BoxRec

leejonesjnr wrote: ↑04 Oct 2023, 08:25 I really liked watching Calzaghe and he was great… BUT…
Alvarez would probably lose three or four and then maul him like a bear for every second of every round from then on.
I was there the night he really ‘came out’ against Lacy and the only occasions I ever wanted him to lose were against Richie (hometown hero who later became my trainer and manager) and RJJ (all time hero). Not Calzaghes fault but both men were no longer near their best when he boxed them.

Sorry, why would Canelo have 'mauled him like a bear' - that's not even canelo's style, he's not a face first pressure fighter, he's a cagey counterpuncher, who draws leads, whilst often also working the body.

Calzaghe has the deeper resume at 168 by far, and there's nothing as yet on the ledger of Canelo, to suggest he was capable of beating, let alone beasting Joe.

I'm no apologist for Calzaghe, I think that if he had faced off all his challengers, he would have had 1 or 2 losses on that ledger, and he pissed much of his career away in meaningless defences, before rescuing his career with the wins over Lacy and Kessler.

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑04 Oct 2023, 11:55

leejonesjnr wrote: ↑04 Oct 2023, 08:25 I really liked watching Calzaghe and he was great… BUT…
Alvarez would probably lose three or four and then maul him like a bear for every second of every round from then on.
I was there the night he really ‘came out’ against Lacy and the only occasions I ever wanted him to lose were against Richie (hometown hero who later became my trainer and manager) and RJJ (all time hero). Not Calzaghes fault but both men were no longer near their best when he boxed them.

Sorry, why would Canelo have 'mauled him like a bear' - that's not even canelo's style, he's not a face first pressure fighter, he's a cagey counterpuncher, who draws leads, whilst often also working the body.

Calzaghe has the deeper resume at 168 by far, and there's nothing as yet on the ledger of Canelo, to suggest he was capable of beating, let alone beasting Joe.

I'm no apologist for Calzaghe, I think that if he had faced off all his challengers, he would have had 1 or 2 losses on that ledger, and he pissed much of his career away in meaningless defences, before rescuing his career with the wins over Lacy and Kessler.

Meh, opinions vary.
If you want to be very literal, then no boxer has the style of a bear and the few times that it’s been recorded that a bear boxed, they lost.
I would expect Calzaghe to pick up points without causing any damage for a few early rounds and then for Alzarez to constantly put him under pressure, walking forwards with high guard and head movement and winging in powerful shots. I wouldn’t be shocked if he got a stoppage.
I wouldn’t say that I’m any more pro Alvarez than I am Calzaghe, and I wouldn’t be upset whatever the result.

leejonesjnr wrote: ↑05 Oct 2023, 05:45

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑04 Oct 2023, 11:55

leejonesjnr wrote: ↑04 Oct 2023, 08:25 I really liked watching Calzaghe and he was great… BUT…
Alvarez would probably lose three or four and then maul him like a bear for every second of every round from then on.
I was there the night he really ‘came out’ against Lacy and the only occasions I ever wanted him to lose were against Richie (hometown hero who later became my trainer and manager) and RJJ (all time hero). Not Calzaghes fault but both men were no longer near their best when he boxed them.

Sorry, why would Canelo have 'mauled him like a bear' - that's not even canelo's style, he's not a face first pressure fighter, he's a cagey counterpuncher, who draws leads, whilst often also working the body.

Calzaghe has the deeper resume at 168 by far, and there's nothing as yet on the ledger of Canelo, to suggest he was capable of beating, let alone beasting Joe.

I'm no apologist for Calzaghe, I think that if he had faced off all his challengers, he would have had 1 or 2 losses on that ledger, and he pissed much of his career away in meaningless defences, before rescuing his career with the wins over Lacy and Kessler.

