Who would people rather Calzaghe fight

[pundit]

Calzaghe, at this stage in his career could probably sell 30-40,000 tickets for the Millennium Stadium.
Anyway, I don't know why people are getting all weak kneed about Kessler. The bloke has only beaten one decent fighter in Mundine, and in all honesty, Mundine wasn't as good as either Brewer or Mitchell.

Some folks never learn....

[Autobarn]

Calzaghe, at this stage in his career could probably sell 30-40,000 tickets for the Millennium Stadium.
Anyway, I don't know why people are getting all weak kneed about Kessler. The bloke has only beaten one decent fighter in Mundine, and in all honesty, Mundine wasn't as good as either Brewer or Mitchell. And beating up a 'ready for the taking' Beyer is hardly going to be a feather in the cap.

Mundine is a much better fighter than you give him credit for. Brewer also gets overrated because he KOed Graham. However, Brewer lost to Echols two fights before he fought Joe, and I wouldn't call Echols more than a good fighter at best. Brewer wasn't that big accomplishment that everyone sees him to be. Ottke got two close ones against him, but Ottke also wouldn't have ever been 34-0 outside of Germany.

he would've been more like 34-2. i admit i haven't seent e 1st Brewer. But I scored Brewer II, Mitchell & Johnson all the same - Ottke doing what he does best, defending well, pecking away, stealing rounds and winning no more than by a couple of points. He was a fusspot but very clever & good to watch if you're in the right mood. There is a bit of stigma surrounding Ottke that he always got lucky, but I think a lot of it is down to sore losers and chinese whispers.

IMO Ottke was class. But he was lucky to beat reid and Larsen.

None of these guys that Calzaghe & Ottke were beating were outstanding. But a lot of them were capable of beating top 10 fighters in a decent division. Eubank, Mundine, Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Mitchell, & so on were either good boxers or good punchers

[fist]

Calzaghe, at this stage in his career could probably sell 30-40,000 tickets for the Millennium Stadium.
Anyway, I don't know why people are getting all weak kneed about Kessler. The bloke has only beaten one decent fighter in Mundine, and in all honesty, Mundine wasn't as good as either Brewer or Mitchell. And beating up a 'ready for the taking' Beyer is hardly going to be a feather in the cap.

Yeah your right Kessler has an awful lot to prove. Is his boxing record on here correct - that he has only fought 12 rounders matches 8 times??

His last 8 rounder was in 2002, when he was 23, and had only been fighting pro for 4 years.

He doesnt seem to have been very active since winning the WBA. Was he injured? Two fights in two years... He needs to keep busy as a relatively new champ.

[Autobarn]

...Lets not forget when Kessler v Lacy was being discussed the Danes were talking telephone numbers

The same danes also OFFERED "telephone numbers", if Lacy would come to Denmark to fight - the exact same amount as they asked to come to the US. But Shaw/Lacy wanted none of that.

Obviously Kessler is not gonna risk two major belts for free. So if Calzaghe wants it - he's gonna have to make a compromise. Something he's usually not happy with.

So, once again - it won't happen.

Team lacy even admitted Jeff wouldn't be ready for Kessler til 2007

[pundit]

Calzaghe, at this stage in his career could probably sell 30-40,000 tickets for the Millennium Stadium.
Anyway, I don't know why people are getting all weak kneed about Kessler. The bloke has only beaten one decent fighter in Mundine, and in all honesty, Mundine wasn't as good as either Brewer or Mitchell. And beating up a 'ready for the taking' Beyer is hardly going to be a feather in the cap.

Mundine is a much better fighter than you give him credit for. Brewer also gets overrated because he KOed Graham. However, Brewer lost to Echols two fights before he fought Joe, and I wouldn't call Echols more than a good fighter at best. Brewer wasn't that big accomplishment that everyone sees him to be. Ottke got two close ones against him, but Ottke also wouldn't have ever been 34-0 outside of Germany.

he would've been more like 34-2. i admit i haven't seent e 1st Brewer. But I scored Brewer II, Mitchell & Johnson all the same - Ottke doing what he does best, defending well, pecking away, stealing rounds and winning no more than by a couple of points. He was a fusspot but very clever & good to watch if you're in the right mood. There is a bit of stigma surrounding Ottke that he always got lucky, but I think a lot of it is down to sore losers and chinese whispers.

IMO Ottke was class. But he was lucky to beat reid and Larsen.

None of these guys that Calzaghe & Ottke were beating were outstanding. But a lot of them were capable of beating top 10 fighters in a decent division. Eubank, Mundine, Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Mitchell, & so on were either good boxers or good punchers

Brewer was top of the division when Ottke fought him, but he was old and slow when Calzghe tried (without success) to take him out. Mitchell - no clue why people rate him so highly. Strong but stationary and slow. Easily outboxed by an ageing Ottke; totally owned by Calzaghe, a knockdown of Calzaghe when Calzaghe got careless notwithstanding.

Calzaghe's best opponent--actualy his only really good one--was Robin Reid. Ottke's best was Glencoffe Johnson, followed by prime Charles Brewer and gifted but green Anthony Mundine.

[Autobarn]

To say Calzaghe should fight Kessler is very much a purist statement. I agree, he should fight him. There is not a better young fighter out there than Kessler.

It would be nice to complete super middle. If Woods beats Johnson, then this will complicate JC's light heavy plans and increase the likelihood of Calzaghe-Kessler.


