BoxRec

fist wrote: Hmmm you seemed to have missed the other aspects to Khan i.e. his speed, accuracy, desire.... Sums up what a lot of armchair pundits are like on here - just slagging off fighters left right and centre, with no balance. Khan is vulnerable, has a huge amount to learn still, but that does not negate the good attributes he has. He has plenty of talent, has shown great heart when he' been in trouble and is doing all that is asked of him i.e. beating who is in front of him. Even if he doesn't make the world class grade he deserves credit for his achievement thus far, for providing entertainment and giving it a committed go.

Great fight last night - very exciting. Thats what boxing should be about.

Hmmm i feel i've been banged around enough by amateurs to be rated above "arm chair pundits" but whatever you say bud.

You speak in cliches- 'beating who is in front of him'. So what does that actually mean mate? And how does it relate to his chances at world level, which is the point of this whole thread?

I think we are being a bit harsh on him hear. If he wants to be world class he needs challenging fights, I think he should have take this fight around the 10th fight of his Carrier but you can't have everything it was a difficult fight and it looked to me like he learned about his deficiencies... does anyone think this could have been Khan's Carl Thompson moment?

The problem with people who are arm chair fans is we expect someone to be world class straight away. I think Warren needs to hold him back and put him in against a few more difficult live opponents and hopefully the winner of the Thaxton Melero fight. Nothing like a world title fight for another 5 or 6 good fights.

Khan may be liable to being hurt but like Morales he comes back firing on all cylinders throwing combinations. This is a good attribute. Cotto has being in the same position as Khan against Torres/Corley/Mosley/Judah but like Khan regrouped. Hatton has survived being hurt and cut to ribbons against European level fighters like Tackie/Ancient Phillips/Magee/Collazo. Delahoya was dropped twice early in his career. The list goes on......This is pro boxing you can get hurt but its how you respond to it and Khan responds well by firing back or regrouping. People are focusing on the KD but Khan took ALLOT of shots from a very big puncher in Gomez and came through. No one expected Khan would need to take that many shots but he did.

Chin aside, his defense needs tightening up and he needs to not give up his reach/height because he fought that fight at Gomez's range. Buddy McGirt is a poor trainer to pressure fighters BUT he would be very good for Khan because he makes his fighters box at range. Roger or Floyd Mayweather Sr would be excellent choices. Khan needs a great US trainer like this because it suits his style. If Khan develops an excellent defense hes going to be very very tough to beat.

Khan will be beat though but he'll get some big wins under his belt too and he is world level already at 21. But most fighters at 21 would get ko'd by the top guys in their division, thats including Hatton/Cotto. Even Barrera got battered as a young 22 year old fighter but because of that he tightened up his defense and thats what made him great.

If Khan becomes a great fighter depends entirely on how he develops in the next 5 years but he has the raw tools to become great (and I was cheering for Gomez)

On another note Khan reminds me of Bruno/Wlad. No one looks better than them athletically, no ones better at long range for the most part but their prone to being smashed at mid range, seriously hurt and shocked when caught. Wlads managed to become the no1 HW despite this similar flaw

But the heavyweight talent pool isn't loaded like lightweight- all the 90s heavies are too old, fat and finished now hence why Wlad sits atop on his shaky throne.

In the lightweights we have Manny Pac, Nate Campbell, Juan Diaz, Joel Casamayor, not to mention Guzman stepping up...

Amir is what he is and its pretty straight forward to see......

He is chinny and thats obviously a major concern. He also at times fights foolishly and is overeager. But on the plus side he's incredibly fast, has tremendous accuracy, combination punching and has excellent movement. He also has enough pop. Nobody will walk through his punches. And he showed last night he has superb heart, the way he came back after absorbing a brutal body shot was great to see.

