BoxRec

Aragon & Salas . . .

Art Aragon was my uncles favorite fighter, and he also liked Salas. I remember as a kid, I heard my dad & uncle talking about the street fight that the Golden Boy had with the "Little Lion from Monterrey"

A reporter, John Hall, was interviewing Aragon one day, and asked Art about the street fight with Lauro Salas.

Hall asked, "Art, is it true that Salas knocked you down five times in the alley?"

Aragon snapped back, "He's a damn liar, two of them were slips!"


-Rick

Rick or Frank,Been to fights at the Olympic,Forum,and Sports Arena in LA. I notice there were a lot of fights in San Pedro. Unloaded fish there once in a while. Where were the fights in Pedro? Thanks Dago

Dagos . . .

San Pedro was a bit before I came along, but I know Frank is familar with that era. To be honest, I have a lot of information on some of those venues, courtesy of Hap Navarro & historian Chuck Johnson, but I don't really KNOW IT well enough yet to comment.

I will say this, there were a couple of brothers who fought out of San Pedro way back, The Ponce Brothers. One was Joe, Bobby Chacon's future mentor. The other, I'm sorry, but off-hand I can't think of his name.

-Rick

OK here's one that has always made me wonder. The old fights in Vernon, California. Is that in the Watts area now,or somewhere else?

A press confernce was held today for the Rafael Marquez vs Israel Vazquez fight to be held on Saturday.

I got there late, but was able to shoot this pic. of Marquez as he was been interview.

Here is another pic. of Rafael Marquez

Speaking of Joe Ponce, Bobby Chacon's old trainer.

I was checking the ring record of Joe Ponce, and discovered that he had his last professional bout on a fairly interesting evening at the old Gilmore Stadium in L.A. The date was October 27, 1943.

In the main event, Sammy Angott defended his world lightweight title against "Slugger" White. Four rounds into the title fight, the lights failed at the outdoor arena, forcing the match to be halted for one hour, seven minutes. When the lights went back on, Angott defeated White over 15 rounds.

In a prelim, Joey Barnum stooped Joe Ponce in five rounds. Thirty-five years later, Joe Ponce would meet 15-year-old Bobby Chacon. The rest is history.


-Rick

kikibalt wrote:
A press confernce was held today for the Rafael Marquez vs Israel Vazquez to be held on Saturday.

I got there late, but was able to shoot this pic. of Marquez as he was been interview.

Frank,This should be another war. Who are you picking?

dagosd2000 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:
A press confernce was held today for the Rafael Marquez vs Israel Vazquez to be held on Saturday.

I got there late, but was able to shoot this pic. of Marquez as he was been interview.

Frank,This should be another war. Who are you picking?

Nobody!! it that kind of a fight.

Joey B., if you ask him about getting ko by fighter x, he would tell you that he took a dive, one dive that we know he did take was against Art Aragon in Albuqerque, New Mexico.

Rick,
Victor "Kid" Ponce (R) was a nephew of Joe Ponce, he was one of the many good fighters we had in L.A. in the early 1950's.

Archie Moore had a training camp up in the foothills outside San Diego in a small town named Ramona. When I worked for the County of San Diego years later,I'd drive out that windy road to see what was left of the place. The few wooden houses were empty. The area was nothing but sage brush and tumbleweeds rolling along with the wind. Moore was still alive,but I think he had sold the property.

Moore would tell the story of how a young Cassius Clay was sent to him as a teenager to develop his boxing skills at that camp.I had always thought that Moore wanted to show Clay how to box like him,but Moore told me different. Moore knew Clay was going to grow into a heavyweight,so Moore told him,"Why dance around at that weight,when I can show you how to get better leverage on your punches so you can knock guys out?"
Moore said that Clay was hard to train. Didn't listen much. Besides he wanted an entourage around to feed his ego. Clay wanted to look stylish in the ring,more like Sugar Ray Robinson(later Robinson refused to train Clay when he was asked). Archie said that many of the things Clay was doing in the ring were unnecessary. Moore also said that Clay didn't want to earn his keep like the other fighters who were training at Ramona. He refused to do chores like the other guys. Moore told him there was a reason for it. Moore wanted to see if Clay would follow directions. Moore told him there'd be a time in a fight when your trainer may ask you to alter something. Would you be able to follow directions and adapt?

I don't know if many people know this because Moore was a very positive person,but Archie didn't like the taunting before his fight with Clay. Moore thought it didn't show any class. Aileen Eaton offered Archie $35,000 for the match. Moore was hurting for dough and asked for a $25,000 in advance. After that fight Archie told me ,after taxes,he wound up with practically nothing.

Moore said that fight made him feel worse than after losing to Marciano. Archie figured he'd be in for a tough battle,but that he hated losing in 4 rounds. Clay predicted,"Moore will fall in four". Archie told me he didn't want to add to Clay's predictions. What also depressed Moore is a lot of people thought he went in the tank. They thought his poor showing validated that assumption. Moore reflected his thoughts to me at his boy's club. "Imagine", he said to me,"After all I've given to boxing. How could anyone think that me?"

I'm writing this to straighten out anyone out there that might think differently from the 'Ol Mongoose.

kikibalt wrote:

dagosd2000 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:
A press confernce was held today for the Rafael Marquez vs Israel Vazquez to be held on Saturday.

I got there late, but was able to shoot this pic. of Marquez as he was been interview.

Frank,This should be another war. Who are you picking?

Nobody!! it that kind of a fight.

