BoxRec

mark thompson wrote:

G0mez wrote:

black panther wrote:Froch has his hands full with Pascal - needs to focus on the task at hand IMO. Pascal is a talented fighter - based on form Froch should win but its not an easy fight by any means. Calzaghe is just looking to add to his retirement fund - as james said the biggest paydays for the lowest reward. Admittedly I would have liked to see Froch-Calzaghe rather than fights with Bika/Manfredo/Ashira etc but lets be honest Froch has beaten no-one of note on the world stage.(Reid was shot IMO)

Some good points Panther. But a slight contradiction don't you think?

I mean does anyone know who Ashira, Bika or Manfredo beat at World Level to deserve a fight?

For starters they had 0, 1 and 4 fights respectively at Supermiddle before climbing in that ring.. all little people.

Bika had a fight with Markus Bayer and drew early, due to a dodgy cut i think but apparently looked pretty good.

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Chambers2 wrote:
What had Ashira, Bika, Manfredo and Salem done to warrant their tilt at JC, had they earnt the right?

We both know this Calzaghe-Froch argument inside out and both of us have valid points IMO, the arguments are all based around the risk:reward ratio. I think that JC should have fought Froch instead of the boxers I listed above as he's at the very worst he's in the same class and it was a BIG Battle Of Britain clash (which I have a soft spot for), but I appreciate that it's an idealistic view as there are numerous obstacles in the way (warring promoters being a BIG stumbling block, Ashira and co were probably abit cheaper than Froch, Ashira and co were definately less of a risk to JC than the Gifted Cobra....)

Manfredo brought a FUCKIN MASSIVE PAYDAY as he was a former contenders star, Calzaghe got a crowd of 35,000 and a multimillion pound payday as a result, for a very easy nights work.

You are answering your own question. Calzaghe has already fought the best of the 168 lb fighters in Kessler, why is he going to fight Froch, who would undoubtedly want paying very well himself?

Ashira etc, were marking time opponents, they didn't need paying too well (with the exception of Mafredo who probably got a nice payday), and they enabled Calzaghe to keep sharp, whilst waiting for bigger fights. Ashira as I recall was a tuneup for Lacy or Kessler, forget which.

mark thompson wrote:

G0mez wrote:Good Post WildWaylon DD

But what if Joe's brittle hand goes ? or if Froch catches him, he know's how to finish unlike Hopkins. Like i always say, if Calzaghe is so many leagues above Froch - why don't he fight him? he has fought a lot of little people since Lacy whilst Froch was top 10 in all bodies.

A Froch v calzaghe fight would draw at least 12,000 Froch fans for that, no problem.

7,500 capacity for the Pascal fight i imagine... and they won't be Canadians i can assure you Whiteboy. He got nearly that for Robin Reid which was just a British title defence.

Like I said, when Joe fought for his WBOgus title against Eubank, it was his 26th fight on the undercard to Ryan Rhodes V Yuri Epifantsev / Hamed v Badillo at Sheffield Arena which holds 9,000 for boxing matches. There was what, 150 fans of his there? ok let's say 200 ? Everyone nowadays are just bandwagon fans who fell of Ricky Hatton's following his defeat to Mayweather - and this is back in the day when boxing was still big news in the 1990's.

No comparison at all between their respective title fights with regards fans and TV exposure.

where do you keep getting 12,000 fans from ?? you keep contradicting yourself too if Froch can sell 12,000 tickets no problem why isn't his promoter putting him in a venue that can hold 12,000 fans ????

WildWaylon wrote:Froch is a fool if he thinks he can goad Calzaghe into fighting him. Froch had his chance with Calzaghe and didnt take it. He should have loked at the long term, not beefed on about how much more Calzaghe would have earned fighting him. Froch is a very talented boxer, has a superb amateur record and so far hes done very well as a pro but that doesnt mean he is going all the way. I think any argement about Froch beating Calzaghe is not only flawed but rediculous as well. He just doesnt have the speed and movement Calzaghe has, so his only chance would be the KO, and Joe can take a punch, get up from it, and go on to win. They are in different leagues so its just about as daft as Khan thinking he could beat Pacman. Froch seems to have a similar mentality to Khan, arrogance and a lack of respect for other fighters. He could end up on his back just like Khan as well if he doesnt show enough respect for Pascal. That copycat Naz style will let him down at the top level because he just doesnt have the speed. I keep saying it, the first rules in boxing are keep your hands up and defend yourself at all times, and Froch doesnt. Pascal isnt fighting Froch just for the money, he wants the title and will give Froch a hard time. If Froch was fighting Kessler I would give him no chance, Kessler would knock him out cold. Thats another thing Kessler couldnt handle Calzaghes speed so how the eff could Froch. Listen, Froch is the pupil, Calzaghe is the master, he needs to show him more respect.

G0mez wrote:
Like Froch or not, if your a boxing fan (not Joe's banker) then you'd be shouting out for this fight at home on your doorstep practically. Instead everyone pulls this potential fight down to the ground which is crazy.

