Classic American West Coast Boxing

[Randyman]

The article is posted here courtesy of East Side Boxing and James Slater.

I Don't think the author gives Cruz enough credit in this article, relegating him to a sidenote in the fight. Other than that it's a good article on Barry.
Randy

McGuigan v Cruz - Brave Barry’s night in hell!

20.06.06 - By James Slater: The following article looks back on an epic fight, from the 126 pound division, that took place almost exactly twenty years ago to this very day. This astonishing bout, fought at the legendary Caesars Palace in Las Vegas, was both thrilling and excruciating..

Ireland’s Barry McGuigan was a genuine hero. Not only to the people of Ireland, but to boxing fans (and non boxing fans when it comes down to it) from all over. Now he was being groomed for stardom in America. His first top of the bill appearance ( Barry had fought once previously in the States, very early in his career) was to be held at Caesars Palace in Las Vegas, against one Steve Cruz. What followed, on June the 23rd 1986, is a fight that is still talked about amongst British fight fans to this very day!

Talk about the result, and most everybody will tell you that the heat of the Vegas desert, and this alone, caused Barry’s loss. There is no doubt that the burning heat and high temperature were huge factors in the outcome of the fight - between a guy who was used to such weather conditions and one who in no way was - but the boxing skills of the little known Texan Stevie Cruz played a role too. More than likely Barry would have won had the fight been held in his native Ireland, but going in to the fight with the nine to one underdog no-one was at all concerned with the thought of him losing his featherweight title. A huge boxing upset was about to be witnessed!

Making his third defence after winning the title in a fine fight with Eusebio Pedroza, McGuigan was in desperate trouble in the last third of the bout. He was very close to being in tears and it was alarming to watch. Never would the thought of quitting ever enter McGuigan’s mind, however. He was one of the toughest and bravest fighters Ireland had ever produced. Barry had a ferociously strong fighting heart. This heart, and this alone, carried him through the most desperate fatigue and pain as Cruz opened up and landed his best shots. Barry was thoroughly exhausted and was sent to the canvas on three occasions - once in round ten and twice in the very last round. He somehow survived to hear the final bell, but after fifteen gruelling rounds his title was gone. The heat certainly did prove to be a massive hindrance to McGuigan, as his being put on an IV drip afterwards more than showed, and in hindsight he should not have fought in such conditions in an outdoor arena.

The new champion would lose the title in his very first defence - against Antonio Esparragoza in March of the following year. But all concern, at least from a British fan’s perspective, was focused on the well being of the ex-champ. He had been in a very bad way during the action-packed fight. How had he gotten through the hell he had been in? Heart can only carry you so
far after all!

Many never expected Barry to fight again after the June fight but he did come back - two years later- and managed to chalk up three wins as a super featherweight. One of his victims was the very strong , and only once beaten, Julio Cesar Miranda. So it was clear that Barry did have more that just a little left to offer the fight game.

His retirement wasn’t too long in coming though. He quit the sport for good after his loss to Jim McDonnell, only his third as a pro, in 1989. But it is that awfully hard fight in Las Vegas for which he is probably best remembered. For although he lost, causing some serious heartache for his many fans in the process, his astonishing courage was something to behold.

No less than the “Bible of Boxing” - Ring magazine - gave the McGuigan v Cruz bout its fight of the year award for 1986.

Such guts and bravery have not been seen too many times in the featherweight division since!

[bennie]

Thanks for posting, Randy. Barry had his night in the sun and knew when to retire, a few years later, which is the ultimate sign of class in a fighter. Yes, the Cruz fight was a disaster. Barry was given three choices of opponent once Argentina's Fernando Sosa was dicovered to have retina problems: Cruz (who lived in Vegas and was thus fully acclimatised), Panama's Jose Marmolejo, whom Barry regarded as a dirty fighter (having sparred with him), and Puerto Rico's Antonio Rivera, a puncher who ran out of steam.
I would have gone for Rivera. Hell, who am I?

[Expug]

I was and still am a big fan of Barry.
Helluva fighter and a good kid.I was walking on air after he beat Pedroza.
Barry was fun to watch, the way he threw that lefthook was tremendous.
I was dissapointed when he lost his title, but Cruz also fought a good fight too.

[bennie]

Barry's son, Shane, is now a solid amateur fighter. He is taller than Barry but has the same barrel chest.

[Randyman]

Just curious. At their peak. In a weather neutral location, not too damp and cold for Bobby and not too hot and dry for Barry, who wins? Both of these guys had good skills and big hearts. Both fighters fought with the fans in mind. I would argue that Bobby fought better overall opponents in his career and would have that edge but I think this is a great "Dream Match".
Randy

[kikibalt]

Stevie Cruz

[Randyman]

Stevie Cruz

Unfortunately for Cruz, the McGuigan fight would be his peak. He never quite measured up to that night. Hard to figure why because he did have the skills.