In a way the worst thing that could have happened was him dropping Gomez early, because he then went gunning for the finish and got tagged himself. Without scoring that early KD i think he'd have boxed a more patient fight from the outside and not taken as many risks in the pursuit of the stoppage. Certainly he underestimated what Gomez had left to a degree, but then again i think everyone did. Gomez has looked shot for years, but is still a dangerman. Thing with Gomez in particular is he always looks ready to go, so opponents rush into finish him and he gets chances to land his hooks. His vulnerability works for him in this regard.

Khan could and should have made the fight far, far easier.....but he beat Gomez at his own game and will have learnt alot from the fight.
I still think if he fought smart and used his speed and natural ability he right now could beat any lightweight. Extra seasoning can only be of use to him, but no matter how many more 'learning fights' he has before going for a world title.....he is always going to be vulnerable as his chin just isn't so good. But his talent is so immense it needn't stop him from achieving what he wants to out of the sport.

overhand_right wrote:But the heavyweight talent pool isn't loaded like lightweight- all the 90s heavies are too old, fat and finished now hence why Wlad sits atop on his shaky throne.

In the lightweights we have Manny Pac, Nate Campbell, Juan Diaz, Joel Casamayor, not to mention Guzman stepping up...

Yes but he doesnt have to fight them all does he, when Hatton was coming up 140 had Mayweather, Cotto, Tyszu, Witter, Harris etc etc. He managed to scalp Tyszu and Castillo but if he'd been thrown in with Mayweather and Cotto in 2004 he may have lost

What if we look at the positive chances Amir has against:

Casamayor - old, low workrate, smaller, many thought he lost to the average Cruz, maybe there for the taking
Nate Campbell - chinny himself, lower workrate, slower than Amir, smaller, not a massive puncher (what if Amir can take his punch?)
Juan Diaz - Not a massive puncher, Khans faster, Khans better at range and a better boxer.
Pacquiao - OK Khans getting KO'd but who knows maybe he'd be too big or maybe he'd be able to take advantage or just back Pacquaio up so Manny can't punch
Guzman - amazing boxer but low workrate and smaller and his power is dropping with every weight class he moves up

I wanted to watch Khan get smashed yesterday but objectively he has a shot against anyone if he can survive. And he is showing heart by fighting back when hurt, which is a very important attribute to have. Despite chin worries he took allot of shots from Gomez who is a big puncher if nothing else and probably bigger than a few top10 lightweights

Riddick Blowe wrote:Plus, I just love it when people keep saying 'Well he needs a little more time, he's not ready yet, let's see if he improves in this next fight' and best of all 'he doesnt necessarily have a glass chin!'

WAKE UP!

The concrete inevitability of Khan's imminent downfall is shockingly explicit - being able to forecast the shocked ITV execs, the stunned casual armchair fans, the worried tones of the commentators as their paymaster is about to fall - we got glimpses of how it will unfold last night.

And for his next outing, this stumble will be forgotten and the process will begin again! How long can they extend the train wreck for?

To be fair, a lot of ppl felt Khan should have stayed amateur for this Olympic Games. He is very young, raw and looked shaky in that ama fight with Craig Watson.

That said, he chose the pro game, and still has plenty of amateur faults & as one of lightweight's heir apparents (with Peterson and Antillon) should be doing better. I believe he needed to be given a better learning curve against more purposeful opposition. That way we would have seen better development.

Khan will likely play the ratings game, get a title shot at the right time, take on the right opponent, right time, right place, and box with methodical caution over the distance (like Macca-Braithwaite). It'll happen.

Come on people, Khan's chin isn't just a worry now, it's a bloody nightmare. He's been put down by two super featherweight where one was shot and slow as hell and the other one couldn't punch his way out of a paper bag. It's also a worry that his legs buckle quite a lot, like against Watson, Limond and to a small degree, Gomez. Even if Diaz, Casamoyor, Campbell aren't considered massive punchers they're still better than the three that put Khan on Maccarinelli-legs, and they're going to tag him more often (not to mention that Khan won't be too much bigger than these on fight night so his weight advantage, what he relies on most, goes straight down the shit pan and he won't be able to push them back like he does with blown up super featherweights). For me, Khan is tow years away from fighting a decent world champion (and it could well be at light welterweight) and he should fornicate McGirt off and try Roger Mayweather.