Chambers2 wrote:

G0mez wrote:
Like Froch or not, if your a boxing fan (not Joe's banker) then you'd be shouting out for this fight at home on your doorstep practically. Instead everyone pulls this potential fight down to the ground which is crazy.

Exactafcukingmundo!

http://www.BS.com/?m=show&opt= ... le&id=8255

Given the lack of clarification on the terms of allegedly’s offer for British and Commonwealth super middleweight champion Carl Froch to challenge WBO champion Joe Calzaghe, Froch’s promoter Mick Hennessy has tabled a proposal of his own to stage the all-British super fight on a Hennessy Sports event either this July or September.

“After being made aware of allegedly’s comments over the last few days, I’m pleased to confirm that negotiations have started with his company Sports Network about a super fight between Carl Froch and Joe Calzaghe,” confirmed Hennessy.

“We were keen to negotiate this fight in the background to its conclusion, but articles published in the News of the World, The Nottingham Evening Post and the Guardian have left me no option but to go on record and address this matter.”

Hennessy explained: “Sports Network’s matchmaker first got in touch with us at the end of last week to ask if we were serious about making the fight. I said: ‘of course: very serious’.

“I explained we were fine with it being staged by Sports Network if the deal was right, but stressed that there couldn’t be any options on Carl Froch’s future fights.

“The matchmaker suggested that this could pose a problem and that allegedly would require some kind of options if Carl beat Calzaghe, but told me that he would get back to me. I then received a simple text on Saturday morning with a money offer for July or September, but there was no mention of the situation regarding options.

“I requested clarification on their position regarding options in writing to our fax number, but received nothing. The lack of response suggests there is an issue, but this would appear to contradict allegedly’s comments in the Guardian yesterday. At this moment, their stance on options is still unclear to me.

“I am happy to continue negotiations for Carl to box on a Sports Network event, but need to know they won’t require an involvement in Carl’s career after the fight if he wins. Given allegedly’s apparent confidence in Calzaghe, it would be a contradiction if they did.”

Unbeaten British and Commonwealth champion Froch has been promoted by Hennessy since his professional debut five years ago. He is currently ranked third by the WBO and second by the WBC, having stopped 17 of his 21 victims. He will move up a position in both rankings once Bute is removed for contesting a final eliminator for the IBF championship, leaving him at #1 with the WBC.

Hennessy has long claimed a fight between the Nottingham boxer and Calzaghe is a marquee affair that would create significant nationwide and global interest. In order to make it happen, he has attempted to set the politics aside and made a firm offer of his own.

“This is a massive fight, between two of the best fighters in the world who both happen to be British,” added Hennessy. “Joe Calzaghe is a great champion and a true warrior. I believe it will take a very special fighter to beat him, but I believe Carl Froch to be just that.

“This is a marquee contest that needs to happen and options shouldn’t get in the way. As such, I have attempted to put all the confusion to one side and made an offer to stage the fight in either July or September.

“I feel the offer was very generous. If you take the amounts that the champion and challenger receive from WBO purse bids, (75/25%), my offer values the total fight at twice the amount of allegedly’s. It would also result in Joe Calzaghe receiving 6 times the amount of Sports Network’s offer to Carl.”

Unfortunately, the proposal has already been knocked back.

“Within an hour of sending the offer, it was turned down by their matchmaker,” said Hennessy a short while ago. “The text offer to Carl was also re-iterated as a final offer, but did not mention whether they required options or not.

“I have again sought clarification on this. There is little point in us even discussing the offer they have made for Carl to box on a Sports Network show until we know their position for certain.

“Once they have stated in writing, as requested, that they do not require options, we can look at the possibility seriously. They have stated that the offer was their last, but I am confident that through ongoing dialogue we could come to an arrangement that reflects the magnitude of this fight.

“This contest could be one of the biggest in British Boxing history. Calzaghe already holds the record for the highest indoor attendance, but it would be blown away if he met Carl Froch.

“I see Jermain Taylor has turned a big offer down. There now isn’t a bigger viable fight out there for Calzaghe, so I’m hopeful his team will be realistic going forward.

“In light of their rejection, I have also asked what terms would be acceptable to Joe Calzaghe to defend against Carl on one of our shows. I am still very hopeful that this contest can happen, regardless of whose event it is on.”

G0mez wrote:

mark thompson wrote:

G0mez wrote:Good Post WildWaylon DD

But what if Joe's brittle hand goes ? or if Froch catches him, he know's how to finish unlike Hopkins. Like i always say, if Calzaghe is so many leagues above Froch - why don't he fight him? he has fought a lot of little people since Lacy whilst Froch was top 10 in all bodies.

A Froch v calzaghe fight would draw at least 12,000 Froch fans for that, no problem.

7,500 capacity for the Pascal fight i imagine... and they won't be Canadians i can assure you Whiteboy. He got nearly that for Robin Reid which was just a British title defence.

Like I said, when Joe fought for his WBOgus title against Eubank, it was his 26th fight on the undercard to Ryan Rhodes V Yuri Epifantsev / Hamed v Badillo at Sheffield Arena which holds 9,000 for boxing matches. There was what, 150 fans of his there? ok let's say 200 ? Everyone nowadays are just bandwagon fans who fell of Ricky Hatton's following his defeat to Mayweather - and this is back in the day when boxing was still big news in the 1990's.