[kikibalt]

Just curious. At their peak. In a weather neutral location, not too damp and cold for Bobby and not too hot and dry for Barry, who wins? Both of these guys had good skills and big hearts. Both fighters fought with the fans in mind. I would argue that Bobby fought better overall opponents in his career and would have that edge but I think this is a great "Dream Match".
Randy

I'll go with Bobby, I too think he fought better opponents, I also think he was the best fighter of the two.

[Randyman]

Just curious. At their peak. In a weather neutral location, not too damp and cold for Bobby and not too hot and dry for Barry, who wins? Both of these guys had good skills and big hearts. Both fighters fought with the fans in mind. I would argue that Bobby fought better overall opponents in his career and would have that edge but I think this is a great "Dream Match".
Randy

I'll go with Bobby, I too think he fought better opponents, I also think he was the best fighter of the two.

Yeah, I have to go with Bobby but I do think it would have been helluva fight. The night Stevie Cruz beat McGuigan, he reminded me of Bobby.

[bennie]

Just curious. At their peak. In a weather neutral location, not too damp and cold for Bobby and not too hot and dry for Barry, who wins? Both of these guys had good skills and big hearts. Both fighters fought with the fans in mind. I would argue that Bobby fought better overall opponents in his career and would have that edge but I think this is a great "Dream Match".
Randy

Barry's style was all-action, all-aggressive and made for quick burnout, although at his peak he was just too relentless for opponents, and that may have included Bobby. Trouble is, his peak was too short to fully rate him over Chacon. Barry wanted to move up to super-featherweight after licking Pedroza (who had made 19 successful defences) and take on Wilfredo Gomez in MSG, which would have been a dream match and a winnable one (Gomez was over the hill at super-feather) but it didn't happen and Barry's relationship with his manager, already in real jeapardy, went beyond the point of no return.
Ultimately, Bobby was the better, cagier boxer and the sharper one-punch hitter. He certainly had that longevity Rick Farris mentions times and again, and Rick is right. Great fighters are great over a longer period than Barry was great.

[bennie]

Stevie Cruz

Unfortunately for Cruz, the McGuigan fight would be his peak. He never quite measured up to that night. Hard to figure why because he did have the skills.

He was a cute fighter, all right. He developed a bit of a drinking habit after beating McGuigan - I don't think he enjoyed being in the limelight. He cleaned up his act and fought his heart out against a 'hot' Venzuelan Antonio Esparragoza in his first defence but was worn down and stopped late. Stevie still had something left, though. He licked Tracy Harris Patterson in 1989 (Patterson was fancied to beat him) and secured a shot at Jorge Paez for the IBF featherweight title in the same year. He floored Paez with a cracking right hand in the early rounds, but Paez had the energy to survive and outpoint him. The bottom line is, Cruz was a world class fighter and a bad match for Barry in the desert heat. He lacked knockout power but had stamina, heart, boxing skills and a great chin.

[Randyman]

Bennie Wrote:

Barry's style was all-action, all-aggressive and made for quick burnout, although at his peak he was just too relentless for opponents, and that may have included Bobby. Trouble is, his peak was too short to fully rate him over Chacon. Barry wanted to move up to super-featherweight after licking Pedroza (who had made 19 successful defences) and take on Wilfredo Gomez in MSG, which would have been a dream match and a winnable one (Gomez was over the hill at super-feather) but it didn't happen and Barry's relationship with his manager, already in real jeapardy, went beyond the point of no return.
Ultimately, Bobby was the better, cagier boxer and the sharper one-punch hitter. He certainly had that longevity Rick Farris mentions times and again, and Rick is right. Great fighters are great over a longer period than Barry was great.

I won't dispute Barry's aggressiveness. He always fought with determination. These type of fighters almost always have a short career. While it's true that Bobby had longevity in his career, I don't think it was good longevity. He paid too high a price. Certain guys can hang around a long time and some can't or shouldn't. Jersey Joe Walcott, Archie Moore, Roberto Duran and George Foreman were able to pull it off. Same with Bernard Hopkins. Ali couldn't do it, regardless of his style. Once he lost his skills he got hit too much. Ray Leonard would have ended up the same way. I also think if Shane Mosley continues to fight he'll ended up ruined. I think he can continue to entertain but if he fights any of the elite fighters he's not going to last. Just an opinion.

Randy

[Randyman]

Barry's son, Shane, is now a solid amateur fighter. He is taller than Barry but has the same barrel chest.

