BoxRec

Delta Jay wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 15:43

ironbeard wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 15:39

Delta Jay wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 15:25
Yes but this is my question, should a ref be thinking about previous?

We all know fury is a freak of nature and that’s why we love him. If that was Sokolowski in there it would’ve ended 2 minutes earlier.

If it was ANYONE else in there the fight would have been stopped. If it was ANYONE else in there v Wallin the fight would have been stopped. If it was ANYONE else who took that shot from Wilder the fight would have been over.

That is why Fury is indeed a great fighter, a fabulous competitor, a true modern gladiator. Maybe he is not the GOAT but he could compete in any era v any boxer in history.

THAT is what makes what Usyk did last night historically special. It was one of the greatest HW performances of all time by The World’s Champion Boxer. AND, it was barely enough.

Shades of Ali v Frazier I.

Calm down Gypsy John

I am not even a Fury fan.

I am just acknowledging reality.

514126 wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 08:22 You can bet your life if it was Usyk on the ropes it would have been stopped

Absolutely.

I think the ref should've waited for Fury to touch down, else stopped it.

Saving a fighter from a potential KO without stopping it doesn't quite sit with me. Feels like selective safety where there should be a stricter uniform rule. Usyk held off the finish because the ref stepped in when Fury was almost out.

Dioufy wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 08:51

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 05:59 i think he handled it right, despite all the complaints that he saved fury by giving a count and not letting usyk continue at him

it IS a thing for ref's to call KDs when they think the ropes held a fighter up. done many times before. i dont know why some people act as if the ref invented something new. and the ropes clearly held fury up. he was obviously badly hurt prior to that, but not to a level where i wouldve stopped it.

Fury was hurt but not as hurt as what the monster Wallin did to him.

fury got southpaw problems doesnt he

first otter scissor hands shreds his face and has him on shaky legs, setting the blueprint

then amazing oleks busts his nose, batters him from pillar to post, and takes his pride

stay away from the lefties

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 18:47

Dioufy wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 08:51

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 05:59 i think he handled it right, despite all the complaints that he saved fury by giving a count and not letting usyk continue at him

it IS a thing for ref's to call KDs when they think the ropes held a fighter up. done many times before. i dont know why some people act as if the ref invented something new. and the ropes clearly held fury up. he was obviously badly hurt prior to that, but not to a level where i wouldve stopped it.

Fury was hurt but not as hurt as what the monster Wallin did to him.

fury got southpaw problems doesnt he

first otter scissor hands shreds his face and has him on shaky legs, setting the blueprint

then amazing oleks busts his nose, batters him from pillar to post, and takes his pride

stay away from the lefties

Some would say stay away from half decent boxers

If that scenario is played out a 100 times, someone is getting hurt.

The fact Fury saw the fight out - making it seem like the correct call - is irrelevant.

The sport has a duty to protect fighters so must have set rules/procedures - regardless of previous performances.

Making ‘allowances’’ blurs the lines and opens the door to grievances when someone is given special treatment.

Having watched it again a few more times, The ref should either have let Usyk continue to work, or stopped it. I've changed my mind.

Frostieballs wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 02:29 If that scenario is played out a 100 times, someone is getting hurt.

The fact Fury saw the fight out - making it seem like the correct call - is irrelevant.

The sport has a duty to protect fighters so must have set rules/procedures - regardless of previous performances.

Making ‘allowances’’ blurs the lines and opens the door to grievances when someone is given special treatment.

Fury only seen the fight out because the ref essentially ended the round with the standing 8, because the bell went before he resumed the fight.

There's also a referee bias in the sense he knows Usyk isn't a particularly huge puncher at HW. If Fury was reeling across the ring like that with AJ tracking him down, suddenly the chance of dangerous brutal 1 punch KO would've been greater.

I don't care what any one says, that was a stoppage in r9.



Had the ref stopped it with Fury totally out of it and crumbled in the corner, absolutely noone is saying it's a bad or early stoppage.

Ricky wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 03:48

Frostieballs wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 02:29 If that scenario is played out a 100 times, someone is getting hurt.

The fact Fury saw the fight out - making it seem like the correct call - is irrelevant.

The sport has a duty to protect fighters so must have set rules/procedures - regardless of previous performances.

Making ‘allowances’’ blurs the lines and opens the door to grievances when someone is given special treatment.

Fury only seen the fight out because the ref essentially ended the round with the standing 8, because the bell went before he resumed the fight.

There's also a referee bias in the sense he knows Usyk isn't a particularly huge puncher at HW. If Fury was reeling across the ring like that with AJ tracking him down, suddenly the chance of dangerous brutal 1 punch KO would've been greater.

I don't care what any one says, that was a stoppage in r9.



Had the ref stopped it with Fury totally out of it and crumbled in the corner, absolutely noone is saying it's a bad or early stoppage.

I agree. And as James says above, the ref stopped Usyk’s work and prevented a stoppage.