No comparison at all between their respective title fights with regards fans and TV exposure.

where do you keep getting 12,000 fans from ?? you keep contradicting yourself too if Froch can sell 12,000 tickets no problem why isn't his promoter putting him in a venue that can hold 12,000 fans ????

Were talking about how many fans to date, that Joe's opponents have brought with them. My forecasted number of fans is not unrealistic by any stretch of the imagination.

Are you telling me, that if he can easily get 7,000+ for a British defence, that a marquee fight with Calzaghe wouldn't bring at least 12,000 Froch supporters ?

Without going right round the houses again, My point is, If Joe can fill a 50,000 arena with 45,000 of his own supporters, then think of what a Froch fight would generate. His excuse is that 'there's no money for a Froch fight' - well that's been well and truly squashed in my opinion.

Let's say Froch does beat Pascal in style, wins the World Title and then calls Joe out for a fight, catchweight or otherwise - you say it shouldn't happen?

Like Froch or not, if your a boxing fan (not Joe's banker) then you'd be shouting out for this fight at home on your doorstep practically. Instead everyone pulls this potential fight down to the ground which is crazy.

Joe is a free agent and Hennessy could put this fight on ITV prime time and i'm sure it would be worth a few quid to Joe too.

Bring it on I say.

johnswan1 wrote:Froch shouldn't be looking at his share of the pot compared to Joes. The monetary value of the offer is what should be considered against what he would expect to make in alternative fights. I agree that they would not want to give Warren options over Carl, but if Carl was that confident of beating JC he should be gambling because a) it would still most likely be his biggest payday to date and b) if he were to win it would propel him to stardom and a larger slice of bigger pots in future that he may not otherwise have.

Twinkle Toes wrote:Froch is doing what other Hennessey fighters have done before - Riding the coat tails of another fighters success.

mark thompson wrote:Nice post gomez but, Calzaghe v Froch would hardly be a Eubank v Benn fight would it ?? Froch is just not really a house hold name unfortunately !!!!

Chambers2 wrote:

johnswan1 wrote:Froch shouldn't be looking at his share of the pot compared to Joes. The monetary value of the offer is what should be considered against what he would expect to make in alternative fights. I agree that they would not want to give Warren options over Carl, but if Carl was that confident of beating JC he should be gambling because a) it would still most likely be his biggest payday to date and b) if he were to win it would propel him to stardom and a larger slice of bigger pots in future that he may not otherwise have.

Did you read Gomez's excellent last post?? Sports Network wouldn't make the fight without having further options on his career, it strikes me that it was Warren and possibly Calzaghe that were lacking in confidence, else why would further options on Carls career be essential in making the fight happen. Frank has been trying to get hold of Froch for years and this was just another one of his attempts at getting him on board.

TwentySix - If Dean Francis was ranked in the top few in the World then yes I believe that Froch would give him his shot

jamesmcdonnell wrote:

Chambers2 wrote:

johnswan1 wrote:Froch shouldn't be looking at his share of the pot compared to Joes. The monetary value of the offer is what should be considered against what he would expect to make in alternative fights. I agree that they would not want to give Warren options over Carl, but if Carl was that confident of beating JC he should be gambling because a) it would still most likely be his biggest payday to date and b) if he were to win it would propel him to stardom and a larger slice of bigger pots in future that he may not otherwise have.

Did you read Gomez's excellent last post?? Sports Network wouldn't make the fight without having further options on his career, it strikes me that it was Warren and possibly Calzaghe that were lacking in confidence, else why would further options on Carls career be essential in making the fight happen. Frank has been trying to get hold of Froch for years and this was just another one of his attempts at getting him on board.

TwentySix - If Dean Francis was ranked in the top few in the World then yes I believe that Froch would give him his shot

Froch is at an entirely different stage of his career!

Calzaghe is almost 10 years older, is plagued with injuries and coming to the end of a long career, Froch started late and has a good 6-7 years left as he doesn't have much wear and tear.

Calzaghe gave Reid a shot at his title earlier in his career, but at this stage, Froch simply hasn't done enough to warrant a shot. It's not Carl's fault, his career started way later than Calzaghes, they are virtually from different eras.

Let it go, it's not going to happen, and whilst there is much to criticize in Calzaghes career, not facing Froch is not reason to do so. Froch isn't big enough to warrant the risk he entails, which is fairly sizeable.

Froch should focus his energies in getting Kessler in the ring, not Calzaghe.

Chambers2 wrote:

mark thompson wrote:Nice post gomez but, Calzaghe v Froch would hardly be a Eubank v Benn fight would it ?? Froch is just not really a house hold name unfortunately !!!!

Froch is not unheard of either, he's fought on BBC and almost in ITV (Inkin's a cuntt). He'll be a household name on December 7th.

I believe that Calzaghe will retire rather than face Froch or Pavlik next, I hope I'm wrong (but it's rare)