BoxRec

i agree, marciano was very inexperienced an green, and lowry nearly won the decision.

I see no reason to doubt that Shavers hit harder than Tyson. Shavers punching power seems evident from his fights aside from Homes. The knockdown of Holmes sounds like it was fairly devastating but I have not actually seen it.

Cojimar 1945 wrote:I see no reason to doubt that Shavers hit harder than Tyson. Shavers punching power seems evident from his fights aside from Homes. The knockdown of Holmes sounds like it was fairly devastating but I have not actually seen it.

See it. Holmes was poleaxed but up at about 3

Downloadable from emule

Cojimar 1945 wrote:I see no reason to doubt that Shavers hit harder than Tyson. Shavers punching power seems evident from his fights aside from Homes. The knockdown of Holmes sounds like it was fairly devastating but I have not actually seen it.

I agree. Most fighters who fought Shavers say he was a devastating puncher and the punch he decked Holmes with would've left most other fighters on the canvas for the count.

It's interesting that a few of Tysons opponents don't actually think Tyson was the hardest puncher they faced. ie. Ribalta says Smith, Pinklon Thomas says Weaver, Holmes says Shavers and Holyfield says Bowe. I think its more a case that Tyson hits you with several punches in the time others may have only landed one punch.

Tyson also had excellent handspeed for a HW so some of the punches would not have been seen by some opponents. This compounds the effects of the punch but doesn't necessarily mean he punched any harder than he actually did

evndrbsn wrote: He also rated the top three heavyweights of all-time:

"(1) Me [Ali]
(2) Jack Johnson
(3) Joe Louis"

Here is his list of 'The Ten Best-Looking Heavyweight Champions Ever' ---

"I'm number one. After me, it don't matter."

--> After me, it don't matter. what a clown .. how dare he say these words when Ken Norton and Frazie beat his balls off. He and his early Ruizing around the ring - blind bat this cat.

bollox wrote:Tyson also had excellent handspeed for a HW so some of the punches would not have been seen by some opponents. This compounds the effects of the punch but doesn't necessarily mean he punched any harder than he actually did

he shoked oponents it seemed and then followed up. He punched harder when he commited to a punch like shavers which is logical. But usually he threw combinations. it's also logical that Holmes tryes to downgrade Tyson's achievement in KO-ing him .

cultus wrote:

evndrbsn wrote: He also rated the top three heavyweights of all-time:

"(1) Me [Ali]
(2) Jack Johnson
(3) Joe Louis"

Here is his list of 'The Ten Best-Looking Heavyweight Champions Ever' ---

"I'm number one. After me, it don't matter."

--> After me, it don't matter. what a clown .. how dare he say these words when Ken Norton and Frazie beat his balls off. He and his early Ruizing around the ring - blind bat this cat.

He was talking about his looks (it is The Ten Best-Looking Heavyweight Champions Ever list after all), not his ring skills. For best fighter, he named three.

BC
Chuck You have fought a lot of very good fighters in your career, Sonny Liston was one of them. What was it like to fight that guy?

Chuck Wepner
VERY TOUGH, HE WAS THE BIGGEST PUNCHER I EVER FOUGHT IF YOU DON’T CONSIDER 72 STITCHES, A BROKEN NOSE, AND A BROKEN LEFT CHEEK BONE A TOUGH FIGHT, HE NEVER LANDED A PUNCH. HAHA

evndrbsn wrote:

cultus wrote:

evndrbsn wrote: He also rated the top three heavyweights of all-time:

"(1) Me [Ali]
(2) Jack Johnson
(3) Joe Louis"

Here is his list of 'The Ten Best-Looking Heavyweight Champions Ever' ---

"I'm number one. After me, it don't matter."

--> After me, it don't matter. what a clown .. how dare he say these words when Ken Norton and Frazie beat his balls off. He and his early Ruizing around the ring - blind bat this cat.

He was talking about his looks (it is The Ten Best-Looking Heavyweight Champions Ever list after all), not his ring skills. For best fighter, he named three.

uups

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:i wouldnt take holmes opinion to seriosely, he said butterbean hit harder than tyson

Have you ever been hit by Tyson or Butterbean?

Nuff said

Carmen Basilio said that Sugar Ray Robinson was the hardest puncher he fought, which is interesting in the context of this thread because he absolutely hated him.

The only way you can know who hit the hardest between tyson and shavers is to measure there punch power scientifically like marcianos was measured and how can you beleive a fighter when he says so and so hit me harder , oliver mccall says buster douglas hit harder than tyson or lewis but douglas couldnt of hit harder than tyson or lewis because tyson and lewis have way more knockouts . Evander holyfield says that bowe hit him the hardest but yet tubbs who also fought bowe says that tyson hit him the hardest .

...another tommy farr quote..when asked if joe louis was a hard puncher he'd say "if he he wasn't then don't know who put these ruddy knobs on my head".

jake lamotta said bob satterfield hit him the hardest...but most of the guys who fought satterfield said that.

There may be a degree of 'the better the fighter the harder he hits' going on here

Who'd to say that Butterbean doesn't hit harder than say, Tyson?

Archie Moore said Curtis "Hatchet Man" Sheppard was the hardest puncher he ever faced. He also made apoint out of saying SHeppard was a bigger puncher than Rocky Marciano.

