BoxRec

steve689 wrote:

Deserter wrote:Don't know exactly why, given I accept it's not far off a 50/50 fight, but I've got a sneaky suspicion Rigondeaux is going to take this fairly clearly on points. Just think his style could give Donaire issues he's never experienced before.

Great prediction Deserter Donaire was ponderous and totally befuddled by Rigo's speed and movement.

Nice one Deserter mate.

I was convinced Nishioka was going to do to Donaire what Rigondeaux did to him, but I got the wrong slick southpaw.

D'oh!

Good job by the Cuban, people may say "Oh but he's boring" but when you fight a dude with dynamite in his gloves you don't win by leaving your chin hanging out to dry.

steve689 wrote:

Deserter wrote:Don't know exactly why, given I accept it's not far off a 50/50 fight, but I've got a sneaky suspicion Rigondeaux is going to take this fairly clearly on points. Just think his style could give Donaire issues he's never experienced before.

Great prediction Deserter Donaire was ponderous and totally befuddled by Rigo's speed and movement.

Thanks mate. Makes up for the times where I've made some shocking calls - the beauty of the game

Arum is pissed off Rigo handled Donaire like that.
Shoulda gone with the Mares offer, Donaire was fave in that fight for me.

I had donaire winning.

Ching Ching easy £££££££

Finn wrote:I had donaire winning.

really

Tommy Gunn13 wrote:

Finn wrote:I had donaire winning.

really

All the rounds were tight but most of Rigos fight was footwork, donaire forced the fight and dropped him. It looked like he marginally outlanded him in the majority of rounds to me as well. Rigo was just really eye catching, apart from the last round which he clearly won.

I think i had donaire up by 3.

Finn wrote:

Tommy Gunn13 wrote:

Finn wrote:I had donaire winning.

really

All the rounds were tight but most of Rigos fight was footwork, donaire forced the fight and dropped him. It looked like he marginally outlanded him in the majority of rounds to me as well. Rigo was just really eye catching, apart from the last round which he clearly won.

I think i had donaire up by 3.

Insane

The Dark Destroyer wrote:I'm just into the seventh round and Donaire doesn't seem to be outlanding him to me. Every time Donaire has landed something of note Rigo has landed straight after with something as good or even better. He certainly seems to be outlanding Donaira every round.

might watch it again later in that case.

well im rewatching it and im up to the end of round 3 and ive got the 1st to rigo and the 2nd and 3rd to donaire. Rigo is making Donaire look very sloppy but the counters are almost all on the gloves Donaire is actually landing some clean body shots and he's the aggressor.

Finn wrote:well im rewatching it and im up to the end of round 3 and ive got the 1st to rigo and the 2nd and 3rd to donaire. Rigo is making Donaire look very sloppy but the counters are almost all on the gloves Donaire is actually landing some clean body shots and he's the aggressor.

The aggression is why the score cards were so close

even after 4 and the 5th to donaire

even again after 6, given the donaire the 7th, back to being even at 8. Rigo gets the 9th. Donaire 10-8 round in the 10th.

Rigo's the one landing on gloves while Donaire lands clean shots? You're seeing completely different things than I did.

Wasn't even close imo; Rigo outboxed Donaire in almost every round. And I've seen Rigo criticized several times for being so inactive, but he threw about 50 more punches than Donaire did, though I'm not sure of the round by round breakdown.

11 and 12 go to rigo so thats a rigo win by 1 point.

Most of the guys on the current scene are away with the fairies so i dont pay too much attention to them anyway but saying donaire got schooled or only won one round and the 10th was a 10-9 is pure nuts imo.

That was a close fight.

crusader wrote:Rigo's the one landing on gloves while Donaire lands clean shots? You're seeing completely different things than I did.

Wasn't even close imo; Rigo outboxed Donaire in almost every round. And I've seen Rigo criticized several times for being so inactive, but he threw about 50 more punches than Donaire did, though I'm not sure of the round by round breakdown.

