BoxRec

Really interesting if they both try for quick starts. A low brow Hearns v Hagler if you will DD

Froch has to start fast to negate the risk of Groves repeating the 1st few rounds of last fight.
That said Groves may be on his bike for 4 rounds to conserve enough energy for the full 12.

It's going to be a cracker whatever happens.

Noxy wrote:Groves can win it if he boxes off the back foot. He doesn't need to "have it" with Froch. If Groves boxes smart, he wins on points. If he gets involved, Froch stops him in the second half of the fight again.

This

jimcook wrote:froch by ko...a bit earlier than last time.
groves chin is still suspect, and this time froch wont take half the punishment he did in the first fight. groves hit froch with everything last time , and froch came through it like the terminator. both groves and froch know that froch is gonna eat him up like pacman. ( hagler said that after he stopped hearns)

He didn't go down in the first fight, did he......?

misterpunch wrote:lets look at the psychology of this fight; last time out george groves DID get under the skin of carl froch. wont happen this time. froch didn't know what to expect in the first fight. he'll have a better idea of it this time. tactically McCracken and froch will be sussed to what groves might bring. froch almost certainly cant be worse than last time and I'm pretty sure groves wont be better than he was in that fight. groves lost the first one after he had froch down and badly hurt. that's got to be rattling around in GG's psyche. just a historical thought; it is not often that rematches swing the other way. this all points to carl froch winning easier than in the first bout.

Enzo v Ovill played out a lot differently.

MarkMcBurney wrote:

jimcook wrote:froch by ko...a bit earlier than last time.
groves chin is still suspect, and this time froch wont take half the punishment he did in the first fight. groves hit froch with everything last time , and froch came through it like the terminator. both groves and froch know that froch is gonna eat him up like pacman. ( hagler said that after he stopped hearns)

He didn't go down in the first fight, did he......?

never got the chance ...the ref was far too quick in stopping the fight.

I just fancy Froch to come in more motivated and get the better of Groves in another war. Groves was unlucky to get stopped no doubt and he didn't have a chance to fight back. People are saying he was finished and saved, but he fought back from dire straights against Anderson and didn't get the chance to show this against Froch.

Their styles dictate that it'll be another good fight. I'd be surprised if Groves fought off the back foot, he's too much of a fighter and would want to get in and hurt Froch knowing he can do it.

Froch is saying he wasn't highly motivated before the last bout - though I remember him saying that he'd hate it to lose to Groves and that all his achievements would mean nothing if he were to lose to him. Froch can fight better than last time but he won't be able to improve; time is not on his side and he did take a fair amount of punishment last time. Groves is the younger and fresher and if Froch didn't have the best camp before, neither did Groves. If both are more settled and both train hard we are in for a treat. I don't think Froch can get into Groves' head and George really does wind Carl up; the build up will be quite tasty as well.

palooka wrote:Froch is saying he wasn't highly motivated before the last bout - though I remember him saying that he'd hate it to lose to Groves and that all his achievements would mean nothing if he were to lose to him. Froch can fight better than last time but he won't be able to improve; time is not on his side and he did take a fair amount of punishment last time. Groves is the younger and fresher and if Froch didn't have the best camp before, neither did Groves. If both are more settled and both train hard we are in for a treat. I don't think Froch can get into Groves' head and George really does wind Carl up; the build up will be quite tasty as well.

Yep agree with that, all the bollox aside, i'm really really looking forward to this one

jimcook wrote:

MarkMcBurney wrote:

jimcook wrote:froch by ko...a bit earlier than last time.
groves chin is still suspect, and this time froch wont take half the punishment he did in the first fight. groves hit froch with everything last time , and froch came through it like the terminator. both groves and froch know that froch is gonna eat him up like pacman. ( hagler said that after he stopped hearns)

He didn't go down in the first fight, did he......?

never got the chance ...the ref was far too quick in stopping the fight.

