BoxRec

Deno1986 wrote:

bennie wrote:Who was the ref?

A Finnish guy by the name of Erkki Meronen.

Columbo

NorthEastBoxingFan, great post, I agree, the way he puts it all on the line is his downfall. Can he change this late if he is to continue?


Do not give up the day job to become a professional gambler will you

Enzo stoppage FAR FAR too late (horrid); Sexton stoppage too late; Dilks stoppage too early (impressions from ringside)...

Enzo seems like a nice enough guy, but from the early days he believed in the hype, especially about being the hardest hitting cruiserweight in the world that was being pimped by SKY at the tme.

In my opinion he was fortunate to get the nod over Hobson, but he showed a lot of composure in the fight even when Hobson was piling on the pressure, I was impressed with him in this fight, even though I thought he lost it.

His performance against Braithwate still stands as his best showing for me.

He was unlucky to be involved in the Calzaghe/Warren dust up, and I am sure that didn't help his form at that particular time.

As for last night, he was winning the fight in my book, and i've already said that I thought the ref made a bad call letting hm carry on, but I don't see this as being the end of Enzos career. He has enough left to be about for a while longer in my opinion.

nh1 wrote:Enzo stoppage FAR FAR too late (horrid); Sexton stoppage too late; Dilks stoppage too early (impressions from ringside)...

Do people not throw towels in anymore? i only saw the sexton stoppage out of those 3 but it was late, once a guys hands drop and he cant defend himself the ref should step in. He took a full flurry after his hands were down - it wasnt stupidly late but still he was defenceless..

Here is the KO for those who missed it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F83U6Ha_cBg

i missed the first knock down but the second was sickening i hope he retires i wouldnt want that to happen to him again

crusader wrote:Here is the KO for those who missed it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F83U6Ha_cBg

Nasty!

TheCobra wrote:

Old bones Ian wrote:Fair play to Alexander Frenkel, he didn't over celebrate, and was concerned for Macca. He kept walking past and checking on his recovery.

Yep he showed a lot of class and that has to be applauded, he should earn a lot of respect for his reaction in the aftermath of the KO, very classy. Classy KO punch too!

Yes Frenkel showed real class there, with the punch he first put Enzo over with, and with his reaction after the KO too.
I noticed in his previous fight with Davis, he showed a touch of class when he had the American in trouble, and looked at the ref, to ask him if he really needed to still keep hitting the guy.
The CLUELESS Finnish ref may as well have not been there at the end, with the "protection" he gave the defenceless Enzo. After such blatant neglect, he needs to be taken off the job - it's risky enough without having a loose cannon like him in charge.

crusader wrote:Here is the KO for those who missed it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F83U6Ha_cBg

It just gets worse every time you see that....

I hear the ref has been called to the EBU to explain himself, lets hope it's true and he is asked some serious questions about his reasonings for not stopping this fight after the 1st knock down

I would ask why he

1) did not ask the fighter the raise his hand after the count
2) did not ask ask the fighter to walk toward him after he had raised his hands (if he could of)
3) did not check his eyes prior to PULLING the fighter back in to fight (Taking 3 extra punches that he should not have)
4) Most important question for me "Does he know the first rule of boxing? Protect yourself AT ALL TIMES"

Enzo was in no fit state to protect himself as anyone could clearly see, the referee is there to protect both fighters when needed.

Rant over

Enzo is a nice guy and very, very decent operator.

The Haye fight really dented his confidence, something he could never totally regain.

Good punch (not as devastating as Warren and Enzo C made out), bottle to burn and always wanting to give the fans their monies worth. He is a solid, stand up guy and, if he wishes to continue, fair enough.

I am not one who usally calls for or who screams for a fighter to retire after a loss (losses can be good, too), but that's 5 times he has been stopped/ KO'd and at 30yrs old, his chin, reflexes etc...wont get any better.

It's his call ofc, as he knows alot, alot better than any of us, what he has left in his locker. Just needs to be truthful with himself and I am sure the fans will respect his decision either way.

Good luck Enzo

taffytoon wrote:I hear the ref has been called to the EBU to explain himself, lets hope it's true and he is asked some serious questions about his reasonings for not stopping this fight after the 1st knock down

I would ask why he

1) did not ask the fighter the raise his hand after the count
2) did not ask ask the fighter to walk toward him after he had raised his hands (if he could of)
3) did not check his eyes prior to PULLING the fighter back in to fight (Taking 3 extra punches that he should not have)
4) Most important question for me "Does he know the first rule of boxing? Protect yourself AT ALL TIMES"

Enzo was in no fit state to protect himself as anyone could clearly see, the referee is there to protect both fighters when needed.

