BoxRec

gilgamesh wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 01:31 I'd still consider Fury the #2 guy behind only Usyk for the time being. A 2nd loss to Usyk or anyone else for that matter would undoubtedly drop him in the rankings. Inactivity would as well. Especially if the other top guys pick up more marquee wins while he's just on the shelf.

Why? I'd like to hear your rationale. Not necessarily for arguments sake, I just don't really understand how you can look at Fury's recent record and have him at number 2 given Klitschko was ages ago, Wilder has been proven a fraud, nobody seems to rate Whyte and there has been absolutely nothing worthwhile in the past 2 years.

Also, I can understand thinking he's the second best, but that doesn't really translate to the rankings.

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 03:12 We not voting Mak in are we?

No point in poll?

Nah, I wouldn't bother. It was a rebuild fight against Rovcanin, a fighter that Top Rank likes to match against their guys.

joshj909 wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 03:29

gilgamesh wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 01:31 I'd still consider Fury the #2 guy behind only Usyk for the time being. A 2nd loss to Usyk or anyone else for that matter would undoubtedly drop him in the rankings. Inactivity would as well. Especially if the other top guys pick up more marquee wins while he's just on the shelf.

Why? I'd like to hear your rationale. Not necessarily for arguments sake, I just don't really understand how you can look at Fury's recent record and have him at number 2 given Klitschko was ages ago, Wilder has been proven a fraud, nobody seems to rate Whyte and there has been absolutely nothing worthwhile in the past 2 years.

Also, I can understand thinking he's the second best, but that doesn't really translate to the rankings.

Because he was Champion for several years, only lost his title via Split Decision, and would be favored to beat most of the division still.

I can see ranking a few names ahead of him, but only a few.

he barely lost to our king, gave him his toughest fight, at least at hw. i dont think anyone else would push usyk quite that hard

has the best resume outside usyk, admittedly with some dating back

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 12:14 he barely lost to our king

He barely beat Ngannou. That's also being generous. Does that make Ngannou top 5?

it's not that simple. fury struggled with franny, aj blasted him out. yet fury did better against usyk than aj. fury's an enigma and clearly fights to his opposition

fury beat chisora way easier than usyk did, yet usyk beat fury

fury's last performance was top level and he has one of the best resumes. i also simply think that when push comes to shove he's just better than anyone other than usyk, possible exception aj. i lol at the thought of a guy like ZZ plodding around trying to lay a glove on usyk like fury did. and remember that your #2 joe barely beat + loss to guys like chisora and whyte that fury toyed with a couple years ago.

usyk is an excellent fighter, he wouldnt have had such a tough fight with fury if fury wasnt up there. if fury's only the 8 hw or whatever what does it say about usyk

btw i gotta lol at the suggestion that this is fury fanboi voting, clearly finky hasnt read many posts about fury from the people who voted him #2

I would consider Fury to be Usyk's best win, and the one that cements him as a top 10 ATG heavyweight. For true greatness, I'd like to see Usyk have a great rivalry. Fury at one point looked to be pulling away, and really had Usyk in trouble. I thought they would cancel each other out, but the styles actually gelled and made for brilliant fight.

That's why a rematch should happen.

If Fury's that crap, surely it devalues the win? We can't have it both ways.

So that's why Fury has to be number 2 for me.

Cyclops wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 19:02 I would consider Fury to be Usyk's best win, and the one that cements him as a top 10 ATG heavyweight. For true greatness, I'd like to see Usyk have a great rivalry. Fury at one point looked to be pulling away, and really had Usyk in trouble. I thought they would cancel each other out, but the styles actually gelled and made for brilliant fight.

That's why a rematch should happen.

If Fury's that crap, surely it devalues the win? We can't have it both ways.

So that's why Fury has to be number 2 for me.

Fury isn't crap, and he fought a great fight against Usyk. He came up short, but he still fought like a Champion.

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 12:43 btw i gotta lol at the suggestion that this is fury fanboi voting, clearly finky hasnt read many posts about fury from the people who voted him #2

Were they Wilder fans previously? Ones standing is inextricably linked to the other. I'm sure the knives will come out again once this weekend passes

Gonna be a shake up here soon..