That's as may be, however if his chin was as bad as people suggest, he'd have been out cold after some of the leather he took in that burst.

That weren't the first time in the fight Groves was punched by Froch; the narrative seems to be that as soon as Froch hit Groves he was done for; that wasn't the case. Groves can hold a shot - I'd imagine that Kenny Anderson hits as hard as Froch; Groves was hurt by Anderson and got through to win.

I'm surprised that out of the 77 people who have voted groves to win only 26 of them think he wins by ko/tko/stoppage ! Yes froch is very durable and has shown he gets up from big big shots, but groves landed when ever he wanted in the first fight and I think the rematch will be no different, groves will take his chances more 2nd time round and finish him when his hurt.

I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Ian1973 wrote:I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Question is does Groves have the durability and engine to last the distance fighting on the back foot against someone who will keep coming forward. He managed just against degale but he has his own stamina issues.

Froch KO 8

A really difficult fight to call. Groves points 115-113, 116-112, 114-114.

Finn wrote:

Ian1973 wrote:I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Question is does Groves have the durability and engine to last the distance fighting on the back foot against someone who will keep coming forward. He managed just against degale but he has his own stamina issues.

That for me is the biggest question than needs answering. I think it's 50/50 if they both go for each other at the off but the longer the fight goes on like that the more likely Froch is to win because he has such endurance.

I think Groves has a much better chance of lasting the pace boxing off the back foot than he does by going into the trenches.

If Groves wants to beat Froch in a scrap he is going to have to do it early while still fresh but if the fight starts like that it could go either way.

I think the result of the fight depends on what Groves decides to do it is his to lose.

I don't buy the "Froch wasn't motivated" last time for a split second. I think outstrengthing Groves over a period of time or late on is Froch's best chance of winning this fight but if Groves has learned from the first fight he should be able to control the pace of the fight.

Ian1973 wrote:I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Good post, spot on. The rematch is much more about what Groves does, not Froch, its Groves fight to loose.

Adding the total votes up for each fighter gives Froch 97 and Groves 89 so far. Just shows how split this fight is!

Ian1973 wrote:I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Groves didn't 'allow the fight to turn into a brawl' in the slightest. Froch IMPOSED that fight on him, and Groves didn't have the engine for a war.

Riddick Blowe wrote:

Ian1973 wrote:I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Groves didn't 'allow the fight to turn into a brawl' in the slightest. Froch IMPOSED that fight on him, and Groves didn't have the engine for a war.

The 'famous back off' as you put it was because he'd shot his bolt, plain and simple. He's young so shoudn't have engine problems so assuming he doesn't address the issue, he will always look spectacular for the 1st half of a fight.

Roars Like Me wrote:

Riddick Blowe wrote:

Ian1973 wrote:I thought the bell saved Froch in the first fight after Gloves had floored him and the stoppage was ridiculous.

Groves, however, I think has only himself to blame for the defeat. From the moment he did that famous back off on to the ropes it all fell apart the macho in him overcame the commonsense in him. He allowed a fight he had previously controlled to turn into (more of) a lottery of a brawl.

This time IF Groves boxes and doesn't allow himself to get dragged into a brawl he easily outpoints Froch who simply doesn't have the speed and technical ability to outbox Groves. Groves is a smart guy, I expect him to have learned his lesson.

Groves didn't 'allow the fight to turn into a brawl' in the slightest. Froch IMPOSED that fight on him, and Groves didn't have the engine for a war.

The 'famous back off' as you put it was because he'd shot his bolt, plain and simple. He's young so shoudn't have engine problems so assuming he doesn't address the issue, he will always look spectacular for the 1st half of a fight.

Being young doesn't mean he can't have engine problems...

Riddick Blowe wrote:Being young doesn't mean he can't have engine problems...