Who said you couldn't write? That line said it all!

dagosd2000 wrote:Archie Moore had a training camp up in the foothills outside San Diego in a small town named Ramona. When I worked for the County of San Diego years later,I'd drive out that windy road to see what was left of the place. The few wooden houses were empty. The area was nothing but sage brush and tumbleweeds rolling along with the wind. Moore was still alive,but I think he had sold the property.

Moore would tell the story of how a young Cassius Clay was sent to him as a teenager to develop his boxing skills at that camp.I had always thought that Moore wanted to show Clay how to box like him,but Moore told me different. Moore knew Clay was going to grow into a heavyweight,so Moore told him,"Why dance around at that weight,when I can show you how to get better leverage on your punches so you can knock guys out?"
Moore said that Clay was hard to train. Didn't listen much. Besides he wanted an entourage around to feed his ego. Clay wanted to look stylish in the ring,more like Sugar Ray Robinson(later Robinson refused to train Clay when he was asked). Archie said that many of the things Clay was doing in the ring were unnecessary. Moore also said that Clay didn't want to earn his keep like the other fighters who were training at Ramona. He refused to do chores like the other guys. Moore told him there was a reason for it. Moore wanted to see if Clay would follow directions. Moore told him there'd be a time in a fight when your trainer may ask you to alter something. Would you be able to follow directions and adapt?

I don't know if many people know this because Moore was a very positive person,but Archie didn't like the taunting before his fight with Clay. Moore thought it didn't show any class. Aileen Eaton offered Archie $35,000 for the match. Moore was hurting for dough and asked for a $25,000 in advance. After that fight Archie told me ,after taxes,he wound up with practically nothing.

Moore said that fight made him feel worse than after losing to Marciano. Archie figured he'd be in for a tough battle,but that he hated losing in 4 rounds. Clay predicted,"Moore will fall in four". Archie told me he didn't want to add to Clay's predictions. What also depressed Moore is a lot of people thought he went in the tank. They thought his poor showing validated that assumption. Moore reflected his thoughts to me at his boy's club. "Imagine", he said to me,"After all I've given to boxing. How could anyone think that me?"

I'm writing this to straighten out anyone out there that might think differently from the 'Ol Mongoose.

I remember when I saw the Moore-Clay "fight."

I said, "Was the referee a personal member of Clay's family?"

Because he let Clay stand right next to Moore after each knockdown and never made him go to a neutral corner.

And that was just the start of the "refereeing" and officiating that went on during Clay's career.

Dagos,

I knew two people who tried to help out Clay with advice or whom Clay asked for advice.

One was a Pennsylvania karate (martial arts) teacher.
The other was Harold Johnson.

As I rode my Harley throught Ramona one time back in the 1980's I saw a road named after Archie Moore.

I'll never forget Ferdinand Marcos congradulating Ali in the ring in Manila saying"I win a lot of money on you tonight"

kikibalt wrote:As I rode my Harley throught Ramona one time back in the 1980's I saw a road named after Archie Moore.

I left that out of the story Frank,but that was the road that went to his camp. So you rode Harley's. I never got past a Norton Atlas.

I was there at the Sports Arena in L.A. for Moore/Clay figth, and I thought referee Tommy Hart did a good job.

kikibalt wrote:I was there at the Sports Arena in L.A. for Moore/Clay figth, and I thought referee Tommy Hart did a good job.

Including letting Clay stand right next to Moore after each knockdown and not making him go to a neutral corner?

Everyone has their own definition of a "good job."
.

dagosd2000 wrote:I'll never forget Ferdinand Marcos congradulating Ali in the ring in Manila saying"I win a lot of money on you tonight"

And how much of that money went to Eddie Futch?

dagosd2000 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:As I rode my Harley throught Ramona one time back in the 1980's I saw a road named after Archie Moore.

I left that out of the story Frank,but that was the road that went to his camp. So you rode Harley's. I never got past a Norton Atlas.

I have an old Harley Shovlehead.
Havent rode in awhile though.
Its a 72 Superglide and its a kickstart.
The thing about them kickstarts is when you role out of the bar and fifty people are watching. If ya start it on the first kick your a freakin hero.
After ten or twelve and ya still aint started it ,your catchin abuse and your buddies are leavin you behind.

dagosd2000 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:As I rode my Harley throught Ramona one time back in the 1980's I saw a road named after Archie Moore.

I left that out of the story Frank,but that was the road that went to his camp. So you rode Harley's. I never got past a Norton Atlas.

Started riding in 1952 and was never without a Harley until 2002 when I got sick and couldn't ride no more, so I sold the one I had at the time, I used to go to the T.J toy run for years

Expug wrote:

dagosd2000 wrote:

kikibalt wrote:As I rode my Harley throught Ramona one time back in the 1980's I saw a road named after Archie Moore.

I left that out of the story Frank,but that was the road that went to his camp. So you rode Harley's. I never got past a Norton Atlas.

I have an old Harley Shovlehead.
Havent rode in awhile though.
Its a 72 Superglide and its a kickstart.
The thing about them kickstarts is when you role out of the bar and fifty people are watching. If ya start it on the first kick your a freakin hero.
After ten or twelve and ya still aint started it ,your catchin abuse and your buddies are leavin you behind.

Hey Pug,I know what you mean. A Norton Atlas doesn't always co operate.
I tore the cartilage in my knee from playing football. The other knee I tore up trying to start that motorcycle. Dagos

Thats my last Harley I had, the one with the saddle bags, on the left is a friend of my brother's, Art and his wife, whom's name I can't remember, the other dude is me.