BoxRec

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 07:29

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑12 Dec 2018, 19:10 He did catch Wilder with alot of right hands. Wilder couldn't seem to dodge those 1-2's jab+straight right hand.

No he did not “catch Wilder with a lot of” anything.

Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

Onetimeonly wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:38

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 07:29
No he did not “catch Wilder with a lot of” anything.

Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

I believe he's touching on the small amount of punches landed in general.

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 07:29

HomicideHenry wrote: ↑12 Dec 2018, 19:10 He did catch Wilder with alot of right hands. Wilder couldn't seem to dodge those 1-2's jab+straight right hand.

No he did not “catch Wilder with a lot of” anything.

Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:49

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 07:29
No he did not “catch Wilder with a lot of” anything.

Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

I am sure you did, including the two 10-8s that made it impossible for Fury to win what you saw.

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:51

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:49

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28
Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

I am sure you did, including the two 10-8s that made it impossible for Fury to win what you saw.

I watched; I scored; I had it for Fury, despite the KD's. I also saw a lot of areas that Deontay should've done better. I think Wilder takes him out next time.

Steveh583 wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 19:17

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:51

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:49
I am sure you did, including the two 10-8s that made it impossible for Fury to win what you saw.

I watched; I scored; I had it for Fury, despite the KD's. I also saw a lot of areas that Deontay should've done better. I think Wilder takes him out next time.

I don't think he will. The best opportunity he will ever have was in that 12th round and he didn't do it. I think the rematch is all fury. A bit like groves vs frock 1 for me, in that groves kind of missed his window of opportunity.

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 19:18

Steveh583 wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 19:17

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:51

I watched; I scored; I had it for Fury, despite the KD's. I also saw a lot of areas that Deontay should've done better. I think Wilder takes him out next time.

I don't think he will. The best opportunity he will ever have was in that 12th round and he didn't do it. I think the rematch is all fury. A bit like groves vs frock 1 for me, in that groves kind of missed his window of opportunity.

Hopefully we won't have to wait too long to find out!

Steveh583 wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 19:19

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 19:18

Steveh583 wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 19:17
I don't think he will. The best opportunity he will ever have was in that 12th round and he didn't do it. I think the rematch is all fury. A bit like groves vs frock 1 for me, in that groves kind of missed his window of opportunity.

Hopefully we won't have to wait too long to find out!

I really hope not, and I hope they both earn a fortune for it. Both very likeable

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:51

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:49

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28
Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

I am sure you did, including the two 10-8s that made it impossible for Fury to win what you saw.

I watched; I scored; I had it for Fury, despite the KD's. I also saw a lot of areas that Deontay should've done better. I think Wilder takes him out next time.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:16 "When I was joining the heavyweight ranks, nobody told me about [being] lineal champion," Joshua said. "I knew about the WBC, IBO, IBF, WBA and WBO [belts] and I've got my hands on four of them. So where has lineal popped up out of the woodwork from?"

Joshua has all but ruled Fury out as an opponent, opting to focus on Wilder instead. It paves the way for Whyte II on PPV as Wilder is more likely to agree terms with Fury again.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:16 "When I was joining the heavyweight ranks, nobody told me about [being] lineal champion," Joshua said. "I knew about the WBC, IBO, IBF, WBA and WBO [belts] and I've got my hands on four of them. So where has lineal popped up out of the woodwork from?"

Joshua has all but ruled Fury out as an opponent, opting to focus on Wilder instead. It paves the way for Whyte II on PPV as Wilder is more likely to agree terms with Fury again.

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:39

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:16 "When I was joining the heavyweight ranks, nobody told me about [being] lineal champion," Joshua said. "I knew about the WBC, IBO, IBF, WBA and WBO [belts] and I've got my hands on four of them. So where has lineal popped up out of the woodwork from?"

Joshua has all but ruled Fury out as an opponent, opting to focus on Wilder instead. It paves the way for Whyte II on PPV as Wilder is more likely to agree terms with Fury again.

AJ's goal is to win all the belts and that's his goal. It would be an amazing achievement to bring all the belts together. If Fury keeps insisting on 50/50, then I can't see the AJ-Fury fight happening.