There are 4 major world titles out there - a route can be found, believe me, to winning a title. And there is also the light welter division.

Let's not forget, while Limond isn't known as a puncher... had that African challenger down 2 or 3 times in the Commonwealth title fight. I'm not saying all Africans are durable or anything, but Limond has impressive accuracy and timing and he's used these qualities to score knockdowns of recent.

Khan is a worry. Perhaps he can avoid situations like these by boxing with caution, and not racing in to finish people. For starters.

Anyway, Warren keeps saying about Haye, you can't grow muscles on a chin. Wods coming back to haunt him, re Khan?

Khan could be another Pac-man type fighter, which would be great in most people's eyes. But that's not what Khan wants for himself, he wants the Mayweather type status where we appreciate his skills and defence, rather than his blistering speed and exciting fights. Judging by his performance against pretty mediocre fighters, he will never achieve that highly skilled/untouchable status. You don't show this many vulnerabilities then go on to become something like Mayweather, Whitaker etc.

He will be a world champion because anyone can be nowadays with half decent talent...Khan's got more than half decent athletic talent, but his boxing skills aren't great.

Verdict on Khan:

Chinny
Quick hands
Average power
Still deluded

If a past it s-feather can put him down with a glancing shot ..
If a past it s-feather can make him miss so much ...
If a past it s-feather can absorb so many clean shots ..

What would a genuine lightweight be able to do to him?

Glad he`s moved to setanta .. another reason not to subscribe

Good to hear McGuigan start to question Khans chin now .. is there cracks in the love affair?

tonyevs wrote:Good to hear McGuigan start to question Khans chin now .. is there cracks in the love affair?

Thats amaaazing!!

In all the hoopla, we've missed how Barry Mac seemed to be cooling his love affair with Amir having seen him on the deck and drawn into a shoot out with a shopsoiled pug.

Khan is a pig in a poke (am I allowed to say that? Or is it 'offensive' to muslims???? ANyway doesn't matter about his religious persuations Khan will be Kod and bruatlly so when he steps up...)

Khan needs better training/sparring and that's all there is to it. His deficiencies are the same as we see in loads of other British/European fighters. He can't fight on the inside which is a big problem and he's to straight up. He can have 20 more learning fights, but if he's doing the same things in the gym what's going to change?

Dean Powell certainly isn't gonna change anything either. He needs to get a North American trainer, but not necessarily a well known one. Guy's like McGirt and Steward are celebrity trainers. They've got to many guy's in their stable and can't devote enough time to each individual fighter. Team Khan should start looking for an experienced trainer who can spend lots of time with him and iron out the obvious problems.

One thing that is getting better with each fight is his punch variety. He's got a lot of different shots in his arsenal and throws punchs that most guy's on this side of the pond simply don't have. Saw some nice hooks and uppercuts with both hands last night. That short uppercut with the left is a good one.

He does have good punch variety .. just not the dig to capitalise on them landing.

As for better sparring .. didn`t they boot a certain domestic guy out of the camp sometime ago for putting Khan down heavilly the chin `problem` have been long known in the camp .. it makes you think why OH had to sign a contract not to discuss Khan if they ever split .. how many other trainers have to do this

Problem with him getting a new trainer is that he`s convinced he is already an established world class fighter who can call all the shots .. I`d think most would view him as too much trouble, and with his lack of chin something of a liability to their reputation.

Trash Khan fits perfect

Can you divulge the name of the alleged fighter who alledgedly put Khan down and was alledgedly let go from the training camp?

Sounds interesting. (alledgedly)

Sam Vimes wrote:Can you divulge the name of the alleged fighter who alledgedly put Khan down and was alledgedly let go from the training camp?

Sounds interesting. (alledgedly)

Ditto.

It’s Khan’s overeagerness to get the job done that’s at the root of people’s reservations over him – and of course the question mark over his chin.