But I would like to point some things out:

1) Kessler has not beaten Beyer yet. This is a TOUGH fight for the orthodox Kessler. It is not easy to jab a southpaw..unless you are Sakio Bika (lol)

2) It is a fact that World Champions can coexist in the same division. It is a fact that outstanding world champs can coexist without fighting. Sal Sanchez-Pedroza, Brian Mitchell-Azumah, Calzaghe-Ottke... If there was only one title, a lot of promoters and a lot of fighters would be locked out. Not necessarily the best fighter would be champ. Threats to his crown might be locked out.

You'd have guys like O Neil Bell who want SHITE-ALL to do with ranked contenders who can give him problems! The promoter who happens to have the champ would be more likely to line the pockets of the sanctioning body and underrated guys of the ilk of Winky, Stevie Johnston and so on would never have gotten any recognition. There would be a monopoly and wouldn't that violate anti-trust laws?

[Autobarn]

Mundine is a much better fighter than you give him credit for. Brewer also gets overrated because he KOed Graham. However, Brewer lost to Echols two fights before he fought Joe, and I wouldn't call Echols more than a good fighter at best. Brewer wasn't that big accomplishment that everyone sees him to be. Ottke got two close ones against him, but Ottke also wouldn't have ever been 34-0 outside of Germany.

he would've been more like 34-2. i admit i haven't seent e 1st Brewer. But I scored Brewer II, Mitchell & Johnson all the same - Ottke doing what he does best, defending well, pecking away, stealing rounds and winning no more than by a couple of points. He was a fusspot but very clever & good to watch if you're in the right mood. There is a bit of stigma surrounding Ottke that he always got lucky, but I think a lot of it is down to sore losers and chinese whispers.

IMO Ottke was class. But he was lucky to beat reid and Larsen.

None of these guys that Calzaghe & Ottke were beating were outstanding. But a lot of them were capable of beating top 10 fighters in a decent division. Eubank, Mundine, Reid, Woodhall, Brewer, Mitchell, & so on were either good boxers or good punchers

Brewer was top of the division when Ottke fought him, but he was old and slow when Calzghe tried (without success) to take him out. Mitchell - no clue why people rate him so highly. Strong but stationary and slow. Easily outboxed by an ageing Ottke; totally owned by Calzaghe, a knockdown of Calzaghe when Calzaghe got careless notwithstanding.

Calzaghe's best opponent--actualy his only really good one--was Robin Reid. Ottke's best was Glencoffe Johnson, followed by prime Charles Brewer and gifted but green Anthony Mundine.

I dunno, I think they were all good but flawed. It shows in their records.

Mundine - beat Echols, lost to Siaca
Woodhall - beat Malinga, Branco, Nardiello, lost to Beyer, gets lucky vs Catley
Eubank - lethergic loss to Collins (couple of years previous) // goes on to nearly knock out WBO cruiser champ Thompson
Reid - beats Nardiello, bad loss to Malinga
Mitchell - KO over Liles, debatable fights with Siaca, beats JC Green
Brewer - KOs Graham, loses debatable KO to Echols (early stoppage)


To me, all these guys are a mixed bag. All good enough to hold a title. None good enough to beat the elite fighters (Calzaghe & Ottke). All pretty good names to have on the record. Both Calzaghe & Ottke proved they were a level above these TITLISTS, one way of proving their champinship class.


Ottke has a win over Glen Johnson which looks a lot better now. Calzaghe's win over Mkrtchian looks better now, as M has beaten a top 10 fighter. The Lacy win may look better if Lacy goes on to do anything. Bika will probably look like a better win in a few years as I feel he can go on to do things.

[glahn]

I reckon Calzaghe wanted to fight Ottke far more than Ottke wanted to fight Calzaghe. I'm not even a huge Calzaghe fan, but I respect his talent enough to believe 100% that he would have beaten Ottke fairly comfortably. I rate Ottke in the same kind of bracket as Artur Grigorian - talented and difficult to beat in his prime, but nowhere near as good as his record would suggest.

Anyway, I don't see Calzaghe vs. Kessler happening, but this time I think it's more because Joe doesn't want the fight. He'll obviously take on either Woods or Johnson next, but the only way he'll go back down to take on Kessler is if there are literally no other options available to him at light heavy. It's a huge risk & relatively low reward fight for him at this stage of his career.

[Autobarn]

IMO Ottke was a superb boxer. A real ring scientist & one of the finest 'ring geometrists' (if there is such a thing) of the 90s. Not many fighters with his spatial awareness, Tszyu & Hopkins notwithstanding. If you forget his last 2 fights he's no more controversial than Jermain Taylor. An insidiously difficult man to pin down & would've given Calzaghe problems.

[mattyp151]

IMO Ottke was a superb boxer. A real ring scientist & one of the finest 'ring geometrists' (if there is such a thing) of the 90s. Not many fighters with his spatial awareness, Tszyu & Hopkins notwithstanding. If you forget his last 2 fights he's no more controversial than Jermain Taylor. An insidiously difficult man to pin down & would've given Calzaghe problems.

Look at Taylor's controversy and who it was against by comparison.

[Axe]

Both easily beat Dawson.

Bollocks. Nobody at 175 would easily beat Dawson, he's gotten better with every fight and is hitting his peak right now.

Dawson has the tools to rule 175 for years to come.