BoxRec

Joshua is a very measured composed fighter. Last nite for first time I’ve ever seen he fought like undisciplined brawler who just wanted to get out of the ring swiftly once he got Ruiz hurt. That’s lack of respect. He was literally standing feet planted throwing wild four to five punch combos exposing himself to true danger. It was frankly the only way he could lose that fight. Get really wild and give Ruiz the openings to land something so huge it would turn his night upside down. He never recovered from that first huge counter hook behind the ear.

ewenhay wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 13:36 He really was light years ahead. Watch a prime Lewis move around the ring and throwing punches then watch the Joshua boxing by numbers. It's a completely different level altogether

Yes, Lewis was better by now, no doubts, but Joshua's career is not over.
What if he beats Wilder, Fury, Usyk (and Ruiz, of course) ?

ValMar wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 13:40 Yes, Lewis was better by now, no doubts, but Joshua's career is not over.
What if he beats Wilder, Fury, Usyk (and Ruiz, of course) ?

Then he's still pretty damn good.

But off of last night's performance, beating all of those guys has to be considered a pretty tall order for Joshua.

SenorPipino wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 13:49 Then he's still pretty damn good.

But off of last night's performance, beating all of those guys has to be considered a pretty tall order for Joshua.

At best tall order. I didn't think AJ could beat Fury or Wilder before, and now I'm more certain of it.

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 13:51 At best tall order. I didn't think AJ could beat Fury or Wilder before, and now I'm more certain of it.

Yeah. I don't like to write a guy off after one defeat.

I'm not of the school that says so many fighters are ATGs until they lose. Then suddenly they're bums.

But I wouldn't have picked Joshua to beat all 4 of those names. Even before last night. So my thinking hasn't changed.

Contendeh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 13:32 The hell skin tone got to do with it?

McCall was a sparring partner who had 5 losses prior to the fight

I'm just saying McCall looks like a scarier, more dangerous person that you can imagine whipping somebody's ass than Ruiz does.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:02 I'm just saying McCall looks like a scarier, more dangerous person that you can imagine whipping somebody's ass than Ruiz does.

True, but we learned last night that physique isn't as telling as we might think.

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:03 True, but we learned last night that physique isn't as telling as we might think.

Not really. Ruiz will still not be a force in the divsion, and his physique is still the reason. He just managed to get a big win in spite of it. He'll never get the best out of his abilities due to his lack of discipline though. Where he actually has the talent to possibly make 4 or 5 title defenses, due to his lack of conditioning he MIGHT make 1 at best, and I'd be genuinely shocked if he's still the Champion come this time next year. Unless he suddenly starts putting the work in, and coming in in way better shape, but we'll see.

It still seems like more a freakish occurrence to me than a confirmation that Ruiz is going to be a force in the division. That being said, he's obviously not just somebody you can walk over either.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:06 Not really. Ruiz will still not be a force in the divsion, and his physique is still the reason. He just managed to get a big win in spite of it. He'll never get the best out of his abilities due to his lack of discipline though. Where he actually has the talent to possibly make 4 or 5 title defenses, due to his lack of conditioning he MIGHT make 1 at best, and I'd be genuinely shocked if he's still the Champion come this time next year. Unless he suddenly starts putting the work in, and coming in in way better shape, but we'll see.

It still seems like more a freakish occurrence to me than a confirmation that Ruiz is going to be a force in the division. That being said, he's obviously not just somebody you can walk over either.

Never said he'd be a force, but body physique (ala AJ) doesn't make a great fighter. There's a long list of great physiques who sucked. Seldon; Ettiene; Seth Mitchell; Grant; et al.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:06 Not really. Ruiz will still not be a force in the divsion, and his physique is still the reason. He just managed to get a big win in spite of it. He'll never get the best out of his abilities due to his lack of discipline though. Where he actually has the talent to possibly make 4 or 5 title defenses, due to his lack of conditioning he MIGHT make 1 at best, and I'd be genuinely shocked if he's still the Champion come this time next year. Unless he suddenly starts putting the work in, and coming in in way better shape, but we'll see.

It still seems like more a freakish occurrence to me than a confirmation that Ruiz is going to be a force in the division. That being said, he's obviously not just somebody you can walk over either.

As I said several times, dedicated/disciplined Ruiz would have been at CW. Although, I think this victory will be good for boxing, generally speaking. I hope his career will be better than Douglas' one.

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:11 Never said he'd be a force, but body physique (ala AJ) doesn't make a great fighter. There's a long list of great physiques who sucked. Seldon; Ettiene; Seth Mitchell; Grant; et al.

But is there a long list or a list at all of fat fighters who were truly great?

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:16 But is there a long list or a list at all of fat fighters who were truly great?

Absolutely not. Just showing it's never 100%. The better boxer will usually win.

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:17 Absolutely not. Just showing it's never 100%. The better boxer will usually win.

x2................

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:17 Absolutely not. Just showing it's never 100%. The better boxer will usually win.

If all is equal though, the guy that's in better condition will win. That's where Ruiz will sometimes lose fights that he didn't have to. For instance a better conditioned Ruiz likely has a win on his record over Joseph Parker instead of a close loss.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:19 If all is equal though, the guy that's in better condition will win. That's where Ruiz will sometimes lose fights that he didn't have to. For instance a better conditioned Ruiz likely has a win on his record over Joseph Parker instead of a close loss.

Condition is different than Physique.

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:19 Condition is different than Physique.

I'm aware of that, but generally speaking a guy that's noticeably say 30 pounds overweight or so with fat around the midsection isn't in his best possible condition.

gilgamesh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:22 I'm aware of that, but generally speaking a guy that's noticeably say 30 pounds overweight or so with fat around the midsection isn't in his best possible condition.

Generally speaking yes.

I have a hunch that Ruiz works hard in the gym but then goes home and stuffs his face non-stop.

So his conditioning his fine but he can't drop weight.

Probably an eating disorder that he should address.

I don't want to see him end up on "My 600 lb. Life" a few years from now.

SenorPipino wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 14:31 I have a hunch that Ruiz works hard in the gym but then goes home and stuffs his face non-stop.

So his conditioning his fine but he can't drop weight.

Probably an eating disorder that he should address.

I don't want to see him end up on "My 600 lb. Life" a few years from now.

How cardio centric can you be and still be that fat though?

You’d never see the winner of a 5k race with a s*it ton of fat on him.

It probably is.

Bearing in mind that Ruiz Jr took the fight at short notice and with the little preparation he had and he still did that to Joshua.

Syntax Error wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 15:10 It probably is.

Bearing in mind that Ruiz Jr took the fight at short notice and with the little preparation he had and he still did that to Joshua.

He had just gotten off of the Dimintrenko training camp and fight, so he pretty much never stopped training for couple of months.

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 15:12 He had just gotten off of the Dimintrenko training camp and fight, so he pretty much never stopped training for couple of months.

That’s a damn good argument for boxers to fight more than they do. Hadn’t thought of that

Contendeh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 15:38 That’s a damn good argument for boxers to fight more than they do. Hadn’t thought of that

Oh yeah!

oogiebe wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 15:42 Oh yeah!

6 week turnaround...time to make that a thing again!

Sleep is the cousin of death!

Contendeh wrote: ↑02 Jun 2019, 15:45 6 week turnaround...time to make that a thing again!

Sleep is the cousin of death!

Remember they used to walk Tyson out there monthly or more just to keep him in the gym and out of trouble!