Who do you think Fury would fight if Wilder fights AJ?

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 07:05

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:39

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:16 "When I was joining the heavyweight ranks, nobody told me about [being] lineal champion," Joshua said. "I knew about the WBC, IBO, IBF, WBA and WBO [belts] and I've got my hands on four of them. So where has lineal popped up out of the woodwork from?"

Joshua has all but ruled Fury out as an opponent, opting to focus on Wilder instead. It paves the way for Whyte II on PPV as Wilder is more likely to agree terms with Fury again.

AJ's goal is to win all the belts and that's his goal. It would be an amazing achievement to bring all the belts together. If Fury keeps insisting on 50/50, then I can't see the AJ-Fury fight happening.

Who do you think Fury would fight if Wilder fights AJ?

I can't see Joshua-Wilder happening next year. I'd be surprised if it isn't the Fury rematch next. I think Joshua's course for 2019 was plotted well in advance but they've had to throw some stuff out there to stave off any criticism. Saying he wants to hold all the belts also allows for the IBF mandatory to be used as a potential sticking point later on in 2019.

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:01

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 07:05

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:39

AJ's goal is to win all the belts and that's his goal. It would be an amazing achievement to bring all the belts together. If Fury keeps insisting on 50/50, then I can't see the AJ-Fury fight happening.

Who do you think Fury would fight if Wilder fights AJ?

I can't see Joshua-Wilder happening next year. I'd be surprised if it isn't the Fury rematch next. I think Joshua's course for 2019 was plotted well in advance but they've had to throw some stuff out there to stave off any criticism. Saying he wants to hold all the belts also allows for the IBF mandatory to be used as a potential sticking point later on in 2019.

The IBF mandatory isn't due for a while. I envision a scenario where Whyte is the WBO mandatory ( he is the #1 after all) and down the line Miller as the WBA mandatory. I don't buy for one second that Team Joshua aren't trying to make the fight, hell, even Wilder says they are. My contact at SKY says Joshua has instructed his team to make the fight.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:16 "When I was joining the heavyweight ranks, nobody told me about [being] lineal champion," Joshua said. "I knew about the WBC, IBO, IBF, WBA and WBO [belts] and I've got my hands on four of them. So where has lineal popped up out of the woodwork from?"

Counter-puncher wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:24

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 06:16 "When I was joining the heavyweight ranks, nobody told me about [being] lineal champion," Joshua said. "I knew about the WBC, IBO, IBF, WBA and WBO [belts] and I've got my hands on four of them. So where has lineal popped up out of the woodwork from?"

fvcking casual

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:51

ironbeard wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 18:49

oogiebe wrote: ↑13 Dec 2018, 13:28
Did too!
I'm a Wilder fan; and I think I saw what I saw the back half of the fight.

I am sure you did, including the two 10-8s that made it impossible for Fury to win what you saw.

I watched; I scored; I had it for Fury, despite the KD's. I also saw a lot of areas that Deontay should've done better. I think Wilder takes him out next time.

tobyh5 wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:23 So according to AJ, the Lineal title means squat, but the IBO belt is legit?

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:59

tobyh5 wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:23 So according to AJ, the Lineal title means squat, but the IBO belt is legit?

Since Lewis vs Holyfield, the IBO has been worn by Lewis, Rahman, Klitschko, Fury and Joshua. Not a bad pedigree.

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 09:19

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:59

tobyh5 wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:23 So according to AJ, the Lineal title means squat, but the IBO belt is legit?

Since Lewis vs Holyfield, the IBO has been worn by Lewis, Rahman, Klitschko, Fury and Joshua. Not a bad pedigree.

You have to put it into perspective, though. It is a makeweight belt, always defended in conjunction with another title. Lewis defended it along with the WBC in his last fight. Wlad had the IBF alongside it until annexing the other belts. It was added to the IBF and WBA belts for Joshua-Klitschko. On its own, it has only been held by Brian Nielsen, James Thunder etc.

If you wanted to argue for it as a belt on its own terms surely looking at Hamed-Barrera would have been a better example? Actually, scratch that as Barrera ditched it almost immediately. It is the boxing equivalent of a waistcoat. It looks alright as part of a suit but you'd look like you were touting for business if you wore it by itself.