Frostieballs wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 04:06

Ricky wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 03:48

Frostieballs wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 02:29 If that scenario is played out a 100 times, someone is getting hurt.

The fact Fury saw the fight out - making it seem like the correct call - is irrelevant.

The sport has a duty to protect fighters so must have set rules/procedures - regardless of previous performances.

Making ‘allowances’’ blurs the lines and opens the door to grievances when someone is given special treatment.

Fury only seen the fight out because the ref essentially ended the round with the standing 8, because the bell went before he resumed the fight.

There's also a referee bias in the sense he knows Usyk isn't a particularly huge puncher at HW. If Fury was reeling across the ring like that with AJ tracking him down, suddenly the chance of dangerous brutal 1 punch KO would've been greater.

I don't care what any one says, that was a stoppage in r9.



Had the ref stopped it with Fury totally out of it and crumbled in the corner, absolutely noone is saying it's a bad or early stoppage.

I agree. And as James says above, the ref stopped Usyk’s work and prevented a stoppage.

Definitely should have been a stoppage,Fury is also very lucky Usyk didn't throw that one when the ref steppin in,he would be still sleeping as he was totally defenceless

I think the red dropped a bollock, realised he should probably have called a knockdown when tyson fell into turnbuckle previously, and panicked.

It's a difficult job, and it all happened so fast, so can't blame them too much.

I'm glad he didn't stop it and in the end the right man still won.

This is a first time ever high profile 4-belt unification between #1 and #2.. whichever way people had it..

Had it been stopped, and we've seen many stopped for less.. it would have been controversial

This way, there is no controversy.

We all know Fury has heart and very good recovery skills and he showed us again.

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 04:49 I'm glad he didn't stop it and in the end the right man still won.

This is a first time ever high profile 4-belt unification between #1 and #2.. whichever way people had it..

Had it been stopped, and we've seen many stopped for less.. it would have been controversial

This way, there is no controversy.

We all know Fury has heart and very good recovery skills and he showed us again.

I think the ref was aware of Tysons ability to come back but that can also be dangerous.Every time Wilder dropped him,he got up,no sign of wobbly legs but the other night he was different,he was gone there,either way the best man won.It wouldn't have been controversial for me if it was stopped there and then,Lennox Lewis got stopped by McCall after far far less

514126 wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:00

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 04:49 I'm glad he didn't stop it and in the end the right man still won.

This is a first time ever high profile 4-belt unification between #1 and #2.. whichever way people had it..

Had it been stopped, and we've seen many stopped for less.. it would have been controversial

This way, there is no controversy.

We all know Fury has heart and very good recovery skills and he showed us again.

Lennox Lewis got stopped by McCall after far far less

I think the difference with Lewis was he was flattened with one punch and was wobbling when he stood up. By far the worst in comparison is Groves v Froch. When to you watch that back it’s hard to believe the ref stopped that

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 03:46Having watched it again a few more times, The ref should either have let Usyk continue to work, or stopped it. I've changed my mind.

9 seconds left on the clock, all of which the standing count wiped. Notice the ref putting a hand on Usyk's shoulder at 22, and then pushing right up against him at 14.

Controversial wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:06

514126 wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:00

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 04:49 I'm glad he didn't stop it and in the end the right man still won.

This is a first time ever high profile 4-belt unification between #1 and #2.. whichever way people had it..

Had it been stopped, and we've seen many stopped for less.. it would have been controversial

This way, there is no controversy.

We all know Fury has heart and very good recovery skills and he showed us again.

Lennox Lewis got stopped by McCall after far far less

I think the difference with Lewis was he was flattened with one punch and was wobbling when he stood up. By far the worst in comparison is Groves v Froch. When to you watch that back it’s hard to believe the ref stopped that

Had Usyk been allowed to land another shot or two, and tyson dropped, I have little doubt that even if he made it up, the ref would have stopped it as Tyson couldn't stand still, his legs were totally gone. The fact that he managed to stay upright, saved him from a certain stoppage, he was like bambi on roller skates.

514126 wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:00

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 04:49 I'm glad he didn't stop it and in the end the right man still won.

This is a first time ever high profile 4-belt unification between #1 and #2.. whichever way people had it..

Had it been stopped, and we've seen many stopped for less.. it would have been controversial

This way, there is no controversy.

We all know Fury has heart and very good recovery skills and he showed us again.

I think the ref was aware of Tysons ability to come back but that can also be dangerous.Every time Wilder dropped him,he got up,no sign of wobbly legs but the other night he was different,he was gone there,either way the best man won.It wouldn't have been controversial for me if it was stopped there and then,Lennox Lewis got stopped by McCall after far far less

I was saying this yesterday, - Usyk hurt him much worse than Wilder, even in the 1st fight, Tyson's head was clear when he got up - he was completely disoriented against Usyk, he had no idea where the punches were coming from.

