last 2fights

[jamesmcdonnell]

If you believe 2001 Hamed was a patch on the 1995 Hamed then there is no point in debating with you. A combination fleet footed Hamed would beat Barrera easily.

The only reason Hameds opponents were on the way down was because they fought Hamed, power like that really destroys a fighter and makes it hard to come back from.

You ought to look at Hamed's record and that of his opponents at the time of fighting him before making comments like that.

If you dont want to debate with me, fine, but your views seem unbalanced.

Incidentally, have you ever boxed? If you have you would know that power is only useful if you can land your shots.

Against Barrera, Hamed was incapable of this.

Yes I boxed in my teens and still spar at least every month. Morales is easier to land on than Barrera. Hamed couldn't get his shots off against Barrera - Morales isn't Barrera. Morales can't really get his shots off on Barrera either. Hes not as fast, defensive and not as good a tactician as Barrera.

I mean maybe Morales would beat Hamed on a UD, I just edge for Hamed as I think its a better style match up for him than MAB

Hamed had some pretty decent names on his record AFTER A FIGHTER TAKES A BRUTAL KO THEY WILL UNDERACHIEVE. Thats a fact.

Look at Hameds record - Kelly, Johnson, Robinson, Vazquez, McCullough, Sotu, Bungu, Sanchez - these were the top guys at 126lbs.

Hamed did jump ship and could have done allot more but putting Morales in another league when Hamed did a better job on common opponents is bogus.

Errr when was McCulloch a top featherweight?

I agree that Hamed was better under Ingle, but I still don't think he would have beaten Morales. Pacquaio is quicker and hits harder than Hamed ever did, and I think Morales would have decisioned him with his more reliable punch output.

Barrera I would have given him a better chance against, because Barrera struggled with movers in his earlier career, and there was little size differential.

[knockout]

have to disagree about Pac hitting harder than Hamed.......