Rant over

I'm sure though that Enzo's corner are perfectly capable of thowing in a towel, too- especially given Enzo's record of being sparked.

kingfinn wrote:Do people not throw towels in anymore? i only saw the sexton stoppage out of those 3 but it was late, once a guys hands drop and he cant defend himself the ref should step in. He took a full flurry after his hands were down - it wasnt stupidly late but still he was defenceless..

Exactly...The ref was wrong but what was his corner doing? Shameful corner work.

Yes, I think we are in all agreement that it was a bad call from the ref - but I do think him being called up by the EBU to explain his actions is a bit on the harsh side.

I've seen fighters in far worst condition being aloud to continue (and the ref being applauded for not leaving the doubts), fighters in far worst condition being stopped and then the complaints that it was stopped to soon. I'm thinking off the top of my head for Khan vs Prescott in the former scenario and Lewis vs McCall 1 in the later.... Had Lewis being allowed to continue, he would have ended up in the same state as Enzo.

Enzo has been a credit to the sport, never really moaned and groaned about something. He cannot keep taking these KO's though - I would urge him to retire. I don't think there is anyway he can mount any challenge again. I don't think he is a "shot" fighter as such, the handspeed, the footwork is the same as before and all. Sadly, I think so is his chin. I don't think it's got worst. If he was too comeback, he must adopt a different fight strategy - what he did against Braithwaite was beautiful - why doesn't he fight like that more often.

I really do admire him, he knows he's chinny - but he doesn't give an eff...... but at the end of the day, its Khan and Klitchsko who are world champions now.

Stu

I have seen refs kick a towel back out of the ring buddy, the referee is there soley to ensure the rules of the sport are adhered to. The very first rule is as we all know "Protect yourself at all times" IMHO the ref did not make sufficent checks that Enzo could protect himself (check the youtube footage, he does not do any checks and actualy pulls Enzo forward?) This in itself warrents a meeting with the EBU so he can explain why he did not follow protoco, this may help some other fighter in the future from being given 3 punches too many (and again as we all know may save a lifetime of missery or worse)

I'm not feeling the same kind of outrage towards the ref as many seem to. I agree there were certain checks missed which might've shown Enzo to be much further gone than he appeared to be, but at the same time, he was the home fighter in a comfortable lead and it's not uncommon for a fighter on unsteady legs to claw and clobber his way to the end of a round and potential respite/recovery.

JamesH wrote:

taffytoon wrote:

JamesH wrote: That's a relief. After the fight I was having a drink and saw Enzo wheeled out on a hospital bed towards the ambulance, before security shut the curtain. He looked in a bad way. Very pleased to here he is ok. Such a shame as he was doing well to that point.

What a load of rubbish, Enzo stayed in his dressing room until around 1am and then walked back to the hotel (NEC Crowns Plaza) spoke to a couple of people and went to his room. Not once was he wheeled to an ambulance

I have no axe to grind with Enzo, I think he's a top bloke and I have no reason for lying. I saw him looking dazed and being wheeled towards an ambulance before the curtain shut. Perhaps he didn't need it, got up and went to his dressing room after that (and stayed there until 1am), it wasn't too long after the fight that I seen him. Whatever, I'm just glad that he's ok.

david haye clearly says in his article on this site that enzo went away by ambulance......so it looks as though you were right mate......

Here's Frenkel landing the same punch on a Kessler undercard a while back:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CQ5l6oHm8f0

taffytoon wrote:Stu

I have seen refs kick a towel back out of the ring buddy, the referee is there soley to ensure the rules of the sport are adhered to. The very first rule is as we all know "Protect yourself at all times" IMHO the ref did not make sufficent checks that Enzo could protect himself (check the youtube footage, he does not do any checks and actualy pulls Enzo forward?) This in itself warrents a meeting with the EBU so he can explain why he did not follow protoco, this may help some other fighter in the future from being given 3 punches too many (and again as we all know may save a lifetime of missery or worse)

I agree.If that took place later on in the fight we could be talkng about a brain damage job or the late Enzo Maccarinelli. The referee's conduct is indefensible. My Nan might as well have been in charge of that round, she'd have probably done a better job.

I had no sound in the pub, someone explain to how Murat was stoppe dby the ref as he got off his stool with no doctors intervention because that is what appeared to happen.

I was still a bit mystified by the stoppage watching the replay.

The ref seemed to call the doctor in, who appeared to say stop it if you want. Murat was up, had his gumshield in, his trainer seemed a bit ambivilent.

bump.

DavidPayne wrote:I had no sound in the pub, someone explain to how Murat was stoppe dby the ref as he got off his stool with no doctors intervention because that is what appeared to happen.

or even bump.

The doctor did intervene, he was in the corner.