Yes, agreed, Lewis was stopped for less, though I'd argue the ref made the right call Lewis didn't look capable of defending himself properly.

ya probably usyk wouldve clubbed fury down for a KD while he was leaning on the ropes, meaning he still gets credited with a count, and either wins the decision or the fight is stopped there

but you never know

usyk coulda slipped following up, fury then gets outta the round without an kd call, and we have a draw

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:27

514126 wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:00

Ruthless-RKO wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 04:49 I'm glad he didn't stop it and in the end the right man still won.

This is a first time ever high profile 4-belt unification between #1 and #2.. whichever way people had it..

Had it been stopped, and we've seen many stopped for less.. it would have been controversial

This way, there is no controversy.

We all know Fury has heart and very good recovery skills and he showed us again.

I think the ref was aware of Tysons ability to come back but that can also be dangerous.Every time Wilder dropped him,he got up,no sign of wobbly legs but the other night he was different,he was gone there,either way the best man won.It wouldn't have been controversial for me if it was stopped there and then,Lennox Lewis got stopped by McCall after far far less

I was saying this yesterday, - Usyk hurt him much worse than Wilder, even in the 1st fight, Tyson's head was clear when he got up - he was completely disoriented against Usyk, he had no idea where the punches were coming from.

Yes, agreed, Lewis was stopped for less, though I'd argue the ref made the right call Lewis didn't look capable of defending himself properly.

Agreed Lewis was very wobbly,but no where near as bad a Fury and that's my point,the ref had it in his mind that Fury was unstoppable,The ref with Lewis didn't have that to considor

514126 wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:46

jamesmcdonnell wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:27

514126 wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 05:00

I think the ref was aware of Tysons ability to come back but that can also be dangerous.Every time Wilder dropped him,he got up,no sign of wobbly legs but the other night he was different,he was gone there,either way the best man won.It wouldn't have been controversial for me if it was stopped there and then,Lennox Lewis got stopped by McCall after far far less

I was saying this yesterday, - Usyk hurt him much worse than Wilder, even in the 1st fight, Tyson's head was clear when he got up - he was completely disoriented against Usyk, he had no idea where the punches were coming from.

Yes, agreed, Lewis was stopped for less, though I'd argue the ref made the right call Lewis didn't look capable of defending himself properly.

Agreed Lewis was very wobbly,but no where near as bad a Fury and that's my point,the ref had it in his mind that Fury was unstoppable,The ref with Lewis didn't have that to considor

The difference is, if you're a ref, and someone gets up from a knockdown, and cannot walk in a straight line, then you cannot really let them continue.

I think the ref realised he should have called a knockdown the first time he went into the turnbuckle and panicked. That's my take on it anyway.

Either panic or an effort to help Fury. Unless by accident you don't touch a fighter if you're not breaking or stopping it, and he stepped in twice before backing off again.

First:



Second:

Grilling Machine wrote: ↑20 May 2024, 18:33 Either panic or an effort to help Fury. Unless by accident you don't touch a fighter if you're not breaking or stopping it, and he stepped in twice before backing off again.

First:



Second:

Yup, that's really disadvantageous to Usyk. He's not the first ref I've seen do that though.

Mark Nelson has been refereeing world title fights for about 30 years( more?) and he's so averse to controversy nobody ever remembers his name

I'm sure he's had his incidents but this was the guy who got accused of being on the payroll for a "hometown ref"(he's American) Joe Calzaghe stoppage over Mario Veit you know, one of those Calzaghe fights that wasn't Peter Manfredo and to say the stoppage was premature was ridiculous

That's the only Mark Nelson "controversy" I remember, (as a ref, judge I dunno)

Your think he was Joe Cortez or that rat from Texas the way people are talking

"The ref" Mark Nelsons name isn't household because he's the referee who usually goes unnoticed, he pulled on Usyks shoulder a bit??? Is that the crime ??? So he was in the pocket for Fury for the Saudis?? Mark Nelson?? I need more convincing

Lewis was stopped by McCall for less?? See that's just horse radish, Lewis hit the dirt, got back up and almost flattened the referee by falling on top of him, Fury was standing on his own weight, the referee could barely hold Lewis up and wave it off at the same time tv's

Utter nonsense

margaret thatcher wrote: ↑19 May 2024, 05:59 i think he handled it right, despite all the complaints that he saved fury by giving a count and not letting usyk continue at him

it IS a thing for ref's to call KDs when they think the ropes held a fighter up. done many times before. i dont know why some people act as if the ref invented something new. and the ropes clearly held fury up. he was obviously badly hurt prior to that, but not to a level where i wouldve stopped it.

Thank you, If one has never seen that before has one ever watched boxing bfore?? I hate the casual shaming thing but ffs, inhalers and corrupt Mark Nelson?? You can mix the inhaler steroid powder into the water so why the fornicate would you try to disguise an inhaler with a crucifix, and a guy wobbling all over the place only to fall into the ropes and have it called a knockdown for the ropes keeping them up isn't an anomaly, it's pretty common.