-KOKid-

Archie Moore said Curtis "Hatchet Man" Sheppard was the hardest puncher he ever faced. He also made apoint out of saying SHeppard was a bigger puncher than Rocky Marciano.

he faced the 55 rocky. the rocky in his late years became a complete swarmer and didnt knock u out with one punch anymore, which was because goldman changed his style to throw shorter punches which enabled him to become a better boxer and throw more punches, but because of shortening his punches he lost power. he became a grind u down type guy late in his career.


ever wonder why rock had brutal one punch KOs early in his career then very late in his career he stopped knocking out guys with one punch?

he became an accumalitve puncher and grind u down type guy late.


but the 51-52 marciano was more of a slugger and one punch KO artist, and tht was when marciano had his most power.


so moore never tested rockys true power, but instead had to deal with a slow worn down beating


kinda interesting about his change in styles huh??

a lot of people said walcott him them the hardest


- marciano did

- sheppard did

- even big abe simon did

- im sure charles rates him high from that left hook

its funny how fighters say which opponents hit harder than others and then they say the one we didnt expect them to pick.

but there in the ring with them so they know

shyguy wrote:The only way you can know who hit the hardest between tyson and shavers is to measure there punch power scientifically like marcianos was measured and how can you beleive a fighter when he says so and so hit me harder , oliver mccall says buster douglas hit harder than tyson or lewis but douglas couldnt of hit harder than tyson or lewis because tyson and lewis have way more knockouts . Evander holyfield says that bowe hit him the hardest but yet tubbs who also fought bowe says that tyson hit him the hardest .

I don't agree. Just because Tyson had a lot of KO's doesn't mean he necessarily punches harder than someone else with less KO's. Tysons hand speed was a major factor, its normally the punches you don't see that knock you out and you are unlikely to remember being knocked out to comment on the punch that done it.

Several fighters said Tyson wasn't the hardest puncher they fought like Pinklon Thomas, Holmes, Ribalta and Holyfield so as they were the ones taking the punches I guess they are the best people to judge.

There have been some big punchers over the years that didn't have great KO records, like Joe Choynski or Mike Weaver.

BrocktonBlockbuster49 wrote:

ever wonder why rock had brutal one punch KOs early in his career then very late in his career he stopped knocking out guys with one punch?

He was a brutal one punch KO artist in his early career because the opposition wasn't great. He struggled later in his career because the opposition was better.

Controversial wrote:

shyguy wrote:The only way you can know who hit the hardest between tyson and shavers is to measure there punch power scientifically like marcianos was measured and how can you beleive a fighter when he says so and so hit me harder , oliver mccall says buster douglas hit harder than tyson or lewis but douglas couldnt of hit harder than tyson or lewis because tyson and lewis have way more knockouts . Evander holyfield says that bowe hit him the hardest but yet tubbs who also fought bowe says that tyson hit him the hardest .

I don't agree. Just because Tyson had a lot of KO's doesn't mean he necessarily punches harder than someone else with less KO's. Tysons hand speed was a major factor, its normally the punches you don't see that knock you out and you are unlikely to remember being knocked out to comment on the punch that done it.

Several fighters said Tyson wasn't the hardest puncher they fought like Pinklon Thomas, Holmes, Ribalta and Holyfield so as they were the ones taking the punches I guess they are the best people to judge.

There have been some big punchers over the years that didn't have great KO records, like Joe Choynski or Mike Weaver.

Also, measuring the impact of someones punch in a "scientific" setting doesn't really reflect how hard a fighter may be able to punch another fighter in a boxing match. Too many variables involved in the fight to be able to recreate "scientifically".

He was a brutal one punch KO artist in his early career because the opposition wasn't great. He struggled later in his career because the opposition was better.

ezzard charles, moore, cockell?? better than

walcott, mathews, layne, lastarza and all early victims???

he didnt face better opposition later in his career. his style changed. marciano knocked out kid mathews two left hooks, only time mathews ever been knocked out in over 100 pro fights.

rex layne took bob satterfields best punches, yet one right hand from marciano knocked him out cold

one right hand knocked walcott out cold

i could go on and on


Marciano was both types of a KO artist. You ever noticed the change? After the first Walcott fight, his style changed. The best comparison I heard someone use was "Before Walcott he was the Atomic Bomb. After Walcott he was the pneumatic drill."
Look at the Layne, Matthews, Louis and Walcott, lastarza fights, then compare them to the LaStarza, Charles, Cockell and Moore fights, there's a difference.


Watch specificully his fights with Layne, Matthews, and Walcott both times. He had devastating one-punch knockout power in either hand.

However, towards the end of his career, Goldman tinkered with his style. In his fights with Layne, Louis, Savold, Matthews, and Walcott, Marciano constantly winds up with one enormous haymaker after another. Then, in his defenses against LaStarza, Charles, Cockell, and Moore, his style changed somewhat, to where instead of loading up his entire body into every shot looking for a one-punch KO, he slightly decreased the power he put into each shot and increased the volume of punches he threw, fighting as more of an accumulation/volume puncher.

I don't think people really understand what an incredible knockout artist Marciano was. He had both methods in spades. He could take you out with one punch at any second over the entire 15 rounds, but if he couldn't get you that way, he still just battered you into submission with barrage after barrage. Marciano was incredible in both respects and was truly perhaps one of the most effective knockout artist who has ever lived.

All i know is that before tyson won the title every fighter he faced said he hit them the hardest by far and that he had inhuman power but then after he won the title fighters started saying that tyson didnt hit that hard its obvious holmes , thomas etc have an agenda against tyson . tyson is without doubt one of the hardest hitters in history he is the only guy to knock thomas out , holmes out,the first fighter to knock tubbs out and the only guy to knock francois botha with one punch and the first to knock him out .

..hatchetman sheppard comes up on the list of the hardest or one of the hardest hitters by just about everybody who fought him. broke a guy's collar bone once (moore always said this with a touch of awe in his voice) and was the only guy ever to kayo the strong chinned joey maxim...one punch...first round. (maxim outpointed him a few weeks later. rematches happened that often in those days)