Will do a fresh thread tmoro of course.

Big shake up

Your scoring system makes no sense and the top 20 heavyweight ranking is highly debatable. You should think about yourself as you have lost a lot of credibility recently.

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑01 Jun 2024, 20:38 Big shake up

Almost impossible for us to get it right because Dubois > Hrgovic > Zhang > Joyce > Dubois + Parker > Zhang

atm looks like i\ll prob go zhang 5, dub 6 or 7. i cant rate joyce ahead of dubs still

joshj909 wrote: ↑02 Jun 2024, 08:51

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑01 Jun 2024, 20:38 Big shake up

Almost impossible for us to get it right because Dubois > Hrgovic > Zhang > Joyce > Dubois + Parker > Zhang

At this moment throw names in a hat and pull them out.
Only the top 4 Usyk, Fury, Joshua and Parker are guaranteed spots.
The rest can be mixed up how ever you think

gilgamesh wrote: ↑29 May 2024, 01:10

Cyclops wrote: ↑28 May 2024, 19:02 I would consider Fury to be Usyk's best win, and the one that cements him as a top 10 ATG heavyweight. For true greatness, I'd like to see Usyk have a great rivalry. Fury at one point looked to be pulling away, and really had Usyk in trouble. I thought they would cancel each other out, but the styles actually gelled and made for brilliant fight.

That's why a rematch should happen.

If Fury's that crap, surely it devalues the win? We can't have it both ways.

So that's why Fury has to be number 2 for me.

Fury isn't crap, and he fought a great fight against Usyk. He came up short, but he still fought like a Champion.

Fury vs Joshua would absolutely clarify matters.

It's undeniable that Fury's resume has taken a severe hit in recent months (Wallin, Ngannou and Wilder have all seen to that) and his drug fuelled win against an oddly lackluster Wlad was way back in November 2015.

Meanwhile on the other side of boxing's HW divide, Joshua, Parker, Zhang, Usyk, Dubois have all gone from strength to strength.

Since Fury has only fought 1 of these and lost, he could easily be as low as number 6!

I'd probably go:

1. Usyk
2. Joshua
3. Fury
4. Parker
5. Dubois
6. Kabayel
7. Zhang

With the rest of the field nowhere. Couldn't rate them as they are terrible (Anderson is like an even worse version of Michael Grant and nowhere nears as strong - Hrg is like a very, very poor man's Vitali) Parker, a lovely guy, is just too dull and does most things ok and is tough but an average HW, reasonable boxing skills. Could make a case for Fury to be 2nd, due to his close loss to Uysk but,his legacy is getting diminished each time.

Add to that, he barely squeaked past McDermott and Ngannou and went hell for leather with an abysmally poor Wilder and Wallin.

As said, in another thread (not by me), for 10 yrs the division has been locked down in BS, promises and hype, which I agree with.

So a couple of names deserve their spot, Uysk, obviously, AJ as he does want to fight anyone (he always has) and, at least, has ok skills and can punch. Kabayel, can fight solidly but not exactly lighting up the division and Dubois, however he is clearly a manufactured boxer with no natural talent, just a big lump who works hard and can whack a bit (and a nice bloke, apparently)..

Quality has dropped massively this last decade and can only hope someone (or a couple) come along and get things going again.

joshj909 wrote: ↑02 Jun 2024, 08:51

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑01 Jun 2024, 20:38 Big shake up

Almost impossible for us to get it right because Dubois > Hrgovic > Zhang > Joyce > Dubois + Parker > Zhang

We can sort it..

Use the "you're only as good as your last fight(or last couple)"

This is what happens when contenders fight each other..

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑02 Jun 2024, 08:53 atm looks like i\ll prob go zhang 5, dub 6 or 7. i cant rate joyce ahead of dubs still

Zhang 5, Dubois 6, Kabayel 7, Joyce 8 looks about right. Think I'll be taking Wilder out altogether tbh, he looks absolutely shot.

Gonna post it now