BoxRec

Kalan wrote:

ClivePatrickLyons wrote:

Kalan wrote:The Duran of the 1st Leonard-Duran Fight beats the Robinson who was decked had a very difficult time with Tommy Bell when SRR won the 147 title.

Bell couldn't box well and was 39-10-2.. Robinson was floored hard and lost the first 5 rounds.. It was the 2nd fight in a row where Robinson was almost KO'd.

Another fight that's a valid comparison is when Welterweight Carmen Basilio -- who was Duran's size -- upset Middieweight Champ Sugar Ray Robinson. Basilio was not a skilled boxer or anything close to Duran's level, but he was a tough guy who had 12 losses when he upset Robinson.

Robinson had a difficult time with Kid Gavilan who was beaten by Lightweight Ike Williams and Doug Ratford, 27-18-6, the previous year and had other losses.

At no time in his career did Robinson ever beat boxers the caliber of Sugar Ray Leonard or Estaban De Jesus -- guys who Duran beat... And Robinson also never fought anyone the caliber of Marvin Hagler... Wilfred Benitez... or Tommy Hearns.. Robinson fought mostly unskilled opponents who he was very likely to beat.. But he didn't always beat them -- Ralph Jones came off 5 straight losses to completely dominate Robinson.

ALMOST KO'D YOUR GETTING effing WORST KALAN LETS BRING UP ALL THE FIGHTERS THAT HAVE HAD THE DISSTINCTION OF BEING NEARLY STOPPED/TKO'D/KO'D WHATS THAT GOT TO DO WITH THE PRICE OF poo HOUSE PAPER

You're dreaming again... Sugar Ray Robinson got floored hard by Tommy Bell and Artie Levine in consecutive fights... Those two guys weren't real good and lost a lot fights... That's material when you're being hyped as the ATG of all time... Nobody as bad as Bell or Levine ever decked Duran -- who put a Middleweight Champion like Iran Barkley clean on his ass.. Roberto is fine at 66.. No problems after winning World Titles in Many weight classes.

ClivePatrickLyons wrote:

Kalan wrote:

ClivePatrickLyons wrote:

ALMOST KO'D YOUR GETTING effing WORST KALAN LETS BRING UP ALL THE FIGHTERS THAT HAVE HAD THE DISSTINCTION OF BEING NEARLY STOPPED/TKO'D/KO'D WHATS THAT GOT TO DO WITH THE PRICE OF poo HOUSE PAPER

You're dreaming again... Sugar Ray Robinson got floored hard by Tommy Bell and Artie Levine in consecutive fights... Those two guys weren't real good and lost a lot fights... That's material when you're being hyped as the ATG of all time... Nobody as bad as Bell or Levine ever decked Duran -- who put a Middleweight Champion like Iran Barkley clean on his ass.. Roberto is fine at 66.. No problems after winning World Titles in Many weight classes.

Have you heard of that guy what was his name mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Kirkland remember him wtf now you got me nearly bagging one of my all time favourites in Roberto geeze your a bad influence bad mouth LEGEND'S say they nearly got ko'd like I said whats nearly got to do with it fuc i'd be a LEGEND my self if I went by the nearly's in my life nearly don't count so find something else to hang your lame argument on..........

Kalan wrote:

ClivePatrickLyons wrote:

Kalan wrote:
You're dreaming again... Sugar Ray Robinson got floored hard by Tommy Bell and Artie Levine in consecutive fights... Those two guys weren't real good and lost a lot fights... That's material when you're being hyped as the ATG of all time... Nobody as bad as Bell or Levine ever decked Duran -- who put a Middleweight Champion like Iran Barkley clean on his ass.. Roberto is fine at 66.. No problems after winning World Titles in Many weight classes.

Have you heard of that guy what was his name mmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Kirkland remember him wtf now you got me nearly bagging one of my all time favourites in Roberto geeze your a bad influence bad mouth LEGEND'S say they nearly got ko'd like I said whats nearly got to do with it fuc i'd be a LEGEND my self if I went by the nearly's in my life nearly don't count so find something else to hang your lame argument on..........

I must have missed it. Did Kirkland Laing knock Duran down????? ... Plus Laing was a better and quicker boxer than some of the guys who beat Robinson.. This isn't about that.. This is about the Duran who beat Leonard versus the Robinson who beat Bell for the 147 title---both at their peak.. Leonard was undefeated and considered by many the best boxer in the world -- Bell was a cherry-picked 2nd rater with 10 losses -- who Robinson already beat in a previous fight... In Robinson's case a fight was setup where he had an overwhelming chance to win a vacant World Title.

elmersalsa wrote:Great match up, but I don't think that the great Sugar Ray Robinson was the most complete fighter ever. In my view, I could name at least 12 boxers that were more complete than Robinson:

Roberto Duran
Sugar Ray Leonard
Salvador Sanchez
Ezzard Charles
Eusebio Pedroza
Marvelous Marvin Hagler
Eder Jofre
Joe Gans
Floyd Mayweather, Jr.
Ricardo "Finito" Lopez
Ismael Laguna
Mike McCallum
Charley Burley

Kalan wrote:Tommy Bell better than James Kirkland? ... HELL NO!! ... Bell better than Kirkland Laing? ... HELL NO!!

Tommy Bell managed to lose to Henry Jordan -- who had a KO ratio of 8% . Jordan lost most of his fights including 10 of his previous 13 fights prior to beating Bell... Everyone Laing lost to had a winning record.. The Gifted One---as they aptly called Kirkland Laing---never lost to anyone with a losing record.

tommo100 wrote:at welterweight,prime for prime,the flash robinson against the hungry and angry duran

Ambling Alp II wrote:If Robinson fights smart he would simply outbox him. He would school him just like Leonard did the 2nd time and Benitez did. Duran was not complete enough of a fighter to handle that.

BoxBuzz wrote:Was Robinson bigger than Hagler?

Size may not be the issue here......no argument that Robinson was not in his prime vs Carmen. But Duran wasn't in his prime vs Hagler.

It would likely be very competitive.

Ambling Alp II wrote:

BoxBuzz wrote:Was Robinson bigger than Hagler?

Size may not be the issue here......no argument that Robinson was not in his prime vs Carmen. But Duran wasn't in his prime vs Hagler.

It would likely be very competitive.

Hagler was closer to his prime than Robinson was to his.

At 147, 154, or 160 Robinson would have won most of the time if they were close to the same age.

As Seamus alluded to, the original question was at 147. Robinson wins 4 of 5. Would have been the best fight of the weight classes. Big question would be what excuses would be made. Was Duran motivated? Did he only have 5 months to prepare? Tummyache?

Seamus wrote:Duran beat Leonard at his very best ??? Leonard went on to stop Tommy Hearns, who was alot more dominant at 147 than Duran. And as far as him kicking Leonard's ass, it was a very close decision, and a fight that the New York Times, Ferdie Pacheco and a few others thought Leonard had won. Robinson was physically stronger and a bigger puncher than Leonard at 147, not to mention being faster and having a longer reach than Duran.