I didn't know that. How old is he? Any plans to turn pro? Can you post a photo?

[Rick Farris]

quick question for west cost fans about Bobby Chacon

i never heard if he had problems with his hands or not but watching the old clasics from later in his career i can't help noticethat he really seems to be pushing his punches out there, and the difference between early and late Chacon seems very pronounced. especially in the left hook his best weapon in his younger days he isn't turning his knuckles over or really getting his shoulder or weight into the punch, it seems to me. plus later in his career he seemed to become a much more right-handed fighter where his left was better when he was younger

can anyone confirm if he had problems with his hands? thanks

C-P, I never knew or heard of Bobby having problems with his hands, maybe Rick can tell us if he did.

thanks, anyone who knows it just strikes me how little weight chacon gets into power punches when he was such a great powerpuncher in his early days

I wasn't aware of Bobby having any hand problems when I was close to him, however, that was only up to 1976. I will say this, Bobby could really bang, his punches landed with a crack and I know that he definitly had weight behind them. Funny how hard punchers are different. Duran had this explosive quality, as did Olivares. Danny Lopez punched in a different way, but the result was the same. Bobby was yet different again. This was my take, based on how it felt on the receiving end of their blows. I have to tell you, as a fighter, you never forget the guys that really hurt you. Bobby never hurt me bad, nor did Lopez, but I'll never forget the power. Punching power can be improved in a fighter thru technique, but true punchers are born with that power.

-Rick Farris

[bennie]

Barry's son, Shane, is now a solid amateur fighter. He is taller than Barry but has the same barrel chest.

I didn't know that. How old is he? Any plans to turn pro? Can you post a photo?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/others ... igans.html

[Rick Farris]

Just curious. At their peak. In a weather neutral location, not too damp and cold for Bobby and not too hot and dry for Barry, who wins? Both of these guys had good skills and big hearts. Both fighters fought with the fans in mind. I would argue that Bobby fought better overall opponents in his career and would have that edge but I think this is a great "Dream Match".
Randy

With all respect to Barry McGuigan, Bobby Chacon or Danny Lopez both knock him out regardless of where or when the fight is held, and under whatever conditions exist. Barry would fight them hard and make for a great fight, before being put out to pasture for good. After one ass whipping from Stevie Cruz, we never heard of the Irishman again. Even if they were to fight in Wembley, with papa singing "Danny Boy", the L.A. boys tame Barry. Just an educated opinion.


-Rick Farris

[Randyman]

Rick Farris wrote:
I wasn't aware of Bobby having any hand problems when I was close to him, however, that was only up to 1976. I will say this, Bobby could really bang, his punches landed with a crack and I know that he definitly had weight behind them. Funny how hard punchers are different. Duran had this explosive quality, as did Olivares. Danny Lopez punched in a different way, but the result was the same. Bobby was yet different again. This was my take, based on how it felt on the receiving end of their blows. I have to tell you, as a fighter, you never forget the guys that really hurt you. Bobby never hurt me bad, nor did Lopez, but I'll never forget the power. Punching power can be improved in a fighter thru technique, but true punchers are born with that power.

-Rick Farris

A good observation Rick and an accurate one. The really good punchers are born with it. A good trainer may help bring it out and develop a better punch but it has to be there to begin with. Just learning how to throw a hook or a right hand correctly is no guarantee of a good punch. If it were everyone would be a KO artist. The same holds true for heart.

[Randyman]

Rick Farris wrote:
With all respect to Barry McGuigan, Bobby Chacon or Danny Lopez both knock him out regardless of where or when the fight is held, and under whatever conditions exist. Barry would fight them hard and make for a great fight, before being put out to pasture for good. After one ass whipping from Stevie Cruz, we never heard of the Irishman again. Even if they were to fight in Wembley, with papa singing "Danny Boy", the L.A. boys tame Barry. Just an educated opinion.


-Rick Farris

Rick, speaking of knockout power, when you give an opinion it's thrown with all the intensity and power of a Rocky Marciano right hand. I like that!

Randy

[kikibalt]

Randy, I really loved those old photos you posted.

[Randyman]

Barry's son, Shane, is now a solid amateur fighter. He is taller than Barry but has the same barrel chest.

I didn't know that. How old is he? Any plans to turn pro? Can you post a photo?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/others ... igans.html

That was really good article Bennie, thanks for posting it. I can understand how Barry feels, in a very small way. In 1993 when my son Andrew was 11 years old he wanted to box. I was actually excited about it but my wife and mother weren't. I took him to the Brooklyn Street Gym in Boyle Heights. One of the trainers took him on. He was developing nicely and eventually had a fight. I was so nervous leading up to that day. When the fight actually happened I was literally besides myself. I was hollering and screaming. Totally out of character.