Meh, opinions vary.
If you want to be very literal, then no boxer has the style of a bear and the few times that it’s been recorded that a bear boxed, they lost.
I would expect Calzaghe to pick up points without causing any damage for a few early rounds and then for Alzarez to constantly put him under pressure, walking forwards with high guard and head movement and winging in powerful shots. I wouldn’t be shocked if he got a stoppage.
I wouldn’t say that I’m any more pro Alvarez than I am Calzaghe, and I wouldn’t be upset whatever the result.

Of course, it's all opinion - I mean, I know I'm right obvsiously, but hey ho.

I think Calzaghe presents a different proposition to anybody Canelo has faced at that weight, very fast, good feet, rock solid chin, and a phenomenal workrate.

I think the workrate more than anything would present big problems, Canelo doesn't like to be forced to work all the time, he likes to have a bit of a walkabout on occasion, and he doesn't throw lots of shots himself.

I'd err on Calzaghe doing more work, and Canelo having spurts eye catching shots, but also periods where Calzaghe lands several unanswerd punches when he lets his hands go.

Calzaghe by a couple of rounds, in a fight with swings and roundabouts.

JC being bigger and stronger is a big issue too, Canelo was just too small for Bivol

Coco wrote: ↑05 Oct 2023, 07:25 JC being bigger and stronger is a big issue too, Canelo was just too small for Bivol

WELL… he’s taller for sure, what? Four inches ish?
I think Alvarez would be stronger.

bivol isnt a big light heavy, could prob make smw, he had the exact style and strengths to be a nightmare for canelo regardless of size

canelo is short but he's an absolute tank

I generally think Calzaghe is the clear number two super-middle of all time. Roy Jones is number one. I think both are winning against Canelo. Jones at his peak may even have stopped the Mexican.

polecateddy wrote: ↑05 Oct 2023, 15:18 I generally think Calzaghe is the clear number two super-middle of all time. Roy Jones is number one. I think both are winning against Canelo. Jones at his peak may even have stopped the Mexican.

Agreed, Jones never looked like anybody was going to beat him at 168.

I clearly don’t rate Canelo anywhere near as highly as lots of posters Some of the descriptions are pretty mind-boggling tbh, make him sound indestructible and unbeatable, which he clearly isn’t.

Where's EO when you need a proper unbiased opinion of Canelo?

Has everyone forgotten Floyd-canelo?

Calzaghe wins handily.

jimb0d wrote: ↑06 Oct 2023, 13:08 Has everyone forgotten Floyd-canelo?

Calzaghe wins handily.

Or v Bivol

He won't be against a guy a couple of divisions smaller

Coco wrote: ↑06 Oct 2023, 15:19

jimb0d wrote: ↑06 Oct 2023, 13:08 Has everyone forgotten Floyd-canelo?

Calzaghe wins handily.

Or v Bivol

He won't be against a guy a couple of divisions smaller

totally agree.

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑05 Oct 2023, 14:54canelo is short but he's an absolute tank

His short torso's an asset up to a certain weight, but Calzaghe's toughness and output would've been too much for him.

I think it's noteworthy Canelo dropped Charlo with a rare straight, otherwise looping his shots in a fashion Calzaghe would've loved countering. That short trunk might've taken him the distance though, since it enables him to shell up really effectively under pressure. By contrast Charlo's longer body forced him to guess low/high a lot, where he often leant towards the incoming shot - tilting away at the hips - to simultaneously cover body and head.

Canelo never seemed to catch on and try feinting to punish it. Crafty little defence if it is a looping shot, but obviously carries danger if not. I'd doubt Canelo's intelligence to make up the physical shortfall against Cal.

Prime for prime I still rate Golovkin above him, but G's a career middle whereas he peaked at 154 (or 155!), each qualifying as all-timers. You could fantasy-match Canelo with old-school middles, given Hagler might've campaigned at 154 in this era, and so on. (I'd back Hagler.)

I'd have watched Canelo-Eubank just for the ringchat.

yea when i read the title thought yea joe would box, box canelo isnt that flat footed he is no mug , and what ages are we imaging this fight happens at saul is a top class fighter dangerous against anyone he fights