lvlarc_uk wrote:He can definetly hang with the greats, Greb, Monzon, Hagler but to pick Hopkins by KO is abit rediculous. Hagler took full blooded shots from the hardest hitting middleweights, notably Hearns and came back stronger. Hagler by UD for me.
i see your point. his head is maybe the hardest i've seen. I'd go for Hopkins to frustrate Hagler, to win on points. Hagler was often open for the lead rights, which Hopkins - at his best - made an art of.
Hopkins was sharper than a needle at his best. Hagler cuffed and swung his shots until he found his range proper. Those leave him so vulnerable to be countered by a guy with great alertness and swift, sneaky countering. Compact, fast, accurate guys troubled Hagler. Hopkins' sense of distance and strength would mean he wouldn't need to run like Leonard.
lvlarc_uk wrote:He can definetly hang with the greats, Greb, Monzon, Hagler but to pick Hopkins by KO is abit rediculous. Hagler took full blooded shots from the hardest hitting middleweights, notably Hearns and came back stronger. Hagler by UD for me.
i see your point. his head is maybe the hardest i've seen. I'd go for Hopkins to frustrate Hagler, to win on points. Hagler was often open for the lead rights, which Hopkins - at his best - made an art of.
Hopkins was sharper than a needle at his best. Hagler cuffed and swung his shots until he found his range proper. Those leave him so vulnerable to be countered by a guy with great alertness and swift, sneaky countering. Compact, fast, accurate guys troubled Hagler. Hopkins' sense of distance and strength would mean he wouldn't need to run like Leonard.
I dont see any MW in history stopping either Hagler or Hopkins.
I think there is a tendency in guys between 32 and 45 who like me look back on the Hagler era with rose tinted lenses.
Hopkins would give Marvin a lot of trouble, remember Duran?
tring to be totally realistic I'd lean to hagler, say 53% - 47%, but only coz Marvin did 15 rounds on a few occasions.
Hopkins top 6 ATG for me no question.
WE SHOULD BE PROUD OF HIM FFS
HE IS A CREDIT TO BOXING. A GREAT MAN AND A GREAT FIGHTER
I admit, I'm from a newer generation of boxing fans. I grew up disappointed watching videos of Hagler looking very sloppy against Duran, Mugabi and Leonard (around '96, when I was about 15). Meanwhile, I overcome my boredom at phony spectacles of seeing DLH and Jones, and keep reading about this Hopkins guy.
So I don't have that Hagler fondness. At least not until I saw him grind down a whole generation of undervalued middles. But this guy could be outboxed. Duran hit him with right hands all night and took nothing hurtful. Was there ever a guy less suited to middle than Duran? He was perfect for 135, a stumpy armed welterweight and at m/w was a guy with conditioning problems. Yet he was hitting Hagler with rights all night, and all that was coming at him were arm punches.
Ppl always say there was something wrong with Hopkins' opponents. But I think he outclassed so many ppl that a tendency has been to say Tito was one-dimensional, DLH not suited to middle, Tarver was shot at light heavy - instead of giving him props for beating the elite of 147, 154, 175. Well Tito carried his huge shot up to middle, which most experts felt would be enough. and DLH was a natural welter - not a natural light, at light he came in the ring a welter, at light welter we was too skinny - whose best wins came at light middle.
Hopkins was a much more sophisticated fighter than Hagler. He also has the punch anticipation, advanced sense of timing and punching speed of class fighters from smaller divisions (see how he beat DLH to the punch, at the age of 40), which are what gave Hagler so many problems. But Hopkins was a very strong and needle sharp puncher, on top of that.
Ppl assume that Echols, Allen, Council, Mercado, Glen Johnson, Joppy, Keith Holmes were naff. I beg to differ. Echols was a dangerous bastard with a great punch. Allen beat Council and boxed superbly in the 1st Hopkins fight. Council gave Winky life and death. Johnson we know is good. Joppy was a classy fighter. Holmes was tricky. Hopkins figured them out & punished them so badly, and damn near ruined most of 'em.
Not all the guys Hagler beat were at their best. I mean, if we're going to be picky, Antuofermo was ruined not by Hagler, but Minter! Only then did Hagler truly master Vito. Hearns' legs were dead after having a massage pre fight. Mugabi was dangerous, but his only world title win - at 154 - was due to his opponent slipping over and twisting his ankle for Christ's sake!
jamesmcdonnell wrote:He beat his share of former champs, Reid, Brewer, Mitchell, Eubank (yes I know, Eubank was a late sub), there are plenty of champions with worse resumes than Calzaghe. Perhaps a B- is more apt. However, you have to give him some props for staying unbeaten so long. Whilst a lot of Hopkins opponents were considered top 10, the middleweight division sucked arse for a very long time.
168 wasnt exactly a hotbed of talent though. As I recall it was once considered the weakest division bar Cruiserweight.