On the way to the fight. I was going over a few things with my son. I warned him to be careful when he shook his opponents hand. Sometimes a kid has nervous energy and hits without ever really meaning to. Sure enough as my son reached out with his right hand, the kid threw a right hand, with everything behind it. it landed flush on my sons face. The ref and the crowd were shocked. The fight hadn't even started yet. they were being introduced. Andrew took it well. He just turned and grinned at me as if to say "How did you know" and I of course looked back at him as if to say "I'm you're father, I know everything". He went on to kick the guys ass but I was a nervous wreck.

He continued training, but my son is a musician at heart, and a gifted one at that. He wanted to devote himself to music and that as they was that. He still follows boxing.

Frank, I don't know how you did it. It was stressful for me and it was just one small amateur fight. Maybe I would have grown into it, I don't know.

[Randyman]

Randy, I really loved those old photos you posted.

Thanks Frank. Those photos were in my fathers old Army trunk for years. A couple of years ago when I started to trace my family tree I got them out and decided to share them. That was old East L.A. I have so many more of my father and uncles. I'll post more from time to time if no one minds but I don't want to overwhelm anyone.

Randy

[Randyman]

Forgive a father's pride in his son. These are photos of my son Andrew. My wife and I have had a hard time dealing with him being away from home for so long. He's decided to remain in Seattle so we have no choice in accepting that. It ain't easy.


With his girlfriend in Seattle, Washington, where he lives.


At a cafe in Rome, Italy


The family hero back from Iraq.

[bennie]

Just curious. At their peak. In a weather neutral location, not too damp and cold for Bobby and not too hot and dry for Barry, who wins? Both of these guys had good skills and big hearts. Both fighters fought with the fans in mind. I would argue that Bobby fought better overall opponents in his career and would have that edge but I think this is a great "Dream Match".
Randy

With all respect to Barry McGuigan, Bobby Chacon or Danny Lopez both knock him out regardless of where or when the fight is held, and under whatever conditions exist. Barry would fight them hard and make for a great fight, before being put out to pasture for good. After one ass whipping from Stevie Cruz, we never heard of the Irishman again. Even if they were to fight in Wembley, with papa singing "Danny Boy", the L.A. boys tame Barry. Just an educated opinion.


-Rick Farris

Rick, Barry would have beaten Cruz but for the 15th and last. It was a desperately close fight.

[kikibalt]

That was really good article Bennie, thanks for posting it. I can understand how Barry feels, in a very small way. In 1993 when my son Andrew was 11 years old he wanted to box. I was actually excited about it but my wife and mother weren't. I took him to the Brooklyn Street Gym in Boyle Heights. One of the trainers took him on. He was developing nicely and eventually had a fight. I was so nervous leading up to that day. When the fight actually happened I was literally besides myself. I was hollering and screaming. Totally out of character.

On the way to the fight. I was going over a few things with my son. I warned him to be careful when he shook his opponents hand. Sometimes a kid has nervous energy and hits without ever really meaning to. Sure enough as my son reached out with his right hand, the kid threw a right hand, with everything behind it. it landed flush on my sons face. The ref and the crowd were shocked. The fight hadn't even started yet. they were being introduced. Andrew took it well. He just turned and grinned at me as if to say "How did you know" and I of course looked back at him as if to say "I'm you're father, I know everything". He went on to kick the guys ass but I was a nervous wreck.

He continued training, but my son is a musician at heart, and a gifted one at that. He wanted to devote himself to music and that as they was that. He still follows boxing.

Frank, I don't know how you did it. It was stressful for me and it was just one small amateur fight. Maybe I would have grown into it, I don't know.

Randy, it was hard for me when the boys turn pro, not so much in the amateurs, when they were boxing in the Jrs. it was more like they were doing it for fun, going to the differed clubs and us older guys hanging around talking and seeing the kids been kids, kids like Rick, and yes sometime drinking a beer, most of the club sold beer to make some money for their clubs.
But when they turn pro it was a differ story, I would get so nervous you couldn't talk to me before a fight, thats one of the reason I brought Jackie McCoy in with me on Frankie's career and also that he could open doors for me, he was not in on Tony's career, I did handler Tony by myself, I would hire Jimmy Montoya to help with the training and to work the corner.

[bennie]

Forgive a father's pride in his son. These are photos of my son Andrew. My wife and I have had a hard time dealing with him being away from home for so long. He's decided to remain in Seattle so we have no choice in accepting that. It ain't easy.


With his girlfriend in Seattle, Washington, where he lives.


At a cafe in Rome, Italy


The family hero back from Iraq.

When in Rome...

Seriously, these are nice pics of your son, Randy.