I am sure that there are’nt many doubts about some of his world class qualities. His handspeed and ability to throw clusters is phenomenal combined with his variety of punches.

But as I have said before, he needs to settle down and go to work in a much more composed manner. This would give him more time to think about his selection of shots whilst being more aware about blocking, slipping moving away from anything that comes back at him whilst operating off that. Instead he remains too frantic and tries to force the KO /TKO in offence and when that doesn’t produce the payoff has little clue to nullify the response whilst backing up.

With his height, reach and speed he should be able to break opponents up at range and then go for a KO/TKO when the opportunity presents itself. His lack of composure and capacity to use his undoudted advantages may well be down to the young top billing and weight of expectation celebrity that was inevitable after his Olympic heroics. He would have been better served down the bill honing skills that would benefit his talent and call on in more challnging circumstances – it would have served him in better stead than bombing out opponents that were – well expected to be bombed out.

I think Khan is a young immature kid that has enormous potential but has the unmistakeable traits of wanting to do it his way as he may think (influenced by celebrity and wanting to please a crowd) without regard for what well intentioned people are saying. Ant Evans said on another thread that he’s pretty shy. The interviews shows this, in that he tries to play up to the billing whilst saying expected things of a high profile boxer that come out wrong and garbled (n’ wha a mean) and probably go a against his natural grain.

charlieb wrote:Khan's becoming underrated because he's fighting guys who on paper look like soft touches, but train their asses off, putting in the fights of their lives.

He needs to leave the vets alone, ditch his family, move to the US, find a world class trainer and start fighting other prospects.

Very true

Khan is still very young with plenty of time to improve, there is no doubt about his ability, and if he stays with FW there will be every chance we will be the finished article by the time he genuinely steps up

As always Khan looked exceptional when on the offence, he's got blurring handspeed and he's very accurate with his shots, but there are wholes in his defence that will get exploited at a higher level and there are question marks over his chin, although he didn't look hurt from the knockdown. I'm looking forward to seeing him in BIG World title fights against world ranked opposition, but I can't say that I'd be overly confident if I saw him up against a decent puncher with a good chin and workrate. Khans still work in progress though

One thing, it looked like they were fighting in a fairly small ring, so Gomez would have been able to close the gap a bit faster. Khan's used to having his space in there and had a new experience. Anyone agree? Wasn't there a bigger ring for, say, St Clair?

Anyone think that Warren knew Gomez would cause him problems, and let Khan realise that he's not ready to go off on his own for the megabucks fights yet?

E wrote:Khan is a pig in a poke (am I allowed to say that? Or is it 'offensive' to muslims???? ANyway doesn't matter about his religious persuations Khan will be Kod and bruatlly so when he steps up...)

You're an idiot. Why is it only you who brings religion and politics into fight threads? friggin 'bigot.

--

Indeed we'll never know whether Khan has a proper chin or not until he takes some clesan hits of genuine lightweights/light welters.

But on the positive side, better to win and win comfortably than to lose.

Autobarn wrote:One thing, it looked like they were fighting in a fairly small ring, so Gomez would have been able to close the gap a bit faster. Khan's used to having his space in there and had a new experience. Anyone agree? Wasn't there a bigger ring for, say, St Clair?

Anyone think that Warren knew Gomez would cause him problems, and let Khan realise that he's not ready to go off on his own for the megabucks fights yet?

Maybe.. But i think a lot of the people here are treating Gomez as some sub-par new fighter. He is obviously past it, but still a threat.

Phenomenal-Nutrition wrote:Khan may be liable to being hurt but like Morales he comes back firing on all cylinders throwing combinations. This is a good attribute. Cotto has being in the same position as Khan against Torres/Corley/Mosley/Judah but like Khan regrouped.

For fcuks sake, are you actually trying to compare Willie Limond and a shot to shit Gomez against the likes of Barrera, Pac-Man, Mosley etc. Get with the program, Khan is being put down by, at best British class, light punching, super-featherweights (Gomez's shot hardly even connected).

Get your head out the cornflakes bowl