BoxRec

So men on average grew 7 inches taller, 60+lbs heavier and their reach grew by 20 inches in the 62 years between 1932 and 1994?

Caractacus wrote: ↑15 Dec 2020, 21:15

I think Eddie Machen possibly may have won the 11th round
( or at least was given it, LOL)

AntonioMartin wrote: ↑18 Dec 2020, 07:26

Djanders44 wrote: ↑14 Dec 2020, 13:23 I met Sonny once, in 1965.

How was Sonny to the fans?

He was in a very good mood the day I met him, answered questions with a smile.

Djanders44 wrote: ↑28 Dec 2020, 16:26

AntonioMartin wrote: ↑18 Dec 2020, 07:26

Djanders44 wrote: ↑14 Dec 2020, 13:23 I met Sonny once, in 1965.

How was Sonny to the fans?

He was in a very good mood the day I met him, answered questions with a smile.

Nice!! Plus I heard he was nice to kids and teens...:)

Mutiple beat him way to slow and easy to read

985802 wrote: ↑20 Apr 2022, 19:13 Mutiple beat him way to slow and easy to read

.... and then they wake up !

Caractacus wrote: ↑21 Apr 2022, 15:25

985802 wrote: ↑20 Apr 2022, 19:13 Mutiple beat him way to slow and easy to read

.... and then they wake up !

Caractacus wrote: ↑21 Apr 2022, 15:25

985802 wrote: ↑20 Apr 2022, 19:13 Mutiple beat him way to slow and easy to read

.... and then they wake up !

And then they make no sense !

p4p1 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2020, 06:49who beats Liston?

Muhammad Ali, Leotis Martin and... Marty Marshall.... Liston was a big, strong man who was tough, could hit hard and had a threatening demeanour...

BUT - he was not this invincible beast that Ali fans make him out to be....

Crease wrote: ↑27 Apr 2022, 19:18

p4p1 wrote: ↑08 Nov 2020, 06:49who beats Liston?

Muhammad Ali, Leotis Martin and... Marty Marshall.... Liston was a big, strong man who was tough, could hit hard and had a threatening demeanour...

BUT - he was not this invincible beast that Ali fans make him out to be....

Bar Ali, Liston was hardly in his prime for his other losses.

It's ridiculous to bring up Marty Marshall. Why not bring up how he beat Marshall twice? He later beat a much higher calibre of opposition. And Leotis Martin? Liston was 40!!!

He had only been a pro for a bout a year when he lost to Marshall.

In the previous 5 years, Liston had beaten the best heavyweights around 9most of them easily) in a decent era.
There are not a lot of guys that would have beaten him.

Billy Tully wrote: ↑28 Apr 2022, 02:19It's ridiculous to bring up Marty Marshall. Why not bring up how he beat Marshall twice? He later beat a much higher calibre of opposition. And Leotis Martin? Liston was 40!!

I woukd tend to say that it's ridiculous to build a fighter up as invincible when he was already defeated by a limited fighter...

Crease wrote: ↑01 May 2022, 08:46

Billy Tully wrote: ↑28 Apr 2022, 02:19It's ridiculous to bring up Marty Marshall. Why not bring up how he beat Marshall twice? He later beat a much higher calibre of opposition. And Leotis Martin? Liston was 40!!

I woukd tend to say that it's ridiculous to build a fighter up as invincible when he was already defeated by a limited fighter...

I don't know who says Liston is invincible, but I would hope anyone with half a brain would realise they're talking about Peak Liston, rather than novice Liston losing to a guy who he later hammered twice.

Liston stopped Patterson, Folley, and Williams and it catapaulted him into legendary status. At least in the early years of the BOTP forum.

There were people that ranked him too high. I once saw him as high as #3.

However most people had him just inside the top 10 or just outside of it. Remember in the early-mid 2000s, we used to rate how good a fighter was even if they fought before our time.
The term Greatest of all time, actually meant of "all-time'. Not Greatest of my time.

Liston did beat the guys that you mentioned; Patterson 2x and Williams 2x. All very good fighters. All pretty easily. Before fighting Ali he had scored 13 ko's in 14 fights against pretty good competition. He did lose to Ali, the best ever. Never lost to anyone else anywhere close to his prime.

Outside of losing to Ali, what do you have against him?

the great big cat williams

I don't really have anything against Liston. It's just that on this subforum in particular we've had several posters who have had him stopping almost heavyweight in history. And that's a guy who's best wins are over Patterson, Williams, and Folley. He has been ridiculously overrated.

agree, the love ive seen here for him is crazy. obviously a very good fighter, but never seen this degree of love for him any other place

how about sonny vs sam, sam would have the height advantage

Seamus wrote: ↑02 May 2022, 16:43 I don't really have anything against Liston. It's just that on this subforum in particular we've had several posters who have had him stopping almost heavyweight in history. And that's a guy who's best wins are over Patterson, Williams, and Folley. He has been ridiculously overrated.

Well Patterson, Williams and Folley were the best of his time, outside of Ali of course. Beat them all easily. What more was he supposed to do? He could box and of course he could punch.
He is probably either just inside the top 10 or just outside of it.

Ambling Alp II wrote: ↑16 May 2022, 11:08

Seamus wrote: ↑02 May 2022, 16:43 I don't really have anything against Liston. It's just that on this subforum in particular we've had several posters who have had him stopping almost heavyweight in history. And that's a guy who's best wins are over Patterson, Williams, and Folley. He has been ridiculously overrated.

Well Patterson, Williams and Folley were the best of his time, outside of Ali of course. Beat them all easily. What more was he supposed to do? He could box and of course he could punch.
He is probably either just inside the top 10 or just outside of it.

And Eddie Machen, another win against a dangerous, top guy Patterson wouldn't face. Crushing Patterson x2, Williams x2, Machen and Folley is impressive, and cleaned out the division prior to Clay. How many other heavyweights happily take on the best in the division? Most duck and dive. His run compares very favourably to other champs.