I think you were watching a different fight. Touching an opponent instead of landing a clean shot, or hitting the cloves, arms, a low punch or when told to break isnt point scoring.

Maybe you should watch the fight again as i did, the judges scorecards were 111-116, 112-115 and 113-114 the first one id argue is too far off unless the 10th was scored as a 10-9 which i cant really see.

I think you were watching a different fight.

I think we watched the same fight, but you gave a fighter rounds simply for moving forward while I didn't. I also considered what each fighter was doing, rather than focusing most of my analysis on how one fighter sometimes missed, even though the other did likewise.

Touching an opponent instead of landing a clean shot, or hitting the cloves, arms, a low punch or when told to break isnt point scoring.

Scoring is based on what the two fighters do relative to one another, and while neither consistently threw or landed eye-catching shots, Rigo was landing more frequently than Donaire was, and Donaire wasn't landing higher quality shots that would make up for his lack of connects. Sure, Rigo landed on arms and gloves, but so did Donaire.

Your reasoning as to what Donaire was doing to win rounds (rather than what Rigo was doing or not doing) was that he landed clean body shots and was the aggressor. But although Donaire moved forward while Rigo moved back, the former was generally less active than the latter and he was less active overall (396-352 for Rigo; Rigo threw more in 8 rounds, Donaire in 3 rounds, 1 round even), so you're giving Donaire points for moving in a certain direction; what is so significant about moving forward that it alone deserves to be favorably and significantly weighted in scoring?

As for Donaire's clean body punches, when did this and his other clean work occur ( in Youtube time)? Rigo moved consistently and Donaire had a very difficult time tracking him down and setting his feet to throw, and Rigo's defensive ability prevented most of Donaires' shots from landing, let alone landing cleanly. While Donaire occasionally landed decent shots, Rigo was more accurate and landed more of such shots, which isn't surprising given Donaire's reliance on being set to punch effectively and his relative lack of defensive ability and speed.

The rounds generally followed the pattern of Donaire coming forward doing close to nothing and Rigo moving back doing close to nothing. Donaire, however, came straight to Rigo, giving him opportunities to score quickly off the back foot as he prefers to, while Rigo's constant and quick movement prevented Donaire from setting his feet, loading up, and scoring with power shots as he prefers to. Donaire fought in a way that suited Rigo (at one point Donaire becomes frustrated and takes the back foot to try to stop Rigo's movement), and he was outscored accordingly, even if he was generally moving forward and even if neither man did much.

Maybe you should watch the fight again as i did

I re-watched the fight and had the same score as I first did. My attention was focused on the fight when I first watched it, so I don't understand why I'd get a significantly different card a day latter as you did.

Here is a link to the source of the punch stats I listed above. I always take punches landed numbers with a grain of salt (although they reflect what I saw in this case), but the punches thrown numbers are usually close to accurate.

http://www.BS.com/forums/view. ... x-compubox

Finn wrote:

Tommy Gunn13 wrote:

Finn wrote:I had donaire winning.

really

All the rounds were tight but most of Rigos fight was footwork, donaire forced the fight and dropped him. It looked like he marginally outlanded him in the majority of rounds to me as well. Rigo was just really eye catching, apart from the last round which he clearly won.

I think i had donaire up by 3.

Were you drinking watching the fight mate or tripping or you just know fornicate all about boxing

"Walking forward" without throwing, is not aggression..

Donaire landed 82 of 352.

Rigondeaux landed 129 of 396 shots (50% more connecting punches)

Donaire's face at the end compounded the stats too.

Rigo was masterful, but sometimes the 'sweet science' is not exciting to watch.

crusader wrote:

I think you were watching a different fight.

I think we watched the same fight, but you gave a fighter rounds simply for moving forward while I didn't. I also considered what each fighter was doing, rather than focusing most of my analysis on how one fighter sometimes missed, even though the other did likewise.

Touching an opponent instead of landing a clean shot, or hitting the cloves, arms, a low punch or when told to break isnt point scoring.