I'm 23 and struggle to run a bloody mile! Played football at decent level from young to about 21 then quit and been in gym 5 mornings a week for 2 years and I've still got the stamina of an 18 stone pensioner. Fair enough I'm not professionally trained but a lot of it is natural. Froch is similar to Bisping in MMA, both just keep going while others fade, both measure extremely low resting heart rates which is a strong indicator. Groves doesn't seem to have that natural cardio.

You can still box on the front foot without having to get in a brawl?

misterpunch wrote:lets look at the psychology of this fight; last time out george groves DID get under the skin of carl froch. wont happen this time. froch didn't know what to expect in the first fight. he'll have a better idea of it this time. tactically McCracken and froch will be sussed to what groves might bring. froch almost certainly cant be worse than last time and I'm pretty sure groves wont be better than he was in that fight. groves lost the first one after he had froch down and badly hurt. that's got to be rattling around in GG's psyche. just a historical thought; it is not often that rematches swing the other way. this all points to carl froch winning easier than in the first bout.

i disagree Froch has already started the personal insults and groves is already under froch's skin ,groves had to find a new trainer a few weeks before the first fight where as froch had his normal camp this time froch will be 6 months older and slower and groves will be 6 months older and stronger and with time to work on a plan this time . Froch must have worries about this fight he didn't want it and he got outboxed and out gunned in the first fight and for a man that lives off his toughness to get dropped like that in the 1st will of dented frochs confidence a lot he knows now that groves can ko him where as he never floored groves himself .Groves is mentally stronger than froch and i think we will see a slightly scared froch in this fight just like the last fight were froch seemed to be hiding in his corner before the fight with groves acting as the confident champion .
groves wins inside the distance and froch will retire .

stevedoc wrote:

misterpunch wrote:lets look at the psychology of this fight; last time out george groves DID get under the skin of carl froch. wont happen this time. froch didn't know what to expect in the first fight. he'll have a better idea of it this time. tactically McCracken and froch will be sussed to what groves might bring. froch almost certainly cant be worse than last time and I'm pretty sure groves wont be better than he was in that fight. groves lost the first one after he had froch down and badly hurt. that's got to be rattling around in GG's psyche. just a historical thought; it is not often that rematches swing the other way. this all points to carl froch winning easier than in the first bout.

i disagree Froch has already started the personal insults and groves is already under froch's skin ,groves had to find a new trainer a few weeks before the first fight where as froch had his normal camp this time froch will be 6 months older and slower and groves will be 6 months older and stronger and with time to work on a plan this time . Froch must have worries about this fight he didn't want it and he got outboxed and out gunned in the first fight and for a man that lives off his toughness to get dropped like that in the 1st will of dented frochs confidence a lot he knows now that groves can ko him where as he never floored groves himself .Groves is mentally stronger than froch and i think we will see a slightly scared froch in this fight just like the last fight were froch seemed to be hiding in his corner before the fight with groves acting as the confident champion .
groves wins inside the distance and froch will retire .

Very confident post but each one of your points can work both ways. Froch being just 6 months older doesn't have to mean he's slower. I doubt he's lost much over the last 6 months. Same with Groves' strength, who knows what will happen in his camp this time, he may not start the rematch any stronger than he was in the first. Yes Froch lives off toughness and did get dropped hard, but instead of that denting his confidence, he may well think I've taken George's best shot, got up and eventually turned the fight around in the second half of the fight. Getting dropped doesn't mean you're not tough. Getting up, taking more shots and eventually coming back in to the fight however, shows immense toughness. I don't think Froch has ever been scared of a fighter, doesn't strike me as the type to get scared. Groves comes across the more mentally tough out the ring, but is he more mentally tough than Froch when it comes to the actual fight? Can Groves take the sort of punishment Froch can and still believe in himself?

Obviously this makes it sounds like I'm promoting Froch and downplaying Groves but I'm just trying to show that the beauty of this fight is that it's so hard to predict. As i said before, I wouldn't be shocked by any legitimate outcome of this fight.