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 09:29

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 09:19

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 08:59

Since Lewis vs Holyfield, the IBO has been worn by Lewis, Rahman, Klitschko, Fury and Joshua. Not a bad pedigree.

You have to put it into perspective, though. It is a makeweight belt, always defended in conjunction with another title. Lewis defended it along with the WBC in his last fight. Wlad had the IBF alongside it until annexing the other belts. It was added to the IBF and WBA belts for Joshua-Klitschko. On its own, it has only been held by Brian Nielsen, James Thunder etc.

If you wanted to argue for it as a belt on its own terms surely looking at Hamed-Barrera would have been a better example? Actually, scratch that as Barrera ditched it almost immediately. It is the boxing equivalent of a waistcoat. It looks alright as part of a suit but you'd look like you were touting for business if you wore it by itself.

I think the belt is bollocks, along with the IBF and WBO. All of which are absolute toilet. Fury might not have lost his belt in the ring, but he vacated all those titles when he retired/failed a drugs test/did loads of blow/had mental health issues.

The 'Lineal' title is usually only mentioned when someone gives up or is forced to give up their belts/title. Jeffries, Ali, Spinks and Fury for example. Me personally, I think it's a load of rubbish. Isn't Lennox Lewis still the Lineal Champion? He didn't lose it in the ring. If Lennox made a comeback, would he not also claim to be the Lineal Champion?

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 09:43

keithmoonhangover wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 09:29

MF DOOM wrote: ↑14 Dec 2018, 09:19

You have to put it into perspective, though. It is a makeweight belt, always defended in conjunction with another title. Lewis defended it along with the WBC in his last fight. Wlad had the IBF alongside it until annexing the other belts. It was added to the IBF and WBA belts for Joshua-Klitschko. On its own, it has only been held by Brian Nielsen, James Thunder etc.

If you wanted to argue for it as a belt on its own terms surely looking at Hamed-Barrera would have been a better example? Actually, scratch that as Barrera ditched it almost immediately. It is the boxing equivalent of a waistcoat. It looks alright as part of a suit but you'd look like you were touting for business if you wore it by itself.

I think the belt is bollocks, along with the IBF and WBO. All of which are absolute toilet. Fury might not have lost his belt in the ring, but he vacated all those titles when he retired/failed a drugs test/did loads of blow/had mental health issues.

The 'Lineal' title is usually only mentioned when someone gives up or is forced to give up their belts/title. Jeffries, Ali, Spinks and Fury for example. Me personally, I think it's a load of rubbish. Isn't Lennox Lewis still the Lineal Champion? He didn't lose it in the ring. If Lennox made a comeback, would he not also claim to be the Lineal Champion?

The criteria is generally that you either beat the holder or unify in their absence. Had Fury stayed retired and Joshua met Wilder the winner would have been accepted as part of the lineage. Some people take it seriously, others not so much. I think the problem with Joshua’s statement is that it is strikes as a bit disingenuous, like we are really expected to believe that he started out dreaming of adding the IBO to the other, more established, titles. The entire ESPN interview comes across as a bit odd, to be honest.

If Joshua and Wilder start to negotiate then the base camp is that Joshua insists it takes place on April 13 at Wembley, so they’ve immediately put Wilder in a position where he cannot negotiate or offer an alternative location or date. As we have seen previously it is not the easiest fight to put together and the last time out it took them months only for it to fall apart.

This means that they would have to agree terms by early-Jan, maybe late-Jan, at a push, as they only really have Feb and March if that is the case. I can’t see them turning it around in what is a relatively tight timescale given all that has happened before. It is almost as if Joshua and his team are saying “Take Wembley on April 13 or leave it” safe in the knowledge that his fans will blame Wilder if it doesn’t happen and lap up Whyte II. I think they may be in for a shock if that is the case and Wilder and Fury go again early in the year. People are fickle.

Announcing the two Wembley "Thanks you, fans" fights in advance probably seemed like a masterstroke at the time. In light of recent events it looks like a bit of an hinderance.