Scoring is based on what the two fighters do relative to one another, and while neither consistently threw or landed eye-catching shots, Rigo was landing more frequently than Donaire was, and Donaire wasn't landing higher quality shots that would make up for his lack of connects. Sure, Rigo landed on arms and gloves, but so did Donaire.

Your reasoning as to what Donaire was doing to win rounds (rather than what Rigo was doing or not doing) was that he landed clean body shots and was the aggressor. But although Donaire moved forward while Rigo moved back, the former was generally less active than the latter and he was less active overall (396-352 for Rigo; Rigo threw more in 8 rounds, Donaire in 3 rounds, 1 round even), so you're giving Donaire points for moving in a certain direction; what is so significant about moving forward that it alone deserves to be favorably and significantly weighted in scoring?

As for Donaire's clean body punches, when did this and his other clean work occur ( in Youtube time)? Rigo moved consistently and Donaire had a very difficult time tracking him down and setting his feet to throw, and Rigo's defensive ability prevented most of Donaires' shots from landing, let alone landing cleanly. While Donaire occasionally landed decent shots, Rigo was more accurate and landed more of such shots, which isn't surprising given Donaire's reliance on being set to punch effectively and his relative lack of defensive ability and speed.

The rounds generally followed the pattern of Donaire coming forward doing close to nothing and Rigo moving back doing close to nothing. Donaire, however, came straight to Rigo, giving him opportunities to score quickly off the back foot as he prefers to, while Rigo's constant and quick movement prevented Donaire from setting his feet, loading up, and scoring with power shots as he prefers to. Donaire fought in a way that suited Rigo (at one point Donaire becomes frustrated and takes the back foot to try to stop Rigo's movement), and he was outscored accordingly, even if he was generally moving forward and even if neither man did much.

Maybe you should watch the fight again as i did

I re-watched the fight and had the same score as I first did. My attention was focused on the fight when I first watched it, so I don't understand why I'd get a significantly different card a day latter as you did.

Because i dont sit with a pad and pen and score the fight on 1st watching i just watch the fight and keep a general tally i only went back and watched it in detail because i was so surprised people had rigo winning almost every round, also lets not forget 2 of the judges and tim bradley agree with me either dot on or within a round, and the other judge doesnt agree with you either.

I dont think its me giving points to donaire for moving forward, its me scoring points to donaire for moving being the aggressor and landing the cleaner shots. You seem to be scoring Rigo for dazzling footwork and punches that barely landed, grazing shots etc.

billy nelson wrote: Were you drinking watching the fight mate or tripping or you just know eff all about boxing

Thank you for your insight billy, see on the 1st watch i was really rusty with my boxing knowledge and scoring abilities after waiting for so long for one of my favourite boxers to be put in the ring with someone worth needing me to score a fight......

Finn wrote:

billy nelson wrote: Were you drinking watching the fight mate or tripping or you just know eff all about boxing

Thank you for your insight billy, see on the 1st watch i was really rusty with my boxing knowledge and scoring abilities after waiting for so long for one of my favourite boxers to be put in the ring with someone worth needing me to score a fight......

Haha Amen

Finn wrote:

Tommy Gunn13 wrote:

Finn wrote:I had donaire winning.

really

All the rounds were tight but most of Rigos fight was footwork, donaire forced the fight and dropped him. It looked like he marginally outlanded him in the majority of rounds to me as well. Rigo was just really eye catching, apart from the last round which he clearly won.

I think i had donaire up by 3.

Jesus christ almighty! I had Donaire winning ONE round. Most of the time he couldnt lay a glove on Rigo.

crusader wrote:Rigo's the one landing on gloves while Donaire lands clean shots? You're seeing completely different things than I did.

Wasn't even close imo; Rigo outboxed Donaire in almost every round. And I've seen Rigo criticized several times for being so inactive, but he threw about 50 more punches than Donaire did, though I'm not sure of the round by round breakdown.

yeah fair enough, Rigo was landing on Donaire's gloves alright! ;)